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Why so much Genesis love?

Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=103629
Printed Date: April 28 2024 at 20:42
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Topic: Why so much Genesis love?
Posted By: Big Kid Josie
Subject: Why so much Genesis love?
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 15:32
OK, I am prepared to get flamed for this but: why so much Genesis love on this forum?

I actually love Genesis's work, particularly SEBTP and the 2 post-Gabriel albums before Hackett left---TOTT and WAW.  I think they're a great 70's prog band and up there with Yes, ELP, Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Jethro Tull, Rush, et al.  I get that Banks is a fine, elegant keyboardist, Collins a great prog drummer in their early days, and Hackett an original guitarist who made some beautiful, melancholy olde English ballads.  I absolutely love Entangled, Blood on the Rooftops, Carpet Crawlers, Cinema Show, etc.  I like Gabriel with Genesis, but actually like his early solo work even better.  I don't like at all what Collins turned Genesis into, but I don't hold that against the band in their 70's prime either.  I see them as 2 totally different bands, with Hackett and without him.

But I don't understand why they are lauded on this site above all those other fine 70's prog bands...can someone enlighten me?  It's not that I don't think they're a great band, just not better than the others I mentioned above... 



Replies:
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 15:33
hahhahah..

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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: LearsFool
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 15:36
Might have something to do with their penchant for excellent openers, drawing people in. That is the one thing I'll always give them.

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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 15:41
easy listening prog..  non-offensive.. ie... not challenging.  Easy to build up a large fanbase.. oh wait.. they didn't do until they discovered their true talents as pop masters supreme. It wasn't that far a turn for them anyway.


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: rdtprog
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 15:47
because they were different than those bands you mentioned. The music is not simply symphonic like Yes, ELP and experimental like KC and not close to JT. The music has that special atmosphere that you don't find in those bands, dark, mysterious, religious and funny at the same time. But love is irrational, you know...


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Music is the refuge of souls ulcerated by happiness.

Emile M. Cioran









Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:08
Because they invented prog, silly! Tongue

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Posted By: Big Kid Josie
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:09
Yeah, I do find Genesis different from those other bands I mentioned.  (I actually think all those bands are very different from each other, one of the great things about the early prog explosions.)  So...they're more popular on this forum (or so it seems to me) because their version of being different appeals to more folks than those other bands, I guess...."Love is irrational", non-logical, etc.

It didn't seem like, at the time, Genesis was that popular in the 70's heydey.  I mean, my friends and I dug them, but it was almost an unknown thing among other music-lovers back then...maybe they were too "olde english whimsy" for the States?

Not that popularity at the time says anything good or bad about a band.  It just seems Genesis love is something of an after-the-fact thing/modern reappraisal... 


Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:11
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Because they invented prog, silly! Tongue


hahhah.. love the avatart man!! Clap


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: Big Kid Josie
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:14
Welllll...I get that you're probably being facetious, but...From Genesis to Revelation came out in 69 after Crimson's ITCOTCK and at the same time as the first Yes album, Floyd's Ummagumma, and the Moody's OTTOAD.  I would say it's the weakest among those prog albums.

Although they made a string of fine albums when they got their classic line-up together.


Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:16
yeah Genesis did it all man... except sell records...


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:25
On a serious note, I think it's because they were complicated but still accessible. If that makes any sense.  Geek


Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:39
This is almost an impossible question because it is not about why I like/love Genesis, but why everyone else does too. My guess is that many like me discovered Prog through Genesis and thereby became the gold standard. I have always found their stature to be equivalent to Yes, but with better stories, better drama. Their playing is not quite as virtuoso-ish as ELP, but with more consistently better song(/instrumental) writing. Their song writing is equivalent in quality to Pink Floyd, but with better more intricate playing. I have always found their stature less than that of King Crimson Among Prog pundits, but there was a warmth to Genesis not found in KC (not at least until Wetton or Belew). Their instrumental work was more intricate than Jethro Tull. Rush is just plain different, nuff said about that.

Genesis were the first Prog band, to my knowledge, accrue a line tribute bands (unless we're counting the Beatles). This tends to indicate that they were quickly associated with a "golden age", most likely motivated by the sense of loss from PG's and to a lesser extent HF's departures. Genesis were also superior to many many other bands in terms of storytelling, but with their movement toward Pop came a movement away from that sort of storytelling, which brought a desire for the return of the old lore. Notice how many more references (like that of Hogweed and such) can be pulled out of Genesis material in a fashion that is widely recognizable across the PA spectrum.


Posted By: GKR
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:42
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

On a serious note, I think it's because they were complicated but still accessible. If that makes any sense.  Geek

Kinda.

But this question just came in a time exaclty were "Seeling England by the Pound" is almost passing Thick as a Brick in teh #2 and #3 positions... so... it kinda means something, right?


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- From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 16:55
^Don't forget that a lot of this love for Genesis was well after the fact. The most successful 'retro loved' prog band, IMHO.


Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:00
Originally posted by GKR GKR wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


On a serious note, I think it's because they were complicated but still accessible. If that makes any sense.  Geek

Kinda.

But this question just came in a time exaclty were "Seeling England by the Pound" is almost passing Thick as a Brick in teh #2 and #3 positions... so... it kinda means something, right?
I'm surprised. I would've thought it had surpassed Thick As a Brick a long time ago. The more amazing thing to me is that Thick As a Brick, nice as it is, would ever have been rated higher than Aqualung. Does anyone ever listen to side 2 of Thick As a Brick? It's a rare thing for me.


Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:02
Originally posted by Big Kid Josie Big Kid Josie wrote:

OK, I am prepared to get flamed for this but: why so much Genesis love on this forum?

I actually love Genesis's work, particularly SEBTP and the 2 post-Gabriel albums before Hackett left---TOTT and WAW.  I think they're a great 70's prog band and up there with Yes, ELP, Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Jethro Tull, Rush, et al.  I get that Banks is a fine, elegant keyboardist, Collins a great prog drummer in their early days, and Hackett an original guitarist who made some beautiful, melancholy olde English ballads.  I absolutely love Entangled, Blood on the Rooftops, Carpet Crawlers, Cinema Show, etc.  I like Gabriel with Genesis, but actually like his early solo work even better.  I don't like at all what Collins turned Genesis into, but I don't hold that against the band in their 70's prime either.  I see them as 2 totally different bands, with Hackett and without him.

But I don't understand why they are lauded on this site above all those other fine 70's prog bands...can someone enlighten me?  It's not that I don't think they're a great band, just not better than the others I mentioned above... 

Actually if you hang around here enough, Floyd, Yes and Tull get about as much love.   And to be frank, Genesis, in many ways, were better than the others mentioned, so I can't blame people for the love.   Plus remember they are practically an institution in Britain.




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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy


Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:06
You are right in that in the early day's, Genesis was not popular in the US....but across the pond they were popular from the position that people knew their music. Some US side had heard it, what did not help was the Lamb Tour in the US started before anyone even had the album.
Once Trick of the Tail hit I think US side is when they started to get more popular, not that any prog-band can be popular, it's not in the molecular structure of prog bands to be "popular".

Why they are revered on this site, like HackettFan says it must do with their writing styles, music and lyrics. There is something magical to it, they are telling stories......And for me it is the music, that line up of 5 members is probably the best there will ever be, next to Rush of course Big smile

If you, like some, feel their 80's music kicks them out of the prog scene then so be it, we all can have our own feelings. But that is the definition of progression, move on to something else...and yet they still created some amazing music. People just have a problem in the fact that they became so friggin POPular, who cares, they made a ton of money and they deserve it IMO.
Their first 4 albums probably sold more issues after their more accessible music came out, makes sense as people wanted to discover where they came from.

Genesis are brilliant.....I am not sure many here feel they are head and shoulders over the others you mention, but where they stand on this site and other prog music sites seems correct in my mind, it's justified.


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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:09
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


^Don't forget that a lot of this love for Genesis was well after the fact. The most successful 'retro loved' prog band, IMHO.
For sure. That was exactly my point about them representing a lost age. After the fact certainly isn't unreal. Abraham Lincoln wasn't nearly so widely adored until he was assassinated. It's not uncommon for artists (painters, writers) to be more appreciated after they've passed away. Genesis is lucky to see some of their appreciation and legacy while they're still alive. But I think that the departure of PG and HF were seen as a sort of passing.


Posted By: t d wombat
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:14
Collins became a megastar and Genesis went along for the ride. Pre Face Value they were popular but not exceedingly so though I think they always wanted to be, probably more so than many of their peers. Watching the various docos I'm always struck by the constant talk about wanting a hit single. Not sure about that at all but nonetheless they were good at coming up with the hooks and compared to most of their peers they were exceedingly melodic and far more accessible than e.g VDGG and KC, even Yes. Reality is that for a Prog lover they were easy listening, with just enough Prog pomp and circumstance to convince me, at least,  they were the real Prog deal.

I've always felt it was the combination of good writing, a modicum of wit and excellent playing that sucked me in. Sure I wish they had continued to strive for art rock perfection but even so, and yes even in their later years, they still produced music that really took me with it. I was discussing CAS v We Can't Dance with someone here the other day and while doing so had yet another listen to Duke. I simply find that album along with others from the Genesis catalogue still puts a goofy grin on my dial that only some of Yes and Floyd achieved amongst the other big guns.  None however did it so often as Genesis.

They also adapted pretty well to the changes within the group. Sure losing Phillips was sad but Hackett was a damn fine replacement and Stuermer is undeniably a great player live while few other drummers could have covered for Collins as brilliantly as Thompson. Of course there is the loss of the fella in the frock to deal with but thankfully they did go with Collins instead of choosing a more typical rock singer. Yes that probably worked against them in the end but that is another story really.

So OK, there are plenty of other outfits that are more than likely superior to Genesis and these days I probably only listen to something of theirs occasionally but when push comes to shove they will always be my favourite prog band. I'll readily admit that without Genesis  (and Yes and Tull) I probably would not have explored this wonderful genre as much as I have.


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Andrew B

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” ― Julius Henry Marx


Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:34
I find them no better than a dozen bands from the 70-75 period. Trespass and Foxtrot are pretty good. The other 3 albums in that period are hit and miss. Gabriel never did much for me. His 80s stuff is pretty terrible

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All I like is prog related bands beginning late 60's/early 70's. Their music from 1968 - 83 has the composition and sound which will never be beaten. Perfect blend of jazz, classical, folk and rock.


Posted By: GKR
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:39
Steve is correct.

HackettFan dont. haha
I really love both parts of TAAB... if someone ask me, it could be in a dictionary as a definition for "climax" or "epic conclusion" (damn it, there is a word for this and I cant remember! Angry )

Back to Genesis: MAYBE the succesfull career of Peter Gabriel and Phill Collins made people wonder if their early career were good, so, its a cycle of fans, perhaps.


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- From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.


Posted By: the lighthouse keepe
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 17:40
Genesis live,whatever period,were the best!I saw them on numerous occasions during there career,and I also witnesed some great concerts featuring Floyd,Yes,Tull,Crimson etc,and these were all excellent,but they don't come close to Genesis live in concert!They just had the "X"factor when it came to performing live.I love prog in general and those bands I've mentioned are class,but ever since I first heard SEBTP,Genesis have always been the best!
Any period of there career I enjoy,but the Gabriel era is just about the best!Genesis Rules!

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"Hello sun.Hello bird.
Hello my lady.
Hello breakfast.May I buy you
again tomorrow?"


Posted By: t d wombat
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 19:03
Originally posted by dr prog dr prog wrote:

I find them no better than a dozen bands from the 70-75 period. Trespass and Foxtrot are pretty good. The other 3 albums in that period are hit and miss. Gabriel never did much for me. His 80s stuff is pretty terrible


Name a few ? That's not a challenge, merely that I'd be interested to see what you are comparing them with.




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Andrew B

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” ― Julius Henry Marx


Posted By: t d wombat
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 19:25
Originally posted by the lighthouse keepe the lighthouse keepe wrote:

Genesis live,whatever period,were the best!I saw them on numerous occasions during there career,and I also witnesed some great concerts featuring Floyd,Yes,Tull,Crimson etc,and these were all excellent,but they don't come close to Genesis live in concert!They just had the "X"factor when it came to performing live.I love prog in general and those bands I've mentioned are class,but ever since I first heard SEBTP,Genesis have always been the best!
Any period of there career I enjoy,but the Gabriel era is just about the best!Genesis Rules!


I'd already discovered Yes, Tull and the Moodys when SE was released. Import record store owner in Sydney suggested I have a listen and that was pretty much that. Sadly Genesis only toured Australia once and that was the Invisible Touch tour so to some extent they were a bit past it as far as I was concerned. Nonethless it was still a mighty show even though some of the material from IT and Genesis I'd have happily done without.

I'm not such an obsessive PG fan, anything from Foxtrot to Duke will do me. Hmmmm ... well other than Spot the Pigeon. Sad fact is that imo, they havn't done anything of note in damn near thirty odd years, if they are still ruling then it's time for an abdication. Smile


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Andrew B

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” ― Julius Henry Marx


Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 19:26
^ yeah.. let's put SWilson on the throne then ErmmLOL


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 22:13
Originally posted by t d wombat t d wombat wrote:

Originally posted by dr prog dr prog wrote:

I find them no better than a dozen bands from the 70-75 period. Trespass and Foxtrot are pretty good. The other 3 albums in that period are hit and miss. Gabriel never did much for me. His 80s stuff is pretty terrible


Name a few ? That's not a challenge, merely that I'd be interested to see what you are comparing them with.


 
I'll make it the 1970-77 period because some bands started about 1973 and would be unfair to miss them out. I've got just as much enjoyment if not more from bands such as Tull, Gentle giant, Yes, Caravan, Oblivion Express, Van der graaf, Le orme, Banco, Goblin, Camel, Greenslade, Magma, Zappa, Hatfield/National Health, Deep purple, Black Sabbath, Ronnie Foster just to name a few


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All I like is prog related bands beginning late 60's/early 70's. Their music from 1968 - 83 has the composition and sound which will never be beaten. Perfect blend of jazz, classical, folk and rock.


Posted By: Polymorphia
Date Posted: August 10 2015 at 23:20
dunno

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https://dreamwindow.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My Music


Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 00:39
I don't know that anyone actually puts them on a pedestal above all the rest of the biggies. Rather, mostly the issue is everybody seems to have some pet project (could be VDGG, Gentle Giant, could be Krautrock, RPI etc etc) and they feel Genesis has undeservedly stolen their thunder. Fine but then you could say the same about the rest like Yes or Floyd and you won't because in your unimpeachable estimation they are rated just fine while Genesis is hideously overrated? That seems to say more about your tastes. Actually I personally do like GG more than Genesis but they are not nearly as accessible so it's hardly a surprise that Genesis are more popular. Oh and I hope nobody is going to rue the fact that Camel is not rated as highly as Genesis.


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 00:52
Genesis had some advantages

1.- In the early days they had no personal ego.....All the members played for the band, not for personal glory...They were a BAND not just a collection of stars trying to be better than the rest.

2.- They combined heavy material, with pastoral tunes and complex but accessible stuff.

3.- Peter had a unique charisma.

4.- They released 5 super albums in a row, hardly anybody did this (7 with the two first Collins releases)

5.- The lyrics were superb and created a mysterious atmosphere like nobody.

6.- They didn't abused of the epics, they were able to make in 6 or 10 minutes, what others did in 25. 

7.- Peter had a great communication with the audience.

8.- They were able to play their music on stage as well as in the studio albums.

9.- They quit Prog before they became a caricature of themselves.

10.- The adult contemporary era is clearly separated from the Prog era, while most of the bands started to became a hybrid.


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Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 01:01
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

^ yeah.. let's put SWilson on the throne then ErmmLOL

Silly wabbit, he's already there.....You missed the party apparently.


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Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 03:25
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

easy listening prog..  non-offensive.. ie... not challenging.  Easy to build up a large fanbase..
 
You described Renaissance and Camel , much more than Genesis, really
 
Though Genesis is not Art Zoyd or Magma or Henry Cow, you'd have to have some kind of bagage to get in their stuff.
 
 


Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 03:42
Well, I couldn't say it better than Iván.

I might add: for me, there are no bands that made such a long line of albums that are almost impeccable from A to Z than Genesis and Yes.
I found, when making a top 100 for this site (one of the threads) that I still had quite some Genesis (and Yes) albums on my list, but also Hackett, Banks, Phillips...
So much talent, so many great tracks.

Genesis and Yes are for me the apex of prog.


Posted By: Skalla-Grim
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 04:23
Their early 70s music is complex but melodious, and their songs tell stories, some tragic, some funny. Peter Gabriel was not only a charismatic singer, he was also an actor who could bring several characters within a song to life.


Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 04:44
I have no idea why people try to analyse personal taste so much. There's no science to it. Some things just are as they are.

Even at their most progressive Genesis were quite accessible and listenable. There's no mystery to it.

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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!


Posted By: Imperial Zeppelin
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 05:42
Because if you don't like Genesis you're not a true prog fan.

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"Hey there, Dog Man, now I drink from your bowl."


Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 07:07
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

I have no idea why people try to analyse personal taste so much. There's no science to it. Some things just are as they are.


That, on the other hand, is of course also true.
It happens that Genesis is tasty prog to a lot of people.
De gustibus non est disputandum.


Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 07:37
For me, Genesis had a magic that no other band really has. It was Nursery Cryme that drew me and a lot of it was due to the bizarre stories in the lyrics - hogweeds, people getting their heads knocked off with mallets, people cutting their toes off. As for the music, it was the climax of Musical Box that hooked me - it's still possibly the greatest ending in prog. Their run of albums from Trespass to The Lamb is only matched by Yes (The Yes Album to Going For The One) imo.


Posted By: progrockdeepcuts
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 08:38
It's a good question and I certainly don't have the answer. All I know is I'm tired of hearing about them and their imitators burned me out on their sound. Can't we discuss Trojan Horse or Bent Knee or something? That stuff is truly exciting. :)

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Listen to older shows here: mixcloud.com/progrockdeepcuts/


Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 08:57
Originally posted by Big Kid Josie Big Kid Josie wrote:

OK, I am prepared to get flamed for this but: why so much Genesis love on this forum?

I actually love Genesis's work, particularly SEBTP and the 2 post-Gabriel albums before Hackett left---TOTT and WAW.  I think they're a great 70's prog band and up there with Yes, ELP, Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Jethro Tull, Rush, et al.  I get that Banks is a fine, elegant keyboardist, Collins a great prog drummer in their early days, and Hackett an original guitarist who made some beautiful, melancholy olde English ballads.  I absolutely love Entangled, Blood on the Rooftops, Carpet Crawlers, Cinema Show, etc.  I like Gabriel with Genesis, but actually like his early solo work even better.  I don't like at all what Collins turned Genesis into, but I don't hold that against the band in their 70's prime either.  I see them as 2 totally different bands, with Hackett and without him.

But I don't understand why they are lauded on this site above all those other fine 70's prog bands...can someone enlighten me?  It's not that I don't think they're a great band, just not better than the others I mentioned above... 


Early Genesis was an extraordinary band with a really unique blend of stuff at its peak with the big emphasis on the 12 strings and harmonies and occasional flute or tambourine for that pastoral English sound, Hackett's devotion to playing classical pieces on guitar as well as pioneering double-tapping stuff and atmospheric slide work, Peter Gabriel's soul-inspired voice and lyrical oddness giving it an intimacy Yes, King Crimson, ELP etc. never had. I think this video gives a good idea of how the band as a whole works.



Now, if you don't buy the stories/lyrics/vox I don't think you'll get it but if you do it's just something that a lot of the big prog bands could never really do.


Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 09:02
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

For me, Genesis had a magic that no other band really has. It was Nursery Cryme that drew me and a lot of it was due to the bizarre stories in the lyrics - hogweeds, people getting their heads knocked off with mallets, people cutting their toes off. As for the music, it was the climax of Musical Box that hooked me - it's still possibly the greatest ending in prog. Their run of albums from Trespass to The Lamb is only matched by Yes (The Yes Album to Going For The One) imo.

Exactly, and my personal list is even longer: Trespass -> Three Sides Live
With Yes: Debut -> 90125


Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 09:07
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

easy listening prog..  non-offensive.. ie... not challenging.  Easy to build up a large fanbase.. oh wait.. they didn't do until they discovered their true talents as pop masters supreme. It wasn't that far a turn for them anyway.
 

Why are you describing Yes? Wink

The real classic Genesis line-up, which doesn't include the two noticeably weaker albums after Gabriel's departure, did a lot of really weird out-there material more in line with some cross of Arthur Brown and music hall than with any of their contemporaries, as well as a lot of extraordinary little pieces that don't sound 'prog' (Harlequin stands out).


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 09:15
Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


^Don't forget that a lot of this love for Genesis was well after the fact. The most successful 'retro loved' prog band, IMHO.
For sure. That was exactly my point about them representing a lost age. After the fact certainly isn't unreal. Abraham Lincoln wasn't nearly so widely adored until he was assassinated. It's not uncommon for artists (painters, writers) to be more appreciated after they've passed away. Genesis is lucky to see some of their appreciation and legacy while they're still alive. But I think that the departure of PG and HF were seen as a sort of passing.
I'm not down playing Genesis because of their retroactive adoration, but I would like to point out the fact that band never had a world conquering album on the scale of CTTE, TAAB, or ELP's debut, and were not even as popular worldwide as KC when they released ITCotCK. They did have a good early following in the UK, but so did Monty Python's Flying Circus. They never had the killer album  that the other super prog groups had, with the Lamb coming closest in critical terms but not really succeeding in worldwide sales.
 
The better question would be "Why so much love for Genesis years after the fact?"


Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 09:39
I don't care really all I know is that they created something unique and powerful back in the 70s, and I love spinning it from time to time.
I also think PA has this thing about bashing prog acts who get 'too big for their own good'. We like our bands to be big and widely known......but not too much because what about The Clouds and Cressida and satan with his icecubemix. DT, SWilson, Meal Norse and so forth have all been through the ring and have taken their punches, some more than others.

I get it though. It's irritating to see people continuing to talk about the same stuff over and over and over again. 'How about that Musical Box eh?' -especially when there is sooooooo much more thrilling and infinitely beautiful music out there.



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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams


Posted By: progrockdeepcuts
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 09:46
To me, Genesis' best stuff is the stuff that never gets mentioned - Fountain of Salmacis, Can Utility and the Coastliners, Anyway ...

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Listen to older shows here: mixcloud.com/progrockdeepcuts/


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:13
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

I don't care really all I know is that they created something unique and powerful back in the 70s, and I love spinning it from time to time.
I also think PA has this thing about bashing prog acts who get 'too big for their own good'. We like our bands to be big and widely known......but not too much because what about The Clouds and Cressida and satan with his icecubemix. DT, SWilson, Meal Norse and so forth have all been through the ring and have taken their punches, some more than others.


You lost me on this one David. As far as I'm concerned, all prog acts are cult acts regardless if they're newbies or almost forgotten dinosaurs.


Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:29
Originally posted by TGM: Orb TGM: Orb wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

easy listening prog..  non-offensive.. ie... not challenging.  Easy to build up a large fanbase.. oh wait.. they didn't do until they discovered their true talents as pop masters supreme. It wasn't that far a turn for them anyway.
 

Why are you describing Yes? Wink

The real classic Genesis line-up, which doesn't include the two noticeably weaker albums after Gabriel's departure, did a lot of really weird out-there material more in line with some cross of Arthur Brown and music hall than with any of their contemporaries, as well as a lot of extraordinary little pieces that don't sound 'prog' (Harlequin stands out).

Well, it may be weird for the kind of theatrical enactment approach or whatever you could call it of Gabriel.  But speaking musically, there is hardly any dissonance in their music and it's mostly all very tightly put together.  Have heard that Banks doesn't like to change a note in live performances and if that is the case, it's a marked contrast from the other big bands of prog.  Even Yes did have a bit of playfulness in their live act.  So I guess it's all about whether people relate to the vocal aspect of Genesis or the musical side.



Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:41
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


^Don't forget that a lot of this love for Genesis was well after the fact. The most successful 'retro loved' prog band, IMHO.
For sure. That was exactly my point about them representing a lost age. After the fact certainly isn't unreal. Abraham Lincoln wasn't nearly so widely adored until he was assassinated. It's not uncommon for artists (painters, writers) to be more appreciated after they've passed away. Genesis is lucky to see some of their appreciation and legacy while they're still alive. But I think that the departure of PG and HF were seen as a sort of passing.
I'm not down playing Genesis because of their retroactive adoration, but I would like to point out the fact that band never had a world conquering album on the scale of CTTE, TAAB, or ELP's debut, and were not even as popular worldwide as KC when they released ITCotCK. They did have a good early following in the UK, but so did Monty Python's Flying Circus. They never had the killer album  that the other super prog groups had, with the Lamb coming closest in critical terms but not really succeeding in worldwide sales.
 
The better question would be "Why so much love for Genesis years after the fact?"


The Gabriel albums were, like VDGG's stuff, really successful in Italy. Selling England By The Pound was very popular in the UK (charted higher than ITCotCK, for instance), and everyone in my parents' generation can sing a bit of 'I Know What I Like' to this day.


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:42
^Isn't that what I said? Barring Italy of course. But still not a worldwide smash phenomenon.


Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:51
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

^Isn't that what I said? Barring Italy of course. But still not a worldwide smash phenomenon.


True to an extent, though they were certainly a reasonably successful act in their time. The reputation has kind of gone the other way to, say, ELP, which were colossally supergiant at the time and have kind of suffered retrospectively.


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 10:54
^An excellent point as one can't deny their 'staying power', that's for sure.


Posted By: Warthur
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 12:27
I suspect there's no one single factor that's made Genesis popular on this site so much as a combination of factors which come together. For instance, off the top of my head:

- It's worth noting that Genesis aren't *uniquely* popular on this site - classic-era Yes also gets a lot of love, for instance, and King Crimson have just as many albums in the http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?salbumtypes=1#list" rel="nofollow - top 10 as Genesis have (and Pink Floyd actually have more!). So part of it is that Genesis are lucky enough to be one of a small set of bands who were keystones of the original golden age of prog and whose work is consequently loved by a wide cross-section of fans.

- It's also worth noting that Genesis aren't immune from criticism on here either - their pop albums are slammed just as hard as, say, some of Yes's missteps, or ELP's more egregious crimes against good taste. So, again, there's a certain extent to which it's just not true that Genesis are uniquely popular on here, though it'd be just as untrue to say that they're unpopular.

- For us young'uns, you also have the fact that Genesis was a big influence on a lot of the early neo-prog groups. Not as much as the press made out with Marillion, mind (bar the Market Square Heroes version of Grendel, which in my view suffers from being produced as though it were a Genesis track), but the likes of IQ and Pendragon both dipped into that well, and a chain of subsequent bands from that day to this have done likewise. As a result, there's a swathe of us out there who came to prog through listening to bands with a Genesis influence who were very favourably impressed when we got around to checking out our heroes' heroes, if you see what I mean.

- Here's something which might ruffle some feathers: Genesis never marred the perfection of their prog era by turning back after they went pop. As a result, people were able to cling onto the hope that they'd return to prog, and tell themselves that if Genesis would just do one more album with Peter Gabriel (or even just a quick return to their Wind and Wuthering sound) it'd be glorious. Conversely, there's all too many bands out there who went pop in the 1980s, found that ran out of steam, and then returned to prog only to find that they couldn't quite recapture the magic of their 1970s material.

- Last but certainly not least, people love Genesis on here because their albums are really good. In particular, during their classic phase they had this extremely rare knack of being able to produce intricate music whilst at the same time not losing sight of the emotions or atmosphere they were trying to evoke. They might not have been as brash and bold and loud as ELP or King Crimson, but there's a depth to Genesis that few others - maybe VdGG and some of the RPI crowd - were ever able to capture. I can keep listening to them over and over again and still find something new in the music, even whilst though by now it's comfortingly familiar to me.


Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 12:30
^ Good post Clap


Posted By: Warthur
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 12:35
Originally posted by TGM: Orb TGM: Orb wrote:

True to an extent, though they were certainly a reasonably successful act in their time. The reputation has kind of gone the other way to, say, ELP, which were colossally supergiant at the time and have kind of suffered retrospectively.
As someone who finds ELP kind of hit and miss (dug the debut album and side 1 of Tarkus, decidedly mixed feelings about everything that followed that), I think this is a particularly apt point.

To draw an analogy using both bands' keyboardists, Keith Emerson's spinning, knife-wielding, rockin'-the-Classics style is extremely flashy, really grabs your attention when you first hear it, and was quite novel at the time, even though it was pretty much the same schtick he'd used in The Nice cranked up to 11. Conversely, Tony Banks' keyboard playing has a subtlety to it which really rewards careful listening and repeated exposure. Personally, I find that once you take away the live showboating Emerson relies too much on the same tricks over and over again, whereas Banks' work in Genesis stands the test of time and repeated exposure much more.

To draw a shorter and much cruder analogy, it's like the difference between a one-night-stand and a marriage: what works for a brief, exciting bit of fun and what works for a long-term, involved relationship are often two very different things.


Posted By: Michael678
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 12:47
I'd pretty much agree with these statements regarding the love for Genesis, but I think they're not exactly one of the "all-time best" for me. King Crimson, Rush, Pink Floyd, and Yes are all higher than these guys for me.

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Progrockdude


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 13:01
Originally posted by Warthur Warthur wrote:



- It's also worth noting that Genesis aren't immune from criticism on here either - their pop albums are slammed just as hard as, say, some of Yes's missteps, or ELP's more egregious crimes against good taste. So, again, there's a certain extent to which it's just not true that Genesis are uniquely popular on here, though it'd be just as untrue to say that they're unpopular.

That's one of the most important points in favour of Genesis

Everybody knows that 5 or 4 men era Genesis is Prog, and 3 men era Genesis is POP (With 2 transitional albums).

Those who like Prog will listen from Trespass to W&W and maybe ATTW3 or Duke...Those who like Pop will listen from ABACAB to CAS

Gabriel and Hackett are immune to the critics of the Pop era and most people who love Pop era, never learned that Peter sang in the group or that Steve Hackett exists.

A Prog fan wouldn't buy a Genesis album to get 2 Prog songs and 7 pop songs, you know what you are paying for from the start and you get it.

If you slam the pop albums, the 5 men era will remain unpolluted, because we know it's a different band.

I'm not old enough to have ever watched a Prog Genesis concert and I dreamed for a last reunion, but today I thank Peter for avoiding it, he kept the magic and the mystery alive, we never saw a bald  guy dressed as Rael or a fat Britannia...We will always see our bootleg quality DVD's of the costume concerts and imagine how great they were.

Yes missed that chance, they continued releasing less than average albums (for their level) and a presenting us group of old men trying to recreate what they did 40 years ago

When Yes retire, people will remember their last concert without Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman and Squire, but when we think in Genesis, we will always remember the golden era concerts...They will never grow old, they will always be remembered young and at their peak, while we saw Yes, ELP, Jethro Tull, Kansas grow old and far from their peak. 


Originally posted by Warthur Warthur wrote:

- Last but certainly not least, people love Genesis on here because their albums are really good. In particular, during their classic phase they had this extremely rare knack of being able to produce intricate music whilst at the same time not losing sight of the emotions or atmosphere they were trying to evoke. They might not have been as brash and bold and loud as ELP or King Crimson, but there's a depth to Genesis that few others - maybe VdGG and some of the RPI crowd - were ever able to capture. I can keep listening to them over and over again and still find something new in the music, even whilst though by now it's comfortingly familiar to me.

Honestly I never seen Genesis as accessible, Musical Box, Fountain of Salmacis, Can Utility, The Knife, Get 'em Out by Friday, are far more challenging than Your's is no Disgrace, Your Move or eve Siberian Khatru.

But you mentioned to basic words:

Emotion and atmospheres, this was something that Genesis had over all he rest of the bands 


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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 13:17
^ Actually, Ivan, there are some of us who listen to them from Trespass to CAS, and find something to enjoy in all of them

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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 13:49
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

^ Actually, Ivan, there are some of us who listen to them from Trespass to CAS, and find something to enjoy in all of them

Of course there are, but lets be honest, it's not so common.

Iván


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Posted By: Imperial Zeppelin
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 13:54
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

^ Actually, Ivan, there are some of us who listen to them from Trespass to CAS, and find something to enjoy in all of them
Actually, there are some of us that also like From Genesis to Revelation and think it is a great album.

Not me though LOL


-------------
"Hey there, Dog Man, now I drink from your bowl."


Posted By: Big Kid Josie
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 14:19
Thanks to everybody for their take on reasons for admiring Genesis...one that stands out to me, now that someone mentioned it, but that I didn't when I thought about the band is:  their great, self-contained stories in their lyrics (Hogweed, Cinema Show, Entangled, Ripples, Squonk, One for the Vine, Blood on the Rooftops).

They consistently wrote better lyrics and stories in their songs than any of the other "Big 7" prog bands of the 70's.

This is what I enjoy about this forum---all the different perspectives on my favorite music that helps me enjoy it even more.  Thanks, guys.   


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 14:23
Originally posted by Michael678 Michael678 wrote:

I'd pretty much agree with these statements regarding the love for Genesis, but I think they're not exactly one of the "all-time best" for me. King Crimson, Rush, Pink Floyd, and Yes are all higher than these guys for me.
I'm with you. What's all the hubbub about anyway.
Member's are starting to write love letters to this band."Oh Genesis. How do I love thee? Let me count the ways." Yucky! LOL


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 14:38
Originally posted by Imperial Zeppelin Imperial Zeppelin wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

^ Actually, Ivan, there are some of us who listen to them from Trespass to CAS, and find something to enjoy in all of them
Actually, there are some of us that also like From Genesis to Revelation and think it is a great album.

Not me though LOL

I like FGTTR more than any post W&W album.

Simple, naive but has some of the best piano performances and cleanest vocals.


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Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 17:15
Genesis, Floyd and Crimson are put on a pedestal in here for sure. Floyd and Crimson will never be top 10 bands to me because they never really had a strong composer

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All I like is prog related bands beginning late 60's/early 70's. Their music from 1968 - 83 has the composition and sound which will never be beaten. Perfect blend of jazz, classical, folk and rock.


Posted By: Svetonio
Date Posted: August 11 2015 at 23:52
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Genesis had some advantages

1.- In the early days they had no personal ego.....All the members played for the band, not for personal glory...They were a BAND not just a collection of stars trying to be better than the rest.

2.- They combined heavy material, with pastoral tunes and complex but accessible stuff.

3.- Peter had a unique charisma.

4.- They released 5 super albums in a row, hardly anybody did this (7 with the two first Collins releases)

5.- The lyrics were superb and created a mysterious atmosphere like nobody.

6.- They didn't abused of the epics, they were able to make in 6 or 10 minutes, what others did in 25. 

7.- Peter had a great communication with the audience.

8.- They were able to play their music on stage as well as in the studio albums.

9.- They quit Prog before they became a caricature of themselves.

10.- The adult contemporary era is clearly separated from the Prog era, while most of the bands started to became a hybrid.
Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap


Posted By: TheWillowFarmer
Date Posted: August 12 2015 at 00:03
I know I like all Genesis albums except for We Can't Dance, Calling All Stations and From Genesis to Revelation.


Posted By: symphonicman
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 19:24
Why so much Genesis love? One simple answer: emotion.


-------------
Master James of St. George.
Of the fields and the sky.
He used to build castles of stone, steel, and blood.
But lines get broken down.


Posted By: aglasshouse
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 20:00
My first record from them was their 1983 eponymous. It's pretty alright.

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http://fryingpanmedia.com


Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 21:27
Genesis was always very safe, very non-confrontational, very pleasant. Very little of their catalog verged on hard rock. Your parents would never get mad if you listened to Genesis. From a prog standpoint, they were not like Tull, who could piss your parents off by questioning Christianity and pointing out its hypocrisy, or Floyd with their occasional profanity, angry Roger Waters vocals and the psychedelic ambiance. Zappa also would be considered beyond the pale with the derogatory lyrics.
 
Genesis was just nice flowery prog with mythological asides, and they got safer the further they went until the 80s when your mum might actually hum a Phil Collins vocal. Safe as milk, but definitely not in the Captain Beefheart sense.Tongue


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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...


Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 21:52
Genesis is very popular because they appeal to the lowest common denominator of prog fans


Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 22:19
I don't necessarily disagree with that.  But it raises the question that how were so they successful if they were neither very bold nor hard rock-ing. See, Kansas was a pretty sheep like band too but at least they had a lot of rock in their sound.  What's the hook w.r.t Genesis.  


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 22:44
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Genesis was always very safe, very non-confrontational, very pleasant. Very little of their catalog verged on hard rock. Your parents would never get mad if you listened to Genesis. From a prog standpoint, they were not like Tull, who could piss your parents off by questioning Christianity and pointing out its hypocrisy, or Floyd with their occasional profanity, angry Roger Waters vocals and the psychedelic ambiance. Zappa also would be considered beyond the pale with the derogatory lyrics.
 
Genesis was just nice flowery prog with mythological asides, and they got safer the further they went until the 80s when your mum might actually hum a Phil Collins vocal. Safe as milk, but definitely not in the Captain Beefheart sense.Tongue

¿Are you sure?

Listen the  lyrics borderline with pedophilia feelings (Even when not pedophilia at all)



There are no stronger lyrics than this in all Prog

Lyrics like The Knife which are pure violence


I'll give you the names of those you must kill,
All must die with their children.
Carry their heads to the palace of old,
Hang them high, let the blood flow.
Now, in this ugly world
break all the chains around us,
Now, the crusade has begun
give us a land fit for heroes,
Now -

Desperation and claustrophobia

"In The Cage"

There's sunshine in my stomach
Like I just rocked my baby to sleep.
There's sunshine in my stomach
And I can't keep me from creeping sleep,
Sleep, deep in the deep.

Rockface moves to press my skin
White liquids turn sour within
Turn fast-turn sour
Turn sweat-turn sour.
Must tell myself that I'm not here.
I'm drowning in a liquid fear.
Bottled in a strong compression,
My distortion shows obsession
In the cave.
Get me out of this cave!

If I keep my self-control,
I'll be safe in my soul.
And the childhood belief
Brings a moment's relief,
But my cynic soon returns
And the lifeboat burns.
My spirit just never learns.

Stalactites, stalagmites
Shut me in, lock me tight.
Lips are dry, throat is dry.
Feel like burning, stomach churning,
I'm dressed up in a white costume
Padding out leftover room.
Body stretching, feel the wretching
In the cage
Get me out of this cage!

In the glare of a light,
I see a strange kind of sight;
Of cages joined to form a star
Each person can't go very far;
All tied to their things
They are netted by their strings,
Free to flutter in memories of their wasted wings.

Outside the cage I see my Brother John,
He turns his head so slowly round.
I cry out help! before he can be gone,
And he looks at me without a sound.
And I shout 'John please help me!'
But he does not even want to try to speak.
I'm helpless in my violent rage
And a silent tear of blood dribbles down his cheek,
And I watch him turn away and leave the cage.
My little runaway.

In a trap, feel a strap
Holding still. Pinned for kill.
Chances narrow that I'll make it,
In the cushioned straight-jacket.
Just like 22nd Street,
When they got me by my neck and feet.
Pressures building, can't take any more.
My headaches charge. My earaches roar.
In the pain
Get me out of this pain.

If I could change to liquid,
I could fill the cracks up in the rock.
But I know that I am solid
And I am my own bad luck.
But outside John disappears and my cage dissolves,
and without any reason my body revolves.

Keep on turning,
Keep on turning,
Turning around,
spinning around.

Hermaphrodite related 


The water tasted strangely sweet.
Behind him the voice called again.
He turned and saw her, in a cloak of mist alone
And as he gazed, her eyes were filled with the darkness of the lake.

[Salmacis:]
"We shall be one
We shall be joined as one"

[Narrator:]
"She wanted them as one
Yet he had no desire to be one"

[Hermaphroditus:]
"Away from me cold-blooded woman
Your thirst is not mine"

[Salmacis:]
"Nothing will cause us to part
Hear me, O Gods"

Unearthly calm descended from the sky
And then their flesh and bones were strangely merged
Forever to be joined as one.

The creature crawled into the lake.
[A fading voice was heard:]
"And I beg, yes I beg that all who touch this spring
May share my fate"

[Salmacis:]
"We are the one
We are the one"

[Narrator:]
"The two are now made one,
Demi-god and nymph are now made one"

Both had given everything they had.
A lover's dream had been fulfilled at last,
Forever still beneath the lake.

And as a bonus, the story in the back of Live 73

Quote 4:30 p.m. The tube train draws to a halt. There is no station in sight. Anxious glances dart around amongst the passengers as they acknowledge each other’s presence for the first time.

At the end of the train, a young lady in a green trouser suit stands up in the centre of the carriage and proceeds to unbutton her jacket, which she removes and drops to the dirty wooden floor. She also takes off her shoes, her trousers, her blouse, her brassiere, her tights and her floral panties, dropping them all in a neat pile. This leaves her totally naked.

She then moves her hands across her thighs and begins to fiddle around in between her legs. Eventually, she catches hold of something cold and metallic and very slowly, she starts to unzip her body; working in a straight line up the stomach, between the breasts, up the neck, taking it right on through the centre of her face to her forehead. Her fingers probe up and down the resulting slit finally coming to rest on either side of her navel. She pauses for a moment, before meticulously working her flesh apart. Slipping her right hand into the open gash, she pushes up through her throat, latching on to some buried solid at the top of her spine. With tremendous effort, she loosens and pulls out a thin, shimmering, golden rod. Her fingers release their grip and her crumbled body, neatly sliced, slithers down the liquid surface of the rod to the floor.

SPLAT!

The rod remains hovering just off the ground, a flagpole without flag.

The other passengers have been totally silent, but at the sound of the body dropping on the floor a large middle-aged lady wearing a pink dress and matching poodle stands up and shouts, “STOP THIS, ITS DISGUSTING!”

The golden rod disappeared; the green trouser-suit was left on a hanger with a dry-cleaning ticket pinned to the left arm.  On the ticket was written-

NAME…………………………….

ADDRESS………………………

…………………………………….

…………………………………….

…………………………………….

And of course the Art Cover of Nursery Cryme:



Quote “Well, the band really liked it. They thought it captured the spirit of the music. And Charisma Records were also very pleased with what they saw, as were the management. But the fan reaction was interesting. There were people who were genuinely shocked at what they saw on the cover. You can imagine what it was like in those days for the unsuspecting record browser. They would be going through the racks in their local record store when they'd be confronted by this image! It created quite a stir back then. Of course, this was before the slasher movies became popular. Now, the cover wouldn't get that sort of reaction at all. But in 1971, it was really seen as being controversial. All those heads on a croquet lawn. It's odd, because at the time I never painted this for any other reason than to represent the music. I had no clue it would be so contentious.”

https://www.teamrock.com/features/2015-02-11/cover-story-genesis-nursery-cryme

Not to talk about the story in Nursery Cryme:

Quote While Henry Hamilton-Smythe minor (8) was playing croquetwith Cynthia Jane De Blaise-William (9), sweet-smiling Cynthia
raised her mallet high and gracefully removed Henry's head.
Two weeks later, in Henry's nursery, she discovered his treasured
musical box. Eagerly she opened it and as "Old King Cole"
began to play, a small spirit- figure appeared. Henry had returned -
but not for long, for as he stood in the room his
body began ageing rapidly, leaving a child's mind inside. A lifetime's desires
surged through him. Unfortunately the attempt
to persuade Cynthia Jane to fulfill his romantic desire led his nurse to the nursery to investigate the noise. Instinctively Nanny hurled
the musical box at the bearded child, destroying both.

William Friedkin wanted to buy this story desperately for a horror movie, but the oppositionn of Tony (mainly) frustrated the negotiations. 

¿Soft songs?

Tull doesn't have a single song as hard as

- The Knife
- Watcher of the Skies
- Musical Box
- Get 'em out by Friday
- The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway
- In the Cage
- The Return of the Giant Hogweed

Genesis did anything except playing safe


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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 22:50
hahah..  oh where is the popcorn man


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 23:00
Let the battle begin!Evil Smile


Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 23:01
haha..  I'll give it to Ivan.. he sure makes Genesis sound interesting.. shame the group itself couldn't do that for themselves.


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 23:19
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Let the battle begin!Evil Smile

No battle, just pointed some FACTS


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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 23:32
if ever I run afoul of the law.. I want you beside me in the courtroom Ivan LOL


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: August 15 2015 at 23:59
Originally posted by TGM: Orb TGM: Orb wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


^Isn't that what I said?
Barring Italy of course. But still not a worldwide smash phenomenon.



True to an extent, though they were certainly a reasonably successful act in their time. The reputation has kind of gone the other way to, say, ELP, which were colossally supergiant at the time and have kind of suffered retrospectively.
ELP created great music but no lore, no mythology, no stories of consequence. Gong was certainly not any more successful than Genesis back in the heyday, but they fare well on PA not just because they made good music, but because they created (rather hilarious) mythology that was extremely consequential.


Posted By: The Sloth
Date Posted: August 16 2015 at 00:32
Melody, harmony, rhythm, and TASTE.


Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: August 16 2015 at 19:30
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

I don't necessarily disagree with that.  But it raises the question that how were so they successful if they were neither very bold nor hard rock-ing. See, Kansas was a pretty sheep like band too but at least they had a lot of rock in their sound.  What's the hook w.r.t Genesis.  


No major English language prog rock band was half as conceptually bold as Genesis with Gabriel and the band's whole sound has often been copied but noone's ever managed it because it's such a specific set-up for the members they've got.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: August 16 2015 at 21:54
Originally posted by Big Kid Josie Big Kid Josie wrote:

Thanks to everybody for their take on reasons for admiring Genesis...one that stands out to me, now that someone mentioned it, but that I didn't when I thought about the band is:  their great, self-contained stories in their lyrics (Hogweed, Cinema Show, Entangled, Ripples, Squonk, One for the Vine, Blood on the Rooftops).

They consistently wrote better lyrics and stories in their songs than any of the other "Big 7" prog bands of the 70's.

This is what I enjoy about this forum---all the different perspectives on my favorite music that helps me enjoy it even more.  Thanks, guys.   


Actually, their lyrics and stories are one of the main things that turn me off from many of their songs. Many stories (like Musical Box), I just don't like, none of it, and some others I might find interesting, but I just don't like the way they are described and the immages they put in my mind. Many times, I just prefer to ignore them and enjoy the music... or just not listen to them at all in the case of songs I don't like anyway.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: August 16 2015 at 22:01
Originally posted by Svetonio Svetonio wrote:

Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Genesis had some advantages

1.- In the early days they had no personal ego.....All the members played for the band, not for personal glory...They were a BAND <span style="line-height: 1.4;">not just a collection of stars trying to be better than the rest.</span>

2.- They combined heavy material, with pastoral tunes and complex but accessible stuff.

3.- Peter had a unique charisma.

4.- They released 5 super albums in a row, hardly anybody did this (7 with the two first Collins releases)

5.- The lyrics were superb and created a mysterious atmosphere like nobody.

6.- They didn't abused of the epics, they were able to make in 6 or 10 minutes, what others did in 25. 

7.- Peter had a great communication with the audience.

8.- They were able to play their music on stage as well as in the studio albums.

9.- They quit Prog before they became a caricature of themselves.

10.- The adult contemporary era is clearly separated from the Prog era, while most of the bands started to became a hybrid.




Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap


I don't really agree with point 4 (nor point 5 actually, but I just posted about it). There's about no single Genesis album I like as a whole... they all have at least one song I rather dislike. For me the band to really have such a line of masterpieces would be Pink Floyd... or at least almost. I would say Dark Side, Wish you were Here, and Animals are among my very favourite albums from any band. I guess I can include The Wall too, even though that one is somewhat lower in my apreciation, but still a monster of an album. And I could put Meddle there too, but it may be even a bit lower in my apreciation (a few songs I don't really like, though Echoes makes up for it), plus, I would have to ignore Obscured by Clouds (also nice, but not in the same league), which would actually be cheating. Actually, if I wanted to have a listen of 5 great albums from Floyd, I might start with Live at Pompeii instead of Meddle, and then go from Dark Side to The Wall.


Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: August 17 2015 at 11:58
Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:


I don't really agree with point 4 (nor point 5 actually, but I just posted about it). There's about no single Genesis album I like as a whole... they all have at least one song I rather dislike. For me the band to really have such a line of masterpieces would be Pink Floyd... or at least almost. I would say Dark Side, Wish you were Here, and Animals are among my very favourite albums from any band. I guess I can include The Wall too, even though that one is somewhat lower in my apreciation, but still a monster of an album. And I could put Meddle there too, but it may be even a bit lower in my apreciation (a few songs I don't really like, though Echoes makes up for it), plus, I would have to ignore Obscured by Clouds (also nice, but not in the same league), which would actually be cheating. Actually, if I wanted to have a listen of 5 great albums from Floyd, I might start with Live at Pompeii instead of Meddle, and then go from Dark Side to The Wall.


That's your taste, but most Prog fans (including myself) consider Genesis lyrics brilliant, but again, it's your taste.

But please, you create Pink Floyd streak deleting albums and choosing others, only Genesis has 7 masterpieces on a row, or at least 5.


Ivan

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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: August 17 2015 at 13:43
Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

Originally posted by Big Kid Josie Big Kid Josie wrote:

Thanks to everybody for their take on reasons for admiring Genesis...one that stands out to me, now that someone mentioned it, but that I didn't when I thought about the band is:  their great, self-contained stories in their lyrics (Hogweed, Cinema Show, Entangled, Ripples, Squonk, One for the Vine, Blood on the Rooftops).

They consistently wrote better lyrics and stories in their songs than any of the other "Big 7" prog bands of the 70's.

This is what I enjoy about this forum---all the different perspectives on my favorite music that helps me enjoy it even more.  Thanks, guys.   


Actually, their lyrics and stories are one of the main things that turn me off from many of their songs. Many stories (like Musical Box), I just don't like, none of it, and some others I might find interesting, but I just don't like the way they are described and the immages they put in my mind. Many times, I just prefer to ignore them and enjoy the music... or just not listen to them at all in the case of songs I don't like anyway.
Yeah, I'm aware of your disposition from past threads and there's no way for me to disabuse you of your opinion. I find it interesting, though, how you say you don't like the stories and the images they produce. I do recall you didn't like the description of the snake-like bodies of the lamia in The Lamia, as for example, and I do find that interesting, mostly because it's hard for me to relate to. The types of imagery you dislike really appeals to my boyish sense of adventure; not only adventure, but a unique "going where no one has tread before" sort of adventure. Admittedly some of it can be fairly mundane and unheroic, like Return of the Giant Hogweed, but they describe it with a driving sense of adventure, and my reaction to that is that it's brilliantly creative and entertaining that way, and darkly humorous. That's my perspective anyway.


Posted By: t d wombat
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 15:09
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

haha..  I'll give it to Ivan.. he sure makes Genesis sound interesting.. shame the group itself couldn't do that for themselves.


Low blow ..... Tongue

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

if ever I run afoul of the law.. I want you beside me in the courtroom Ivan LOL


I fought the Ivan and the Ivan won. Ouch




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Andrew B

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” ― Julius Henry Marx


Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 17:22
Because I love them (well, maybe not those last two albums [they're sucky]). A classic English band that showed personality and masterful skill in spades. Thank you, Peter, Phil, Mike, Steve, and Tony (and Chester wasn't that bad, either).

-------------
"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno


Posted By: Terakonin
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 19:12
For me, there's no mystery.

-------------
You left a note in your perfect script
Stay as long as you like
I haven't left your bed since


Posted By: TheWillowFarmer
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 22:25
What actually bugs me is how much hate the Collins-era Genesis albums after Wind & Wuthering get.

I don't like all of them, We Can't Dance for once is pretty bad save for the first three tracks in it, and I won't deny Abacab and And Then There Were Three suffer from having a handful of filler material. But Duke, the 1983 s/t and Invisible Touch are great pop albums imo, especially Duke, I'm one of these guys who claim Duke is still prog despite being poppier than the albums before it. As for the post-Duke albums, I always thought they had good pop music with some prog sensibilities, which is more apparent in songs like Dodo/Lurker, Me and Sarah Jane, Mama, the Home by the Sea suite, Tonight Tonight Tonight, Domino and Driving the Last Spike, all of these which happen to be my favorite tracks on the albums they came from.

Do I think they're as good as the Genesis albums from Nursery Cryme to A Trick of the Tail or Wind & Wuthering? Well, no, but I don't think they deserve to be as maligned as they are at all.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 22:50
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:


I don't really agree with point 4 (nor point 5 actually, but I just posted about it). There's about no single Genesis album I like as a whole... they all have at least one song I rather dislike. For me the band to really have such a line of masterpieces would be Pink Floyd... or at least almost. I would say Dark Side, Wish you were Here, and Animals are among my very favourite albums from any band. I guess I can include The Wall too, even though that one is somewhat lower in my apreciation, but still a monster of an album. And I could put Meddle there too, but it may be even a bit lower in my apreciation (a few songs I don't really like, though Echoes makes up for it), plus, I would have to ignore Obscured by Clouds (also nice, but not in the same league), which would actually be cheating. Actually, if I wanted to have a listen of 5 great albums from Floyd, I might start with Live at Pompeii instead of Meddle, and then go from Dark Side to The Wall.


That's your taste, but most Prog fans (including myself) consider Genesis lyrics brilliant, but again, it's your taste.

But please, you create Pink Floyd streak deleting albums and choosing others, only Genesis has 7 masterpieces on a row, or at least 5.


Ivan


Yeah, it's my taste, just as liking those lyrics is your's. For me, I much prefer Waters Lyrics over Gabriel's, but then again that's my taste. Surely if we make a poll here, Gabriel would win as a lyricist... if we made a poll among classic rock fans in general, then surely Pink Floyd would win by a huge margin. And about the streak, well, my first statement was that I didn't consider any of Genesis albums as a masterpiece, because they all have something I don't like (and I do am aware that I'm talking about my own taste), so 4 masterpiece albums in a row from Floyd is more than that. And many here might actually consider Obscured by Clouds as a masterpiece too, so that would make it 5 albums, and if you already got ObC into the streak, you would surely have to include Meddle too, that makes 6. And from there, it wouldn't be too difficult to find people adding Atom Heart Mother and/or The Final cut into the streak, making it into a 7 or 8 album streak. And then, there's just about no album I don't enjoy listening from them, which is not the case with Genesis, or mostly any other band around. But then again, it all comes down to our personal tastes.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: August 18 2015 at 22:56
Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

Originally posted by Big Kid Josie Big Kid Josie wrote:

Thanks to everybody for their take on reasons for admiring Genesis...one that stands out to me, now that someone mentioned it, but that I didn't when I thought about the band is:  their great, self-contained stories in their lyrics (Hogweed, Cinema Show, Entangled, Ripples, Squonk, One for the Vine, Blood on the Rooftops).

They consistently wrote better lyrics and stories in their songs than any of the other "Big 7" prog bands of the 70's.

This is what I enjoy about this forum---all the different perspectives on my favorite music that helps me enjoy it even more.  Thanks, guys.   


Actually, their lyrics and stories are one of the main things that turn me off from many of their songs. Many stories (like Musical Box), I just don't like, none of it, and some others I might find interesting, but I just don't like the way they are described and the immages they put in my mind. Many times, I just prefer to ignore them and enjoy the music... or just not listen to them at all in the case of songs I don't like anyway.
Yeah, I'm aware of your disposition from past threads and there's no way for me to disabuse you of your opinion. I find it interesting, though, how you say you don't like the stories and the images they produce. I do recall you didn't like the description of the snake-like bodies of the lamia in The Lamia, as for example, and I do find that interesting, mostly because it's hard for me to relate to. The types of imagery you dislike really appeals to my boyish sense of adventure; not only adventure, but a unique "going where no one has tread before" sort of adventure. Admittedly some of it can be fairly mundane and unheroic, like Return of the Giant Hogweed, but they describe it with a driving sense of adventure, and my reaction to that is that it's brilliantly creative and entertaining that way, and darkly humorous. That's my perspective anyway.


Perhaps I dislike them just because it's hard for me to relate. And it's strange, for I do like fantasy and mythology a lot, but it's just about the way Gabriel describes things. I don't really like this kind of humour and so... I guess I like my music more serious. And if such lyrics end up on a song I don't really like to begin with (like Giant Hogweed), well, there's no hope for me there. Perhaps what you describe as a boyish sense of adventure might seem as childish for me... and I have never really liked childish stuff (in a way, not even when I was a child... up to a certain point, of course).


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: August 23 2015 at 21:31
I saw Genesis perform at the "Spectrum" in Philadelphia on the "Wind and Wuthering" tour. One of the tightest bands I've ever seen. I hold them in the highest regard for that alone! Not one indication of a mistake on any instrument or forgetfulness of breaks within arrangements. Just amazing! The mix was incredible and they were so great ..I just cracked up...I mean..I could not believe it. It was like seeing many other bands that reached a certain peak from traveling the road and doing a entire show like second nature. Example: An outstanding show by Jethro Tull or Yes. It was very much like that and kept you on the edge of your seat. They had such an amazing high level of perfected dynamics in music. It was very impressive how the band went from soft to loud ...and or the dynamic build up of volumes on the instruments ..gradually progressing was very Classical oriented. Some people in the audience would get jaded during a section of music that was soft and gentle. "One For The Vine"  in particular and that can be attributed to the times we were living in. If people were bored, they would light up some smoke and prepare for the more exciting parts. Professional Classically trained musicians from Philadelphia were in the audience to observe the band and learn from the experience of hearing the band live. They were forming cover bands ..playing Genesis music up and down the east coast of the U.S. to make a good living...and additionally forming original Progressive Rock bands of their own ...which some were signed in the late 70's during the downfall of when Prog was originally promoted in the media. 


Genesis were an important band to a majority of trained musicians in the 70's who took music seriously...or took themselves very seriously..Lol! I was part of the music scene when Happy The Man and Nektar played clubs and theaters. I was basically on the road all of the time and skilled musicians sat in dressing rooms, playing "Entangled", "Dance On A Volcano" or "Watcher Of The Skies" and playing those songs ...not any worse, but maybe as good or better than Genesis, regarding their personal embellishments they added on their own. This was part of the development within the second wave of Prog, (maybe wrong?), but Genesis were a huge influence on thousands of American musicians in the 70's. All sorts of vocalists I knew from the road were classically trained and experienced in acting. They bought the costumes of Peter Gabriel and emulated his vocal tone to the max, and doing a set of Genesis material in a Rock club that was so packed, you couldn't even get to the bathroom before you had to enter the stage again. They were much better than many of the tribute bands of today. They just came out of music college and others had been playing Jazz and Broadway material in N.Y. Everybody around me was learning Genesis material at that time. When "A Trick Of The Tail" had been released ..musicians were blowing up each other's phones. It was ridiculous! Musicians knew that Gabriel had left and doubted the future of the band. A Trick Of The Tail completely chopped that theory in half and dozens of cover/original bands spent long afternoons trying to tighten up "Dance On A Volcano". So...that is the insight I offer from a time period when Genesis completely tore off the heads of musicians. Gentle Giant were very influential to American musicians and they became popular in Philadelphia ..to a degree...where they were talked about all the time. In art galleries , record shops, and concerts. It was short lived and probably because they didn't gain popularity on the east coast until the release of "The Power and the Glory"...where the difference lies within years prior to that ..when Genesis had already established a devoted following.


Posted By: prog4evr
Date Posted: August 24 2015 at 03:29
Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

This is almost an impossible question because it is not about why I like/love Genesis, but why everyone else does too. My guess is that many like me discovered Prog through Genesis and thereby became the gold standard. I have always found their stature to be equivalent to Yes, but with better stories, better drama. Their playing is not quite as virtuoso-ish as ELP, but with more consistently better song(/instrumental) writing. Their song writing is equivalent in quality to Pink Floyd, but with better more intricate playing. I have always found their stature less than that of King Crimson Among Prog pundits, but there was a warmth to Genesis not found in KC (not at least until Wetton or Belew). Their instrumental work was more intricate than Jethro Tull. Rush is just plain different, nuff said about that.

Genesis were the first Prog band, to my knowledge, accrue a line tribute bands (unless we're counting the Beatles). This tends to indicate that they were quickly associated with a "golden age", most likely motivated by the sense of loss from PG's and to a lesser extent HF's departures. Genesis were also superior to many many other bands in terms of storytelling, but with their movement toward Pop came a movement away from that sort of storytelling, which brought a desire for the return of the old lore. Notice how many more references (like that of Hogweed and such) can be pulled out of Genesis material in a fashion that is widely recognizable across the PA spectrum.

^^THIS^^  (Well-stated, Hackett Fan...)


Posted By: Rando
Date Posted: August 30 2015 at 14:19
Originally posted by TODDLER TODDLER wrote:

I saw Genesis perform at the "Spectrum" in Philadelphia on the "Wind and Wuthering" tour. One of the tightest bands I've ever seen. I hold them in the highest regard for that alone! Not one indication of a mistake on any instrument or forgetfulness of breaks within arrangements. Just amazing! The mix was incredible and they were so great ..


Genesis were an important band to a majority of trained musicians in the 70's who took music seriously...or took themselves very seriously..Lol! I was part of the music scene when Happy The Man and Nektar played clubs and theaters. I was basically on the road all of the time and skilled musicians sat in dressing rooms, playing "Entangled", "Dance On A Volcano" or "Watcher Of The Skies" and playing those songs ...not any worse, but maybe as good or better than Genesis, regarding their personal embellishments they added on their own. This was part of the development within the second wave of Prog, (maybe wrong?), but Genesis were a huge influence on thousands of American musicians in the 70's. All sorts of vocalists I knew from the road were classically trained and experienced in acting. They bought the costumes of Peter Gabriel and emulated his vocal tone to the max, and doing a set of Genesis material in a Rock club that was so packed, you couldn't even get to the bathroom before you had to enter the stage again. They were much better than many of the tribute bands of today. They just came out of music college and others had been playing Jazz and Broadway material in N.Y. Everybody around me was learning Genesis material at that time. When "A Trick Of The Tail" had been released ..musicians were blowing up each other's phones. It was ridiculous! Musicians knew that Gabriel had left and doubted the future of the band. A Trick Of The Tail completely chopped that theory in half and dozens of cover/original bands spent long afternoons trying to tighten up "Dance On A Volcano". So...that is the insight I offer from a time period when Genesis completely tore off the heads of musicians.


And true...
I've mentioned this before in past posts some years ago, but I (and two friends) were very fortunate to have seen Genesis Selling England show at the Roxy in LA...Then in January 74 caught The Lamb show in Berkeley...we followed them back to LA and saw The Lamb again at the now famous Shrine show. Three outstanding concerts in every aspect. Perhaps because it was LA, the audience at the Shrine show felt more electrified (at times a little rowdy) but embraced The Lamb, and still we weren't disappointed as they came back for two encores, The Musical Box, and Watcher Of The Skies.

We had also seen Pink Floyd, EL&P, and Yes, but there was no comparison the lasting effect the Genesis shows had left us with. At the time we were three music students at the university and we couldn't wait to get back home to learn how to play Watcher Of The Skies, Cinema Show, or the piano intro to The Lamb! No, we didn't become a tribute band but as Toddler mentioned how Genesis became an important band to "trained musicians in the 70's" Genesis to us became the most important and best Progressive Rock band, musically, lyrically, and conceptually.

Smile


-------------
- Music is Life, that's why our hearts have beats -


Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: August 30 2015 at 15:50
Early Genesis turned me into a zombie prog pod person.  I had enjoyed prog bits here and there there but in the late '70's it was what really got me baby.  There were parts of Trespass that gave me goosebumps despite listening to it on a crappy little portable turntable with built in speakers.  Yeah they crapped out by going commercial but they made substantial music when it mattered in my life.


Posted By: uduwudu
Date Posted: September 11 2015 at 21:27
Genesis made enjoyable music whether the involved epic or the harder edged sounds in the 80s onwards. They sound impressive and contain lots off details. The epics have the details going on, the songs have the details inside and happen relatively quickly. But their career is in a capsule and not growing or ... changing. (Jaws theme). Some like change, many don't and resist change. Can't change that.

Odd really as progression implies change. Lyrically PG's sci fi orientation captures (or not) the imagination. Lyrical direction was changed as Gabriel was no longer around. I thought the others did very well lyrically and the musical variety was explored more e.g. the difference between Dance On A Volcano and Entangled. The expected direction from Genesis turns up in the latter day epics; sort of historical works such as Driving The Last Spike and story metaphors such as One For The Vine. I think they became more direct with And Then There Were Three. a very cynically themed album. Always thought it should have been a 2 LP set really. There were a lot of ideas (Undertow) that may have benefited form musical exploration - it was like a great prog rock album but with truncated numbers. Then again I thought, and still do that Seconds Out should have been a 3 LP set and Live a 2 LP. But I'm like that. More is more. No changes there.

I'm fine with Hogweed (the number not that plant I found in the Royal gardens at Kew) or Follow You Follow Me. These guys are good at so much. Frightening and friendly. Or in the case of the Lamb, scary and funny (bizarre).

Too many changes for the CAS era perhaps. One possible observation of the failure of CAS was in that critical aspect - the drumming. Nir Zidkyahu was fine but very different to Collins. New voice and new drums was too much. So goodbye changing Genesis. Hello unchanging capsule.

Perhaps over familiarity with playing the same records and a resentment when the changes are too great for prog fans' pop sensibilities means time's up. Or maybe the demands on someone's time as an adult means less time to devote to playing the same record constantly until you like it.

Once upon a time a rock and roll artist by the name of Ricky Nelson went on a come back tour, early '80s or so. He had a new album for his devoted followers. They turned up to the gigs but the album tanked. The fans only wanted what they knew from the '50s. They did not respect the artist just wanted repetitive audio wall paper.

Not a new thing, look at the conflicts with  changes in Floyd, Yes and Genesis. Oh, and to a lesser extent Crimson from 1981 being different from 69 - 74. Perhaps it's not so much the music as what listeners associate with it. Changes to that makes them look at their lives and time and it's unsettling. The old days are always best. Can't change those.




Posted By: O666
Date Posted: September 12 2015 at 10:05

I think Hackett's "Genesis Revisiteds" are part of "Number of Genesis Lovers" and you can't ignore that. Most of Revisited's musicians are Prog stars and have many fans around the world (like S.Wilson). There are many Genesis's "Influeced Band" to "Copycat Band" and these bands have their own fans. Every 2,3 years release VA "Genesis tribute albums". 



Posted By: geekfreak
Date Posted: November 11 2015 at 02:50
I`m a fan of a Genesis freak like most here. even the Hackett`s " Genesis Revisited " albums... even the fans whom production of there own progressive rock music like Stevie Wilson do have there Collins era whom call them albums Collins Backing Band as most of the album where more pop than progressive rock, there where the odd two/three  tracks which where PROG!...

-------------
Friedrich Nietzsche: "Without music, life would be a mistake."



Music Is Live

Two people are better off than one, for they can help each other succeed.



Keep Calm And Listen To The Music…
<


Posted By: TheLionOfPrague
Date Posted: November 12 2015 at 17:52
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:


I don't really agree with point 4 (nor point 5 actually, but I just posted about it). There's about no single Genesis album I like as a whole... they all have at least one song I rather dislike. For me the band to really have such a line of masterpieces would be Pink Floyd... or at least almost. I would say Dark Side, Wish you were Here, and Animals are among my very favourite albums from any band. I guess I can include The Wall too, even though that one is somewhat lower in my apreciation, but still a monster of an album. And I could put Meddle there too, but it may be even a bit lower in my apreciation (a few songs I don't really like, though Echoes makes up for it), plus, I would have to ignore Obscured by Clouds (also nice, but not in the same league), which would actually be cheating. Actually, if I wanted to have a listen of 5 great albums from Floyd, I might start with Live at Pompeii instead of Meddle, and then go from Dark Side to The Wall.


That's your taste, but most Prog fans (including myself) consider Genesis lyrics brilliant, but again, it's your taste.

But please, you create Pink Floyd streak deleting albums and choosing others, only Genesis has 7 masterpieces on a row, or at least 5.


Ivan

Obscured by Clouds is a soundtrack, so it's not really cheating. Anyway, I think Genesis made more great albums than any other band outside Floyd. Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot, Selling England by the Pound, The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway and A Trick of the Tail are all amazing. Trespass, Wind and Wuthering and And Then There Were Three a bit below but still very good.


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I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place


Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: November 13 2015 at 15:24
Well, it's pretty obvious they are popular here because they were one of the original prog bands that became well known (though oddly, less for prog than for their later pop).  They are a hugely famous band that probably led many people to prog who might not have been led to it (I'm thinking of friends who adored the 80's albums and decided to see what they had done before).  Whether individuals here like them or not, it's impossible to deny their tremendous influence on the prog world.  I mean, what other band was responsible for an entire resurgence of the prog sound (80's neo prog owes far more to 70's Genesis than any other 70 prog bands)?  What other band has been more copied in style and songwriting approach?  Yes might come close on that last one, but I've certainly heard far more bands heavily influenced by 70's Genesis than influenced by 70's Yes.

Also, they were a great, original band with a unique stage show for their time.  Their songs were very well composed and performed, with interesting, intelligent lyrics.  What more could you want? Wink


Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: November 19 2015 at 08:35
I am just now getting into Genesis. Like someone here once said, (paraphrase) Genesis just clicked with me. I get it now. I've been absorbing everything I can from Trespass though Duke.
Just amazing stuff. Musical Box blows my mind. Watcher of the Skies and Supper's Ready as well. So much more to dig into though. Should be fun



Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: November 19 2015 at 09:38
Originally posted by uduwudu uduwudu wrote:

......
Once upon a time a rock and roll artist by the name of Ricky Nelson went on a come back tour, early '80s or so. He had a new album for his devoted followers. They turned up to the gigs but the album tanked. The fans only wanted what they knew from the '50s. They did not respect the artist just wanted repetitive audio wall paper.



I had that single on a '45'.....Embarrassed
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_Party_%28Rick_Nelson_song" rel="nofollow - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_Party_(Rick_Nelson_song )


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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin


Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: November 19 2015 at 09:54
Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:

I am just now getting into Genesis. Like someone here once said, (paraphrase) Genesis just clicked with me. I get it now. I've been absorbing everything I can from Trespass though Duke.
Just amazing stuff. Musical Box blows my mind. Watcher of the Skies and Supper's Ready as well. So much more to dig into though. Should be fun

Welcome to the club!

-------------
"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno



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