Gentle Giant Missing 8-Track master Tapes
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Forum Description: General progressive music discussions
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=105010
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Topic: Gentle Giant Missing 8-Track master Tapes
Posted By: pitfall
Subject: Gentle Giant Missing 8-Track master Tapes
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 15:14
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I was reading recently in Prog magazine about Steve Wilson re-mixing Gentle Giant's LP's, and that he had to do it from the 2-track tapes because of the 'unavailability' of the original multi-track master tapes. This reminded me of the reason for that 'unavailability' and the part that I played in it. In the early '80's my friend and keyboard player in our band was the engineer at Advision Studios, and we were recording tracks there for our album under the name of Tea. One day he asked me to come into the studio to lend him moral and physical support in undertaking a task which had been given to him by the management. It turned out that Advision were going to dispose of their old and now unused Scully 8-track machine, and had told him to destroy the dozens of reel to reel masters that were recorded on it. Like me, he was a massive fan of Gentle Giant - and among those tapes were the original recordings of our favourite albums, Music In A Glasshouse, The Power And The Glory, Free Hand etc. etc. He didn't feel up to doing this on his own, so he roped me in to help out. There were, as far as I can remember, 40 - 50 masters, and my first reaction on seeing the ones fro GG was to suggest that we might save them from destruction, but he said that that was more than his job was worth. So we spent many hours during the night listening to a selection of the masters in detail for one very last time, especially what we thought were the best ones. And then we set to work with razor blades.
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Replies:
Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 15:24
Bloody hell. Advision Studios bosses, you will reap karmic justice for this  . Reincarnation as a tapeworm seems appropriate.pitfall, I'm sorry you had to be party to such wilful stupidity. |
Posted By: GKR
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 15:50
This is such a sad story.  ------------- - From each according to his ability, to each according to his need. |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 15:57
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The destruction of any art is senseless and mindless.....especially music, it can never be duplicated again with that emotion and feeling in the studio. -------------   
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Posted By: pitfall
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 16:18
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Too true. I felt bad enough at the time, but the sadness has grown over the years. Maybe if I had snuck one away it would have been unplayable before too long - they were stored in a temperature and humidity controlled room, which is something I have never had.
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Posted By: garfunkel
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 17:21
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This makes me sad. So are they still designated as "missing"? Does anyone other than the one's involved know about this? |
Posted By: poeghost
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 18:48
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Oh no! This makes me sad. Gentle Giant made such wonderful music! Couldn't they have given the tapes to the band!? This reminds me of how some of the early Doctor Who episodes were destroyed. |
Posted By: progrockdeepcuts
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 18:51
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This is heartbreaking. ------------- Listen to older shows here: mixcloud.com/progrockdeepcuts/ |
Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 19:45
I just couldn't have brought myself to do it  ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Posted By: progrockdeepcuts
Date Posted: November 29 2015 at 22:14
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So, if Power and the Glory was among the destroyed multitracks, what did SW use to remix it last year? ------------- Listen to older shows here: mixcloud.com/progrockdeepcuts/ |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: November 30 2015 at 06:18
| This is a crime on a par with the BBC recording over some classic TV programmes so they could reuse the tapes (not your fault though, pitfall). |
Posted By: unclemeat69
Date Posted: November 30 2015 at 08:08
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So, the copyright on those recording are (presumably) still owned by the record company but that record company doesn't care enough about those recordings to hold the actual tapes containing those recordings..... Interesting...... Why didn't the recording studio hand over those tapes to either the band or the record company? ------------- Follow your bliss |
Posted By: Manuel
Date Posted: November 30 2015 at 09:43
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A sad story indeed. Imagine what could be done with those tapes nowadays? If we only could for-see the implications of our actions!!!!!
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 20:35
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I blame SWilson... the new antichrist of prog. if he wouldn't have messed around with remastering every damn prog album.. we all would have have safely and blissfully ignorant. I don't know about you all.. my copies still sound good. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: sublime220
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 20:38
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While I can agree with you on his poor solo output, his remixes actually sound fantastic, particularly the 2013 stereo remix of Red. ------------- There is no dark side in the moon, really... Matter of fact, it's all dark... |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 20:48
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I probably should check one out and see how much of a difference a remix really makes. I really can say I'm not sitting around listening to this album or that one thinking to myself.. man.. I wish SWilson would do a 6.5 remix of this one. Perhaps it is like sex though.. you don't know what you are missing until you experience it. Perhaps someday he'll do an album I adore and I'll see what the fuss is about. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 21:28
That's really sad to hear. But since they were mastered for LPs, aka, also known as vinyls by most kids who weren't around at the time, then they must have been made perfect so it should be a simple matter of recording those records back to digital and with a good program fake extracting things and surround sounding them. If anyone can do it Steve can! Yeah I'm being half silly and half serious. but I do have a lot of trust in Steven's talents. Plus I really miss the way 8-tracks conveniently truncated things into four parts instead of relying of the natural divisions that the musicians had originally considered like the sides to an LP or a 45...  Mickey, just saying, but I really do appreciate the way a good surround sound mix can enhance an album that you might have already become way too familiar with... ------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 21:36
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I do have a surround sound system here.. but probably not used to fully capacity. I'll have to check it out. Then again.. I still need to upgrade to a smart phone. I do like things nice and simple. Isn't music supposed to sound scratchy and imperfect. I think many RPI albums actually sound better for their particular lo-fi recordings. oh well. Some day.. I did only take the step up to a GPS last year.. next will be a smart phone. then perhaps SWilson 7.2 remixes. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 21:42
I dragged my feet to cell phone and "smart" phone and don't regret it. I have two functioning surround systems. One home computer in the music room and one home theater in the family room. No regrets other than my wife never lets me crank up the family/living room one when she is around. But I get by.  then there's that whole personal battle about whether or not I should watch something surround or stereo video. Aieeee!!!!------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: garfunkel
Date Posted: December 02 2015 at 21:45
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Hey Micky, I think we're in the same boat. I don't care much for high audio quality at all, even though I know stuff would sound better with the equipment, I just want the music! |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: December 03 2015 at 11:49
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The other main point in remastering/remixing/reissuing older recordings in any format....is to keep these glorious recordings available for future generations....Digital technology will help this, sure there are still some things that digital does not do good, but it is getting better. Some of these reissues are being done because the original recording/mastering were not done well. Back in the early 70's audio gear may not have "shown" these inadequacies. But with today's advanced audio gear, especially digital, it's clear these recordings are pretty bad. Steven Wilson is just one of these guys taking great care to bring out more of the music that is hiding on some of these old tapes, Nick Davis is another one. His remixing work on the early Genesis albums is stellar.... Whether you like to hear your music on audio gear that brings out all the small nuances or tidbits or every sniffle of the musician, or if you are fine listening thru 2" laptop speakers.....Does not matter, but having these recordings around for possibly forever is very important. -------------
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Posted By: Meltdowner
Date Posted: December 03 2015 at 11:54
I used to think like that, until I heard music from an high-end analogue set up. I've been working on upgrading my sound system since then, and it's totally worth it  I have the SW's mix of PATG and I'm very happy with it: it has a great 5.1 mix and also the original stereo mix and SW's stereo mix on 24/96. I bought Octopus the other day
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garfunkel wrote: