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Are most prog lovers musicians ?

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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=112746
Printed Date: April 24 2024 at 09:57
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Topic: Are most prog lovers musicians ?
Posted By: Jzrk
Subject: Are most prog lovers musicians ?
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 18:11
I am not a musician but love music.Prog is one of my favorite genres.
It seems that prog would be most appreciated by musicians and maybe I am not a normal prog fan?
Even more so on a forum.So am I alone or I wonder what the mix is here in these parts?
I did my best to play some instruments in my childhood but was really never any good .It did not come natural to me and maybe it was too hard to progress so I ended up dropping playing.



Replies:
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 19:26
I wish. 

I struggle at drums, all thumbs on keys
.... bum on a guitar, saxophone sleaze, 
bumbling bass, always off key
My flute took flight though I got music degrees
 I can't carry a note... Son, so don't play like me
...Jack of all trades, master of none. 


Posted By: ReactioninG
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 20:20
I am not a musician and do not come from a musical family. Still, I have always loved prog since as far back as I can remember. 

I think one advantage of not being musically knowledgeable is that I can concentrate more on the themes, moods and lyrics and the overall musical product. I feel like it would bog someone down to concentrate on what this or that instrument is doing or whether it is being done well or in what time signature. 


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 20:32
Guitarist here. Playing guitar has, in fact, made me appreciate a lot of prog that I would not have cared for otherwise.

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https://gamecrazyprofessional.weebly.com/


Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 20:50
No, no more than most jazz, classical, folk. country or pop fans are.
Indeed, we can extend this to art gallery patrons: most are not artists
Theatre goers: most are not actors.
Readers: most are not writers.

Etc.

I have known many Prog fans--one plays guitar and sings (and it's not Prog).

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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.


Posted By: Manuel
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 20:54
For a while, I remember listening the phrase "Music for Musicians" when referring to Progressive music. I play guitar, Mandolin, Laud and a little piano. I played in a few bands here and there for a while, but I think my main influence in choosing music to listen to instead of music to dance to, was my grandfather, who was a classical musician, and who taught me how to listen and understand music. 


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: January 23 2018 at 23:07
I am musician, I play guitar, bass and drums, but I am not been almost any musical schools, learned mostly myself. I donīt think itīs nothing to do are you musician or not when liking prog. My brother is lot better musician than I and heīs not liking prog much. And my band of this moment doesnīt play prog at all. I know also guys who like a lot prog but doesnīt play anything.


Posted By: Squonk19
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 00:02
I wish too.... A touch of bass when I was younger, but nothing else. My teenage son plays some excellent electric/acoustic guitar and got effects pedals for his birthday. My daughter played piano for many years but that has eased since she started university.

I am so impressed by people who can play instruments. Music - whether prog or classic rock, modern jazz or classical - remains my first love (as a young John Miles once said). Sadly I am an interested by-stander - but it's a pretty good view!

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“Living in their pools, they soon forget about the sea.”


Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 00:27
I thought I was at one time. It has become quite apparent that I am far more proficient at listening to music than performing it.

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https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp


Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 01:40
I'm a mediocre drummer. I barely class myself as a musician. Can't play anything else and can't read/write music.

I started to like to like prog rock before learning to play drums. The music spoke for itself. I didn't need a musical grounding to appreciate it. I just happened to respond emotionally to it. Once I figured out the meaning of time signatures and key changes it almost spoilt the magic tbh. I almost preferred composition to be magical and mysterious rather than essentially based in maths. I suspect that doesn't make sense to anyone here

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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!


Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 02:05
This topic has come up before and the answer is always 'no'.


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Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to.
http://bandcamp.com/jpillbox" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp Profile


Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 02:11
I'm a semi-professional bass player out of Boston. I've played and recorded with dozens of bands, but not enough to make an actual living (I'm fine with this!). I always said prog makes more sense if you can count meters, but it's not a prerequisite for enjoyment!

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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021


Posted By: I prophesy disaster
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 02:47
I don't know where I stand with this question. I've dabbled with music and music theory but I wouldn't call myself a musician.

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No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.


Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 03:33
I'm a bass player. I think being a musician helps you to appreciate the skill of prog musicians, but it's not essential.


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 04:24
As a sound and recording engineer, it was essential for me to at least have a basic understanding of music in order to know tempos, song keys, the number of bars, etc., etc. But I've never thought that one had to be a musician to enjoy music. Many of my friends can't play along with spoons, but they love prog!

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This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.


Posted By: I prophesy disaster
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 05:25
I don't think one has to be a musician to enjoy prog, but maybe those who enjoy prog are also those who enjoy making music.

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No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.


Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 05:36
I'm not sure I'd enjoy lobster bisque more if I knew how to make it. The same thing applies to music...but there is and has always been a small portion of musicians who vehemently believes that only musicians who've passed through a certain level of instrumental prowess are capable of enjoying complex music to its fullest (we've certainly had a few of them on here through the years). That is bs though. Enjoyment can have something to do with understanding but I feel experiencing the same thing head-on, without any muffling notions of how on earth this or that note is played or if it indeed is a waltz rhythm, can be just as meaningful.
Knowing how to speak meter and chord is however very helpful if you're about to analyse the music afterwards. 


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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams


Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 07:15
I sing, but cannot play an instrument.

My stepson is a really good bassist and practises on prog pieces a lot (Hysteria, Roundabout, YYZ, a lot of Marillion and Riverside). He now listens to a lot of prog as a result.


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A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.


Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 08:09
Hi,

Strange bananas!

Is there no "other" music out there? I'm curious how one can "like" one thing and not the other ... it's all music, is my thinking.


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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 08:50
^ Confused

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This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.


Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 09:03
ben non.

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Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 09:18
No, but I think most frog lovers are magicians!

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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.


Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 09:58
Originally posted by Peter Peter wrote:

No, but I think most frog lovers are magicians!  

This is the correct answer! Tongue


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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021


Posted By: Argo2112
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 11:40
I play drums & I think that's part of the reason prog appeals to me so much .
So many great drummers in prog bands.
That being said I know a lot of non musicians that love prog & a lot of musicians that don't care for it.


Posted By: Progosopher
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 12:17
Probably not.  I play guitar but since I have mostly played for my own enjoyment, I have a unique style but I cannot say I am a good musician.  I have played in a few bands in the distant past and have enjoyed some quality jam sessions.  I have also dabbled in bass, mandolin, and flute but cannot claim any proficiency.  Most of those I know who like Prog have also dabbled with playing.  One of my old friends and bandmates, however, who is quite proficient at bass, guitar, and mandolin no longer enjoys Prog and is in many ways opposed to it.  He even went so far once as to call Kansas, one of his favorite bands as a teenager, Vogon poetry.  A little familiarity with how music works, though, enhances ones enjoyment of Prog by revealing many of its intricacies.

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The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"


Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 12:39
I am a very capable amateur guitar player. I liked Prog as a teenager, which motivated me to learn guitar. I played guitar throughout my 20s, then gave it up in my 30s. After I took it up again it expanded my interest in music to Classical and Jazz. "Most" Prog lovers are not musicians, but whether there is some elevated tendency is an emperical question that won't be decided without careful sampling, contrastive comparison with other genres, and statistical analysis.

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A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)


Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 12:44
Okay, that's settled (once more) with a "no."

Now: are most meat lovers also hunters?
First, let's hear from the great cats. Can we get a show of paws? (Count them.)....

-------------
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.


Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 13:57
My dog loves catching a frisbee even though she doesn't understand Newton's Third Law of motion or the Bernoulli Principle Wink


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https://wytchcrypt.wixsite.com/mutiny-in-jonestown" rel="nofollow - Mutiny in Jonestown : Progressive Rock Since 1987


Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 14:05
#Not me


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Posted By: Jzrk
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 20:25
Thanks for all the replies! Not that I was expecting a actual answer to the question,but nice to hear from all!
I know a lot of non musicians who enjoy great musicianship and prog can be part of that.But a lot of musicians don’t care for it either so it probably still all comes back to taste.


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: January 24 2018 at 22:52
Originally posted by Peter Peter wrote:



Now: are most meat lovers also hunters?
.
I think they should be Wink


Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 02:09
Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

My dog loves catching a frisbee even though she doesn't understand Newton's Third Law of motion or the Bernoulli Principle Wink

Dude, my dog knows calculus, and it greatly improves his appreciation of the sport of frisbee! Wink LOL 


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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021


Posted By: Davesax1965
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 07:12
Most musicians aren't musicians, to be honest. 

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Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 07:58
^Hereīs one!Smile But anyway I really like to play.


Posted By: Davesax1965
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 08:15
:-)

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Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 08:19
Classical guitarist here.
Started back in the 70's.
Played in punk bands in the 80's.
Retired in the 90's.
Returned as a freak-folk, death-indie acoustic act in the 2000's.
Retired again.


Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 10:23
not really--and I'm not a musician-- but I have found musicians who hear good prog can appreciate the playing even if they are not a fan of the type of music.


Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 10:44
I would say that probably at least half are or at least it sure seems that way. I'm sort of in between myself. I own two musical instruments(guitar and keyboards)but don't play very well. I'm trying to teach myself to read music but as it stands right now I do not consider myself a musician.


Posted By: Cosmiclawnmower
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 13:34
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

I thought I was at one time. It has become quite apparent that I am far more proficient at listening to music than performing it.

Me tooLOLWink


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Posted By: Cosmiclawnmower
Date Posted: January 25 2018 at 13:57
Of course you don't have to be a musician to 'appreciate' music. Being a musician presumably helps you understand it from a technical, 'nuts and bolts' perspective but 'appreciation' is something unique and deeply personal to the individual.
And although very hard, if not damn near impossible to communicate this 'appreciation' accurately to your fellow man,i can say that ive stood in venues, looked about and seen endless beatific expressions on the faces of those around me and known that there is a common bond in 'appreciation' for what we are hearing.


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Posted By: maryes
Date Posted: January 26 2018 at 15:50
I'm a amateur guitar player, electric, acoustic 6 & 12 strings and I'm Luhtier.
   but the "guilt "of my love or music is my Father, I grew up listening his collection of classical music and some others related music , Although he was a  public officer which never played any instrument, when I started listening progressive rock he sometimes listened with me ! 
I have some friends which not play nor a "neighbor bell", but are true prog lovers !!!


Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: January 26 2018 at 16:42
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

My dog loves catching a frisbee even though she doesn't understand Newton's Third Law of motion or the Bernoulli Principle Wink

Dude, my dog knows calculus, and it greatly improves his appreciation of the sport of frisbee! Wink LOL 


2 dogs were walking in the park and the first dog says, "Wow, I just learned calculus".  The other dog says, "Wow...a talking dog" Tongue




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https://wytchcrypt.wixsite.com/mutiny-in-jonestown" rel="nofollow - Mutiny in Jonestown : Progressive Rock Since 1987


Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: January 26 2018 at 17:32
Okay, face it: this is a silly question. It's a matter of numbers and statistics.
Look at any Prog concert, count the band members, then count the fans!

Most Prog lovers are FANS. It's so obvious, though I can't prove it to you.

And my theatre audience or classical audience analogy stands: it's not mostly other actors or violinists in the audience. Why would Prog rock be any different? Common sense: musicians are outnumbered by FANS.
Duh.

Whew! I'm okay now.

-------------
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.


Posted By: Mellotron Storm
Date Posted: January 27 2018 at 13:04
Great to see a post from Peter^. 
At my previous job a new guy started, around 20 years old looked like a large Mennonite. Mumbled half the time but seemed to know a lot about most things, a book guy. Anyway he was into Classical music but also extreme metal so I lent him probably ten or so cds over time that I thought he'd like. His comment was that I must be a musician to like this kind of music so I get the question here but the answer is no you don't have to be a musician to love Prog although maybe it helps.

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"The wind is slowly tearing her apart"

"Sad Rain" ANEKDOTEN


Posted By: ForestFriend
Date Posted: January 27 2018 at 13:38
Well I've been to a few prog rock shows where more people came to play that night than to listen!

Of course, that analogy is a bit silly... just because someone is in the audience one night doesn't mean they're not a musician.


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https://borealkinship.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My prog band - Boreal Kinship


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: January 27 2018 at 22:41
If I have understood right, progconcerts in today Finland there are just other progmusicians in audience (really not they canīt full the place). I am glad this wasnīt true when Magma came to Finland last year, the place was full and i donīt think they all were musicians.

Also, I really hope prog is coming a little bit more popular here too, I was really surprised when there has put progalbums in demostration in my hometown library. I was just wondering "is January progmonth?"


Posted By: Skala
Date Posted: February 02 2018 at 12:31
Almost all of the true prog fans I know personally are professional or amateur musicians. But I think it depends on the type of prog - some artists are far more accessible than others.

What amazes me is that there are many people around me that can not even tell the diference between rock genres, let alone understand what prog is. So Deep Purple, Rush, Metallica or Psychotic Waltz - it is all the same to them.



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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChrjF_HlSbWofiTv-NVmc4Q" rel="nofollow - Unnote Musical Project


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: February 02 2018 at 22:31
Originally posted by Skala Skala wrote:

Almost all of the true prog fans I know personally are professional or amateur musicians. But I think it depends on the type of prog - some artists are far more accessible than others.

What amazes me is that there are many people around me that can not even tell the diference between rock genres, let alone understand what prog is. So Deep Purple, Rush, Metallica or Psychotic Waltz - it is all the same to them.

Itīs just because most of the people are not in music as you and I. Just met one of my friend, who really much is aware what is happening in the world (read a lots of newspapers etc.). Anyway he hasnīt ever heard about Morrisey and was wondering how I remember so much names in music. Itīs just what we are interested in this world. I know people of my age who hasnīt even heard term prog even they listened music. But when I said Pink Floyd one of them, he said "aa I have heard that band".


Posted By: Skala
Date Posted: February 03 2018 at 01:49
Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

But when I said Pink Floyd one of them, he said "aa I have heard that band".


Yeah, I guess the more popular the artists, the more non-musician fans they have. For example, I've been to a couple of Fates Warning concerts -  shamefully small audience probably entirely consisiting of aspiring musicians. Dream Theater, on the other hand, gather larger crowds and I suspect most of them are not musicians. Pink Floyd probaly have even more 'random' fans, but I am not sure these fans like the proggier side of their music.




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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChrjF_HlSbWofiTv-NVmc4Q" rel="nofollow - Unnote Musical Project


Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: February 03 2018 at 02:22
Originally posted by Skala Skala wrote:


What amazes me is that there are many people around me that can not even tell the diference between rock genres, let alone understand what prog is. So Deep Purple, Rush, Metallica or Psychotic Waltz - it is all the same to them.

^QFT. There are so many people like that in general.

Originally posted by ForestFriend ForestFriend wrote:

Well I've been to a few prog rock shows where more people came to play that night than to listen!

Of course, that analogy is a bit silly... just because someone is in the audience one night doesn't mean they're not a musician.

Dude, in the states, this is not a joke. Most of the time at shows - unless you're on a big bill - 2/3 of the audience will be the other bands that night lol. New Hampshire is BRUTAL (especially Dover and Portsmouth area) for new bands. Nobody comes out anymore!


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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: February 03 2018 at 02:59
In Finland people generally doesnīt go to watch unknown bands anymore. But when some popular artist that have just been in some reality tv program performs, there is of course house full.


Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: February 10 2018 at 12:37
Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:



2 dogs were walking in the park and the first dog says, "Wow, I just learned calculus".  The other dog says, "Wow...a talking dog" Tongue


Good one, Crimson King!

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"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno


Posted By: tdfloyd
Date Posted: February 11 2018 at 07:37
Don't play a note. Ok, was pretty good at the piccolo 40 years ago.    Love prog. My kids play multiple instruments but hate my music.


Posted By: wiz_d_kidd
Date Posted: February 17 2018 at 08:00
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

I'm a bass player. I think being a musician helps you to appreciate the skill of prog musicians, but it's not essential.


I think being a "bad" musician makes you appreciate their skills even more.  Having played rudimentary drums in my youth, I am absolutely astounded at watching what drummers like Manuel Pasquinelli (Sonar, Switzerland) or Adam Marko (Special Providence, Hungary) can do.  Friends of mine, who never played drums, listen to their music and say "What's so special? Is that really hard to play or something?".



Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: February 18 2018 at 05:34
I was a prog fan before I picked up my first guitar.  I have never gone out and performed.  I just play for my own enjoyment.

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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...



Posted By: WeepingElf
Date Posted: February 26 2018 at 12:40
I have an amateur prog band going (my avatar is our band logo) where I sing, play keyboards and write most of the music and lyrics. While it is probably an overstatement that most prog lovers are musicians, it seems true that many are. Prog has indeed often been called "musicians' music".



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... brought to you by the Weeping Elf

"What does Elvish rock music sound like?" - "Yes."



Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: February 27 2018 at 08:08
Hi,

Had our family been able to continue some music and piano lessons in my early days, I doubt I would be talking/writing here. I don't see the point many times, and it is difficult quite often not to say something rude or not cool when typing here.

Artie Shaw once told a student, that if he wants to be a genius and an artist, that you need to find a genius and an artist and stick with him, so you can learn.

And, sometimes, this is where most of us fail. The musicians that took it up and stayed were not afraid of practice, and other learning possibilities with the music. And, in the case of our generation, it was curious enough to want to do something else that had not been done before, that according to the history of Europe after the war, was a general reaction to the social environments that helped the war along, and specially how so many people stopped caring.

Our generation stood up!

And it will be remembered for a long time to come for all its music, art and literature, which, for the most part is not something that we seem to have the ability to discuss very well.

I doubt that most "prog lovers" are musicians, and vice versa. I am a musician at heart and mind, in that you can put on any piece of music and I can fly forever off it. I've been told, before, that I was a natural musician, if there ever was a chance of me learning music ... which I would likely revolt against ... and then do something else with it!

I read a lot of biographies, and the thing that stands out the most ... is ... its about the individuality of the person, and how far they take it and express themselves with it ... and I think that too many of us quit way too soon to get any further. Like I got a wife and kid now and have to go cook at $10 bux an hour to pay rent .... etc, etc ... and sometimes the difference is that the "musician" or "artist" did not do that, even if it caused personal issues with family and friends ... and this is common in almost all the artists that "made it".

It's an interesting question, for sure, however, I'm not sure that the answer can be properly articulated. Some of the folks here, that are professional musicians, and get paid for it, will likely tell you ... they never quit on their instruments and inner person. 

This makes, many of us, btw, just frustrated musicians that could not do it, and it is where some of the dislikes come from. I simply do not use these "dislikes" as any part of my writing and thoughts ... I love music too much, and at 67, it does not matter if I am a musician or a writer ... I'm living within myself!


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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com


Posted By: Henri
Date Posted: March 04 2018 at 03:49
I know how to play the MacGyver theme on harmonica... if I have the tabs for it. I earned a couple of euros once playing it on the street at night. So, yeah, I'm getting there.

Seriously, sometimes I wonder if I could get even more out of music if I knew something about the theory/technical aspects. But in the end I don't think it would make much difference in the enjoyment.


Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: March 04 2018 at 09:12
I don't know if most are but at least half seem to be.


Posted By: MortSahlFan
Date Posted: March 04 2018 at 09:52
I play drums, guitar, piano, bass, other percussion



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