Fly From Here: Return Trip WTF??
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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=114365
Printed Date: April 23 2024 at 19:45
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Topic: Fly From Here: Return Trip WTF??
Posted By: JD
Subject: Fly From Here: Return Trip WTF??
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 19:11
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Really? Is this the proverbial putting lipstick on a pig or what? Does anyone believe having Trevor sing and having a few solos redone is going to make this anything other than what it is, a huge disappointment? I'm just saying. ------------- Thank you for supporting independently produced music |
Replies:
Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 19:23
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Pass. ------------- |
Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 20:11
| well I've heard it and it is interesting as it is remixed in many parts---like the "Fly from here" suite---one part is completely remixed and sounds better than the original---the long version of Hour of need is good---but Howe sings on a new song and it is pretty bad----I mean it's fine but of course Benoit is washed clean of the his history with Yes even though his vocals on certain songs like Into the Storm is way better than Trevor Horns. I'm a die hard classic line-up guy but thought this album was ok---meaning I listen to it more than any Yes west album. I think Yes is trying to continually help Chris Squires family financially in any way they can this release and the re-release of Fish out of water to get us all to go out and buy again. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 21:30
| I just gave the new one a listen on YouTube, and it didn't convince me to buy the new one. I loved Benoit's singing on the original one, and Trevor's singing is a small step down for me. I didn't listen with enough attention to really notice the remixing changes, except for crearer backing vocals, which sounded nice enough, and an extra keyboard solo on Madman at the Screens. I wish they had done this with Heaven and Earth, I believe that one would have benefited much more with the remixing and the new vocals... but of course that one had nothing to do with Trevor Horn and there is no reason for him to touch it and work with it the same way. |
Posted By: Manuel
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 21:54
| Unfortunately, YES seems to be making the wrong decisions lately. Once on top of the world, it seems that these days they cannot find their way out mediocracy. Really sad. |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 23:00
| Not ever been big fan of any kind of remixes/ redoings (only one I have is Kate Bush director´s cut, haven´t listened that also much). I like the original, I have now much else to listen, maybe I listen this someday (or not). |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: April 03 2018 at 23:03
| It seems they really have an attitude problem towards certain vocalists. First with Jon Anderson, then Benoit. As Dellinger, I don´t see any problem in Benoit´s singing, although even I can hear some very little mistakes in his pronouncing. |
Posted By: Squonk19
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 01:21
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I am very disappointed with this decision. I thought the original album was reasonably good and that Benoit did a good job, all things considered. This move to wipe him out of Yes history is unnecessary and highly disrespectful. Remaster the album for sure, but don't replace the vocals (which from what I have heard myself are not an improvement on the original). Start thinking clearly lads.....you will taint your legacy this way. Spend more time coming up with an album better than Heaven and Earth, then such retrospective shenanigans. ------------- “Living in their pools, they soon forget about the sea.” |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 01:45
Are Yes lost these days ??? 
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Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 02:44
Since 1974. ------------- Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to. http://bandcamp.com/jpillbox" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp Profile |
Tom Ozric wrote:Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 04:05
Exactly. Regardless of what you felt the respective merits (or lack thereof) of `Fly from Here' were or weren't, Benoit's vocal was certainly not the problem. He conveyed himself with a dignity and thoughtfulness (just like he did when he was in the Mystery band), and he deserves to be treated better than that. Although I'm still happy to collect it for my Yes collection, the original version will be the `proper' one, and this re-writing of history to not only squeeze another round of sales out of this one album that only would have appealed to die-hard Yes fans, and to try to align it to the original `Drama' line-up (which `Fly from Here' sounds nothing like, and only little pieces of the material date back to that period!) to give it more `credibility' is really desperate. Perhaps they should be re-issuing both versions as a double-set, but keeping the original as the main version (and the newie as a `bonus disc')... 
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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 04:29
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I agree: Benoit isn't a problem. I've seen his live performance (on youtube only unfortunately) and I have had the impression of listening to YES. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: progaardvark
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 05:20
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I can't wait for the William Shatner version. ------------- ---------- i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 05:21
| I'm giving this a miss. I really like the original album and by all accounts Benoit's vocals are better than Trevor Horn's, so even if it is a remix I'm not buying it. It's frankly a bit of an insult to Benoit, even if Horn did write the songs. |
Posted By: Mormegil
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 06:20
THIS!!!!!! ------------- Welcome to the middle of the film. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 06:45
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To answer the OP's question, yes this is putting lipstick on a pig. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 08:15
| I don't care. I liked the original. Ordered the new one. Far from perfect, FFH was still better than 99% of the records released in the past ten years. Just saying'. |
Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 08:39
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You should re-release 'Live from Lyon' with new vocals by Trevor, guys. That version of Yes is a grand masquerade afaic. ------------- |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 09:17
I'm not sure that's a fair assessment of what they are doing. Just like classical music, there are many different bits and pieces and interpretations and everyone still buys them, and some folks even have Beethoven's 5th with 3 different versions, because Karajan's version is very much stronger than the others, as an example. And Mahler ... you have to hear it to believe it! In this case, there should not be any concern for their wanting to update a few things and change a few others. I seriously doubted that Stravinsky did not make changes to some of his pieces when he started directing them, instead of just sitting back, and then Lenny brought out a version that made us thing ... wow, this is smooth and very cool! It's OK if you do not care for it and you prefer this or that singer on it, but saying that it is mediocre simply because one did not like it, is probably not cool, and is simply demeaning to the complete band's cannon and work. Not all the piece's in one's listing are preferred. Not all of Picasso's work are in your wall (posters, anyway) and he has more styles than anyone else, and writers ... oh my gawd ... they can make this situation look even worse! It's impossible for people to "interpret" things properly and correctly the way that most theater and film pieces try to do. And I am not sure that us, as "fans", have a right to tell the artist and owner of the piece what to do with it ... We, seem to be "stuck" on something that has one version, usually the original, and not all of the originals are better than some follow ups on various pieces of music, specially. You can look at Bob Dylan, and find that Sandy, Jimi, Bryan can do him better, and you can look at Manfred Mann that even did a Boss tune better when it first came out, and made a huge hit out of it, along with several other Dylan songs. You might as well sit here and say that these "copies" stink, and they don't. And I know some YES fans, that happen to like this redo ... and one of them is trying to get me to buy it, though I (STILL) do not have any YES after "Relayer". To me, it's when it died, and its "soul" and "spirit" was taken out by fans ... whose preferences were more important than the artists work on its own. I'm simply getting tired of this form of "social-ism" that supposedly tells you what is best for you, and you and I can't even try it and find out for ourselves anymore, because the bandwagon of vitriol has taken off, and honestly? ... now you know why I am not enamored with anything YES, in the past 40 some years! ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 10:21
 ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 12:55
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I rather liked Benoit's performance on the FFH suite on the album. I remain to be convinced how this will add to anything, aside from adding to the Squire widow pension pot...... ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 20:11
| the band is a make shift mess with a lot of second rate talent and no real authenticity ---the Drama line up is the closest thing they can come up with that is a credible decent line up from the past---so they are advertising this as the Drama line up---follow up to Drama. Only thing they can do now that they are not speaking to Anderson or Wakeman ever again. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 20:34
| However it may be, I guess the best for anyone interested enough is to at least listen to it. I did hear it on YouTube and it didn't convince me to buy it... because I liked better Benoit's vocals and because I agree with most that it is disrespectful. But I did read many comments on the FB news about this album being already available from people who really liked the remix and feel it is an improvement over the original, so it might just as well be worth checking it out before discarding it. |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: April 04 2018 at 21:49
| Wow, it's funny how opinions differ. Over on another prog website everyone seems to like it. |
Posted By: SouthSideoftheSky
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 01:30
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I haven't heard the new version yet, so I cannot comment on how its sounds, but I like the idea. Indeed, recording this album with the original Drama-line up seems like the most natural thing to do, and what they should have done in the first place. Why even hire a new vocalist, when Trevor Horn was already there in the studio with them as a producer? It would have made a lot more sense to have Horn sing on the original version of the album when it was first recorded. The only reason they hired Benoit David, I believe, was so that they could go on tour, which is outside of Horn's comfort zone, and that it made more sense to them to record the album with the same singer that they would be touring with. That reason is now irrelevant, so it makes sense to redo the album they way it should have been all along, as a true follow-up to Drama. |
Posted By: SouthSideoftheSky
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 01:44
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I have no disrespect towards Benoit David, but he was the first member in Yes-history to be hired solely because he is a sound-a-like to a previous member. Yes has such a rich stock of ex-members to draw from, so it makes a lot more sense to re-invite a previous member than to hire an impersonator from a Yes-tribute band. I'm glad that Geoff Downes was brought back, because he had "unfinished business" with the band, and the same goes for Horn. |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 05:09
I don't think Horn has the range to sing it properly tbh. I saw Yes on the original Drama tour and Horn looked like he was going to burst a blood vessel trying to sing the pre-Drama Yes numbers.
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Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 07:33
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I would like to quote Goethe on this matter: "Getret'ner Quark wird breit, nicht stark" meaning "Curd you (repeatedly) tread on does not get strong, it gets broad". The German original has a double meaning; "Quark" does not only mean "curd" but also "rubbish, nonsense". I think good old Goethe pretty much nails it here. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Upbeat Tango Monday
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 09:37
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Both Benoit and Trevor are good singers, but this was an unnecessary move. FFH was alright. ------------- Two random guys agreed to shake hands. Just Because. They felt like it, you know. It was an agreement of sorts...a random agreement. |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 11:16
Yep, I saw that tour in Deeside, and Horn really struggled. The crowd reaction was none too favourable. Boo......boo....... ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: SouthSideoftheSky
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 11:29
Like I said above, performing live was outside of Horn's comfort zone, but he was more than capable in the studio. No disrespect to Benoit David, but the band didn't need him in the studio. Live is another matter. |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 12:39
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To quote a review of a new Yes album in a major rag back in the '80s (I think it may have been Musician): "Just say no." ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: ForestFriend
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 19:50
Benoit David had already been in the band for two years when they did Fly From Here; I'm assuming the reason they had him sing on the album was that they considered him a member of the band, rather than just a hired gun. They even gave him the same treatment as Jon... by replacing him when he got sick instead of waiting for him to get better. ------------- https://borealkinship.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My prog band - Boreal Kinship |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 20:58
I'm not really all that glad about Geoff's coming back, because that meant getting rid of Oliver in a very disrespectful way (once again), and I believe he was a better player and was doing a better job... and getting rid of Oliver that way did put them at odds with Rick, with whom they had been having a good enough relation up to that point. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 05 2018 at 21:03
Actually, singing Anderson's parts was also out of the comfort zone of Benoit. I have only seen Yes twice... sadly neither one was with Anderson (once with Benoit, and once with Davidson), and I could see Benoit struggling with the high notes too. That's why I was so pleased with Fly from Here... I wasn't so sure about him as a singer, but once he sang on something that could be withing his comfort zone he did so much more beautifully... as far as I'm concerned, better than Horn. Davidson didn't seem to struggle as much as Benoit... but mostly because he doesn't even seem to try, and his performance sounds flatter than it should. |
Posted By: SouthSideoftheSky
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 02:05
It is of course always sad when people have to be ousted, but Fly From Here was all about making a follow-up to Drama, and to resurrect material that the band was working on during that time, with that line-up. So it was only natural to bring back Downes for that, who originally got to do only one album with the band. That they then had him perform those earlier albums live (as can be heared on the Like It Is releases) was perhaps not the best idea, I give you that. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 13:34
| ^ I believe it was Horn's idea (since he was already the producer when they chose to bring those old Drama era songs back) to bring Geoff Downes into the band... why he (or they, the whole band) didn't choose to sing them at the time is a puzzle, specially now that we have this Return Trip thing done. However, it might have been a thought to be considered, but in the end I believe the band was diminished by the decision. |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 16:26
I agree with this. Oliver shouldn't have been cut like that. He was cut like a chunk of fat from a chop. ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 16:28
Too bad FFH 's nowhere near the caliber of Drama. ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: ReactioninG
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 20:32
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I just love Trevor Horn too much too dislike Return Trip. I need to get the official version, I have, erm, a bootleg of it.... |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 20:56
Actually, I think I like both albums about the same. The only song I really love on Drama is Machine Messiah... and Open Car and Run to the Light are rather enjoyable, though much more light hearted. If only those 3 main songs used on the Fly from Here suite (which I understand were already written) had been used on Drama too, I believe it could have been a really great album. I really like the wong Fly from here, as well as Madman at the Screens, and Sad Night at the Airfield stands comfortably among the most beautiful songs they have made. |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: April 06 2018 at 23:28
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Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: April 07 2018 at 10:42
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Not sure why Yes is doing this, except to re-write history....maybe to give Trevor Horn some cash flow? Benoit did a fine job in this version, also featuring Ollie Wakeman! I never did care for the twirling Benoit stage act, but hell, the guy could sing! ------------- I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!! |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: April 07 2018 at 11:08
Drama is a gem in the Yes catalogue. Nothing on FFH stood out for me. It's another just-okay latter-day Yes album. I do like calling it Fly For Beer. I get that much, at least. LOL. ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: hieronymous
Date Posted: April 08 2018 at 09:06
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Drama has some of my favorite Chris Squire bass - Tempus Fugit, Does It Really Happen, Into the Lens - of course Fragile, The Yes Album & Close to the Edge are the classic sound, but to me Drama is a peak in his career bass-wise. It's basically one of the only Yes albums I listen to regularly. I really loved Fly From Here when it came out - I've ordered the new version and look forward to hearing it.
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Posted By: ReactioninG
Date Posted: April 10 2018 at 16:09
| Fly From Here the song, particularly the beginning - really should have been on Drama and is a great anchor on the 2011(/2018) album. The rest of the songs I never really got into. My go-to version for some time has been the Buggles' demo version, as the Fly From Here album was taken down from streaming services some years ago. Makes sense for Trevor Horn to sing it. My main complaint with Fly From Here was that they had an impersonator, primarily of Jon Anderson, singing on the legendary Fly From Here track. When they announced the album I already was enamored of the track in its demo forms so it was a real treat to hear it realized. I listened to the digital single that preceded the album as much as the album itself probably. |
Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: April 10 2018 at 18:27
Drama absolutely features some of Chris' all time career best bass lines  .------------- "I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
Posted By: Squonk19
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 05:21
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I do appreciate the varied opinions expressed on this thread and they all have some validity. I understand the linking back to Drama etc. and I have no issues if you want to buy the new version too. As I said...my main problem with this, is the disrespect to Benoit shown by this release. It's the moral aspect I'm thinking about, and I know I'm very naive about thinking this should be above any financial benefits that will accrue here. Yes in recent years have shown a lack of respect to other members (not least Oliver Wakeman) and I really wish they could avoid such air-brushing out of some past members and retain the positive 50th anniversary vibe I felt when I saw them a short while ago. ------------- “Living in their pools, they soon forget about the sea.” |
Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 17:19
Thanks, that was a very good post! I think Jon Anderson is the one who has been given the most disrespect....Howe's snarky "ex-girlfriend" comments come to mind. Yes are playing smaller & smaller venues....devolving into a Spinal Tap parody of themselves. Pretty soon it will be "Puppet Show, Yes" on the marquee. Sad.
------------- I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!! |
Posted By: FunkyM
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 18:30
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I was surprised when I heard the band was re-recording Fly From Here. I thought the original was pretty good. *shrug* I remember there were a few comparisons to Drama made when the album was first released. Maybe the band heard this too and were inspired? I'll give the new version a chance if I get a chance to hear it, but it's probably not one I'll rush to get. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 20:00
| ^ It's not a re-recording. The only thing recorded again are the vocals, the rest are the same... well, I think Trevor Horn did add a few new instruments here or there, but not something really noteworthy. And he remixed the album too. |
Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 22:10
Yes has a long history of disrespect---so what comes around goes around---Jon and the gang kicked out whoever they wanted in the early days and replaced them with someone better---Tony Kaye--Patrick Moraz were both removed rather heavy handedly--so this is nothing new---Yes is a big mess right now just trying to make money by endless tours and re-releasing music for Squires family----I'm a long time fan and won't see either (mainly because I can't stand hearing Rabin butcher Howes parts and no interest in hearing Yes west songs) there are 4 living members who fans want to see together---Howe Anderson White and Wakeman---but sadly that will never happen.
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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: April 12 2018 at 11:01
Fly From Here to the Sky Custom. Love it ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 14 2018 at 07:33
The Muppets have not done YES? The shame. The total shame! Can you hear Mrs. Piggy singing Jon's lines? She's got them memorized already! ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: April 14 2018 at 07:45
*spits first beer of day on monitor* thanks Pedro.. No I hadn't been able to hear that before your post.. and now it is all I'll likely hear.. flying from here. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: hieronymous
Date Posted: April 14 2018 at 20:16
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I get that many of the YES band members have treated each other badly. They are definitely not the greatest band to choose as role models for band management! But I'm not sure that I'm that great a person myself - I've definitely treated fellow band members badly in the past - not necessarily "on purpose" but I've done things I'm ashamed of so I'm withholding judgment and going to enjoy listening to the new version - I hope! It could suck too lol
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: April 15 2018 at 00:20
| I wasn't that impressed with the original FFH, why would I be listening to this re-recording? |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 15 2018 at 01:52
| Quite like The Mystery and would rather listen to them than modern day YES. The last decent Yes album was Keys Studio. The symphonic DVD was also rather wonderful. After that they could safely have retired leaving a legacy that few could touch. |
Posted By: hieronymous
Date Posted: April 16 2018 at 19:52
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Wow - finally got my copy - this is amazing. I love the original version of the album - I have listened to it many times. Return Trip is very different - only on track 3 but so far the songs are not only remixed but also rearranged. This is very cool - it's eerie - must have been an interesting experience for Trevor Horn to do the vocals with Chris Squire's voice preserved and suspended. I'm still going to listen to the original version too - will probably remain my favorite version - but I'm digging this too. It's kind of like a reboot, like the Star Trek or James Bond reboots - it's a reimagining of something that was great and that now exists in a different way. Man, listening to the "Turn your life around" section of "Sad Night at the Airfield" is really moving - a lot of focus on Chris Squire's voice.
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Posted By: twosteves
Date Posted: April 18 2018 at 07:25
| I heard the remix---only once but if you liked the album there are parts of this that sound totally different from the original---so in that sense I will buy ---I like Benoit voice better generally and on Into the Storm--Trevor does not do a great job---Its not his song and its the only real train wreak for me--- |
Posted By: Squonk19
Date Posted: April 22 2018 at 02:35
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I listened to both yesterday, cutting between each at times. A number of points struck me. Firstly, to these ears there is not a major difference and definitely not one worth paying out for. Some tracks have subtle differences and slightly modified tonal tweeks, but I find them minimal. Secondly, I'll credit Trevor Horn for doing a reasonable job on the vocals on the majority of the tracks. He did a fine job on Drama and maintains a good standard on this one, surprisingly. Thirdly, despite saying that, I still prefer Benoit David's vocals overall, and so the purpose of this remaster remains largely lost on me (other than a financial one). Finally, I would like to say I still think Fly From Here is a good album and probably their best latter day album - even if it isn't close to the classic era. If the band spent more time trying to emulate that direction after the blandness of Heaven and Earth with a new album, rather than a disrespectful rehash this is, then we might get one more good album off them before age takes further toil on them. Maybe they could get Benoit to re-record Drama to even things up, as apparently they seem to think both albums are joined at the hip! ------------- “Living in their pools, they soon forget about the sea.” |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 22 2018 at 21:39
| ^ That one would be good. It would have been great if they had played both albums complete when both Benoit and Downes were in the band. |