Early 90's Technical Death Metal Showdown
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Printed Date: June 06 2024 at 11:57
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Topic: Early 90's Technical Death Metal Showdown
Posted By: Morningrise
Subject: Early 90's Technical Death Metal Showdown
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 07:41
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Part 3 of the metal showdown series. Death purposely not included.
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Replies:
Posted By: dougmcauliffe
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 08:43
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Great stuff, gotta go for Atheist, perfect discography, but Spheres by Pestilence is one of my favorites as well. ------------- The sun has left the sky... ...Now you can close your eyes |
Posted By: Progmind
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 10:36
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Cynic for me, the impact of the album "Focus" was immense. Love Atheist and Pestilence too
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Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 11:37
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Cynic, easily. ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: Morningrise
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 12:43
And how about their "Traced In Air" comeback 15 years later? Awesome band.
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Progmind wrote:Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 12:55
Cynic, who are mostly dead now. Talk about death metal  ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 13:29
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cynic ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: geekfreak
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 15:36
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Cynic ------------- Friedrich Nietzsche: "Without music, life would be a mistake." Music Is Live Two people are better off than one, for they can help each other succeed. Keep Calm And Listen To The Music… < |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 15:44
| Yeah, my vote for Cynic as well. |
Posted By: dougmcauliffe
Date Posted: March 29 2021 at 15:55
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Cynic is like Death Metal for aliens, still trying to wrap my head around it ------------- The sun has left the sky... ...Now you can close your eyes |
Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: March 30 2021 at 00:11
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Obvious bias will be towards the more accessible fusion of Cynic, which I understand. Gorguts is the pinnacle of tech death for me. They're exactly what my ears and souls crave. The Erosion of Sanity is the peak of the early 90's tech death style, unmatched. Obscura is still ahead of it's time, so much so that I still think everything Luc released after still pales a bit in comparison to that, despite the awesomness! Luc has the ability to weave technical riffs in with actual classical and jazz and progressive elements in ways that don't so forced. Gorguts is its own lexicon of sound in a way, especially on Obscura. Erosion is my favorite, though. Gorguts and Luc Lemay RULE.
------------- "I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
Posted By: Artik
Date Posted: March 30 2021 at 14:00
| Cynic is doing well without me, so I've helped Pestilence |
Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: March 30 2021 at 23:32
Cynic is going to win for their adherance to sounding most like a traditional fusion band, just more extreme. Pestilence broke the mold in 1993. All these bands did. Literally, this entire list, go listen to their 1993 releases - they're all gold! RoadRunner truly was legendary back in the day. Monte Conner!!! ------------- "I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: March 31 2021 at 03:46
| Gorguts |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 07:52
 It's their only album that I enjoy.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 07:58
| Out of these I prefer Cynic, but I don't really see them as Death Metal. They got lumped into that category, there is very little "Death" about an album like Cynic - Focus. More like Prog Extreme Metal/Fusion ... |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 08:01
well, if it's got growls, it's death metal.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 08:10
^ It has more vocoder than growls 
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Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:23
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I agree. Cynic isn't really death metal. They carry elements of it, but it's blended into something completely different. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:27
Their debut has been classified as technical death metal and progressive death metal, both are fine IMO.
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Posted By: Saperlipopette!
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 09:51
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I like Cynic the least out of these and prefer the rest on their earliest albums - when they were still relatively straight forward Death Metal. I guess i just want my Death Metal to be Death Metal. The technical part is ok, but I tend to look elsewhere than in metal for progressive/experimental music. Voted for Gorguts ------------- 
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Posted By: mellotronwave
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 10:54
| none |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:18
I'll reclassify it as Progressive Extreme Metal
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:21
You mean extreme progressive metal? That includes progressive death metal.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:28
| Yes, extreme metal includes death metal, but not the other way round. And yes, it makes more sense to order the words like you did, but I recently introduce Extreme Metal as a genre at AP (due to popular request), and when you add "prog" to it the badge gets created as "Prog Extreme Metal". I'll work on tweaking that ... |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:32
| ^ ^^ As opposed to extremely progressive metal, which can be its own thing. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:34
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^ Yes - annoyingly, my tag system supported that as well (you could set the progressiveness level to 10 and then it would say "extremely progressive"), but I removed that feature long ago.
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:35
Extreme metal is an umbrella as it includes several subgenres. For example the technical/extreme progressive metal genre tag on PA includes bands that play progressive black, death or thrash. And not just on PA.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:36
| ^ So what's wrong with assigning this more general genre to releases that can't really be attributed to a specific subgenre? |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:41
I remember that feature. I liked it. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:45
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^ It's still there in the background, I might introduce a user setting to reactivate it.
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:48
| ^ Cool, and "extremely extreme progressive metal" has an epically excessive ring to it. :) |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:50
like what?!  |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:53
| ^ Like Cynic - Focus, which isn’t really Death Metal. |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 13:59
How is not death metal when it's got extreme growling vocals?! Metalstorm classifies the album as progressive death metal. MMA as technical death metal Metal archives as Progressive Death Metal/Fusion All o them are right if you ask me.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:21
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^ Sure, there's nothing wrong with classifying them as death metal, especially when you look at it from a historical perspective - after all, they started as part of the Florida death metal scene. I just think that their music had already moved away from the typical death metal style significantly, so that I think that the more generic label "extreme metal" is a better fit. Let's agree to disagree.
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:24
Extreme metal does less justice to Cynic's debut than technical death metal or progressive death metal (both are more specific unlike the broad extreme metal).
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:25
That's what people say when they want to get rid of someone or stop discussing.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:34
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^ I really think we DISAGREE on the question of "how death" the Cynic debut is, and we're not going to resolve that here. You pointed that on most websites it is classified as death metal, which I acknowledged. On my website there's now "extreme metal" as its own subgenre of metal, and that is not available on these other websites, afaik. In any case, I stand by my OPINION that the broader term "extreme metal" fits better, and I accept and respect your differing opinion. What else can we do? It's either a duel with pistols, or shake hands and move on
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:40
No site I mentioned classifies them as just "death metal", even the death metal has become a genre with subgenres. To me things are simple, if it's got growls its in the death metal umbrella.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:44
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^ Yup, to me it's more complex. Not everything with a saxophone is Jazz either (but much).
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:48
it's not the same, growling is a very specific characteristic of the death metal genre. Saxophone can be used in any genre, obviously.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:52
| ^ To me death metal is not just defined by the vocals. I'm a musician, and when I listen to Focus, there's just too much that's really different from the typical death metal style. |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 14:58
I never said it's typical death metal, but technical and progressive one. Obviously not just defined by the vocals, but that specific kind of vocals is front and center. That's why the "death" component is specified in genre tags (like death-doom or example, with that tag, listeners know what to expect).
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 15:04
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^ Sure, you never said that it's typical death metal, and I didn't say you did. I just said that FOR ME there is sufficient difference that I'd rather just assign the more generic term "extreme metal". Now, are you going to insist that I cease doing so?
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Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 15:12
I wasn't insisting you cease doing anything, I just think your description/tag does not do justice to that album.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 15:19
| ^ It's how the release is listed here, btw.. Doesn't say Tech/Prog Death Metal, but Tech/Prog Extreme Metal. Of course that's because of the crude genre system here, but the point is that it is NOT WRONG. I can call a square a rectangle, and of course you could argue that it is doing injustice to the square ... it could scream "I'm a special rectangle, my sides are all of the same length!", to which I would say "sure, but you are ALSO a rectangle". |
Posted By: Cristi
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 15:27
The tech/extreme prog metal is fine with the debut, not correct anymore with the rest of their following albums.
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Posted By: Awesoreno
Date Posted: January 10 2024 at 22:54
When I listen to Focus, I sometimes hear yodeling.
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Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: January 11 2024 at 01:56
Tech/Extreme Death Yodeling. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow"> https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |