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Zypressen & Lacrymosa

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Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Polls
Forum Description: Create polls on topics related to progressive music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=40509
Printed Date: July 06 2022 at 04:45
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Topic: Zypressen & Lacrymosa
Posted By: avestin
Subject: Zypressen & Lacrymosa
Date Posted: August 02 2007 at 19:47
Not really a poll, this is more to:
1. Get a (what will probably a small) discussion about these two related Japanese chamber rock groups.
2. Expose them to newer crowds who may not know them yet.
 
I added http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=2982 - ZYPRESSEN  a while back and I hope to add http://gnosis2000.net/reviews/lacrymosa.htm - Lacrymosa when time permits (along with another Japanese avant-rock band, Amygdala). Press the links to read more.
From the little background I know, Zypressen only released one s/t album, influenced by Univers Zero and Lacrymosa apparentely released two albums (at least I only know of two, which are the albums I've heard but I read somewhere there are two more...). Both demonstrate a nice and well performed chamber rock (UZ being a big influence).
 
So, any impressions/thoughts you have of those?
Any other bands I/we should know of and listen to?
 
 


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Replies:
Posted By: laplace
Date Posted: August 02 2007 at 19:53
I know these bands from my japanese kick, and having heard both, I prefer Zypressen - less humour and more beauty. I find Zypressen's music fairly wintery and sad, rather than jarring and heavy-going like the famous UZ albums. You could still compare Zypressen to the UZed album, or maybe Implosion?

I found Lacrymosa more in line with bands like Cro Magnon and X-Legged Sally and I question if that's really my thing, sometimes. ;P


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FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO TO HELL


Posted By: coleio
Date Posted: August 02 2007 at 20:06
What's chamber rock?



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Eat heartily at breakfast, for tonight, we dine in Hell!!


Posted By: chamberry
Date Posted: August 02 2007 at 21:17
Originally posted by coleio coleio wrote:

What's chamber rock?

It's the combination of Chamber Music and Rock. Maybe you'll hear a rock band with a cello and violin or maybe a chamber group with drums and bass, line-ups in the same vein end up being called chamber rock.


On to the topic: I haven't heard Lacrymosa, but Zypresen is great! I'm thinking on reviewing it soon. I won't vote, though.



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Posted By: Rainer Rein
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 03:28
I surely prefer Zypressen because of more "beautiful" and "juicy" soundspectrum and "warmness" of acoustic instruments. Lacrymosa seems IMHO too "sterile-sounding" and more"colder" than Zypressen.


Posted By: honganji
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 04:07
I prefer Zypressen. Smile
 
By the way, the band leader of Lacrymosa, Saito Chihiro also played in Katra Turana and Golden Avant Garde.
 
Katra Turana is considered  as a chamber rock group. 1st album (Saito played only in this album)  is more serious sound than 2nd album Kimera and 12 inch single The End. But I prefer The End and Kimera than 1st album Katra Turana. LOL
 
Golden Avant Garde has released only 1 album in 1990s. This is also Saito's leader group but very different from Lacrymosa. He said this was cyber-punk rock. Wacko Of course, this must be put into progressive rock !!
 


Posted By: avestin
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 12:51
Originally posted by honganji honganji wrote:

 
Katra Turana is considered  as a chamber rock group. 1st album (Saito played only in this album)  is more serious sound than 2nd album Kimera and 12 inch single The End. But I prefer The End and Kimera than 1st album Katra Turana. LOL
 
Golden Avant Garde has released only 1 album in 1990s. This is also Saito's leader group but very different from Lacrymosa. He said this was cyber-punk rock. Wacko Of course, this must be put into progressive rock !!
 
 
I have the Golden Avant Garde album and like it as well, different somewhat than those two bands, more rock oriented or rather the guitar is more dominant as is the electrified sound (sound more like some other post-punk bands).
 
I do not know Katra Turana, but I will track it down and get to know them. Thanks for the info, as always!
 
 


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Posted By: VanderGraafKommandöh
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 12:56
Great thread, Assaf!

I've heard both Lacrymosa and Zypressen once and need to hear them both again.  I remember enjoying one of the bands more than the other, but I forget which one.

I've tried ordering both albums from ReR, but they cannot get them, hopefully that will change.

I do have an Amygdala album though, but I've yet listen to it.  I got that album from Greg Walker.

I also need to listen Golden Avant Garde, which I do have access to.

Like Assaf, I do not know Katra Turana.


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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 15:10
I have yet to hear either. I'm particularly interested in hearing Zypressen.

Originally posted by chamberry chamberry wrote:

Originally posted by coleio coleio wrote:

What's chamber rock?

It's the combination of Chamber Music and Rock. Maybe you'll hear a rock band with a cello and violin or maybe a chamber group with drums and bass, line-ups in the same vein end up being called chamber rock....


It need not have strings, but it generally has acoustic instruments.  It's best heard in a small venue... such as a chamber pot Wink, and it should have a fairly small ensemble with one player to a part.  Most bands don't have many players, of course.  Solos are not as common in chamber music generally (be it classical, jazz, or rock), as it's about the interplay of parts.  I find it more intimate than other forms of rock.  It won't have the lushness of, say, Symphonic Prog (a piano fits the music better than a Mellotron), and it won't have the spectacle associated with Arena Rock, or the loudness (I wouldn't want to see a chamber rock group with huge amplifiers).

The players tend to be very good in Chamber Rock, and there's often more playfulness and subtlety than in other forms of rock.  It's more minimal than some other types of music, but each part is well-integrated.

Incidentally, some bands associated with chamber rock have quite large ensembles, but I tend not to classify those as chamber rock. It's music best played in an intimate venue.

I love chamber rock, but then I would rather go see a classical music trio or quartet than a symphony orchestra.

That's sort of my take on it beyond line-up, anyway.  I started with classical chamber music (love cello, violin, piano trios), and apply the same basic principles to chamber rock (as I said rock tend to have small ensembles anyway, but it's an approach to making/ performing music beyond utilising acoustic instruments).

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"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence" (Hitchens) and those who dismiss things too easily can be easily dismissed (Logan).


Posted By: VanderGraafKommandöh
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 15:38
So are small klezmer bands classed as Chamber Music as well?  Klezmer isn't so minamalist, but he bands are quite often small (although they can also number many as well).

Alamaailman Vasarat I class a chamber klezmer band, for example.


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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: August 03 2007 at 16:01
Or as Alamaailman Vasarat humorously describe themselves (quote only) "kebab-kosher-jazz-film-traffic-punk..." chamber music.  I think of AV as chamber rock, I don't know about all the klezmer bands.  Certainly their music owes much to klezmer music.  There's lots of klezmer music that could be described as a kind of chamber music, certainly (though the term is generally used for a kind of classical music of course, so I don't think one would normally classify it as such).  "Chamber klezmer music" sounds like a good classification to me.  Not all klezmer-based music with small bands would fit I would think (generally, strictly speaking, it should be one player to a part with tight interplay of musicians -- harmonics).

Lots of ethnic/ folk music might be brought under the umbrella.


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"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence" (Hitchens) and those who dismiss things too easily can be easily dismissed (Logan).



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