Disapointing epics
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Topic: Disapointing epics
Posted By: el böthy
Subject: Disapointing epics
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:05
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So, one of prog´s absolute best things are the epic songs, and I think we can all agree one that. What better than to listen to 20 min of what makes a band great? Most cases they are good but of course there are some that aren´t... and for those I have created this topic. Which epics dont you like? Which dont you think work? Are they too long? Was the band just not up for such challenge? You name them and explain why they dont work. I will start with Green Carnation´s Light of day, day of darkness. This song is one hour long... and its 40 minutes too long! Had they reduced it to 20, or 25 min it might have worked... hey, I even think 30 would have been nice! But one hour? How many times can they stick the same riff in it? I tell you, if you are gonna make a one hour song better have some "Holy crap, this is f**king awesome Im about to sh*t my pants" moments... not one... in 60 min!  ------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?" 
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Replies:
Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:20
| For me the most disappointing epic is Thick as a Brick. This song is just to long and boring for me. I've listened to it only a few times and heard the whole thing only a couple. Every time I listen to it I find myself changing to another song at about minute 14. After that I just get bored and have to stop. |
Posted By: Kaz4815
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:24
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Are you kidding? That's basically the climax of the first half, one of the most exciting parts! I'm biased because TAAB is my favorite, but anyway...
I'd have to say "Gates of Delirium" by Yes. Just kind of meh. Not enough variation. ------------- "I hate hippies..." -- Ian S. Anderson |
Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:28
| It's not really the music at that point of the song bores me more than the rest i just am bored by the entire song by that point. I get bored before that and try to finish it but just cant |
Posted By: darkmatter
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:30
| Does a near 15 minute song count? I find The Ministry of Lost Souls by Dream Theater to be a pretty dull song, not horrible but just rather boring. |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:31
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Gates of delirium was absolute joy after enduring The Revealing Science of God. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:31
Wow, never thought Gates would be mentioned... I can see Thick being here, the second part is not thaaaaaaat good (still, I would never mention them)... but Gates???...  ------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Kaz4815 wrote:Posted By: Sckxyss
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:33
Are you kidding? That's one of Yes' most accomplished pieces!
 I can't think of any that I really don't like...
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Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:34
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so I'm not the only one completely and utterly let down by LODDOD anyway hmm disappointing epics... Atom Heart Mother..though I knew the album wasn't one of their better ones ------------- 
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Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:42
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I agree with those who say Gates of Delirium. I'd add The Remembering to that list.
-------------  <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: October 08 2007 at 23:44
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Close To The Edge.
------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 00:20
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Gates of Delerium. Kinda uninteresting until "Soon."
------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: puma
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 00:28
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Would "The Battle of Epping Forest" count as an epic? Because to me, that's a little too overdone, too many lyrics, too much happening at once, and that's from someone who is a huge fan of Van der Graaf and King Crimson. |
Posted By: russellk
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 00:41
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I like all the epics mentioned to this point. What about Jean Michel Jarre's 'En Attendant Cousteau?' Woo hoo - 47 minutes of potential turned out to be ... a below-average exercise in ambience. |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 00:44
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I have another one, Echolyn´s Mei! Really the only exciting part is the second one, after that it seems they try to make the whole thing as long as possible
------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Posted By: Soul Dreamer
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 00:57
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The Ancient -Yes
I can never get through the first 10 minutes or so, I allways skip to minute 13 or something like that where the acoustic song sets in. I just don't like the beginning 2/3 of that track...
Edit: And ofcourse that Moonchild track of ITCOTCK, which IMO is a waste of album space...just noodling (except for the first 2 minutes or so...) ------------- To be the one who seeks so I may find .. (Metallica) |
Posted By: spacemetal
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 01:53
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Supper's Ready Here's the gun, shoot me if you wish. I happen to love Light of Day, Day of Darkness too. Go figure. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 02:11
| Going for the One is only suite from Yes I don't like ( but I know not many people think that way ). I think they keep playing it live today because it is the less demanding and more ambientesque of their suites.It is a good excuse to see Chris with his super-bass, though. |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 03:25
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General observation.
Please try to add a comment or two to support your views. Simply naming a song does not stimulate debate.
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Posted By: fuxi
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 04:00
I totally agree with you. I first got to know the "condensed" live version (on BURSTING OUT) and I've always preferred it to the original, which is (in my view) simply not colourful enough. As far as Yes is concerned, I can't imagine why people would be bored by GATES OF DELIRIUM or THE REVEALING SCIENCE OF GOD: in spite of their titles, I find these pieces thrilling from beginning to end. Thirty (!) years ago, I also loved "Nous sommes du soleil", but THAT now really bores me: in the first main part (after the instrumental intro) the singing just goes on and on - sounds like hectoring to me! And don't get me started on AWAKEN: only the KEYS TO ASCENSION version almost convinces me, but I first need half of bottle of wine. |
Posted By: Ricochet
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 04:07
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As always, the most popular epics seem to be discussed over and over and over again, though prog rock is such a diverse thing. I personally, right now, remember that I disliked Explorer's Club second album, made out of two full epics. It was a cold, even criminal, complex composition of new age and hard/metal rock.  ------------- 
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Posted By: iguana
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 05:17
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GRENDEL and the entire lot of TALES FROM TOPOGRAPHIC OCEANS, with the
honourable exception with “revealing science“ which has some genuinely nice bits. ------------- progressive rock and rural tranquility don't match. true or false? |
Posted By: fuxi
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 05:36
Well you know, the problem is most of the longer pieces (mock-epics?) by Canterbury bands like Soft Machine, Caravan and the Hatfields are just too darn GOOD... |
Posted By: toolis
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 05:39
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i'm not ver y fond of epics, so, i'll only mention the ones i really enjoy: 1.Dream Theater - A Change Of Seasons 2.Marillion - This Strange Engine/Grendel 3.Yes - Close To The Edge 4.Jethro Tull - TAAB 5.Pink Floyd - Echoes ------------- -music is like pornography... sometimes amateurs turn us on, even more... -sometimes you are the pigeon and sometimes you are the statue... |
Posted By: Negru Voda
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 05:45
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Awaken Doesen't impress me much. It's kind of a dissapointment after the grand Gates of Delirium And Magma's Khontarkosz bores the living daylight out of me. Oh, and Supper's Ready isn't all that great either. |
Posted By: Floydian42
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 06:24
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Karn Evil 9, I'm sorry. I just did NOT like that song.
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 07:34
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have said it time and time again.... VDGG's Plague of Lighthouse
Keepers. The first half is simply incredible.. but the 2nd half
is a catatonious frickin mess and it completely ruins it.
People.... but even worse.. sometimes musicians ... seem to forget that
music first and foremost needs to be listeneable.
------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 07:50
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For me Jethro Tull's A Passion Play.
In terms of music, I think Thick As A Brick is a much better epic than A Passion Play. APP sounds like JT bit off more than they could chew, a bit similar like Yes and Tales From Topographic Oceans (even though I like that album). Maybe they didn't know where to go with their music after Thick As A Brick.
On the other hand, maybe the music is just more than I can handle
 |
Posted By: Gog/Magog
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 07:55
 "The Clot Thickens" -------------  |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 07:57
 there is no crying in prog ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Gog/Magog
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 08:06
Yes, let's be sensible now and no more talk of Supper's Ready or Plague of Lighthouse Keepers. 
How about Harvest of Souls by IQ, full of bombast and trite lyrics and little else for 25 soul destroying minutes. ------------- |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 08:11
| The term disappointing epic is, as far as I'm concerned, an oxymoron. |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 08:21
Yet you have Animals as your avatar...Animals is much more boring than TaaB. Do you find Dark Side boring? Because it is more or less two side-long songs, the only difference is it is cut into songs and Taab isn't. |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 08:45
not so fast my friend.. hahah another sacred cow that I have to admit disappointed me was Awaken from Yes. I just NEVER could get into that. Many love that... but it simply never 'grabbed' me. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: razifa
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 08:50
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Personally I have no doubt my most disappointing epic is the last track from DT's Octavarium. When it finishes I feel my sufferings finish too. Boring, unstabdable, lack-of--originality, etc. ------------- ********** **razifa** ********** |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 09:05
Very well said!  From my point of view, it's hard to fault 'epics' like "Nine Feet Underground" or the marvellous "For Richard" - yet, they are hardly ever mentioned whenever the subject of epics comes up.Anyway, back to the topic at hand, my own choice would be "Supper's Ready", which I've never been able to get into. I also share Micky's view of "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers" - it's way too long, and it just doesn't hang together as it should. On the other hand, "Awaken" is IMHO much better than it's given credit for, though of course it's no "Close to the Edge". "Karn Evil 9" would also benefit from being a tad shorter, especially the final section. |
Posted By: The Doctor
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 09:18
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I found the IQ epic The Narrow Margin to be a disappointment. When I first heard Subterranea, I loved everything I heard, and was very excited to hear the 20-minute epic at the end. I thought surely it would be one of the greatest epics ever, as the finale to a great album. Perhaps I built it up to be more than it would be. Or perhaps, it's the fact that they hold the same melody line for 10+ minutes, and I don't find the melody that compelling. Whatever it is, this is probably the most disappointing epic I've heard. I love their other epics, Last Human Gateway, Harvest of Souls, Seventh House and so on. But this one never really impressed me. ------------- I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you? |
Posted By: Cesar Inca
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 10:21
That's right! I would go further and say that 'The Gates of Delirium' is one of the best prog epics ever, with the rockier sections delivering amazingly disturbing ambiences. I don't know what other people regard as "enouch" or "much variation", but TGOD definitely comprises lots of variations, even during the development of one same motif. On the other hand, any of the four suites of "Tales" drags a lot, undisputed really.
Kind regards.
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Posted By: Gog/Magog
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 10:24
Woah, yes I'm with you on that my friend, never has a song been so mistitled. ------------- |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 11:06
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Ricochet is right, let us talk about other epics, not just Yes and Jethro Tull... How about Nemo? God, I just dont like Nemo, they are so souless to me, I get absolutly nothing out of them and their first epic Philéas just shows that good musicianship and some ideas here and there do not make up for 20 min of good music. Now, here Im being a bit too critical maybe... but Nemo is a band that I have heard so much about and has let me down so badly, specially when it comes to the epics! ------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 11:09
I agree. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: Zargus
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 11:25
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I have yet to find an epic i dont like. ------------- 
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Posted By: Negru Voda
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 11:45
Yeah, I forgot to add KE9 in my list. The first 13 minutes are great but and IMO they should've stopped there. |
Posted By: infandous
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:23
Heh, I love Nemo. Though I admit that they are a bit "cold" at times. I think their production accounts for a lot of that though. Still, I kind of agree about Philéas, but only to the extent that I don't really think it's even an "epic". It seems like 4 separate pieces of music to me. As to modern epics I don't like much, The Flower Kings "Love Supreme" is more of a really long song than an actual epic in structure and they just drag out a fairly uninteresting melody over 19 minutes. Pretty boring for me, and I am a big fan of The Flower Kings, especially their epic tracks. |
Posted By: jimmy_row
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:34
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Two that spring to mind immediately are KE9 and Passion Play...both had the potential to be excellent but couldn't go the distance, so you get a 60/40 balance of brilliance vs. fluff and utter dross. ------------- Signature Writers Guild on strike |
Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:41
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Close to the Edge. No, seriesly. The first couple of minutes are quite interesting, but from their on out its a cure for insomnia. Stardust We Are. the Flower Kings seem to have a problem with not knowing when to stop recording songs, or how to shorten songs that drag on too long. The entire SWA album is too long, and he first time I heard the closing epic I was 10 minutes in before I checked and found that, yes, it was SWA that was playing, it just sounded exactly the same to the previous 24 songs on the album. Octavarium. Utter drivel, the intro's too long, the structure doesnt work too well and the whole thing should have been 12 instead of 24 minutes, plus the production on the whole album sucks so you cant here the bass except for a couple of parts. The World that we Drive Through. See Stardust We Are, same problem here on this epic from The Tangent. Nine Feet Underground, Caravan. Extremely boring except for one section towards the end. Moon in June, Soft Machine. Really dont like the first 10 minutes, but picks up fantastically after that. ___On Limpid Form and Amaranth the Peddler, Kayo Dot. The lat two songs on Dowsing Anamone... and they are both very repetitive and incredibly dull. Anesthetize, Porcupine Tree. Just very boring. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005 
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Posted By: magnus
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:44
Scientists have recently made a major breakthrough! They discovered something which they decided to call "opinions", I think you should look into it. 
And I refuse to listen to Micky, Raff and Stonebeard, A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers is 23 minutes and 5 seconds of pure musical extacy  ------------- The scattered jigsaw of my redemption laid out before my eyes Each piece as amorphous as the other - Each piece in its lack of shape a lie 
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Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:46
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Supper's Ready and Octavarium.
Supper's Ready - The ultimate song...or ultimate epic of prog? You can't be real, it was more of a collection of songs then one long piece. The beginning and end are great, but they got lost somewhere in between. Octavarium - Loved this song, after a while I couldn't understand why. Long drawn out intro on the continuim, followed by an extremely long verse. The instrumental is the only notable thing on that song and the album. Dream Theater had like 3 other albums with 8 songs...what were they trying to pull off with this album .
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Posted By: ConfusedGenius
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 12:58
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The one that immediately comes to mind is "Temporary Peace" from "Fine
Day to Exit" by Anathema. Clearly the last 13 or so minutes are just a
waste. "WHAT ABOUT DOGS AND CATS AND CHICKENS!: ...why?
------------- Don't eat...your beets...RECYCLE!! - "Earth Day" by Devin Townsend |
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 13:07
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"End of the Day" - SB ------------- https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sQD8uhpWXCw" rel="nofollow - It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood...Road Rage Edition |
Posted By: Lofcaudio
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 14:40
I agree 100%.
I would also add that I don't care for Gates of Delirium up until Soon. Plague of Lighthouse Keepers is also borderline, as is Battle of Epping Forest.
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Posted By: darkmatter
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 15:04
I wouldn't call it an epic, because it's really just a 5 or 6 minute song with extra material following it.... |
Posted By: Evans
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 15:06
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Oh, it's totally Supper's Ready. I used to like it a lot, but somehow that disappeared. "The End" was a disappointing one that i eventually warmed a lot to, so that's cool... ------------- 
'Let's give it another fifteen seconds..' |
Posted By: zachfive
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 15:15
I kindly disagree with his statement. And for those who are bashing on Gates, go and re-listen to it you punks, because it is one of progs greatest epics. |
Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 15:51
Fair enough, doesnt mean your right though. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:19
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Posted By: Melomaniac
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:24
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The Battle of Epping Forest - Easily the most annoying Gabriel era Genesis epic. ------------- "One likes to believe in the freedom of Music" - Neil Peart, The Spirit of Radio |
Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:32
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Any Traffic one, say Low Spark, Dream Gerard, Rollright Stones (if it's possible to call 'em epics)
------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:36
| a lot of people are complaining about The Battle of Epping Forest but I would hardly consider that an epic it's only 11:50 |
Posted By: Melomaniac
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:38
Medium length epic, but boring nonetheless ------------- "One likes to believe in the freedom of Music" - Neil Peart, The Spirit of Radio |
Posted By: Lucent
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:40
| I detest Supper's Ready |
Posted By: Shakespeare
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:42
All I meant by that was that Taab has some quieter moments, yes, but it generally has more going on than Animals, I didn't mean that Animals was inferior to Taab or that one captures the listeners interest more: simply that TaaB has more going on, y'know? Anyway, that is my opinion! I'm just sharing it. |
Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:43
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Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 16:45
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^ Oh please, to each his own
------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: cynthiasmallet
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 17:08
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Echoes by Pink Floyd is a little disappointing, not dreadful, but not great either. After that it's got to be Thick As A Brick. ------------- Would you like to watch TV, or get between the sheets, or contemplate the silent freeway, would you like something to eat? |
Posted By: cacha71
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 17:22
Well said!  It's rather like a good book... the more pages, the juicier it is, you just don't want it to end. I think musicians work very hard on their pieces before releasing them.------------- http://www.last.fm/group/Progressive+Folk |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 18:02
Of course they do, but does hard work equal to masterlines? ------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Posted By: Dim
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 18:07
The remembering rawks!
Actually, besides thick, I love about every seventies epic i have heard (which isnt saying much considering I dont own any VDGG).
I'll come back to his one after some thought... ------------- 
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Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 18:17
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Ah yes. How could I have forgotten Echoes. Parts are pleasant but parts just go on with no substance whatsoever. It is certainly the weakest epic, so I apologize to Yes. Echoes, in my opinion - overrated bland rubbish.
------------- <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 21:49
yeah.... boring as hell aren't they ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: sircosick
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 21:53
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^ Seriously, Micky...... They're blaaaaand!! xD
------------- The best you can is good enough... |
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 21:54
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Echoes (and Meddle) are the most overated Floyd to me. Echoes has marvelous moments but really puts me to sleep, and I don't have that problem with any other floyd. I love Floyd.
------------- https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sQD8uhpWXCw" rel="nofollow - It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood...Road Rage Edition |
Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:07
You= die now  and I'm very surprised you didn't say Shine On, which Echoes beats the sh*t out of -------------
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Posted By: 1800iareyay
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:14
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Beowulf- I think it's highly overrated Dream Theater- Six Degrees. I love the version on Score,. but the studio version just bores me. |
Posted By: Novalis
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:20
| Gates of Delerium>Supper's Ready, although both are overrated in my opinion. |
Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:21
| Passion Play by JT, though side 2 of Thick as a brick is weak. |
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:23
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I'm never going to speak to some of the people who posted here
------------- "PA's own GI Joe!" 
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Posted By: Fassbinder
Date Posted: October 09 2007 at 22:38
Wisely I never posted here...
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Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 00:55
| People seem to be attacking the bigger epics...let's really concentrate on the really sh*tty ones. |
Posted By: jimmy_row
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 01:03
------------- Signature Writers Guild on strike |
Posted By: martinprog77
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 03:47
  ------------- Nothing can last there are no second chances. Never give a day away. Always live for today. |
Posted By: Novalis
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 03:54
I actually quite like Gates and Supper's Ready has some good parts, but yes, I think they are overrated.
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Posted By: Norbert
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 08:28
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Anyone who mentions Yes of the '70's or VDGG or Supper's ready should run for cover...
Personally I am quite underwhelmed by The Great Nothing( quite an appropriate title) and Octavarium. No real direction or point in these pieces, they don't do much to me, although they have some good parts.
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Posted By: Novalis
Date Posted: October 10 2007 at 21:24
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Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 01:46
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Just saw a review of it on the archives...the Fantomas album...can't even remember the name delerium cordia or something like that. I listened to it once, just over an hour of noise.
But it's probably not considered an epic. |
Posted By: Teh_Slippermenz
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 02:07
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Shine On You Crazy Diamond by Pink Floyd. Really, it didn't live up to my expectations, and it's kind of boring. *ignites controversy among the prog fans of the entire world* |
Posted By: Astrodomine
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 02:37
| Shine On for me too. I always found it boring and generic. |
Posted By: salmacis
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 09:45
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Cannot think of one Genesis epic I dislike from any era of the band; I genuinely love them all (though some longer tracks on 'Calling All Stations' drag a bit). In fact, there are few of the 70s classics that have ever disappointed me. 'Awaken' in particular is simply staggering, IMHO; the climax of that track is arguably the finest thing Yes ever recorded, IMHO. But there's an embarassment of riches when you're talking about the great Yes epics.
Their later epics are another matter; the ABWH album has not aged at all well, but more importantly, I find a lot of the longer tracks on that to be weak and even cheesy ('Teakbois', 'Order Of The Universe'). 'That That Is' from 'Keys To Ascension' I found to be monumentally disappointing as well. It starts off really well but dovetails into nothing, IMHO. Unfortunately that nothing is about 20 minutes long though. I love 'Mind Drive', 'Homeworld' and 'In The Presence Of', though, so they can still do it.
Marillion's 'Grendel' is kind of an 'amateur hour' equivalent of a prog epic, IMHO. It's very dated, IMHO, and the band seem to be ashamed of it these days! There was a great bit in the Fish concert I saw not so long ago where there was an introductory film that made fun of the constant calls for 'Grendel' that he still gets.
Rush's 'Hemispheres' I find to be overstuffed, personally. I know some think it's their best album and fair enough, but I don't think that track coheres very well despite some good moments. There's too much going on, IMHO.
Keith Emerson's 'Piano Concerto' doesn't do it for me at all. The band were often criticised for having pretentions to being classical musicians and this is the clearest indication of that criticism. At least 'Pictures At An Exhibition' is adventurous and exciting (I love it), but I find this concerto to be as dull as ditchwater. Having said that, I did see a version of it Keith did with his band and it was really excellent. Perhaps it's the orchestrations I have a problem with.
As for IQ, I generally love their work (I will say I find the 'neo' bands to be much better at songwriting and constructing epics than they are given credit for, especially on their more modern albums) but 'Subterranea' as an album doesn't click with me fully. I think there's some excellent material on it but a lot of padding too, IMHO. If it was one disc I'm sure I'd like it a lot more than I do.
Then we get to Glass Hammer...I know some absolutely swear by 'The Inconsolable Secret' but I find almost every epic on there to be poorly written, appearing 'piecemeal' in construction. It's all very well pandering to fans who love a good epic (as I do myself) and indeed, I have no problem with bands writing songs in the 70s style, but please, have some good songwriting skills rather than piecing together sections randomly without coherence. I have this issue with some Flower Kings epics; 'Driver's Seat' springs to mind. There's a bit in that where it just stops completely dead and heads somewhere else.
And I struggle to accept 'Devil's Playground' as a coherent epic as well. |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 11:45
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I too used to dislike Hemispheres, now I like it a bit more, but I still find it to be the weakest track of the album.
------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Posted By: TheMadCap
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 12:46
| I use to hate Shine On You Scrazy Diamond but I have come to love that song. |
Posted By: dwill123
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 14:51
Tales from Topographic Oceans  
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 17:41
------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: October 11 2007 at 17:46
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to talk of truly disapointing epics... I have to say the poster child is Karn Evil 9... talk about ALL over the place.... the first part of first impression... oh my god.... totally out of this world.. the second part of the first impression...the less said the better.. when anything from a prog group is used in Dr. Pepper commerical where a 300 pound football lineman is dancing .... simply is the posterchild for disappointing hahha 2nd impression.... back to OMG... the problem though.... what does it have anything to do with where this epic started. the 3rd impression... the theme of the epic is finally fleshed out... yet the music has put me to sleep. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: pickle
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 10:37
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Marillion's This Strange Engine (title track) seems like H's emulation of the And When Did You Last See Your Father story by Blake Morrison. That last bit where H is laughing crazily always reminded me of Spike Jones & The City Slickers' I Went To Your Wedding!
I'll get the Monty Python foot crashing down on me for this, but I felt both discs of Kate Bush's Aerial needed a decent edit. If I want to hear someone burbling on about their child, I'll listen to my sister! ------------- Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back in time for breakfast! - Ace Rimmer (Red Dwarf) |
Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 14:11
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Hmmm...
Shadow Gallery - First Light (Not sure if it's even an epic, it's a long song then alot of silence and then another song at the end to me)
Pink Floyd - Atom Heart Mother (Good song, but some parts makes me sleepy)
King Crimson - Lizard (First part is enough)
Emerson, Lake & Palmer - Karn Evil 9 (Good song, but i expected much better)
And i'm surprised that several epics mentioned are favorites of mine
Yes - All of "Tales from Topographic Oceans"
Caravan - Nine Feet Underground
...
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Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 14:28
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Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 15:02
indeeeeeed------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 15:11
I forgot about Lizard, not one of my favourites. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Posted By: Sckxyss
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 16:59
 .. just continuing the anger pyramid |
Posted By: Gog/Magog
Date Posted: October 13 2007 at 17:02
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The Sky Moves Backwards is pretty rubbish...but then Porcupine Tree have been getting pretty rubbish the more they go on (and on and on etc)
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