ELO, 10CC and Supertramp
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Topic: ELO, 10CC and Supertramp
Posted By: Ely78
Subject: ELO, 10CC and Supertramp
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 09:50
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I love these three similar bands.
And you? ------------- When the love becomes poetry, distant from the eyes (Quando l'Amore Diventa poesia/ Lontano Dagli occhi [Aphrodite's Child) |
Replies:
Posted By: ClemofNazareth
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 10:48
I suspect there are many 30-40 somethings here who took the path of ELO -> 10CC -> Supertramp -> Magma (or something like that)  in their formative years. All three of them are great bands, and I think sometimes their commercial success caused their standing to suffer with some proglodytes. ------------- "Peace is the only battle worth waging." Albert Camus |
Ely78 wrote:Posted By: Mandrakeroot
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 12:46
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Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 12:49
| Pretty mediocre... |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 12:56
granted I don't know 10CC that well... but Supertramp and ELO do NOT have the same style... have never heard it... but that is personal opinion... Mandy.. .watch the translator there if you are trying to make points... no one has insulted anyone here or has any reason TO be insulted.. and bringing it up.. in whatever you are trying to say is bound to leave people scratching their heads. Myself included.... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 12:57
| Andrea, Bob wasn't insulting you, on the contrary! He said those three bands are very good. However, I don't really see them as having the same style. |
Posted By: Mandrakeroot
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 15:05
Is the point of view of Mandrakeroot, Ely78 and Lady In Black (Prog Golden Age Die Hard Fans Team). Because it's true, th difference are great but, final result, these three bands have the same final style. Clear not in all songs.
Sure Supertramp, ELO and 10CC (hey... from today only 10CC are PR... This isn't the correct place for this thread!!!) have the same fans (not all the fans of one is the fans of another). For this fact this thread includes these three bands. -------------
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Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 22:57
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I'm not sure what's similar about these.
ELO I hated back in the day, given that they were competing with Yes and ELP. However Turn To Stone and Evil Woman are excellent tracks.
10CC I am less familiar with. Must say Dreadlock Holiday is first rate, thought obviously not anywhere near prog.
Neither of the above is in the same class as Supertramp.
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Posted By: ClemofNazareth
Date Posted: November 17 2007 at 23:09
My point was that, at least where I grew up in the 70s, many kids got into ELO because they were popular, their label promoted them heavily, and they had songs on the radio with rather simple hooks that appealed to many. From there some of those same kids got a little more adventurous and checked out 10CC, who were a little more British-sounding and therefore were considered a bit more exotic to us kids from the sticks of Montana. Even fewer got into Supertramp because they were considered quite weird and foreign-sounding (mostly because of Hodgson's voice). Obviously some of us worked our way past them and on to even more exotic and progressive music (hence the Magma reference). The point is that for some of us (okay, maybe just me) ELO, 10CC and Supertramp were catalysts to get us to a greater appreciation for the broader progressive music spectrum where we might not have otherwise had is not been for those bands. On the subject of whether I like/respect those bands - read my reviews. Of 400+ reviews I've only ever given 21 a 5 star rating. Three of those are Supertramp albums.  ------------- "Peace is the only battle worth waging." Albert Camus |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: November 18 2007 at 08:10
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I can almost agree with Mandy here. All three are great bands of their time and did indeed produce albums that sit comfortably alongside each other. From late 1974 onwards all three bands produced a similar strain of radio-friendly Art-Pop (for want of a better word): exquisitly crafted music, with unusual instrumentation and intelligent lyrics, superbly played and well produced. If we were to judge their music from that point on I think we would all agree that they were all in that fuzzy grey area between Pop and Prog. However, before then both ELO and Supertramp had produced 100% Prog albums and only moved away from that when American success beckoned (or became less Prog once American success occured). Crisis What Crisis is a different album to Crime of the Century in the same way that Eldorado and New World Record are different to No Answer and Face The Music. 10cc on the other hand, made complex and clever Pop songs that were influenced by Prog through-out their career, (excpet maybe Hotlegs, which isn't really 10cc), but they were never fully Prog. Had Godley and Creme remained with the band and produced Consequences as a 10cc album things may have been different, certainly Consequences would have been improved by the addition of Stewart and Goldman's production and song-writing restraint, which IMO would have limitted the excesses of that ultimately flawed Prog masterpeice, but then we would not have had the Pop-Art-Rock pleasures of L or Freeze Frame. My 2 Pence worth (old money) ------------- What? |
Posted By: TGM: Orb
Date Posted: November 18 2007 at 17:04
| I love 10cc (particularly Sheet Music), like Supertramp (but I've only heard Crisis? What Crisis and Crime of the Century itself) and like some ELO (Sweet Talking Woman, Roll Over Beethoven in particular). |
Posted By: Mandrakeroot
Date Posted: November 19 2007 at 12:02
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DARQDEAN: I haven't albums of Godley and Creme. Nevertheless from my searches in Internet I learned that they come more Prog than considerat the 10CC (of which were members). -------------
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Posted By: Thandrus
Date Posted: November 19 2007 at 17:26
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I love ELO... Time is THE MASTERPIECE... I think, The Beatles would sound in the same great way in 80s...
I like Supertramp, also, but not enough to give Crime Of The Century a 5 star rating.
And, with 10CC... never got much into them... perhaps I should listen to them more, but from what I've heard they are stuck bentween prog and pop in a bad way (unlike Supertramp and ELO, IMO) I mean, the lack of pop hooks and absence of true prog complexity. I like their early albums relatively more... I think they were strongly influenced by Frank Zappa. And yeah, I'm Not In Love is really catchy! Well, maybe I'll fall in love with this band somewhen... but not now.
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Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: November 20 2007 at 05:10
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While Supertramp and ELO are excellent rock bands that had a pop edge and were prog (at least for a while), and had both their typical sound, which sound nothing alike
10CC was a pop band that enjoyed much pastiche like Queen and Sparks. So I'd link 10CC to a poppier Queen (at least in the 70's) than ELO or Supertramp.
------------- let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
Posted By: Lady In Black
Date Posted: November 22 2007 at 05:46
In my vision of prog (that is the vision also of Mandrakeroot and Ely78 because Ely78 and Mandrakeroot have uncovered the Prog thanks to me) 10CC are a good Prog bands. In fact the treatment of the POP elements in 10CC songs produced a good Progresive POP or better Song Songwriter Prog. But yes, in a more general view these three bands are great boundaries (between Rock [POP] and Prog) bands. ------------- It's dark... I've fear... I have strong pains... A serpent is being born... That badly I did, I? |
Posted By: Sole
Date Posted: November 27 2007 at 19:07
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I love 10CC and ELO. I adore this type of music!
In a certain sense these two bands are a great occasion to pass 40 mins to listen to great music! ------------- The Sun is my name... The Moon is my death! |
Posted By: maani
Date Posted: December 15 2007 at 18:55
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dargdean:
Brilliantly put! Bravo!
Actually, Supertramp and 10CC were "kissin' cousins," good buddies palling around and being influenced by each other. The similarities are not an accident. ELO was on a somewhat different path, though there are similarities in all three bands - certainly at least partly because all three were obviously Beatles-influenced as well.
Interesting fact: When Klaatu was asked who their influences were (besides The Beatles), they said, "ELO, Supertramp and 10CC." No kidding. So Klaatu also linked those three groups in some way.
When the Queen controversy began here at PA (for those who remember! LOL), I was one who argued strongly for the creation of a new category called "progressive pop," in which they would have more suitably fit (yes, yes, I know they wrote a handful of truly prog songs, and maybe Queen II and NATO are largely prog, but that is only a small minority of their total output). Into this category I would have put Queen, ELO, 10CC, Supertramp, Klaatu, XTC and perhaps a few others whose music often straddles the line between "pop" and "progressive." Needless to say, I was voted down, and "prog-related" became the category - a moniker I remain uncomfortable with, since there are any number of bands that could sneak (and some have) under the wire, where they might not have in "progressive pop."
Peace.
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: December 15 2007 at 20:38
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^ XTC is a fine example of Progressive Pop or Art-Pop - even their early stuff - This Is Pop is such a subversive little song ("If that was Pop I don't want to meet Mum" - Peter Cook).
I'll see your XTC and raise you one Sparks - another band that defies description and walked that wobbly line betwix Prog and Pop, from their early Bearsville Art Rock albums, through the Hits period from This Town... to Beat the Clock to the recent return to Art Rock albums of Lil' Beethoven and Hello Young Lovers. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: December 18 2007 at 08:17
| Not a big fan, but selected tracks by all three I can live with. Supertramp probably the best for me. 'Crime of the Century' is a pretty good album. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: December 19 2007 at 15:14
| ELO and 10cc. |
Posted By: BrufordFreak
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 08:48
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i couldn't agree more. If you ever had a chance to see Supertramp in concert pre-'Breakfast in America' you'd know you were watching a true progressive rock band. Their live executions made their songs sound like symphonic peices that incidentally had lyrics---with all of the emotional impact of a Broadway show. Plus, I'm just a sucker for a 12-string guitar and a slide show on a video screen. Must be a visual learner.... Nektar, doves slayed me. What about XTC? ------------- Drew Fisher https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/ |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 10:24
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10CC: for some reason, I have difficulty appreciating them.
ELO: I used to like their hits. Since I discovered prog I'm not really interested anymore, except for Mr. Blue Sky.
I like Supertramp from Crime Of The Century to Breakfast In America, though I don't like them as much anymore as I used to. Also because of the prog factor, I think. But it's a good band.
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 10:45
you need to re-visit their first two albums - definite prog quotient. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Man Erg
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 10:53
Absolutely,Dean.I would also add 'On The Third Day'.My favourite ELO album. Their rendering of 'In the Hall of The Mountain King' is prog at it's most overblown...in a good way. Ocean Breakup from OTTD is also an amazing prog track. -------------  Do 'The Stanley' otherwise I'll thrash you with some rhubarb. |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 12:19
You're right, I know that I still have some homework to do. I haven't heard any ELO earlier than Eldorado, I realise that, and I think I've heard someone say before that the first albums are good. Well, I shall push them a little bit higher on my things-I-need-to-hear-list
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Posted By: gr8dane
Date Posted: April 04 2008 at 12:44
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Can't play prog when the Missus's around.
But these will not get any complaints.
Great pop with a dash of prog.
Everybody's happy.
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Posted By: BroSpence
Date Posted: April 08 2008 at 00:50
| I like ELO a lot actually. Don't care too much for the other two. Jeff Lyne is a creative guy and so he keeps the ELO albums quite interesting. I even enjoyed the generally hated Discovery album! |
Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: April 19 2008 at 02:54
I can't stand their first album, except for 10538 Overture. On The Third Day and Eldorado were their most solid offerings, although I'm also fond of Out of the Blue and A New World Record.
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Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: April 21 2008 at 22:19
| Actually ELO, at least the hits, always reminded me of ABBA, or maybe the other way around. |
Posted By: Drew
Date Posted: April 21 2008 at 22:22
That's somehow an insult to BOTH bands ------------- |
Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: April 21 2008 at 22:27
My specialty
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Posted By: Bitterblogger
Date Posted: June 09 2008 at 02:05
I agree with Blacksword several posts back--each, in their heyday, had some material that I enjoyed, but each having also MOR pop elements that are mostly antithetical to Prog...(cue the inevitable shadow reference to post-Hackett Genesis  )
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Posted By: A B Negative
Date Posted: June 09 2008 at 11:20
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When I first started to seriously listen to music, my friend always insisted that Supertramp and ELO were better than Pink Floyd and Rush. I borrowed his LPs and found a lot of enjoyable music (but I still preferred Floyd and Rush).
Never met any 10cc fans. ------------- "The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time." |
Posted By: Alberto Muņoz
Date Posted: October 16 2008 at 11:34
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Supertramp: Their first album is a super MASTERPIECE.
10 CC: haven't heard so much, but is great band.
ELO: Their first album is SUPERB. -------------  |
Posted By: AlanD
Date Posted: November 20 2008 at 02:36
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All three bands happily reside in my collection...
10cc were sheer genius between 1972 and 1976 - the layering, nuance and attention to detail in their albums of this period would take a book to elucidate (I may write it one day).
ELO were just a fabbo pop band and although you could nearly always see where Jeff Lynne had re-written a tune from - I still found them irresistible.
Supertramp knocked my socks off live on the Crime of the Century tour but were patchier thereafter.
------------- AlanD |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: November 20 2008 at 03:52
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i know it sounds a bit corny when someone says "that music was the soundtrack of my life" but ELO, Supertramp and 10cc truly were!
all their albums were rarely off my turntable during the 70's and 80's especially "Third Day","Face the Music", "Out of the Blue", "Time", "Crisis", "Breakfast", "Sheet Music", "Original Soundtrack", "How Dare You"......ah, memories...who needs a photo album? the faces and places all come flooding back
-------------  Prog Archives Tour Van 
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Posted By: Abrawang
Date Posted: December 11 2008 at 22:55
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I haven't heard this song for ages but in university I always like 10cc's One Night in Paris. It's funny and has lots of prog elements. I tried a search on Limewire recently but you can imagine the results I got.
------------- Casting doubt on all I have to say... |
Posted By: ZowieZiggy
Date Posted: December 20 2008 at 18:57
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These bands have nothing in common IMO (except they were great at some time of their existence). I have reviewed their whole works and liked them an awful lot.
But what does have ''Sheet Music'' or ''The Original Soundtrack'' (CC) has in common with ''Crime'' or ''Crisis'' (Tramp) or with 'the great ''ELO II'' or ''El Dorado''?
Nothing but a high rating (four to five stars). ------------- ZowieZiggy |
Posted By: SgtPepper67
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 07:34
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I love Supertramp, at least their albums from Crime of the century to Breakfast in America, I haven't heard the rest yet. They're one of my favourite prog bands. I have only two albums by ELO, Eldorado and A New World Record. I like them but I didn't really got into them yet. I love the first 3 or 4 songs on A New World Record but the I usually lose interest after those ones when I listen to it. The few times I tried to listen to Eldorado it couldn't hold my attention. But I think it's just a matter of time, I know it's a band I will end up loving sooner or later. I think they're somehow similar to Supertramp cos in my opinion they sound like pop oriented prog. I find some Styx stuff from the 70's a bit similar too. I haven't heard anything from 10cc, are they worth cheking out? -------------  In the end the love you take is equal to the love you made... |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 09:07
check out Brother where are you bound from Supertramp... you'll love it... I did at least.. have a sample and ELO... you should get the first 3 next . all very different.. yet all 3 completely prog.. GREAT stuff. have a sample... my favorite ELO track... from the 2nd album.. yet the 3rd as a whole is my favorite.. was mentioned earlier in the thread ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: MovingPictures07
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 10:48
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ELO and Supertramp are fantastic. Never heard 10CC. ------------- 
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Posted By: progrules
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 12:00
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10CC made one great (I'm Mandy fly me) and one good (Wallstreet shuffle) song at least where their hits are concerned. I also like several songs on their magnum opus: How Dare you ?
ELO's best song is Overture, followed by Evil Woman and Sweet talkin woman.
Supertramp made a few beauties like Fool's Overture, Crime of the Century and Goodbye Stranger..
Of all three I'm afraid I will have to say: the rest is dispensable. But that's only an opinion. ------------- A day without prog is a wasted day |
Posted By: J-Man
Date Posted: December 21 2008 at 17:02
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1. ELO 2. Supertramp 3. 10CC Love the first two, 10CC's okay though... -------------  Check out my YouTube channel! http://www.youtube.com/user/demiseoftime" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/user/demiseoftime |
Posted By: Mandrakeroot
Date Posted: December 23 2008 at 07:32
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Uhm... The side of Prog POP is sure to deepen. Also because I returned to listen Prog POP and I rediscovered great music. Even in a group like Alan Parsons Project/ band I rediscovered big music! -------------
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Posted By: Mandrakeroot
Date Posted: December 27 2008 at 04:33
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http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=54272 - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=54272
This is the link of the thread that absorbs this thread! -------------
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: January 16 2009 at 15:17
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Hi,
They all have their place, and made their own history ... and there are things they did ... that we still see today!
Of these, ELO maybe considered the one that went the furthest and that would be because Jeff Lynne was a neighbor and close friend to George Harrison, and eventually put together the Travelling Willburys ... which might not have happened if there was not someone like Jeff to pull together things and organize them. Even Tom Petty comments on it in the movie (worth seeing btw)
Sadly, there is one thing that is sadly forgotten. I always thought that some of the humor and fun in ELO was brought in by Roy Wood ... and he has been hung out to dry ... and one listen to his albums shows more impressive experimentation and variety of things than many other musicians out there.
10CC ... is one of my favorites ... unffortunately the "moving picture music" that their songs and lyrics helped create for your imagination died one day ... and no one could do anything about it anymore ... maybe they got tired of little home movies, as it were. But I still have the first 5 albums and I can sit through them any time and still enjoy them ... after that ... the enjoyment goes out ...
If anything hurt this band more, it was that Creme and Godley were very good together and what they were doing in solo albums (they had several together) was magnificently (progressive and off the wall too!!!) nice, but not designed for a "pop song" as 10CC was. And it became evident when Godley ended up writing and directing several videos for The Police ...
You have to remember that these same guys were almost single handedly responsible for dressing up Neil Sedaka and right after they were also responsible for undressing us with some kind of neanderthal love! The kind of thing that most fans can not ... understand ... we want pop songs after all, or some prog bullship! But music? ... and humor on top of it? Goodness gracious ... how dare you?
Supertramp ... It was in Santa Barbara and I just came home from work and my roomate has tears in his eyes. He had just brought home "Crime of the Century" amidst a couple of other things ... and he had just finished playing the album ... he was just in tears .. and was kinda moved that someone could write something like this and be ... relevant and important. When he went on the air that night he played both sides back to back ... and that was the number one FM station in Santa Barbara at the time ... and within days the whole station was playing it and within months ... everyone knew about this band. Same thing happened with the Average White Band. And Camel ... endless history here.
They were very good as long as they were sticking to themselves. One day ... one of them or another got into of those "opiate for the rich" things ... and the band died. It was sad for me. I happened to like the first 3 albums immensely, for their freshness and approach.
Imagine this stuff being played on the air in 1973 ... in those days FM radio was slightly new and it was known for "long cuts" and far-out music that represented the natural progression from the "pop" orientation of the hippie days, and the desire for many of those musicians to "grow" and take things into a new era and generation ... and it worked for a while ... and I'm not sure that Led Zeppelin (for example) would have made it so nicely if it weren't for FM radio, since many of their cuts were longer and AM radio was not gonna touch anything over 3 minutes ... see the difference? Goota play all those commercials ... gotta pull in t money ... it's never the music that matters ... and few stations EVER ... made time and space for "something else" out there.
All three of those bands lost their focus ... as they got bigger. In a way 10CC did get bigger, but into being the artists that they were ... you were not going to keep Creme and Godley writing pop songs all the time ... specially when they decided (finally) to get visual ... and forget the money and royalties they were not gaining/getting that they should have been getting ... the internet came up 10 years later ... and in a way one of these guys even invented the GIZMO, which became eventually know as a guitar synthesizer later on ... in this case we were dealing with highly intelligent folks that were doing much more than just pop musik.
Thx
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