History of Twin Lead Guitar
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Topic: History of Twin Lead Guitar
Posted By: Castroph
Subject: History of Twin Lead Guitar
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 22:59
| I was interested in knowing where the twin guitar sound was first used/made up. The only bands that I've known that do that are Wishbone Ash and Iron Maiden. Anyone care to explain the history behind this? |
Replies:
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:05
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where's Certif1ed when you need him.. overdubbing of lead guitar goes way back.. twin guitars I'm not sure about |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:06
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My first knowledge of it was a late 60's (67-69) San Franciso group called Quicksilver Messanger Service who had Gary Duncan and John Cippolina on lead guitar. Not as heavy as some others later but that was the first one I knew aobut. Maybe there were others before?
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: Castroph
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:10
| I've heard Allman Brothers also had twin lead guitars, but I want to know the roots of it. |
Posted By: Walker
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:18
| I think the Allman's had to be one of the first... after all, "lead guitar" as we know it didn't really exist until the mid 60's. Thin Lizzy also employed twin leads very effectively I might add. |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:21
loved Cippolina, great tone and feel for electric blues, saw a few times in S.F. before he died |
Garion81 wrote:Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:37
This was the group that first leaped to mind with me, but I don't think they were the first.
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Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:48
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The first person to release albums with double tracked guitars was Les Paul.
As far as rock bands with two leads go, along with the ones already mentioned there is also Big Brother and the Holding Company and Fleetwood Mac. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:56
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Kansas may not have been the first, but there are plenty of Kansas songs with dual lead that Maiden seem to have been heavily influenced by (though they probably wouldn't admit it).
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Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: June 02 2008 at 23:58
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[QUOTE=Easy Money]The first person to release albums with double tracked guitars was Les Paul [QUOTE]. I think the original poster was actually talking about harmonized twin leads and dualing guitar solos and not double tracking per se. Well anyway, the way I always saw it, was that Wishbone Ash were one of the bands that really made harmonized guitar parts popular, and not only used the bog standard major and minor 3rds, but also used parallel 4ths and from memory parallel 5ths, but I can't be sure about the 5ths.
Iron Maiden made it even more popular and raised the bar of the complexity of the actual rifffs to be harmonized. Not only using just harmonized licks, but on some of their work utilising contrary motion as well (but not that frequently) ------------- 
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Posted By: VanderGraafKommandöh
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:06
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Harry, that last post went right over my head! Well, let me see... you're correct, Wishbone Ash, Thin Lizzy, Allman Brothers Band, Fleetwood Mac and Quicksilver Messenger Service all had twin guitars. What about twin acoustic in a rockier context? I'm thinking of Pentangle here. Of course, twin acoustic have been used for centuries. In the 1930s you had Eddie Lang playing with other acoustic guitarists, as well as Leadbelly also playing with others. Also, Juicy Lucy kind of had twin guitars in the late 1960s. -------------   
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Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:08
If you are talking about two guitars harmonizing a melody together in a rock context then I am sure the Allmans were ahead of Ash and Maiden. The question is, was there someone ahead of the Allmans, that someone could be Fleetwood Mac. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: VanderGraafKommandöh
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:11
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From an interview with Laurie Wisefield of Wishbone Ash: Where did the dual guitar sound originate? Laurie: A long time ago before I was with Wishbone Ash I played with a band called Home, who did a couple of albums and then split. Home did a lot of touring with Wishbone in those days and both bands were using the twin lead guitar sound, so I’d definitely say that Home and Wishbone Ash were the first. There are several bands using the twin lead guitar sound now but I shan’t mention any names. Addendum: that was around 1973, so I'd say Fleetwood Mac were one of the pioneers. -------------
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:21
| Black Oak Arkansas were doing the twin lead thing in '70 - '71. Not sure if it was first but it was early on. |
Posted By: soundsweird
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:28
| I think we can add Savoy Brown to the list... |
Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:31
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^Wishbone Ash definitely started doing it before Black Oak, back in '69 for sure. Easy Money could be right about the Allman bro's on this one, but I'm pretty sure even if they got to it well before Wishbone did, Wishbone were the guys that made it popular. -------------
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Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:37
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A quick check of the internet has Mac forming in 67, Allmans 69 and Ash in 70.
I keep wondering about the possibility of some older RnB or blues band out there that did it first. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: akiko
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 00:56
| Bubble Puppy founded in 1966 seems to be credited with the first dual lead guitar. |
Posted By: Ahmadbarqawi
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 01:57
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i dont know if they were the first but... Judas Priest did it in 1973 ------------- {Flashlights shade shrunken views Of a red demon’s foxtrot in brews Guns & flowers crown morning news Panic-stricken guilt now ensues} |
Posted By: KeleCableII
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 02:38
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I believe one of the defining features of southern rock is the twin lead guitar. Lynyrd Skynyrd, Allman Brothers, .38 Special, The Outlaws and The Marshall Tucker Band all had two lead guitarists, I think. Edit: Triple guitar in Molly Hatchet apparently. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flirtin'_with_Disaster) |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 03:00
| Lynyrd Skynyrd had 3 lead guitars most of the time e.g. Rossington, Collins and Gaines. |
Posted By: BaldJean
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 03:20
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it was the Yardbirds who invented double lead guitar
-------------  A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 03:24
| ^ that's a good guess, or they at least popularized it |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 06:30
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Well the Yardbirds were around way ahead of Fleetwood Mac, but I thought they played in a rhythm plus lead style like the Stones.
I think the question was about two lead guitars harmonizing melodies together. I can't remember if the Yardbirds played in that style, if they did they would at least be ahead of the other mentioned bands. P.S. I just got through playing my only Yardbirds record, Over Under etc. There were a lot of great songs with two guitars, but no harmonized leads. I know there is Beck's Bolero, but that may or may not be an isolated incident. Also, Bolero sounds like Beck double tracking himself, I'm sure he was aware of Les Paul's pioneering work in this area. I guess the alleged Bubble Puppy comes in ahead of Fleetwood Mac. Seems like maybe the Beatles did a couple early guitar breaks with harmonized leads but that may not be true, also I was wondering if the Byrds did anything in that style. Looks like everyone else has lost interest, I guess I'll just turn out the light and close the door behind me. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 12:32
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^ I have to agree Bob that the Yardbirds use of the dual guitar was more akin to the Stones rhythm and lead. Quicksilver had two lead guitarist in their formative years before their record deal in 1967 actually they had a third member who sang and played guitar as well. But who really knows who was first. Is the Question who put a band together using it or who first employed it? I mean that could go back to any two people sitting down and trading chops. Jerry Garcia used to sit in with Airplane all the time and him and Jorma Kaukonen (and Jack Casidy) used to trade chops all the time but never as part of a studio album so not sure that counts. But I am guessing for Rock within a band this came about somewhere in the mid 60's but I couldn't tell you who was first. -------------
"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 13:16
| How about The Ventures? Were tthey using dual lead guitars? They came before any other band mentioned here. I'm thinking of Walk Don't Run, etc., but I haven't heard those songs in a while so it may be more of a lead/rhythm guitar configuration. |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 13:42
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Good choice, I do believe the Ventures did some harmonized melodic leads, which leads to a band we all forgot, the Shadows in the UK, who did a lot of instrumentals with harmonized lead guitars and were an influence on many young aspiring prog-rockers. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 13:45
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I thought the Nashville Teens had dual lead before mid-60's (big hit: Toacco Road) - wasn't it one reason why they won MM's Group Contest 1963 or '4? Of course Hank and Bruce in the Shadows had to lead guitars in 1959, although Jet Harris on an early electric bass did more lead work then Bruce Welsh, who was strictly rhythm* (how many chords did Welch know?) - and then I think Hank played with Wally Whyton (folkie and children's TV presenter) in the Vipers in 1957 or 8...... * On the sleeve of Wishbone 4 one photograph includes a Shadow's LP cover as an acknowledgment to what went before. Indeed Keith Richard and Brian Jones of the Stones weren't that bad on leads. ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 13:50
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Hi Dick, glad you weighed in on this, more specifically the question is about two leads playng lines together in harmony (ie Fleetwood Mac, Allmans, Wishbone Ash etc), not just two lead guitars. I don't think the Stones did a lot of harmonized leads together, but I have been wrong before. ------------- Help the victims of the russian invasion: http://www.jazzmusicarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523&PID=130446&title=various-ways-you-can-help-ukraine#130446 |
Posted By: paolo.beenees
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 13:55
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Of course he was not the first one, but Michael Rother could create excellent harmonized guitar pieces by dubbing himself (in his first three albums) ------------- 
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Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 14:00
Good point . Bruce Welsh and Hank Marvin certainly had a very sympathetic set up wrt lead and harmony chords, but never striking off as two true leads. What of the other forgotten UK instrumental groups: Shane Fenton's Fentones (1 hit wonders - with Riders In The Sky?????), Billy Fury's Tornados (pre-Telstar)?? or Billy Kramer's group? Was the early 60's hit Sleepwalk by Santo & Johnny, dual lead? ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 14:29
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And then there is the pairing of Allan Holdsworth and Ollie Halsall on Tempest's BBC Radio One In Concert set (recorded 1972 or '3), but released only a few years aback on the double Under the Blossom: The Anthology . Some of the playing heard takes a lot of beating ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: Chicapah
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 15:28
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For a very brief time in 1966 the Yardbirds had both Beck and Page sharing lead guitar duties and their appearance in the movie "Blow Up" that same year documents that. If you ever have a chance to grab the soundtrack of that movie, their blistering version of "Stroll On" ("Train kept 'a rollin'" with different lyrics) is enough to make your hair stand on end. The gutteral tones of both guitarists are way before their time and you can tell they are both trying to "one up" the other. So, for me, that's when the idea of having more than one lead guitarist in the same band was formulated (although The Ventures were doing it instrumentally all during the early 60s). ------------- "Literature is well enough, as a time-passer, and for the improvement and general elevation and purification of mankind, but it has no practical value" - Mark Twain |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 18:30
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkN1lFqldb4 ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: The Quiet One
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 18:34
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Whitesnake on 1977 were already using twin guitars, and it wasn't their popish metalish era, don't be afraid of purchasing something.
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Posted By: jammun
Date Posted: June 03 2008 at 20:49
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And one of the great examples: Joe Walsh & Glen Frey on Hotel California. Not necessarily well-thought of on this site, but those twin guitar solos are near perfection. |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 23 2008 at 02:56
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Yardbirds and QMS that's for sure Besides i don't remember if FZ and Elliot Ingber do Twin Lead guitar dutie in Freak Out! anyone? And Safes as Milk Beefheart has two guitars one Ry Cooder and the other Alex St Clair, do not remember if they shared duties... And finally Julian Bream and John Williams for classical  -------------  |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: August 23 2008 at 08:49
And have you seen the dual leads of John Williams and PeteTownshend on one of the Sleeping Policeman's Balls recordings?Which reminds me you'll also find Jeff Beck and Eric Clapton on one of those recordings too!!  ------------- The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS. CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php - http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
Posted By: Avantgardehead
Date Posted: August 23 2008 at 15:57
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Genesis with Steve Hackett used quite a few dual leads, even though he was only one person...
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 23 2008 at 16:38
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^ which tracks?
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Posted By: Avantgardehead
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 00:17
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Oh geez, well... Ending section of The Musical Box Opening section of One for the Vine Opening section of Get 'Em out by Friday Many more. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Avantgardian |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 05:44
^ thanks! I didn't mean to imply that there were none, I just couldn't think of any right away.
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 09:26
No, but thanks for the recommendation!!!!  BTW i ust remember that old concert called night of the kings that played JB. Page and Clapton, have you heard? is a good one! ------------- |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 09:29
Are you reffering to Trouble, Ready and Willin' and Love Hunter?? those are really very good albums, and not the crap that later do, i support your recommendation too!!! ------------- |
Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 09:29
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 09:30
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Yeah Home The Alchemist has a fine twin lead guitar dutie.
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Posted By: Alberto Muñoz
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 09:31
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Omega Kisstadion concert has some twin guitar moments if i remember well...
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: August 24 2008 at 19:18
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I started it
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Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: August 26 2008 at 14:58
| ^I influenced you to. |