Top 250 Proto Prog & Prog Related
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Forum Name: Proto-Prog and Prog-Related Lounge
Forum Description: Discuss bands and albums classified as Proto-Prog and Prog-Related
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=65760
Printed Date: April 25 2024 at 17:06
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Topic: Top 250 Proto Prog & Prog Related
Posted By: Marty McFly
Subject: Top 250 Proto Prog & Prog Related
Date Posted: March 14 2010 at 04:57
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Interesting charts that you won't see every day: Top 163 Proto-Prog albums (there is just 163 of them in database) http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=37&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=37&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list And now Top 250 Prog-related, this category is quite bigger, so first will be "average" P-R: http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Here is more closely examined charts, magic tricks with MIN/MAX ratings to present all P-R albums in PA database: 14 - infinity http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=14&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=14&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list 6 - 13 http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=6&smaxratings=13&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=6&smaxratings=13&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list 3 - 5 http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=3&smaxratings=5&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=3&smaxratings=5&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 1 - 2 http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=2&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=2&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0 Dedicated to one person who likes Prog-Related a lot. ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu  Even my |
Replies:
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: March 16 2010 at 18:12
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Still nobody interested ? At least leave your opinions about this thing I've managed. ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 15:50
| Marty, It was only while I was looking at your proto and related links that I discovered that bands/albums in these two categories aren't listed in the Top 250 albums. Why is that? |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:02
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I suppose that it's a way how to focus mostly on Prog, while having, but not promoting so much, Related and Proto. I would prefer to give reader a choice, but I don't make rules here, nor I want to "fight" for this opinion so much. Anyway, it was nice mind exercise to find this out, figure how to do it :-) Not so much Proto-albums, huh ? And I hope that this list will be useful to you, or someone. ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
seventhsojourn wrote:Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:17
| Yeah, I've never used these filters before so it has been useful in that respect. It's handy to look at some of my favourite genres (Crossover, Folk, RPI) to see where my top choices are. I think it's kinda funny that Deep Purple, Black Sabbath and Uriah Heep are all in different genres. Back in the day they were all 'heavies'. |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:22
Yes, some people felt the need to have a 'ghetto' for PP and PR, in order to avoid the purity of true prog to be contaminated  . There are a lot of bands or artists included in 'real' prog categories that have been included on account of one album, when many of the so-called prog-related acts have more than one. Unfortunately, most of them are too well-known for their own good, and known as 'something else' - and you know, labels stick, especially when people judge according to them, instead of using their ears. |
Posted By: jampa17
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:34
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Interesting... Prog related ruled by Queen and Zeepelin with Metallica in the top 10.... great... I'm glad that at least in the rating those albums recieve so good ratings.... As Raff said, shame that some bands that are included in other subgenres are less prog than some of the listed there... but we have to know there's a system going on and many people involved.
We don't have always the true on things... good thread Marty... keep going man...!!! ------------- |
Posted By: Bonnek
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:51
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How come I don't like Queen? I own and like more or less the entire top 70 of the prog-related list, except for number 1 and 2 which I don't want to go near. So what's the deal with Queen? Great to see this list Marty |
Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:58
| Yes, nice work from Marty... especially as these two categories aren't available via the sub-genre filter. So the Top 100 albums on the list aren't the top 100 on the site. Rules is rules, i guess. |
Posted By: Gooner
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 16:58
...nice to see Deep Purple's "In Rock" in the top 10. 
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 17:09
Nothing to do with rules at all - it's called the lesser of two evils. When I joined the site, there was no such separation, which came much later due to the close-mindedness of some people, and the great store some people set by ratings of all sorts. Unfortunately, it seems that for someone seeing some albums in the Top 100 was tantamount to having their worldly goods stolen (or something to that effect), so, to keep the peace, it was decided to remove them, and treat the two categories like a ghetto. There has also been talk of not allowing PP and PR reviews on the front page . |
Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 17:27
| ^ Raff, Is that still a possibility or has the idea been shelved? Hopefully it won't happen. |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 17:31
| I think it has been shelved, for now at least. Hopefully no one will resurrect it ever again. |
Posted By: jampa17
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 17:31
No way...? really...? is that problematic to people...? I didn't knew that... I'm sure the majority will kill for having the Beatles in the front page... the problem is that is not the same for another bands like The Who or Metallica... ------------- |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 17:40
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It's not easy to make any changes, one have to be very careful with the code, because as it's more or less "hack", it's not so friendly to me. So: Top 250 NEW (89 onwards) Prog-Related http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=2010&syears=2009&syears=2008&syears=2007&syears=2006&syears=2005&syears=2004&syears=2003&syears=2002&syears=2001&syears=2000&syears=200+&syears=1999&syears=1998&syears=1997&syears=1996&syears=1995&syears=1994&syears=1993&syears=1992&syears=1991&syears=1990&syears=1989&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=87&y=17#list - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=2010&syears=2009&syears=2008&syears=2007&syears=2006&syears=2005&syears=2004&syears=2003&syears=2002&syears=2001&syears=2000&syears=200+&syears=1999&syears=1998&syears=1997&syears=1996&syears=1995&syears=1994&syears=1993&syears=1992&syears=1991&syears=1990&syears=1989&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=87&y=17#list The least I can do for Prog-Related. Bringing them more closely to people here. Except reviewing album, something that I also like. <<<Juan >>> You know that there are Prog purists. I somehow lost my sense for enjoying "normal" metal over last two years. It just happened. I used to like electronic (DJ Tiesto melodic mixes, even techno) few years ago. And where am I now :) Some people can't stand P-R, or even bands that are rumored to cause disturbance in time and space /// erm, I meant in PA. I don't think so, but who knows for sure. <<< Raff >>> My plan is simple. If they already are here, I want to promote them. No matter if it means "hidden" Wonderland of Prog-related, or exotic bands, I want to do it. I somehow feel for the underdogs. Want to give them fair chance and at least show them in my lists here on forums and on main page when reviewing them. Anyway, it's very interesting to experience so many different kinds of Prog music from all around the world. Not endless US/UK ones. Even I like them too. <<< Gooner >>> Deserved place, even I quite understand Queen's place. <<< Chris >>> I like to play with controls, explore it all and see results, enjoy them and share them with other people. Of course, you don't have to be programmer (I'm not, I don't understand it at all), but basics helps. You have to know what command lies where :-) <<< Bonnek >>> I have soft spot for them, but also for most of these bands. <<< everyone>>> It's strange, but it seems like I know much more of Prog-Related bands, than those in Top 250 of all time PA ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 18:54
I guess it is to some... or was especially to some in particular.. to see their reviews of .. hahah... 'unknown prog gems' get cycled off the front page due to Hendrix or Zeppelin reviews. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: memowakeman
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 18:57
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Nice lists, had never checked those PP and PR top albums, some great music there ------------- Follow me on twitter @memowakeman |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: March 17 2010 at 19:00
And this is the real crime of having those lists hidden. There are some great albums among the lesser-known names, which in this way will get even less exposure than they would have if they had been considered 'real' prog. |
Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: March 18 2010 at 06:08
| The site works very well with the so-called ghetto of Proto-prog and prog-related. PA's Top 100 on the front page is what people visiting the site first meet, and PA would loose credibility as a "serious" site if they were met with Beatles, Metallica and Queen in the top 10. |
Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: March 18 2010 at 08:34
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Excellent list - a real eye opener in some cases. ------------- 
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Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: June 05 2010 at 16:03
Let's bump this a little bit. Lists you won't see every day :-) ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: June 06 2010 at 05:06
| Ok, Marty. Just one question about Proto... why don't Deep Purple fit into a 'proper' Prog category, for example Heavy Prog? Sorry, I realise this is probably an old discussion but I've done the usual searches and found nothing. |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: June 11 2010 at 06:44
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^ Oh, I overlooked this thread again. It's difficult. I always saw them very similar to Uriah Heep (except vocals), but that's me. They could be there if you can give facts and reasons. I don't know them so well, so I won't be able to help you. I suggest you go to Heavy Prog thread and talk with members there, show them your vision :-) ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: CyberDiablo
Date Posted: June 11 2010 at 09:10
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Deep Purple's The Book of Taliesyn is a perfect example.
------------- Music is some kind of art. -- Anonymous |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: June 11 2010 at 19:18
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So go on, fight for your Deep Purple and maybe, you will achieve them moved to Heavy Prog.
------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: CyberDiablo
Date Posted: June 12 2010 at 08:08
No, really. Deep Purple's albums The Book of Taliesin and Concerto for Group and Orchestra were actually progressive. (Source: Wikipedia) Sadly it only lasted a few years then they became a hard rock band with their album Deep Purple in Rock. Check these; and this one is instrumental and is from The Book of Taliesin, and it's now orchestral; You see? They were progressive and symphonic! ------------- Music is some kind of art. -- Anonymous |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: June 17 2010 at 18:25
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Anyway, I hope that this thread will change opinion of some people about importance of Prog-related. It's not poor cousin of Prog-full genres, it's underdog genre that should get equal chance by my opinion. And this is my share of help. Top 73 Prog-Related of last 20 years http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=2010&syears=2009&syears=2008&syears=2007&syears=2006&syears=2005&syears=2004&syears=2003&syears=2002&syears=2001&syears=2000&syears=1999&syears=1998&syears=1997&syears=1996&syears=1995&syears=1994&syears=1993&syears=1992&syears=1991&syears=1990&syears=1989&scountries=&sminratings=14&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=38&salbumtypes=1&syears=2010&syears=2009&syears=2008&syears=2007&syears=2006&syears=2005&syears=2004&syears=2003&syears=2002&syears=2001&syears=2000&syears=1999&syears=1998&syears=1997&syears=1996&syears=1995&syears=1994&syears=1993&syears=1992&syears=1991&syears=1990&syears=1989&scountries=&sminratings=14&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=1&smaxresults=250&x=59&y=0#list ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: Fusionman
Date Posted: June 19 2010 at 07:29
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I don't remember the Prog Archives 6 years ago being cluttered with nonsense like Kate Bush in the top 20 and Queen taking up 2 spots in the top 10...but they might have been. In any case the list is an obvious embarrassment which doesn't shock me very much. I've occasionally peeked in on the forums or about 4 years, and only rarely comment. I don't comment because I see it cluttered with kids saying "The new Opeth is great! But I wish they would make another album like Damnation." "Yeah isn't the Coheed and Cambria true prog?" "What do you think of the Mars Volta?". Along side posts of people who apparently just discovered that Yes is a band...and then crazy SOB's which are crying "But Tales of the Topographic Ocean is an album full artistic expression with patience....NOT A PRETENTIOUS COMPOSITION LACKING ANY MELODIC DIRECTION OR MOTIF!!" The opinion of people no longer matters because being different is oddly trendy. ------------- 
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Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: September 19 2010 at 04:08
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Bumping again, maybe new people will saw it, maybe new people will thrive with it, maybe new people will post here.
------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: tuxon
Date Posted: September 19 2010 at 08:17
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the top albums from Related and Proto would come in the top 100 at around place 25 so the top wouldn't be scewed that much only for purists it would be an inconvenience. but for good charts you'd have to make a top list from your favourite genre's anyway.
IMO the charts (top 100 most importantly) should reflect the best/most popular/bestknown albums on the archives independant from sub-genre.
finding more obscure masterpieces should be a search for the holy grail and only findable for those who want it bad enough.
BTW Deep Purple should be in a prog-genre and not in proto-prog or prog related as they were one of the pioneers and actually part of the early progressive movement. from In Rock onwards it was still progressive, very heavy prog indeed. ------------- I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT |
Posted By: notesworth
Date Posted: September 23 2010 at 00:10
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Great lists. I bookmarked them so I can find them again. If proto and related were in the main list, Queen II would be 61, Led Zeppelin IV would be 67, Abbey Road would be 94, and A Night at the Opera would be 99. They show the weighted average by each album so I slipped them in.
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Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: September 21 2011 at 19:52
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Let's bump this for a new generation of PA members (2011 ones). ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: notesworth
Date Posted: September 22 2011 at 12:57
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http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=12&ssubgenres=3&ssubgenres=42&ssubgenres=44&ssubgenres=41&ssubgenres=35&ssubgenres=30&ssubgenres=17&ssubgenres=18&ssubgenres=32&ssubgenres=6&ssubgenres=33&ssubgenres=19&ssubgenres=15&ssubgenres=36&ssubgenres=28&ssubgenres=4&ssubgenres=43&ssubgenres=29&ssubgenres=11&ssubgenres=38&ssubgenres=37&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=0&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=0&smaxresults=250&x=68&y=10#list" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=12&ssubgenres=3&ssubgenres=42&ssubgenres=44&ssubgenres=41&ssubgenres=35&ssubgenres=30&ssubgenres=17&ssubgenres=18&ssubgenres=32&ssubgenres=6&ssubgenres=33&ssubgenres=19&ssubgenres=15&ssubgenres=36&ssubgenres=28&ssubgenres=4&ssubgenres=43&ssubgenres=29&ssubgenres=11&ssubgenres=38&ssubgenres=37&salbumtypes=1&syears=&scountries=&sminratings=0&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=0&smaxresults=250&x=68&y=10#list This link goes to the top 250 chart including proto- and -related. Quadrophenia by the Who is #8.
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Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: September 22 2011 at 16:17
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Oh, 10 Prog Related and 10 Proto Prog albums in that list. This goes bigger than I thought.
------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
Posted By: Marty McFly
Date Posted: February 17 2013 at 09:54
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Bumping again, because this thread is worth it. Hopefully, it will bring new insights into the minds of newcomers (and those who already seen these lists can see them again with new votes). If anyone sees this thread and likes it, please leave a comment - I will know my findings were not useless. ------------- There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |