Camel, Gentle Giant, Renaissance, VDGG
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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7633
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Topic: Camel, Gentle Giant, Renaissance, VDGG
Posted By: Yanns
Subject: Camel, Gentle Giant, Renaissance, VDGG
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:51
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OK, ladies and gents, here's what I'm looking for. I would like to know what your favorite album by each of these four bands is. Of course, if you don't know all of them, then do some. But I'd like to know what your favorite of each is. Also, tell me which of these four bands you think is the best. Let me know. |
Replies:
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:52
Great topic, I'll be back after my pizza...
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Posted By: spectral
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:52
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Camel - Moonmadness. Probably in my top 10 or top 15 all time fave records! ------------- "...misty halos made visible by the spectral illumination of moonshine." |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:53
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flowerchild wrote:Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:55
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Camel- The Snow Goose Gentle Giant- The Power And The Glory VDGG- Pawn Hearts I've never heard anything by the other band. Sry. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 14:56
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Interesting band selections! To explain: soft and simple/crunchy and complex/soft and simple/crunchy and complex. Personally, I don't have much time for soft and simple, at least not from the likes of Camel or Renaiassance. I much prefer the meditative side of Krautrock for times when I want something gentler, so I can't really answer on those two. Haha! And now, whilst typing this I've remembered JUST how much I love GG and VDGG... I couldn't pick a favourite with either. Tempted to say Godbluff for VDGG but that's only 'cause I was listening to it earlier this evening. No, sorry - I can't answer this one at all!  How useless am I?! |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:00
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Trouserpress: I read, reread, and reread your post. I came to the conclusion that there is not one bit of info in there. |
Posted By: omri
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:02
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I do'nt have enough of VDGG, GG or Camel to give a serious answer although all I have is realy good. Renaissance is a different matter and my answer is deffinitely "Sheherezade" that is IMO one of the most underrated album in this site. Turn of the cards is a close second. Hope I helped a beat. ------------- omri |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:02
There isn't! I fully intended for it to be a useful post, but it's rubbish! Very true rubbish, but still rubbish! Oh well... I'll just go and stand in the corner, shall I? *shuffles off, mumbling quietly as he does so* |
Posted By: Joren
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:03
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Camel: Mirage (but I only have four of their albums and I don't like them very much) VDGG: Still Life (with Pawn Hearts, The Least... and Godbluff close behind it) GG: Power And The Glory I think, although In The Glass House is fantastic too. Renaissance: I only heard two songs from them: good, but not fantastic. The same thing as Trouserpress says |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:04
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Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:04
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Posted By: geezer
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:12
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Camel - Snow Goose Gentle Giant - In a Glass House Renaissance - Turn of the Cards (Ashes are Burning is a close 2nd) VDGG - Pawn Hearts (Godbluff is a close 2nd) I have not heard every album from these groups, mostly just the "classics". |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:18
| Funny, nobody has answered the second part of my question. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:18
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:19
Oh! I didn't see that bit! No doubt in my mind as to the answer for that one: GENTLE GIANT! And I'll never get tired of reminding people about that! |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:21
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Posted By: Lyzarrd
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:23
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Camel - Mirage Gentle Giant - Octopus (The Advent of Panurge left me on the floor when I first heard it) Renaissance - Scherehzade and Other Stories VDGG - Pawn Hearts/World Record (I could take either one) Of all these, Gentle Giant is by far my favorite, they're just fantastic musicians with no bad albums...everyone is a masterpiece (from the 70s )------------- Can you tell me where my country lies... |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:28
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I knew that was coming. |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:33
However did you guess? |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:39
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Hey, great. I love all 4 bands!!! Camel - Nude Gentle Giant - Acquiring The Taste Renaissance - Live At Carnegie Hall Van der Graaf Generator - Maida Vale My favourite band: Camel |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 15:58
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Camel - Moonmadness (But Mirage on Mondays VDGG - Godbluff Gentle Giant - I've only heard Octopus, and to be honest I'm not that keen. Excellent musicians but their songs dont really strike a chord with me. Rennaisance - Ashes are Burning ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:04
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Wow, there was a second part. Sry bout that. Gentle Giant ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: NetsNJFan
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:09
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great topic i love all four bands dearly: Camel - Mirage (1974) Gentle Giant - Octopus (1972) Van der Graaf Generator - tough decision, but I'll go with H to the He... (1970) Out of these bands I cannot say which is best, but Renaissance is by far my favorite (of these), true Symphonic Prog. Great piano and vocals, and some wonderful compositions. Simply georgeous! Having said that all four are amazing, the complexity and tightness of GG, the dark emotivness of VdGG's organ/sax/Hammill attack and the beautiful soundscapes and melodies of Camel (notably Latimer's ultra fluid Guitar). ------------- 
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Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:12
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Camel & Rennaisance are my joint faves from this lot. I love John Touts piano playing. The intro to 'At the Harbour' is fantastic, and apparently is a variation on a Debussey piece. Can anyone confirm? ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:19
Just a hunch By the way, everybody, you know the song "Can You Understand?" by Renaissance? I play it. |
Posted By: NetsNJFan
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:19
i cannot confirm but i have also heard thta before, Renaissance 'sample' quite a bit of music uncredited. but they do it well in my opinion. I alos like Jon tout a lot. just straight piano, no crazy synth work. -------------
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Posted By: Ben2112
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:20
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Camel - haven't heard entire albums besides Snow Goose & Moonmadness, but I like Moonmadness a little more
Gentle Giant - The Power And The Glory Renaissance - One of those bands I've been meaning to check out VDGG - just can't get into them, as much I have tried 
Of the four, Gentle Giant is my absolute fave (and one of my favorite bands) |
Posted By: omri
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:52
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blacksword wrote : Gentle Giant - I've only heard Octopus, and to be honest I'm not that keen. Excellent musicians but their songs dont really strike a chord with me. It's funny. I purchased Octopus few months ago and it was realy nice. although I thought that it is not that essential as most reviewers claim. Then I went to the store and the only other available was their first (gentle giant) so I took it. And for some odd reason I like it much more. ------------- omri |
Posted By: glass house
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 16:56
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Gentle Giant : everything 'till Giant for a day
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Posted By: felona
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 17:10
trouserpress has a wonderful way with words ------------- I was never really sure what I was waiting for. When the moment came I was looking away ...... The Church "After Everything Now This" |
... Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 17:43
...You know, I think we're going to get along very well indeed. |
Posted By: felona
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 17:49
trouserpress .... ...------------- I was never really sure what I was waiting for. When the moment came I was looking away ...... The Church "After Everything Now This" |
Posted By: Tony Fisher
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:03
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Camel - The Snow Goose (by a tiny margin from Mirage, Moonmadness and Nude) Gentle Giant - Free Hand Renaiisance - Live at Carnegie Hall VDGG - nothing at all. Peter Hamill destroys everything for me
Camel soft and simple? My arse!! Complex and melodic; packed with emotion. One of the best bands of all time along with Runrig, Wishbone Ash and Horslips. And Renaissance are too sophisticated for some but also a top class band.
Trouserpress, I don't normally denigrate other contributors but you are talking utter bollocks IMO. If you don't like Camel, leave them to those of us who do.
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:07
Compared to much of my collection Camel's music is very gentile and
simplistic. Sorry, but that's the truth. I'm not saying you can't enjoy
them. Personally I can't understand your attitude to VDGG - or indeed
anyone who complains about Hammil. It's HIS music! He writes 90% of it,
and he writes it FOR HIS VOICE. If you don't like it, fair enough, but don't just blame the man's singing. VDGG is Hamill's artistic vision. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:19
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Very big pizza.... ..poor u who asked the question, not much serious answers this time (either!!!!)
cheers |
Posted By: Hiwatter
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:39
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Camel -- Snow Goose Renaissance -- dont know, not much into them VDGG -- Pawn Hearts Gentle Giant -- In a Glass House The best are VDGG for me from these bands. |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 16 2005 at 21:40
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Those of you who don't like VDGG/Hammill: What don't you like about Hammill? |
Posted By: Paco Fox
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 03:24
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Camel: Harbour of Tears (The reason is that I also like celtic music) Renaissance: Scheherazade. Just great. Gentle Giant: Octopus, with Free Hand in a very close second position I really can't stand Peter Hamill's voice, so I don't listen to VDGG. Which one is the best? All of them are top prog, and all of them have their followers and even clone bands. Thay can't be compared. My favourite is Camel, because it's the most moving music I've ever listened to. I understand in this forum there are a lot of people who prefer hiper-complex music, and usually dissmiss groups like Camel and Renaissance (although most of the time, like in this topic, with respect for both bands). But I came to prog searching for emotion, and ironically you need a certain degree of complexity to archive and comunicate this emotions better. But sometimes I find too complex and avant garde music can dismiss this element (for example, Gentle Giant's 'Interview') |
Posted By: Gentle Ronnie
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 03:39
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Moonmadness Yay me. ------------- 
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Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 03:50
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Camel - Snow Goose is listenable
Gentle Giant - Octopus is rather clever but a little to start and stop for me, Free Hand has its moments as do others to a lesser degree Renaissance - Turn of the Cards and the album before and after have their moments VDDG - guess Pawn Hearts and Still Life are as good as it gets but cant handle being Hammillized, Arthur Brown carried the flag much better for the british psycho/prog thing! Pete's to Syd for my taste! 
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Posted By: fcentur
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 12:17
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Camel: Rain dances
Gentle Giant: Octopus, probably (just followed by Acquiring the taste and In a glass house) VDGG: Pawn hearts Renaissance: really I don't know them And for the second part: GENTLE GIANT |
Posted By: Hammill
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 13:15
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everything from VDGG, everything from CAMEL, octopus-acquiring the
taste-the power and the glory -in a glass house from gentle giant and
everything from hammill except noise (i hate that album) ------------- 
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Posted By: tuxon
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 14:48
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Camel - Moonmadness
Best album from this list: Sheherezade and other stories Best band Camel
(obviously i go for melodic over complicated) ------------- I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT |
Posted By: Retrovertigo
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 14:49
Oh geez, I haven't heard any of these bands yet. 
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 14:59
If you like Mr Bungle (which I'm guessing you do) then Gentle Giant are a must. You'd dig 'em. |
Posted By: Retrovertigo
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 15:02
| Gentle Giant is similar to Bungle? Nice... where should I start with Gentle Giant? Check out my Welcome Newbies topic to see my likes if you want. |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 15:04
I wouldn't say they're similar to Bungle, but they're one of the most important bands in the "complex" side of prog, which Mr Bungle also come under. It's a case of getting to know your roots, I suppose. Do some reading up on them! |
Posted By: Retrovertigo
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 15:09
| Aye. I will read up on them here. |
Posted By: Under
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 15:19
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I think it would be about time some band would starting covering those Gentle Giant songs. Did you know Matthew Bellamy from Muse stated he is influenced by Gentle Giant? Rennaissance is great. Old & mysterious and very good piano playing from John Tout. |
Posted By: gabriel
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 16:10
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Camel - Moon Madness Renessaince - Turn of the Cards Gentle Giant - Octopus VDGG - Pawn Hearts |
Posted By: NetsNJFan
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 16:55
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Posted By: Vieux Prog
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 17:44
Yep, it comes from a piece by Claude Debussy, indeed: "La cathédrale engloutie" ("The sunken/submerged cathedral"?), from the 1st book of Préludes. |
Posted By: Fragile
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 19:20
That is possibly the most idiotic statement I have ever read on this site.(ref Hammill) |
Posted By: Intruder
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 20:06
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Camel - Mirage (easy choice....I dig their early stuff) Gentle Giant - Three Friends (though Aquiring the Taste and Octopus run close behind) Van der Gaff - Pawn Hearts Renaissance - Live at Carnegie Hall (mainly 'cause the highlights of the early LPs are included) Can't choose a "best" of "fave"......but I put Renaissance and Gentle Giant on the the turntable most....Van der Gaff least. ------------- I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there..... |
Posted By: Yanns
Date Posted: June 17 2005 at 23:39
I'm so annoyed, we had Three Friends and Scheherazade in the house before I became a true progger, and now they are gone.  Eh, oh well, I'll get 'em again.
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Posted By: Salmacis72
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 17:57
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Camel - Mirage GG - Octopus Renaissance - don't really listen to them but I liked parts of Scherehadze (sp?) VDGG - Godbluff ------------- 
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Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 18:39
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Camel: actually I like all of the very early albums (let's say up to Moon Madness, but Mirage & Snow Goose being the best ones probably IMO) Gentle Giant: they have many excellent albums, my favorites are Freehand & In A Glass House (other very good ones: Octopus,Power And The Glory,Three Friends & Same) VDGG: they have many excellent ones as well, but I can't listen to them at any moment (same to GG). I'd say my favorite is Still Life, but very good as well: H to He, The Least We Can Do....,Pawn Hearts,Aerosol Grey Machine! Renaissance: well I listen very rarely to them (like to all the other ones, just because I'm discovering too many unknown obscure bands I have to listen to first!), but I used to like very much their first one, Illusion and Shehezarade. Hope this is of any help for you, but of course, everyone has his own taste, so finally you have to find out on your own which ones you prefer. I usually just get the full collection of a band I'm interested in for this reason (not in original of course, I am not Bill Gates! |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 19:03
You seem to miss the point of his singing. PH is one of the very few singers you can get a hint of what he is singing about without understanding a single word of English. It is reflected in the way he uses his voice as well as in the compositions. As for PH not being varied: You must be joking. Even the VdGG albums vary a lot in style. Of course VdGG being a band he composes for the band members when he writes songs there, so at least the arrangements for the songs are limited in a way. But PHs compositions cover a wide range of territory. And of course he has a certain style of composing, but one must not confuse "style" with "limitation". It is certainly not a "limitation" of Ravel that he doesn't sound like Richard Strauss, for example. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Walker
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 21:04
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Renaissance - Live At Carnegie Hall Camel - Moonmadness I'm just now getting into VDGG and Gentle Giant so I will refrain from commenting until I have heard the core group of albums by each. |
Posted By: Cesar Inca
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 22:00
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CAMEL - Mirage GENTLE GIANT - Acquiring the Taste VDGG- Pawn Hearts RENAISSANCE - Scherazade |
Posted By: beterdedthnred4
Date Posted: June 19 2005 at 22:37
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Camel-Moonmadness Gentle Giant-Free Hand VDGG-Pawn Hearts Renaissance-Ashes are Burning |