New Prog Rock history book...
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Topic: New Prog Rock history book...
Posted By: frenchie
Subject: New Prog Rock history book...
Date Posted: June 30 2005 at 07:27
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British leading music magazine, Q are releasing a special collectors edition book about the history of progressive rock on 15th of July. This may be after the numerous complaints they have recieved by tending to give prog rock albums very bad and ignorant reviews usually complaining that the songs are too long and complex for people to listen to... lately Q have been more favourable of prog and including more releases with better reviews. This prog ignorance first kicked off with the recent yes digipak remasters, giving fragile and close to the edge 2 stars saying that no1 listens to prog. This site would disagree as currently, close to the edge is probably the pinnacle of prog rock on this site. Therefore, this book will be very interesting to see, will it be full of accurate history, good stories review and interviews? Or will it just add to Q's ignorant view on progressive rock. I will certainly let you all know! ------------- The Worthless Recluse 
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Replies:
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 01 2005 at 08:06
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Hello there Dear Frenchie, how remarkably well-informed you are. Let me address a few of your points, though… This isn't actually a book. It's a special edition magazine: full-colour, very glossy, 148 pages. Q and Mojo have published several of these specials on single artists (The Who, The Beatles) and genres of music (Psychedelia). This one has Pink Floyd among others on the cover and goes on sale from 14 July. A couple of things, though: to the best of my knowledge Q has never received "numerous complaints" about its treatment of prog rock bands. I've worked there for eight years and don't recall receiving any. Sorry. I would have remembered. Albums are reviewed by individual reviewers, not by committee. Some writers like this music; some don't…Those that do have helped put this magazine together. I'll post some more details about the mag nearer the on-sale date. Who knows, we may not be as ignorant as you think? 
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Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: July 01 2005 at 15:14
how scary is that! it like a spy in the house of frenchie ------------- The Worthless Recluse
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Q&Mojo wrote:Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: July 01 2005 at 15:16
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anyway, you are probably right, and i sware in the letters section i have read letters by people wanting more prog rock articles and reviews and Q replied something like: why bother, no1 likes prog. ------------- The Worthless Recluse
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Posted By: frenchie
Date Posted: July 01 2005 at 15:17
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Q and Mojo are brilliant though, i have many issues of each. I have been a Q subscriber since about 98 i think, but i get them through the post. Love the Oasis interview in the latest issue, i sware the release date was 15th in the mag! ------------- The Worthless Recluse
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Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: July 01 2005 at 18:00
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Welcome back Q&M, the Pink Floyd special was very good. Whether or not you have received complaints, it is fair to say that Q turned its back on prog, and joined the bandwagon of bad press (or indeed no press) it has received in recent years. I didn't complain, I just cancelled my subscription. Mojo was better (didn't Mark Ellen leave Q to set up Mojo?), but seemed to increasingly focus on either the Beatles and REM, or obscure artists few had even heard of. It's all very well attributing bad reviews to individual reviewers, but perhaps more effort could have been made to ensure the selected reviewers at least had a passing appreciation of the genre, and were not going to simply deride prog albums in order to boost their street cred. Good to see the prog special in the pipeline though, do you have much about prog in the monthly mags (Q or Mojo) these days? |
Posted By: Retrovertigo
Date Posted: July 02 2005 at 04:31
| Magazines are gross. |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 05:30
15th July it is then. You're quite right. Though I dare say some copies will creep out a day or so earlier. Hope you enjoy the magazine. |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 09:15
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Hello again More details below about the Q & MOJO Prog Rock special edition magazine below… You can e-mail queries, praise or abuse to us at [email protected]. PINK FLOYD & The Story Of Prog Rock A Q & Mojo Classic Special Edition Take a trip to another musical dimension, celebrating the astounding tales and amazing sounds of… • PINK FLOYD: The Lost Years, The New Interviews, The Unseen Pictures… • PLUS in-depth stories, exclusive interviews with GENESIS • YES • VAN DER GRAAF GENERATOR • KING CRIMSON • RUSH • HAWKWIND • ELP • SOFT MACHINE • THE MARS VOLTA and more… • SEX, DRUGS & WIZARDS: From Wish You Were Here to OK Computer - 40 Cosmic Rock Albums To Blow Your Mind! • AND: Rarities, artwork, competitions and more Available as a Q Classic special edition in the UK and a Mojo Classic special edition overseas (including the US). On Sale from 15 July, in all good newsagents or by ordering online from here… Q www.subscription.co.uk/products/qprog Mojo www.subscription.co.uk/products/mojoprog |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 09:27
Yep, the Pink Floyd issue was excellent, the Led Zepellin one was too! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 09:35
Thankyou. Much appreciated. We're planning a Rush one… (just kidding, sorry…) 
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Posted By: threefates
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 10:37
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Is it going to have anything about the Pink Floyd reunion?? Also... I have a copy of Mojo here from March 2001... a huge article on ELP about the financial woes of the taking the orchestra on the road... and it mentions my full name and a paragraph quote from me... that I don't remember ever giving a reporter.... hmmmmm........... ------------- THIS IS ELP 
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Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 10:44
No Floyd reunion, as they spoke to us before Gilmour agreed to Live8. Actually, I saw that quote from you in the original ELP piece as well! No idea where that came from  You're getting a free copy, though, so, come on, no complaining
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: July 04 2005 at 10:52
Grrrrrrrrrrr! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: July 05 2005 at 12:15
| Will there be any mention of Gentle Giant in the mag? |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 05 2005 at 12:22
Yes. We spoke to Ray Shulman. One of the Giant's great works is chosen as one of the 40 Cosmic Rock Albums To Blow Your Mind!
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: July 05 2005 at 12:50
I do hope it's not Octopus...
Anyway, I'll end up buying this regardless so I don't know why I'm
bothering to ask. Be sure to be on the recieving end of some severe
whingeing if you've cocked it up though! |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: July 05 2005 at 14:58
| Looking forward to it, it sounds good! |
Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: July 14 2005 at 17:21
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Call me cynical, but the timing of this issue, just days after Floyd's Live 8 reunion, seems like quite a cunning marketing ploy. Does anyone at Q actually care about these prog bands, or was someone up top thinking about shifting a few extra units on the back of Live 8? Walk into any record shop last week and you'd be greeted with (quite literally I suspect another tongue-in-cheek review of the genre, and the media-starved prog herds will all rush out and buy it, for that snippet of Gabriel saying how ridiculous it all was at the time.... ------------- "Now all the seasons run together, and the middle days are gone..." |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 15 2005 at 04:36
From the top then: the Floyd/Live 8 thing was a happy accident. To put a 148-page magazine together - commissioning, sourcing pictures, interviewing musicians etc - takes longer than the lead-in time between Floyd announcing their decision to play Live 8 and the magazine going to press. I'd love to tell you that we have some sort of hotline to the prog stars, but the first we knew about Floyd at Live 8 was when we read about it on the electric internet. But, yes, I'm pleased we put Floyd as the main cover image. Commercially, it would make sense. Does anyone at Q actually care about these prog bands? In a word: yes. You cannot produce a magazine about any genre of music without using writers that have an understanding and a genuine interest in this stuff. If you do, you will come unstuck very quickly. U2 and the Beatles getting overkill elsewhere perhaps? Not this week, but, hey, give it time. Can Robbie not shift the units anymore? No idea. I don't think he's doing much at the moment, apart from counting his money. suspect another tongue-in-cheek review of the genre, and the media-starved prog herds will all rush out and buy it, for that snippet of Gabriel saying how ridiculous it all was at the time.... Unfortunately Gabriel wasn't available. Hope this answers your questions, though. |
Posted By: Moogtron III
Date Posted: July 15 2005 at 08:15
| I'll surely buy. Sounds great! |
Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: July 15 2005 at 11:14
I suppose I should appreciate the fact (and I expected you to respond along these lines), that you are providing a potential opening for would-be prog fans through the comfortable 'Pink Floyd door'. As virtual music and fashion lepers, us prog herds should probably be grateful for such an endorsement. However, I shall investigate the magazine in the usual way (standing in the Union shop) before committing! I should also admit that previous tongue-in-cheek takes on prog(such as the brilliant Top Ten on Channel 4), have made me laugh out loud. If your magazine gets anywhere near that level, I shall probably succumb....
------------- "Now all the seasons run together, and the middle days are gone..." |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 15 2005 at 11:47
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I read this as well. On the internet, of course. Which is where magazines get most of their information these days I suppose I should appreciate the fact (and I expected you to [/QUOTE] True, our tongues are never far from our cheeks and we are not afraid to raise an eyebrow at some of the more excessive aspects of the genre, but there is a genuine love and appreciation of the music to be found in this mag. Honest! If you do succumb - let us know what you think. Good or bad.[/B |
Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: July 15 2005 at 20:11
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I'm sure there is genuine love and appreciation, and your diplomacy is admirable!! Of course, I can only speak for myself, but I relish the pomposity and bombast of Emerson's spinning piano (again - I laugh out loud and show it to people), or the ludicrous moribund existentialism of VDGG - such extravagance is sorely missed from today's bands. I'm 33, and really wish I'd been old enough to witness some of that stuff when it was still original, as I know that the closest contemporary acts will come is getting that talentless vocal lightweight Robbie Williams to fire a firework from his codpiece whilst singing his sycophantic, melody-less factory fodder I've decided to buy the magazine if one condition is met - that PFM are mentioned ANYWHERE between the front and back covers. A passing homage, a fleeting reference, an acknowledgement of their indisputable songwriting talent. If they are overlooked, then you really are doing the genre no favours. PFM are effortlessly cool, surprisingly still going, and NOBODY I've played them to, has yet disliked them. If they are in, I shall recover some faith in the popular music press. Finally, I heard there is no free CD with the magazine. Is this a testament to the fans' collective respect for the genre and respect for their personal collections, which you would imagine as containing all the proposed songs anyway? Was it that you felt such a product would lower your profit margin? Did you have trouble getting the rights to the material? Or did you find that you could actually only fit 2-3 songs on one CD and would actually have to release a 3-CD gatefold special with Roger Dean artwork?
------------- "Now all the seasons run together, and the middle days are gone..." |
.Posted By: threefates
Date Posted: July 17 2005 at 00:38
I wasn't complaining about my quote.. just curious... and how come it got left out of this article? ( Now I'm complaining)....
------------- THIS IS ELP
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Posted By: Tarkustra
Date Posted: July 17 2005 at 00:41
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Actually did you guys at Mojo ever consider doing an article on Linda and her prog journeys. How many women do you know spent that much time around prog bands? Or how many women do you know would have wanted to? ------------- When you speak, is it you that hears? Are your ears full? You can't hear anything at all. |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 04:30
Actually, yes, I did think about it. But I was too much of a gentleman to ask a lady about her "prog journeys". |
Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 11:20
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The Union Shop at Nottingham University haven't got Q. I'll now have to buy it from a reputable retailer, instead of reading the whole thing over days by standing in the shop. I think you should have a word with them...its totally unacceptable, considering the pile of utter dross taking up the rest of the shelf space. They DO have Mojo - but nothing about prog on the front, just the usual fodder about Page, Beck, Hendrix' musical toenails. Is it possible that the new Q has not reached us here yet??? I thought it was out July 15?
------------- "Now all the seasons run together, and the middle days are gone..." |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 12:27
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Ive seen it here in Cardiff ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 12:34
Don't forget, it's not a regular issue of Q or Mojo, it's a special edition, so they may not stock it. Get yourself over to WH Smiths or somewhere like that. They'll have it. What's a good album to start with on PFM? I've managed to avoid them all these years.
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 12:45
Do you want English lyrics or Italian or not bothered? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Wrath_of_Ninian
Date Posted: July 18 2005 at 15:04
I found it in WHS, and took a chance after a brief glimpse through it. I have to say I've been impressed with what I've seen so far - plenty of juicy stories, interesting facts, dubious recommendations ( I'll post a more in-depth review once I've dissected it a bit more. Of course, my initial fumble through it revealed no mention of PFM, and they didn't make the top 40 cosmic mind-blower albums, whereas the decidedly average Land Of Grey & Pink managed No.19. SUrely its not THAT good? Misplaced Childhood at No.17 - again... Expect no plaudits from this site for putting Lamb Lies Down on Broadway BENEATH RAdiohead's mediocre OK Computer (they hit far greater prog heights with Kid A and Amnesiac) and as for Dark Side Of The Moon at No.1 - perhaps a huge selling populist melodic rock album, but hardly the cream of our genre...... Each to their own.... PFM - their entire back catalogue from 1972 (Storia Di Un Minuto, Per Un Amico/Photos of Ghosts), through to 1977 (Chocolate Kings & Jet Lag) you cannot find a bad album. Later than this, you cannot find a good album...unless its the recent live reworkings of the old stuff. Chocolate Kings was the pinnacle for me, but most PFM fans prefer the earlier work - a lot more pastoral, and without Lanzetti's Gabriel-esque love-it-or-hate-it voice. If I had to choose one album for you to listen to, it would be Chocolate Kings - massively overlooked/underrated, and would blow at least 39 of the most cosmic mind..etc albums out of the water. You'll soon see what I mean...
------------- "Now all the seasons run together, and the middle days are gone..." |
Posted By: sdavmor
Date Posted: August 08 2005 at 13:50
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I received my copy over the weeked courtesy of my cousin David's recent visit to France. Not bad at all, as long as one accepts its focus and built-in shortcomings. Other than Rush it presents progrock as a UK phenomenon. Which is true to the extent that the Europroggers (etc) never achieved the kind of market penetration that the "Big 6" of UK prog managed. Though how Kansas failed to make the cut is mystifying, at least on the basis of their output and chart-topping sales. They were certainly prog up through "Monolith". Still, these are minor quibbles, given that this isn't a preaching-to-the-choir publication. The special issue is a very solid piece of work, with only a handful or readily identifiable factual errors. I can well imagine someone who owned LPs by these bands back in the day, or someone that is a fan of modern rock that is trying to embrace the spirit of progressive rock, finding this highly educational and a source of albums to go buy on CD. The list of 40 cosmic rock albums to blow your mind is a decent starting place, and manages to touch many important bases. Everyone of those records is worth having in any adventurous music collection, but there's many just as vital that didn't make the cut. And, it also manages to miss the boat on at least the major Italian and French proggers, and only hits a couple of better known Krautrockers. i.e. no PFM, Banco. Le Orme, Pulsar, Magma, Can, just to mention 6 superb groups. Lest I appear to be nitpicking I'd finally like to say that this is worth having for the coverage of my favourite headcase spacerockers Hawkwind. That is a freaking hysterical read! Thanks guys. Do it again sometime. ------------- SDM -- a 21st century schizoid man www.systemstheory.net internet music project www.soundclick.com/systemstheory www.cdbaby.com/systemstheory Buy "Soundtracks For Imaginary Movies" online |
Posted By: sdavmor
Date Posted: August 08 2005 at 14:43
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Starting with PFM? Unless you're already hip to the native-language efforts of Banco, Le Orme, Maxophone, etc., (...and some people simply don't want to listen to rock of any style that is not in English...) probably your best bet will be to pick up the pair of English-language albums done under the guiding hand of the ELP/Sinfield axis. Get "Photos Of Ghosts" and "The World Became The World". If you dig them, get the two follow-ups with Lanzotti (a Peter Gabriel meets Roger Chapman vocalist). "Chocolate Kings" and "Jet Lag" are very fine records. Then go back and try the three original Italian-language albums from which "POG" and "TWBTW" were assembled. Then very carefully work forward if you are still interested in exploring further. (I own everything by PFM, including the 80s crap and the 90s reformation albums.). After "Passpartu" (sort of Strawbs-ish in a Mediterranean sunbaked way) there's nothing that is essential, and there's over 700 Italian prog albums from the 70s that you could spend $ on and get more out of (assuming that you can find them, that is). Having said that, the 2002 live DVD is a must see and the 90s reformation albums are quality neo-prog/larger than life symphonic AOR. If you get the chane to see PFM in concert, do it. They are stunning, still blessed with their chops and vocals. ------------- SDM -- a 21st century schizoid man www.systemstheory.net internet music project www.soundclick.com/systemstheory www.cdbaby.com/systemstheory Buy "Soundtracks For Imaginary Movies" online |
Posted By: sdavmor
Date Posted: August 08 2005 at 15:00
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Mr. Q&Mojo. There's been a couple of threads about this special issue over at another large progressive rock forum (2500+ members, 400+ regular posters). If inclined, drop by and wade in at http://www.progressivears.com - www.progressivears.com ------------- SDM -- a 21st century schizoid man www.systemstheory.net internet music project www.soundclick.com/systemstheory www.cdbaby.com/systemstheory Buy "Soundtracks For Imaginary Movies" online |
Posted By: bad1
Date Posted: August 10 2005 at 08:42
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I enjoyed most of the Mojo/Q prog issue - and have recommended it to a lot of people. At the same time I have some issues with the IMO a bit too condescending attitudes towards bands like ELP and Yes... Another symptom of what today's music magazines believe is needed to keep their critical cred? ------------- Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions. G.K. Chesterton |
Posted By: bad1
Date Posted: August 10 2005 at 08:57
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Hello Q&Mojo! Just noticed you saying that
As I have both sent and have gotten published with critical comments on Q's treatment of prog, I think you should check again Here are three examples: ---------------------------- Start of my Q mail quotes --------------------------- -----Original message 1----- Sent: 28. juni 2001 09:51 To: mailto:'[email protected]' - '[email protected]' Subject: Prog and Prejudice in Q 178 I have to admit I'm rather puzzled by your review of the book on Emerson, Lake and Palmer. For some peculiar reason it seems more focused on the reviewers feelings about the "demented" music of ELP, than on the book. Perhaps the strangest thing about the review is that it overlooks that the book is rather innovative and illuminating, for at least two reasons. For once we get someone to write a history of a band and daring as well really to analyse their music, which of couse may seem a rare treat to a music magazine. And in a time when digital sampling abound, its extremely valuable to get insight in the dire and dangerous period of analogue synths - and perhaps understand some of Keith Emerson's project. Unfortunately as it seems, the authors of "Welcome Back to the Show That Never Ends" are more concerned with chords and creativity, than with the beers and beat angle which rides other rock books like a mare. Though, as you mentioned, there are sufficient such in the book for the connoiseurs. In short I can't quite fathom why music journalists 25 years after "Anarchy in the UK" still seems to provide the slam that never ends. Its an endeless enigma why critics don't dare to drop the automatic abuse reflexes when seeing the letters E, L and P - especially in the age of Radiohead, Muse and Tool.
> -----Original message 2----- Sent: 12. april 2003 17:20 To: '[email protected]' Copy: '[email protected]' Subject: The Church of Q Reading the latest Q Magazine made me realise that you're in a religious war. For once your ritual carpet bombing of Yes in the review section made sense. For this is about attacking the Axis of Evil, clearly defined as Yes, ELP and all their being. The main crime seems to be making the hideous heresies of "emotionless" and "flashy" music, both terms for some peculiar reason undefined by Your reviewer. In addition, they have weird lyrics. Fortunately the religious fervor slips to the surface in the reviewer's prayer against Yes at the end. This made me at last understand what's afoot here. And it also finally explains why no other musical genre receives that kind of treatment. Q manages admirably to maintain some kind of neutrality in writing on Glam rock, C&W and even Britney Spears. However, twenty five years after the Punk period, you're still launching the bombers whenever 70's prog rears its head. The inquistors of Q will of course never rest until the heresy is routed out. Any idea of musical pluralism and tolerance seems decades ahead. Hopefully, readers bored by this may in the meantime still be allowed to enjoy the incomprehensible bliss of Yes music. -----Original message 3---- Sent: 28. februar 2004 14:04 To: '[email protected]' Subject: Q-less critique I'm not quite sure what dark childhood shiverings make your reviewer Peter Kane insist that Emerson, Lake and Palmers are "still genuine contenders for the worst band ever". While doubtlessly great fun to read for all stuck in the punk ideology of 1976, to the rest of us it proves once and for all an admirable ability to select queless reviewers, which is a bit strange in Q. With his critical delusions, loopy sixth form comments and verbal pomposity, Peter Kane is the supreme example of where rock critics went wrong in the mid '70s. Good to know, then, he sound as ludicrous as ever on this eccentrically compiled review doing horrible things to a creative band like ELP, as well as jokey misfires on our brains. Next time Q reviews a progressive band, please use a reviewer who at least seems to understand what he is talking about. - - - - - - P.S. A personal note, as I (a fan of "pompous" bands like Mars Volta, Radiohead and Tool) am not able to fathom what this negativity really is about, and to follow up an earlier letter of mine (se below): Why do Q keep up some kind of war against "prog and pomposity"? Its impossible to avoid the strong feeling that this is about a lot more than "taste", and touches the museopolitical. Speaking of pomposity and ludricous lyrics, it would be far wiser to go for Tom Jones, Gary Glitter, Queen, or even major parts of David Bowie's work. The same goes for about 80 % of every musical genre, except "metal" bands, where 97 % is ludricous, like Norway's own Dimmu Borgir and Turboneger. Still these tend to get rather raving reviews, or at least no systematic slamming. Peace and love, please. Regards ---------------------------- End of my Q mail quotes --------------------------- OK, no offense meant - just putting the record a bit straigthter ------------- Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions. G.K. Chesterton |
Posted By: Q&Mojo
Date Posted: August 22 2005 at 11:46
Just had a look, but you gave the wrong url in your post. |
Posted By: sdavmor
Date Posted: August 22 2005 at 14:53
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Hi Mr. Q&Mojo. Go to www.progressiveears.com. Create an
ID. Go to Other Topics Forum. There's a three page thread there
currently active called "Mojo's Prog Special magazine".
------------- SDM -- a 21st century schizoid man www.systemstheory.net internet music project www.soundclick.com/systemstheory www.cdbaby.com/systemstheory Buy "Soundtracks For Imaginary Movies" online |