Making room for the Human Equation
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Top 10s and lists
Forum Description: List all your favourites here
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=88887
Printed Date: April 23 2024 at 19:56
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Making room for the Human Equation
Posted By: octopus-4
Subject: Making room for the Human Equation
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 10:22
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The Ayreon's masterpiece is out of the PA top 100 and currently at place 108. Which 8 albums would you remove from the top 100 to make it enter back the list?  ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Replies:
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 10:39
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Dunno - are there 8 Miles Davis albums in the Top 100? ------------- What? |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 10:45
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I don't think, but in that case I would look for 14 albums to remove...of course it's a joke and honestly I can't find any album which I would remove from that list. But it was months since my last forum thread. The question is not which album I would swap, too easy finding one that one likes less than another. A stupid question, I know.Probably it would have been better placed in the Just for fun section but as soon as somebody posts a list I'm sure we'll see an interesting discussion. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 10:51
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I thought this was going to be about how 2+2=5 or what do you get when you multiply 6x9...
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 12:27
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108? Thats far too high.
------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005  |
Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 13:07
Good question
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octopus-4 wrote:Posted By: Lofcaudio
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 14:19
| Since The Human Equation is one of my favorites (easily top 20), you can name just about any of the albums in the Top 100 and I would rank them below THE. |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 14:29
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Lord of cheese god of slumber - Ayreon never really struck a chord with me, but I see why he's idolised the way he is. Crystal clear to me. He's just about the exact opposite of what I like, which in itself makes him top 10 material  ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Ytse_Jam
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 14:58
| 108 is enough to me. |
Posted By: Smurph
Date Posted: August 09 2012 at 15:11
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I mean, it's pretty fun cheesy music.
But if we're going with cheesy music I'd rather go for The Shaming of the True or something. ------------- http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/ wtf |
Posted By: Morsenator
Date Posted: August 10 2012 at 14:03
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I don't care much about whether I think something is cheese or not, only if it's good or not. And in my perspective THE definitely is. The story is very interesting, too.
------------- You love the music, the music loves you! http://moonsofjupiter.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - http://moonsofjupiter.bandcamp.com/ |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: August 10 2012 at 14:06
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THE got a 5-star rating from me. Enough said. ------------- 
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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: August 12 2012 at 02:04
 . ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 12 2012 at 02:16
| Hmm....IF at all it somehow needs to get into the top 100, then let it be at the expense of Banks of Eden/Doomsday Afternoon/Second Life Syndrome, which are somewhat of the same 'family'. There are some other rather overrated albums in the top 100, like Grey and Pink, Scheherazade, Hybris, Eros but Hybris might be the only one I'd want to see out of the top 100 to make room for THE (other than the three I already mentioned). I am not sure how much I'd like the new Anglagard if I did listen to it, but since I haven't, no comments. Moonmadness is another album I am quite ambivalent about, but no, much rather that than THE. 'Sadly' no Epica, Nightwish or Rhapsody in the list it seems, would have been an easy vote. |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: August 12 2012 at 02:20
Let's put a top 200 in the home page instead. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 12 2012 at 02:24
| ^^^ They are not! I said those are some albums I am not sure are top 100 material, but I wouldn't swap them for Human Equation. |
Posted By: Mista-Gordie
Date Posted: September 23 2012 at 14:58
| Personnaly, I would place The human equation in the top ten of all time. Stunning album. It's definitely better than any album from Gong, ELP, Magma, The soft machine ad Caravan. |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: September 23 2012 at 16:14
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It looks like you don't like Canterbury....but isn't Andy Latimer in your avatar? ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Jbird
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 05:57
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Is it really that much better than Ayreon's other albums? I have the Universal Migrator I & II, and that 01001010 album, and while they are ok, I just can't get excited about them enough to listen to over and over. I take it Human Equation is better?
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 06:03
------------- What? |
Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 06:19
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I cant believe Human Equation is out of the top 100! Its an Injustice!!!! ------------- 
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Posted By: dtguitarfan
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 06:25
I'd say it is. I'm not an Arjen Lucassen fanboy either, though I do love some of his music. ------------- http://tinyurl.com/cy43zzh" rel="nofollow - My 2012 List 
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Posted By: CCVP
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 06:30
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H8rs gonna h8, Ayreon is amazing. -------------   
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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 12:36
Since the number of albums in the PA database has grown considerably since the idea of the Top 100 was first thought of, all we need to do (and it's perfectly logical to do so) is make it bigger - a simple increase of 10% would see THE in the chart. Problem solved.  ------------- What? |
Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 12:46
| Casey Kasem here with your American top 44! |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 12:52
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...see how catchy that is ... you know it makes sense.
Look how easier "The Top One-Ten" is on the tongue than "The Top One-Hun-dred", it's positively lyrical by comparison. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 13:01
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This thread triggered me into listening to the album during work. Can't say it left the lasting impression now that it has been lacking for years. If it's not in the top 100, it's probably for a reason. Not bad, but not Top 100 material either. ------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 14:22
OMG! Contact Amnesty International ASAP. http://www.amnesty.org/" rel="nofollow - Amnesty International | Working to Protect Human Equation Rights------------- Just a fanboy passin' through. |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: September 24 2012 at 15:54
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This thread resurrected after some months in the limbo. When I started it my idea was to see which albums people would have removed (if any) from the top 100 to make room to this one, not if it really deserves to stay in the top 100 or not. Honestly there aren't many albums which I would personally see out of the list. I don't even know what is currently in the list. I have to admit that usually my threads and polls don't gain much success. I hope that at least my reviews are better.  ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Chozal
Date Posted: September 26 2012 at 07:39
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I thought the top 100 was constantly updated, but since Sounds that can't be made has a mark that puts it in the top 100 but is not there yet, I understand it is more than mathematical calculations ? Were all of the top 100 albums handpicked by the PA staff ?
------------- https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Infinite-Progability-Drive/141225469388975" rel="nofollow - The Infinite Progability Drive , feeding you daily progressive/weird music for just a like <3 |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: September 26 2012 at 07:41
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It's not. The score is not the only parameter. The algorithm is based also on the total number of reviews and ratings otherwise an album with just one 5 stars rating would be top 1. It's automatic and periodically updated. To be honest I don't know the details, but it's all mathematical stuff. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: September 26 2012 at 07:57
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[/QUOTE]
No, it's more complicated than that:
3.83 | 133 ratings http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?syears=2012" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?syears=2012 ------------- What? |
Posted By: Chozal
Date Posted: September 26 2012 at 08:21
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Thanks for the quick answer :) As for Human Equation, I think it suffers from the Lucassen 2-disc disease : some great passages, but too much stuff overall. And the lyrics. =( ------------- https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Infinite-Progability-Drive/141225469388975" rel="nofollow - The Infinite Progability Drive , feeding you daily progressive/weird music for just a like <3 |
Posted By: progbethyname
Date Posted: September 26 2012 at 10:34
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I think it's a great rating system. Best you can really do anyway. Meanwhile....my thoughts turn to that human equation album. I gotta say it's lyrically brilliant. The entire story makes total lucid sense and track by track you uncover the mystery of what's going to happen from the moment he crashes his car to the time he fights to wake up. TRAUMA is easily my favourite track on this album. ERIC CLAYTON as REASON is so fitting and brilliant. My favourite character. 👊 ------------- Gimmie my headphones now!!! 🎧🤣 |
Posted By: CCVP
Date Posted: September 27 2012 at 12:41
It's a grower, people. I know some can digest 2 hours of new music in the blink of a eye, but amazingly most can't and they still review it saying "ZOMG, DIS ALBOM EEZ 2 LOWNG". Meh, I still think highly about it.
That guy's amazing, even though most of his album are 0% related to prog. He can stay there, for all I care, all should know Miles! Interestingly enough, his 'prog' albums aren't on the yop 100, which is a shame.
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Posted By: Chozal
Date Posted: September 27 2012 at 16:41
I listened to the whole album a bunch of times over a month or two ... It probably deserves another chance, but there is so much music that I get excited about that I often forget to re-spin things like The Human Equation (when I do, it's mostly for classic albums that I did really overlook, like A Passion Play). I still have a problem with the pot-pourri aesthetics of Lucassen. He has done some absolutely brilliant tracks (Life on Mars, Amazing Flight, The Awareness, Isolation ...) but never done a absolutely brilliant album imo. I'm listening to some stuff from The Human Equation atm and I think the main problem I have with it is the lyrics : it's much too narrative for my taste =\ EDIT : Ok listening to it again, I should get back to it once more. ------------- https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Infinite-Progability-Drive/141225469388975" rel="nofollow - The Infinite Progability Drive , feeding you daily progressive/weird music for just a like <3 |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: September 27 2012 at 16:59
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I think that also Actual Fantasy revisited deserves more attention. About THE Heather Findlay's voice is enough to make me love the album and thare's a lot more. Day sixteen for example. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: progbethyname
Date Posted: September 27 2012 at 18:41
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Keep in mind that the lyrics need to sound overly narrative. That's the whole point and structure to this album. I really don't find it daunting to listen to because the story is just so great, so really I can sit with it for 2 hrs easy. It's a brilliant album and ARYEON's best album, in my opinion. 👌 ------------- Gimmie my headphones now!!! 🎧🤣 |
Posted By: CCVP
Date Posted: September 27 2012 at 19:12
Seriously, an album, any album, takes at least months if not years to be propperly appreciated. I stand correctly. -------------
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Posted By: Prog Snob
Date Posted: September 28 2012 at 05:44
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It is at 111 now. BUT Sieges Even's The Art of Navigating by the Stars is 181 and in my humble opinion that should be higher than any Ayreon album...sorry guys.
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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: September 28 2012 at 06:05
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I don't know that album. Of course everyone has a favorite album which he thinks is not rated right both in a good and in a bad sense. Personally I'd like to see SEBTP out of the top 100 as in general I can't stand listening to its entirety in one shot, but Genesis fanboys may laike to see Abacab in the top 10. The good is that the top 100 is based on a math algorithm, so everything in it is right apart the rating abuses which the admins are fighting against. I intended this thread as a "just for fun" mixed with an "appreciation thread" and your suggestion about Siegen Even is more than welcome. Any sample somewhere? ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Chozal
Date Posted: September 28 2012 at 06:06
But us young folks want to listen to so many different things we don't take this time =( ------------- https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Infinite-Progability-Drive/141225469388975" rel="nofollow - The Infinite Progability Drive , feeding you daily progressive/weird music for just a like <3 |
Posted By: progbethyname
Date Posted: September 28 2012 at 07:11
 QUEENSRŸCHE's OPERATION MINDCRIME. best concept album ever. Emotional too. ------------- Gimmie my headphones now!!! 🎧🤣 |
Posted By: CCVP
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 08:48
Dude, wtf, I'm about as old as you are.  -------------
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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 09:01
You young folks have bandcamp plus legal and illegal downloads available. We old farts had only expensive vinyls and listening to them hundreds of times was also because buying a new album was not that easy in the 70s. I love Close to the Edge since when it was eleased, but I have bought it on vinyl only at the beginning of the 80s when I had my first job. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 11:15
HAHAHAHAHAHA ROTFL!!! I would remove duplicates ... from the same band ... since you already know that I would prefer this not to be about the album, but the band. And some, then, would likely fall of the list anyway ... I like the idea of considering KC progressive, and we do not have to specify the albums, or ELP or whomever, but the thought of a band that only had one album as progressive (Beach Boys for example!), and the rest not and the band mentioned is more scary than otherwise ... but sometimes, even the Beatles deserve to be mentioned ... but really shouldn't, other than the last album! This ends up in a very subjective area that I'm pretty sure most of us would have to agree to disagree. But Miles in the list? ... probably makes sense, since folks like him did a lot more for music during his time, than most ... regardless of what we call it ... and hte European churches of music went with it ... pretty well, much more than folks did in America at the time. Should we make Bitches Brew mandatory listening?
------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: CCVP
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 11:53
What? -------------
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Posted By: progbethyname
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 15:58
I'm a young guy and I buy all my music in cd lossless audio format. It's the best for me plus I get to look at all the clever art work as well. It's worth it. Love my cd collection and THE HUMAN EQUATION was a great buy. Bought the 3 disc special edition. Cost me 28$ though. Ouch !!! But worth it. ------------- Gimmie my headphones now!!! 🎧🤣 |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: October 03 2012 at 16:29
Miles Davis currently only has two albums in the top 100, and three in the top 250. Kind of Blue is at 29, In a Silent Way is at 40, and Bitches Brew is at 143. if you look at the JRF category alone top 250, then he has albums at number 2, 4, 19, 24, Bitches Brew is at 30, 42, 47, 61 (with Big Fun, a fave of mine), 70, 81, 101, and then at 104 is Get Up With it, which I almost always list as my favourite of his. Bitches Brew is not a favourite electric Miles album of mine, but I do think it's essential listening for explorers of JRF/ electric jazz, and so is In a Silent Way (which I prefer) which unlike BB does make the top 100 all genres list. Considering it's historical importance for its category, at 143 (all genres) and number 30 for JRF alone, it's not ranked that high at all. No album is mandatory listening for all, of course. I don't care for Close to the Edge and a lot of albums that rank better than Bitches Brew in PA, but I would still say that CttE is an important album for its category and Prog generally, of course. It's more important to Prog itself, or/ and more synonymous with Prog, than Bitches Brew. (though I think BB is the more important album overall). Having Miles Davis in the list is fine, of course, but what seems ridiculous and often gets commented on is that Miles Davis' Kind of Blue is in the top 100 (the top rated Davis album) which is a modal jazz classic from 1959, but not electric Miles/ JRF. Miles Davis was not included for that, of course. For my tastes, I'd be happy to see get up With It and Big Fun in the top ten, but that's my tastes. Kind of Blue is one that I would disqualify for the top 100 if I could. I'm fine with the rating, but would like to see it out of that ranking. Anyway, Dean doesn't like jazz, so not surprising he'd mention Davis. ------------- Just a fanboy passin' through. |
Posted By: King Manuel
Date Posted: October 16 2012 at 07:00
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Which ones I would remove? Easy: the albums by Magma, The Mars Volta, Anglagard, Porcupine Tree and King Crimson. That should create enough space for the Human Equation. However I would rather see Into the Electric Castle there instaed of the human eqaution. ------------- Don't Bore Us, Get To The Chorus |