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Robots

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Topic: Robots
Posted By: Stool Man
Subject: Robots
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 11:23
I've been watching the development of robotics and robots over the last few years, I hope I live to see the world filled with as many robots as there currently are planes or trains. 

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rotten hound of the burnie crew



Replies:
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:00
Depends on the statistics about their behavior. But as of now, I'm kind of terrified of the whole idea of "ingenuine", cold interaction between two intelligent beings. If we want to change the world's infrastructure by filling it with robots, we should change ourselves first, ... figure out how to properly treat the AI.

To sum up, ... I'm terrified of robots begot by humans ... because humans are idiots.


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"People tell you life is short. ... No, it's not. Life is long. Especially if you make the wrong decisions." - Chris Rock


Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:04
Robots scare me

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The greatest record label of all time!


Posted By: The Doctor
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:05
I want a robot body so I can stay perpetually young and never die. 

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I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?


Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:07
"Your plastic pal who's fun to be with!".

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My other avatar is a Porsche

It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.

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Posted By: Jim Garten
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:17
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

But as of now, I'm kind of terrified of the whole idea of "ingenuine", cold interaction between two intelligent beings.


And you're a member of an internet forum why, exactly?

Oh sorry - you said "intelligent"

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Jon Lord 1941 - 2012


Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 12:18
LOL ... indeed. Like I said, humans have to learn how to treat AI first. (Please don't make a joke about AI as a disease. Wink)

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"People tell you life is short. ... No, it's not. Life is long. Especially if you make the wrong decisions." - Chris Rock


Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 13:03
What scares me even more is the idea of humans being part of one robotic network, which, let's face it, is already happening. Someday it'll get to the point where you can't tell man from machine


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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 14:14
They're just dumb machines.
 
I'm more scared of the acne-pocked Billy Nomates's who write the software, well, not them specifically, but the bug-ridden C++ code they produce. If megaliths the size of Microsoft, Apple and Google can't write error-free, crash-proof, virally-immune code what chance is there that a spotty oik working in a university basement can adequately program software into an electric tooth brush that won't violate Azimov's Three Laws of Robotics the moment your back is turned??


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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 14:24
Robots give me diarrhea

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Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive
Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.


Posted By: manofmystery
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 15:52
I'm still waiting for Japan to perfect and mass market a lifelike intercourse robot

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Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 15:55
I love robots: they don't have any ego, they work for free, they cover Motorhead...


Posted By: Stool Man
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 16:16
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

....... won't violate Azimov's Three Laws of Robotics the moment your back is turned??
 
Drone bombers have already done that Cry


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rotten hound of the burnie crew


Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 19:22
Originally posted by smartpatrol smartpatrol wrote:

Robots scare me

I'm basically frightened of melting foods and magazines called digest.


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Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: March 19 2013 at 19:28
The whole idea of robots interests me a great deal and I look forward to future developments, but then I'm a fan of Japanese mecha so hardly a surprise that.

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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005



Posted By: Stool Man
Date Posted: March 22 2013 at 07:05
http://www.robotaward.jp/english/index.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.robotaward.jp/english/index.html

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rotten hound of the burnie crew


Posted By: HemispheresOfXanadu
Date Posted: March 24 2013 at 22:51
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

I love robots: ...they cover Motorhead...
Clap


Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: March 25 2013 at 03:17
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

I love robots: they don't have any ego, they work for free, they cover Motorhead...
Many people in the 19th and early 20th century expected that machines would release humans of the hard work and improve our quality of life so we could live working less and enjoying life more. Sci-Fi stories portrayed future societies were machines did the work and humans as a whole enjoyed that reduction of hard work and dedicated themselves to philosophical and cultural activities.
The reality is that those who have a job have to work as hard if not harder than before in order to lead a 'normal life' (perhaps not physically as hard but surely in terms of time and effort) and because of machines a lot of people have become unemployed and my guess is that the trend will grow worse in the coming future. The huge level of automatisation in current industry has drastically reduced the need for human employees and companies strive to automatise their processes more and more and reduce their human workforce as much as possible.
The problem is that all that work now performed by machines does not produce any benefit for those whose work has been taken over but all the contrary, it has made them miserable. Alright automatisation allows products to be cheaper for the consumer but we have to pay attention or we will get a society where things are cheap but only a few people have any money to buy them.



Posted By: Stool Man
Date Posted: March 25 2013 at 03:50
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

I love robots: they don't have any ego, they work for free, they cover Motorhead...
Many people in the 19th and early 20th century expected that machines would release humans of the hard work and improve our quality of life so we could live working less and enjoying life more. Sci-Fi stories portrayed future societies were machines did the work and humans as a whole enjoyed that reduction of hard work and dedicated themselves to philosophical and cultural activities.
The reality is that those who have a job have to work as hard if not harder than before in order to lead a 'normal life' (perhaps not physically as hard but surely in terms of time and effort) and because of machines a lot of people have become unemployed and my guess is that the trend will grow worse in the coming future. The huge level of automatisation in current industry has drastically reduced the need for human employees and companies strive to automatise their processes more and more and reduce their human workforce as much as possible.
The problem is that all that work now performed by machines does not produce any benefit for those whose work has been taken over but all the contrary, it has made them miserable. Alright automatisation allows products to be cheaper for the consumer but we have to pay attention or we will get a society where things are cheap but only a few people have any money to buy them.

 
Partly the reason for so many unemployed people is having so many people.  1 billion in about 1800 doubling to 2 billion in the 1920s, doubling again to 4 billion in the 1970s, and currently 7,106,117,013 ( when I wrote that number, now out of date)
http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/" rel="nofollow - http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/
 


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rotten hound of the burnie crew


Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: March 25 2013 at 03:58
Originally posted by Stool Man Stool Man wrote:

 
Partly the reason for so many unemployed people is having so many people.  1 billion in about 1800 doubling to 2 billion in the 1920s, doubling again to 4 billion in the 1970s, and currently 7,106,117,013 ( when I wrote that number, now out of date)
http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/" rel="nofollow - http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/
 
Superpopulation is undoubtedly one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) problems the world is facing, but in terms of impact on unemployment I would say that it is only marginally relevant, since under equal conditions, production and consumption are both proportional to population. If today we used the production methods of 100 years ago I guess that there would be work for the 7,1 billion without any problem (whether maintaining this population with those methods would be practically feasible or not is another question).


Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: March 25 2013 at 06:22
im more keen on cyborgs, please make me one!

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Acting on your best behaviour

Turn your back on mother nature

Everybody wants to rule the world



Posted By: VOTOMS
Date Posted: June 03 2013 at 20:59
i love robots

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http://myanimelist.net/profile/BradherleysCoach" rel="nofollow - http://myanimelist.net/profile/BradherleysCoach


Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 03:31
As long as my life insurance policy covers robot attacks...

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Posted By: Chris S
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 03:36
Hal

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Music - The Sound Librarian
...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...


Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 04:19
I have a favourite robot.

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Acting on your best behaviour

Turn your back on mother nature

Everybody wants to rule the world



Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 04:19
Robot Fripp?

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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 04:23
John Petrucci Clown, well i like the Iron Giant, that is the most cool robot.



I AM SUPERMAAAAAAAN Headbanger


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Acting on your best behaviour

Turn your back on mother nature

Everybody wants to rule the world



Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 04:30


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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 04:51
Danger, Will Robinson!


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Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 06:18
Drones worry me, they're counting down the hairs on my head.

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Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 06:51
Originally posted by someone_else someone_else wrote:

Drones worry me, they're counting down the hairs on my head.
  EEEEEExterminate!!!!


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Acting on your best behaviour

Turn your back on mother nature

Everybody wants to rule the world



Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 07:24
Ermm Somehow a drone with OCD doesn't seem that threatening.
"Look out! It's a drone!"
 
"Quick, spill a packet of Skittles™ on the floor..."
 
"Oh noes, it's counting down the hairs on my head!"
 
"Don't worry, since you are a very hairy fellow we have plenty of time to make our escape."


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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 07:50
e8a374b2-e7a8-4c31-b487-78d4a9f4b9b3_400




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Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 08:31
The world is already full of robots and they are taking away the jobs of so many people, only for the benefit of their 'employers' Confused
The company I work for has been developing a very advanced robot for many years and we commonly joke that it will eventually use it to substitute many of us without receiving complaints, without getting ill and without having to deal with Unions. The problem is that we wonder if we are really joking or predicting the future Shocked


Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 09:07
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

The world is already full of robots and they are taking away the jobs of so many people, only for the benefit of their 'employers' Confused
The company I work for has been developing a very advanced robot for many years and we commonly joke that it will eventually use it to substitute many of us without receiving complaints, without getting ill and without having to deal with Unions. The problem is that we wonder if we are really joking or predicting the future Shocked
Why is this a problem? Who wants to work every day for the whole of their life anyway? This expectation that we should work ourselves to death is a disease that we've been suffering from since William Lee invented the Stocking Frame in 1563 - the people who ran Blake's dark satanic mills are still with us - forcing us to go to work at stupid o'clock every day and remain there for the next 8-10 hours trudging away at meaningless and unfulfilling tasks - paying us just enough money to ensure we turn up again tomorrow. Whatever the meaning of life is, (and you all know my opinion on philosophers), that certainly isn't it.
 
If the ultimate future reality is to replace all human workers with robot slaves then bring it on - Woo-hoo!
 
We should be thinking how to use all that new-found free time when unempolyment is a legitimate career choice


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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 10:48
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

The world is already full of robots and they are taking away the jobs of so many people, only for the benefit of their 'employers' Confused
The company I work for has been developing a very advanced robot for many years and we commonly joke that it will eventually use it to substitute many of us without receiving complaints, without getting ill and without having to deal with Unions. The problem is that we wonder if we are really joking or predicting the future Shocked
Why is this a problem? Who wants to work every day for the whole of their life anyway? This expectation that we should work ourselves to death is a disease that we've been suffering from since William Lee invented the Stocking Frame in 1563 - the people who ran Blake's dark satanic mills are still with us - forcing us to go to work at stupid o'clock every day and remain there for the next 8-10 hours trudging away at meaningless and unfulfilling tasks - paying us just enough money to ensure we turn up again tomorrow. Whatever the meaning of life is, (and you all know my opinion on philosophers), that certainly isn't it.
 
If the ultimate future reality is to replace all human workers with robot slaves then bring it on - Woo-hoo!
 
We should be thinking how to use all that new-found free time when unempolyment is a legitimate career choice
Sure, that was the utopian dream! the problem is that this is not how it works, robots and automatization in general did not just release humans from the heavy work and improved their life by doing so. Those who 'own' the 'robots' (generalise as 'machines') benefit from their higher efficiency and lack of social issues for performing the work but those who used to perform the work before do not get any clear benefit from the introduction of those machines. Sure, the 'population' or 'we the consumers' benefit from their ability to produce goods and services at lower cost than humans do, so in paper it feels like this is a positive thing, but is it so? do we really prefer a world where a yoghurt cost us 1.00 euro and 25% of the population is unemployed, or a world where a yoghurt cost 1.20 euro and we all have a job? (I'm obviously exaggerating and over-simplifying).

If you think that machines allow humans to work less time you are wrong for the most cases, at least that is what experience tells us so far. Less physically heavily perhaps, but less time or with less stress, no. Of course the target might be that by employing machines to do the heaviest part of the work, humans can spend their time in other (presumably more noble) tasks, but given the nature of economics it is very hard to imagine that this will ever be the case.



Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 11:16
i could not live in a realiry like the utopian world represented in Demolitian Man , I dont want to knit the rest of my life.

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Acting on your best behaviour

Turn your back on mother nature

Everybody wants to rule the world



Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 12:44
I for one welcome our robot overlords.

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Posted By: AEProgman
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 13:10
I want to disect one and re-arrange its servo motor parts.  Then start a Robot service company.

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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 13:54
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Sure, that was the utopian dream! the problem is that this is not how it works, robots and automatization in general did not just release humans from the heavy work and improved their life by doing so. Those who 'own' the 'robots' (generalise as 'machines') benefit from their higher efficiency and lack of social issues for performing the work but those who used to perform the work before do not get any clear benefit from the introduction of those machines. Sure, the 'population' or 'we the consumers' benefit from their ability to produce goods and services at lower cost than humans do, so in paper it feels like this is a positive thing, but is it so? do we really prefer a world where a yoghurt cost us 1.00 euro and 25% of the population is unemployed, or a world where a yoghurt cost 1.20 euro and we all have a job? (I'm obviously exaggerating and over-simplifying).
If you think that machines allow humans to work less time you are wrong for the most cases, at least that is what experience tells us so far. Less physically heavily perhaps, but less time or with less stress, no. Of course the target might be that by employing machines to do the heaviest part of the work, humans can spend their time in other (presumably more noble) tasks, but given the nature of economics it is very hard to imagine that this will ever be the case.

Utopia is always just over the next hill.
 
(As I hinted at before) Since the birth of the Industrial Revolution we have been slaves to the machine, just as Jethro Tull's seed drill enslaved us to the land rather than liberated us from it. Automation never released us from drudgery, it shackled us to the working day, we must work while the machines work and those machines never sleep - the automated production line did not result in a shorter working day, it created the shift system - we have a longer working day, a longer working week and a longer working year than our medieval ancestors - the reward for that is payment and that is the only incentive there is. (re-read what I posted before - this is the gist of what I said - the working day is a disease we are inflicted with).
 
Fully autonomous robots that can truly replace a human (and not the automated machines that we currently call "robots") will liberate us, though the socio-economic revolution that will result from that will not be pretty nor easily achieved - every ideology, every sociology and every philosophy we currently hold so dear will resist this change, probably more violently than any 19th century Luddite or 16th century Saboteur.
 
One thing we cannot halt is the rise of the machines, how we manage that change is going to be the toughest challenge modern civilisation has ever faced .Empires will fall, nations will crumble, civilisation as we know it will change beyond all recognition, even beyond the wildest fantasies of any SF author.
 
 


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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:15
I welcome them. Robotics will totally revolutionize all industries but especially those involving repeatable manual labor. Once we have 50% unemployment, we'll have to rethink how humans live and how society works. I think it's exciting and nerve-wracking, but we're not stupid enough to wither away and die or let petty past philosophies stop us from moving on. We'll find new things to struggle over, but I don't think money in itself will be one of them.

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Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:28
^ exactly Thumbs Up

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If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman


Posted By: jude111
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:31
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

They're just dumb machines.
 
I'm more scared of the acne-pocked Billy Nomates's who write the software, well, not them specifically, but the bug-ridden C++ code they produce. If megaliths the size of Microsoft, Apple and Google can't write error-free, crash-proof, virally-immune code what chance is there that a spotty oik working in a university basement can adequately program software into an electric tooth brush that won't violate Azimov's Three Laws of Robotics the moment your back is turned??

CryLOL Killer self-aware toothbrushes! "I brush, therefore I am." Great, another thing I've got to worry about! ShockedLOL


Posted By: jude111
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:36

We need robots... But they don't need us.

Nor do they need clean air, clean waters, pristine nature...

They don't need to eat, nor sleep... They don't need houses. They won't marry or have children... So they won't be slave wage earners. A world with self-aware robots would indeed be terrifying.


Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:37
^ Are you saying that they are going to destroy nature?

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"People tell you life is short. ... No, it's not. Life is long. Especially if you make the wrong decisions." - Chris Rock


Posted By: jude111
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:41

The ultimate capitalist fantasy: the lone individual, roots severed from nature. The extended family reduced to the nuclear family, reduced finally to the atomized individual. No past, no history, free roaming, floating in space.

In short: the robot.


Posted By: jude111
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:43
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

^ Are you saying that they are going to destroy nature?

Nothing to preserve. Are some robots going to form "Save the Wetlands" NGOs? They won't care about inferior carbon-based lifeforms. The planet will be transformed into their likeness: a vast machine factory planet.

Maybe?... Would make a cool film.... (Or... wasn't that kind of the plot of "The Matrix"... Shocked Or the Borgs in Star Trek... Hmmm, I thought I had an original idea, but 'guess not, lol...)


Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: June 04 2013 at 14:47
^ Or even worse ... The Cube!

Originally posted by jude111 jude111 wrote:


The ultimate capitalist fantasy: the lone individual, roots severed from nature. The extended family reduced to the nuclear family, reduced finally to the atomized individual. No past, no history, free roaming, floating in space.

In short: the robot.
So, we, the parents of the machinery (sorry, you said "no history") the machines are bound to meaningless existence until something or someone defines that meaning for them. Sweet. Ermm


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"People tell you life is short. ... No, it's not. Life is long. Especially if you make the wrong decisions." - Chris Rock



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