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Best 70s Wishbone Ash record

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URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94586
Printed Date: December 26 2014 at 01:24
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Topic: Best 70s Wishbone Ash record
Posted By: presdoug
Subject: Best 70s Wishbone Ash record
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 16:19
A tough choice for me, as i love all of them from that decade. (I have not included live boots released later on.) The first four do the most for me, as the band sound so fresh and invigorating in their musical approach.
I will go with Argus, as it is certainly a very special musical outing for the band.
      What is your favorite one?

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"and what music unites, man should not take apart"--Helmut Koellen                               



Replies:
Posted By: VOTOMS
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 16:29
Argus, no doubt

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Posted By: crpearson2004
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 17:24
That Argus album they released was pretty good..... so I suppose that one. Wink

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Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 17:39
Argus is one of the very few discs I rate as nearly perfect - there's not a bad note on it.
 
But Pilgrimage and Live Dates are also excellent and No Smoke Without Fire is also very good.
 
Several others are also good, the only turkey being Locked In.
 


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I have many faults. Being wrong is not one of them.


Posted By: Wanorak
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 20:17
Argus.

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A GREAT YEAR FOR PROG!!!


Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 21:08
I like their debut most. My favorite Ash record though is Elegant Stealth. 

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I Will Write Peace All Over Your Wings And You Will Fly Around The World


Posted By: stegor
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 22:04
Argus is one of those albums that absolutely every Prog fan should hear.

Or so I'm told, I've never heard it.


Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: July 25 2013 at 23:30
Originally posted by stegor stegor wrote:

Argus is one of those albums that absolutely every Prog fan should hear.

Or so I'm told, I've never heard it.

I heartily suggest you hear it!  Check it out on YouTube!  

I first saw them in 1973, they were amazing!  More recently, I saw Andy Powell's version just a few months ago, it was really fine!

It's hard to understand why there are two Wishbone Ashes, rather ridiculous....Martin Turner's version with Ted Turner and Steve Upton sounds excellent!  

Hey, whatever, I enjoy all of it!  Here's a good Andy Powell interview:

http://psychedelicbaby.blogspot.com/2011/12/wishbone-ash-interview-andy-powell.html" rel="nofollow - http://psychedelicbaby.blogspot.com/2011/12/wishbone-ash-interview-andy-powell.html


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 26 2013 at 00:32
I was lucky enough to have witnessed the Nektar/Martin Turner W.A. gig at B.B. Kings in NYC (very proud of that Embarrassed).  Certainly a fine band I've been missing out on for years.  Currently I only have 'Argus' and 'Live Dates', both of which are highly excellent, I intend on getting more of their 70's discog in the future.  Can't honestly vote.  They do strike me as more than just 'Prog Related'..........they are no less Prog than, say, May Blitz (for instance).


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: July 26 2013 at 03:12
I'm a huge WA appreciator from the 70s and I think Argus is brilliant but Blowin' Free (from Argus) however does not do it for me and to me it is the only weak point on the album.

There's The Rub however is sublime from go to whoa. Buy it, play it, make it part of your life!!


Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: July 26 2013 at 07:18
It's hard to think of another band who has one album so far above the rest as Ash have with Argus. In order to give the others a bit of a chance, I voted for Pilgrimage.

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Posted By: AEProgman
Date Posted: July 27 2013 at 21:31
Argus it has to be for me.  It is an album that I never tire of and can listen to it anytime.  Very key in my youthful listening world.  But as the Glibb mentioned, Blowing Free was a song that really did not fit with the rest and was a hit in England if I recall correctly, it is my least favorite on that album, but the rest of the album is perfect!
 
Their first album, self titiled is excellent also and worthy of votes.  Phoenix is a killer..
 
I was saddened to hear their are two versions of the Ash going around, just work it out, shut up and play!


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Posted By: presdoug
Date Posted: July 28 2013 at 07:53
Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

Argus is one of the very few discs I rate as nearly perfect - there's not a bad note on it.
 

But Pilgrimage and Live Dates are also excellent and No Smoke Without Fire is also very good.

 

Several others are also good, the only turkey being Locked In.

 
After i voted initially, the first other vote registered was for Locked In. Who would figure?


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"and what music unites, man should not take apart"--Helmut Koellen                               


Posted By: progresssaurus
Date Posted: July 28 2013 at 08:42
Pilgrimage


Posted By: Chris S
Date Posted: August 02 2013 at 01:06
love them all but 'four' and ' new england' my faves at the moment, in fact' new england' comes really close to ' argus'

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Posted By: Svetonio
Date Posted: August 02 2013 at 22:50
Argus


Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: August 12 2013 at 11:09
I was a big fan in the 70s, lost interest after Martin Turner left in 1980 but got back into them in the last 15 years. I've seen MT's band many times and for me they have the classic WA sound of the 70s.

As for albums, I have to go with Argus. It's my favourite album by any band, and the most progressive of Wishbone Ash's catalogue. Other albums of theirs that I really like are No Smoke Without Fire, There's The Rub, and Live Dates Vol 2.


Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: August 12 2013 at 14:41
Argus. But there was other great stuff.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROpma9reN8A" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROpma9reN8A


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Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: August 12 2013 at 14:46
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Originally posted by stegor stegor wrote:

Argus is one of those albums that absolutely every Prog fan should hear.

Or so I'm told, I've never heard it.

I heartily suggest you hear it!  Check it out on YouTube!  

I first saw them in 1973, they were amazing!  More recently, I saw Andy Powell's version just a few months ago, it was really fine!

It's hard to understand why there are two Wishbone Ashes, rather ridiculous....Martin Turner's version with Ted Turner and Steve Upton sounds excellent!  

Hey, whatever, I enjoy all of it!  Here's a good Andy Powell interview:

http://psychedelicbaby.blogspot.com/2011/12/wishbone-ash-interview-andy-powell.html" rel="nofollow - http://psychedelicbaby.blogspot.com/2011/12/wishbone-ash-interview-andy-powell.html

 Cool interview. I wonder what kind of drugs They were on.Cool


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Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: August 12 2013 at 16:39
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:


It's hard to understand why there are two Wishbone Ashes, rather ridiculous....Martin Turner's version with Ted Turner and Steve Upton sounds excellent!  

 
I hope you don't mind me correcting you -  Martin Turner indeed has an excellent band, but it doesn't include Ted Turner and Steve Upton. Martin is in the same position as Andy Powell in that both bands have just one original member. Ted Turner has guested with Martin's band a few times (most recently in Japan a few weeks ago), but Steve Upton doesn't play any more, sadly.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: August 13 2013 at 00:30
As I have mentioned elsewhere, I was fortunate to catch the Nektar / M.T.'s Wishbone Ash gig at BB Kings, NYC, and Turner was the only original member.  But that's all they needed - wonderful Bowdown


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: October 03 2013 at 11:07

Argus is probably their most consistent work. I like songs from New England, There's the Rub, and Pilgrimage. I bounce around between those 4. I also enjoyed Noveau Calls..which is not a 70's release, but a instrumental one and worth checking out. I didn't like the production on their debut and that gets to me. The debut is fine no doubt. Some of my favorite pieces/songs are "The Pilgrim"..(which is very Progressive Rock), "In All Of My Dreams" , and "The King Will Come". They often produced a style which ventured into Traditional Folk. The center of "The King Will Come" features 2 guitars blending and produces that traditional English style found on Fairport Convention, Pentangle, and Steeleye Span albums.



Posted By: oldrok
Date Posted: October 27 2013 at 11:03
Good comments all...

Ok, Argus: For me is the best "technical" expression of the band to that point. Prog rock fans were surely wondering what limits WA could ascend to, and their Label fully expected future efforts to launch them deep into the mainstream, didn't fully come to pass though.

There's the Rub: I like a lot. Produced by Bill Scymzyk, and the overall sound and mix reflects that, it could have been, at least in my mind, far more commercially successful than it was with stronger backing and airplay. That is, of course if commercial success is important which ultimately I'll concede that it is not.

New England: What an album. Recorded "in the basement at Mart's place"(Martin Turners home in Connecticut), this effort is one that I have never tired of listening to in well over 30 years. A sort of return to garage band roots, for me it took the band in the direction that THEY wanted to go, something that not all bands would do even if they wanted it. Even with harsh tracks like "Mother of Pearl", which I take as an expression of living in their exile to the U.S. due to tax troubles in U.K., this album gets my vote.

Locked In: As noted or alluded by several was unlistenable, which having fallen in between two of the bands best efforts seems odd at best.


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: October 27 2013 at 13:16
Argus has always been  my favorite one but recently I was lucky to find a used copy of both Best of Wishbone Ash and Pilgrimage on cd. Other than the tracks on the best of I haven't heard any of the later Ash lp's.

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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: October 31 2013 at 05:46
ARGUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 04:13
I just acquired the Wishbone Ash debut LP, and I have to confess that it is more me than Argus. And I can see how Steve Harris modelled Iron Maiden on this mob. Still, the San Fran band Quicksilver Messenger Service were a twin guitar revolution, with excellent music to boot.
Duncan/Cipollina are still my preferred guitar duo.


Posted By: LSDisease
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 04:16
Wishbone Four

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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 04:20
Surprising there are no votes for the 'Live Dates' dbl LP extravaganza. Fantastic performances all 'round.


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 04:27
OK, who's the comedian that voted for Locked In?!



Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 04:53
It wasn't me - honest - but so far it's the debut that does it for me. I still need to get more from them........I have my eyes on 'Pilgrimage', 'Fourth' and 'There's The Rub'. Then I will start to judge what I prefer most.


Posted By: Hawkwise
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 08:53
The double live albums a bit special , as it reminds me of the time's i saw them at Reading University 75 and the Reading festival the same year .   top Live band !!



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Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 10:08
It doesn't fit into the 70s as it was released in 1980 (though recorded in the 70s) - but if you're talking live albums then Live Dates Vol 2 is well worth a spin.


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 12:34
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

It wasn't me - honest - but so far it's the debut that does it for me. I still need to get more from them........I have my eyes on 'Pilgrimage', 'Fourth' and 'There's The Rub'. Then I will start to judge what I prefer most.
I think you'll like Pilgrimage....similar to the first...imo.

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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: UMUR
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 13:02
There´s the Rub is my favorite, but New England is a favorite too.

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Posted By: UMUR
Date Posted: January 25 2014 at 13:03
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

OK, who's the comedian that voted for Locked In?!


Well taste is taste , but yeah I agree, it´s definitely not their best

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Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: January 27 2014 at 17:47
If you notice the piano on "Blind Eye", it gives the song that characteristic of the British Blues Boom era. Wishbone Ash surfaced from that scene around the time when the structure of the British Blues was becoming heavier in sound. Surely not too obvious on Free's s/t , but more so evident on Fire and Water with songs like "Mr. Big". Andy Powell and Ted Turner seemed to be influenced by traditional Folk music. Take the intro to "The Pilgrim" for example, ....there is something very traditional European in the style. The center section of The King Will Come and Leaf and Stream are very traditional sounding like Fairport Convention pieces.


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: January 28 2014 at 01:15
Originally posted by TODDLER TODDLER wrote:

If you notice the piano on "Blind Eye", it gives the song that characteristic of the British Blues Boom era. Wishbone Ash surfaced from that scene around the time when the structure of the British Blues was becoming heavier in sound. Surely not too obvious on Free's s/t , but more so evident on Fire and Water with songs like "Mr. Big". Andy Powell and Ted Turner seemed to be influenced by traditional Folk music. Take the intro to "The Pilgrim" for example, ....there is something very traditional European in the style. The center section of The King Will Come and Leaf and Stream are very traditional sounding like Fairport Convention pieces.

Andy Powell has stated in the past that he had great respect for Fairport Convention i.e. Richard Thompson and his guitar playing. 


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: January 30 2014 at 07:42
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

Originally posted by TODDLER TODDLER wrote:

If you notice the piano on "Blind Eye", it gives the song that characteristic of the British Blues Boom era. Wishbone Ash surfaced from that scene around the time when the structure of the British Blues was becoming heavier in sound. Surely not too obvious on Free's s/t , but more so evident on Fire and Water with songs like "Mr. Big". Andy Powell and Ted Turner seemed to be influenced by traditional Folk music. Take the intro to "The Pilgrim" for example, ....there is something very traditional European in the style. The center section of The King Will Come and Leaf and Stream are very traditional sounding like Fairport Convention pieces.

Andy Powell has stated in the past that he had great respect for Fairport Convention i.e. Richard Thompson and his guitar playing. 
tHANKS for the tip!


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: January 30 2014 at 07:53
Wishbone Ash had such a distinctive sound and writing style. It was difficult to run across any other artist in the 70's that sounded  anything close to the Ash  as they were very original. There was one person though... and that was Danny Kirwan from the early Fleetwood Mac.
Example : Child Of Mine, Bare Trees, Sands Of Time, Dust, and One Sunny Day are structured like the writing of Andy Powell and Martin Turner. It is also very easy to hear Danny Kirwan singing "Time Was" or Martin Turner singing "Bare Trees". "Time Was" is very much like a song Danny Kirwan would have written. Danny Kirwan's guitar playing is a cross between the sound and style of Andy Powell and Ted Turner. It's just really strange and I've observed it over the many years of being a Wishbone Ash fan.


Posted By: Guzzman
Date Posted: January 30 2014 at 10:49
I voted for Live Dates, because it was the album that made me familiar with Wishbone Ash. And I'm thankful for that.

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"We've got to get in to get out"


Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 05:01
There's no context with Argus, but there's a bunch of good songs even on Front Page News which is still wth no votes. Despite the very bad cover sleeve, a song like "Surface to Air" deserves some love IMO. 

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Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half.


Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 06:53
Thought I'd give some love for Pilgrimage. A flawed album but with plenty of strong material. Vas Dis, The Pilgrim, Valediction, Lullabye and Alone are all great with that unique early Ash combination of dual guitar heavy rock plus folk and a bit of jazz. And I love the cover which reflects the mood of the afore-mentioned songs perfectly. The only mis-steps are the two dull generic "boogie" tracks which stand out like a sore thumb IMHO.


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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 07:13
Originally posted by Cactus Choir Cactus Choir wrote:

Thought I'd give some love for Pilgrimage. A flawed album but with plenty of strong material. Vas Dis, The Pilgrim, Valediction, Lullabye and Alone are all great with that unique early Ash combination of dual guitar heavy rock plus folk and a bit of jazz. And I love the cover which reflects the mood of the afore-mentioned songs perfectly. The only mis-steps are the two dull generic "boogie" tracks which stand out like a sore thumb IMHO.
Effectively I'm used to skip the last track. 


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Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half.


Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 09:05
I quite like Jail Bait - and it's still a concert favourite today.

I agree about skipping the last track though.


Posted By: Andrea Cortese
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 10:07
No context at all.

Argus easily wins the game.

There's the Rub comes as close second.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 05 2014 at 18:43
Context - contest ??   
I am really obsessing over the debut at this stage. Just love it, even their standard 'boogie' tracks kick ass. Side 2 is where it's at for me, I prefer it to Argus.......


Posted By: Andrea Cortese
Date Posted: February 06 2014 at 05:38
^^^

yep, the last you said EmbarrassedTongue (contest)


Posted By: presdoug
Date Posted: February 06 2014 at 07:49
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

There's no context with Argus, but there's a bunch of good songs even on Front Page News which is still wth no votes. Despite the very bad cover sleeve, a song like "Surface to Air" deserves some love IMO. 
yeah, i quite like Front Page News. It deserves some recognition.


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"and what music unites, man should not take apart"--Helmut Koellen                               


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: February 07 2014 at 03:57
IMHO after 40 years of listening and appreciating them.......

There's the Rub (5*) > Argus (5*) > Live Dates (5*) > New England (4.5*) > Wishbone Ash (4*) > Pilgrimage (4*) = No Smoke Without Fire (4*) > Wishbone Four (3*) > Front Page News (2.5*) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Locked In (1*)


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 07 2014 at 04:15
^ 40 YEARS !! Well, I take those ratings as 'kosher' - most titles there are on my 'wants list'. Don't think I can go wrong.
Again, been salivating over the debut - just *adore* it. Starts out great, ends BRILLIANTLY. I doubt they can top the debut (in my world...).


Posted By: Andrea Cortese
Date Posted: February 07 2014 at 05:41
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

IMHO after 40 years of listening and appreciating them.......

There's the Rub (5*) > Argus (5*) > Live Dates (5*) > New England (4.5*) > Wishbone Ash (4*) > Pilgrimage (4*) = No Smoke Without Fire (4*) > Wishbone Four (3*) > Front Page News (2.5*) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Locked In (1*)

Well, I agree on the first three studio records you mentioned. New England gets third place after Argus and There's The Rub.Clap

I don't like Wishbone Four.

Locked In it was a waste of money.


Posted By: menawati
Date Posted: February 10 2014 at 16:56
Definitely Argus but Phoenix off the debut is my favourite song of theirs.

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They flutter behind you your possible pasts,
Some bright-eyed and crazy, some frightened and lost.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 13 2014 at 23:43
I'm still drooling over the debut - love everything about it - and I also got LP's of 'Pilgrimage' and 'There's The Rub' at a recent record fair and love them both - the track 'Vas Dis' is probably the best I've heard from the 5 LP's I now have.....
.....but something's really special about the debut........


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: February 16 2014 at 04:45
^Tom....

If you drooling over their debut you should now buy the album "First Light".

"First Light" was discovered by WA's single most ardent fan as an acetate pressing in approx. 2007. The band recorded this acetate before their debut album in 1970 and was used as a way to get a record deal. It has most songs from the debut but also has probably their greatest track that was never ever released; that track is called "Roads of Day to Day" and this track is astonishing.

The fan was able to get all previous members of WA on board and released it on CD in 2008. For an acetate recording it is amazing quality.

Go buy "First Light" now and get back to me about "Roads of Day to Day" .......I still cannot believe that they did not re record this for their debut......it should have been a monster hit.....it should have been released as a single in 2008.




Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 16 2014 at 14:26
^ Right - I'll see what I can do - thanks for the info. Anything to do with the debut *must* be acquired. I run the risk of 'burning' the album out from listening too much to it.
The sound of 'Pilgrimage' is amazing - Marty thrashing a beautifully toned Rickenbacker throughout is notable.
The track 'F.U.B.B.' from There's The Rub is awesome, so is 'Persephone'.
I don't like what I read about Wishbone 4 and Locked In, but some of the albums afterwards I'll be keeping an eye out for.


Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: February 16 2014 at 18:21
First Light is certainly worth getting. It has alternative versions of every track from the debut album except Phoenix, plus a version of Alone from Pilgrimage which is longer and has vocals, plus the song BarryGlibb was raving about , and an unreleased instrumental.
 
Of the albums after There's The Rub, I would say New England and No Smoke Without Fire are the best.


Posted By: Chris S
Date Posted: February 16 2014 at 20:28
^^ Wishbone Four is underrated cos they went to short tracks mode but highly recommend Ballad Of A Beacon, and Everybody Needs A Friend

I love Front Page News too, Laurie Wisefield's contribution to the later WA sound is praiseworthy for sure



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<font color=Brown>Music - The Sound Librarian

...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...[/COLOR]


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 00:16
Originally posted by AlanB AlanB wrote:

First Light is certainly worth getting. It has alternative versions of every track from the debut album except Phoenix, plus a version of Alone from Pilgrimage which is longer and has vocals, plus the song BarryGlibb was raving about , and an unreleased instrumental.


 

Of the albums after There's The Rub, I would say New England and No Smoke Without Fire are the best.
^ These are the 2 I had in mind . I can't believe that I had skipped on this band for 20-odd years


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 00:24
Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

^^ Wishbone Four is underrated cos they went to short tracks mode but highly recommend Ballad Of A Beacon, and Everybody Needs A Friend
I love Front Page News too, Laurie Wisefield's contribution to the later WA sound is praiseworthy for sure


Well, I'd probably get this fourth album if/when I see it (on LP) - I am familiar with 'Ballad...' from the Live Concerts album.
Darn it, I wish I had paid more attention when I saw MT's Wishbone perform live last year at BB King's whilst I was on holiday in NYC. I was there for Nektar, and MT and his band came on after and I hadn't ever before heard a note of WA. I stuck around to see what all the fuss was about this band and was sold that night . I really thought they were a 'bog-standard' blues/boogie band with twin guitars. Boy, was I wrong..........even the way they do their more simpler 'rockers' just ticks all the right boxes for me. As you can tell, I've gone all WA mad


Posted By: AlanB
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 01:42
Wishbone Four, in hindsight, wasn't a bad album - it's just that it followed Argus and fans were expecting more. Also, the mixing/production wasn't great, and sadly the original tapes have disappeared so producing a cleaner version isn't possible Cry
 
What I would recommend, since you enjoyed MTs band, is getting a copy of the "Life Begins" DVD (or CD) that they recorded a few years back. It includes renditions of what are (IMO) the four standout songs from Wishbone Four, so if you have that you probably wouldn't need the album.
 
PS. Locked in really is dire though!


Posted By: Chris S
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 03:37
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

^^ Wishbone Four is underrated cos they went to short tracks mode but highly recommend Ballad Of A Beacon, and Everybody Needs A Friend
I love Front Page News too, Laurie Wisefield's contribution to the later WA sound is praiseworthy for sure


Well, I'd probably get this fourth album if/when I see it (on LP) - I am familiar with 'Ballad...' from the Live Concerts album.
Darn it, I wish I had paid more attention when I saw MT's Wishbone perform live last year at BB King's whilst I was on holiday in NYC. I was there for Nektar, and MT and his band came on after and I hadn't ever before heard a note of WA. I stuck around to see what all the fuss was about this band and was sold that night . I really thought they were a 'bog-standard' blues/boogie band with twin guitars. Boy, was I wrong..........even the way they do their more simpler 'rockers' just ticks all the right boxes for me. As you can tell, I've gone all WA mad

Funny, I am kinda pissed you have recently discovered them now.....All that discovering, Yep as Alan says There's the Rub and New England are outstanding. The only one I have struggled with so far but still turn it up for loyalty sake is Raw to The Bone


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<font color=Brown>Music - The Sound Librarian

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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 04:54
^ ?? What - 'another mug jumping on the bandwagon' pissed, or 'it's taken someone this long to discover a great band' pissed ?? I'm confused as to your context - hopefully the latter......


Posted By: Chris S
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 13:48
Sorry Tom, just an expression meaning I was envious you have only recently found WASmile 

Someone recently had shared they just discovered Caravan and I thought the same thing!

Mate the risk of typed words, I am very happy for you


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<font color=Brown>Music - The Sound Librarian

...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...[/COLOR]


Posted By: presdoug
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 15:50
I like Locked In.

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"and what music unites, man should not take apart"--Helmut Koellen                               


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 16:24
^So you're the one!


Posted By: presdoug
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 16:42
^LOL

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"and what music unites, man should not take apart"--Helmut Koellen                               


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 17 2014 at 23:14
Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Sorry Tom, just an expression meaning I was envious you have only recently found WASmile 

Someone recently had shared they just discovered Caravan and I thought the same thing!
Mate the risk of typed words, I am very happy for you
Cool !! Oh, the joy of discovering music this wonderful. I mean, I've missed out on enjoying WA for a possible 25 years (since I started buying LP's and getting into Prog...). Better late than never -


Posted By: Andrea Cortese
Date Posted: February 18 2014 at 06:05
Originally posted by AlanB AlanB wrote:

Wishbone Four, in hindsight, wasn't a bad album - it's just that it followed Argus and fans were expecting more. Also, the mixing/production wasn't great, and sadly the original tapes have disappeared so producing a cleaner version isn't possible Cry
 
What I would recommend, since you enjoyed MTs band, is getting a copy of the "Life Begins" DVD (or CD) that they recorded a few years back. It includes renditions of what are (IMO) the four standout songs from Wishbone Four, so if you have that you probably wouldn't need the album.
 
PS. Locked in really is dire though!

I'll give W4 another listen.

Probably you're right and the problem is just that it's in between two terrific records (Argus and There's the Rub).




Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: February 19 2014 at 08:40
All 3 volumes of Live Dates are worthwhile purchases although they have a few tracks to be skipped over sometimes..it's worth having them in your collection. I liked Locked In ..but I personally have trouble adapting to the "talk box" which in the 70's was very huge and crafted by guitarists like Joe Walsh and Peter Frampton. Wishbone Ash began using it on Locked In and New England. New England is a fine album without the "talk box"


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 24 2014 at 03:34
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

^Tom....
If you drooling over their debut you should now buy the album "First Light".
"First Light" was discovered by WA's single most ardent fan as an acetate pressing in approx. 2007. The band recorded this acetate before their debut album in 1970 and was used as a way to get a record deal. It has most songs from the debut but also has probably their greatest track that was never ever released; that track is called "Roads of Day to Day" and this track is astonishing.
The fan was able to get all previous members of WA on board and released it on CD in 2008. For an acetate recording it is amazing quality.
Go buy "First Light" now and get back to me about <span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;">"Roads of Day to Day" .......I still cannot believe that they did not re record this for their debut......it should have been a monster hit.....it should have been released as a single in 2008.</span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>
Just got this 'First Light' on order as an LP !! Syn-Phonic has copies of it fresh in-stock so without hesitation.......
Still obsessing over S/T - the first 5 minutes of 'Handy' is some of the most inspired music I've heard for ages.....


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 09:32
"The Pilgrim" and particularly the live version on Live Dates is one of their most progressive pieces. The piece opens with a ambient style that begins with a distant guitar harmony combined with rolling of drum sticks on cymbals. That equals prog. Then the piece develops into quick stops forming a time signature which is in the vain of early YES. Then the vocal harmonies come in and that entire section is outstanding. The way it was written and the feeling which goes into it. Just after the vocal section ends...a burning guitar solo is storming through the speakers and it just spins my head around after all these years of listening to Wishbone Ash. The piece is very progressive , guiding you through sections..and again..this is definitely Progressive Rock. "The King Will Come" was  vocally difficult to pull off. I haven't heard one live recording where one of the members doesn't accidently go sharp or flat. Getting those harmonies to sound fluent takes hours of vocal practice. It's best to practice without the instruments for a few hrs just to master the sound effect of what you're vision gives you. On the studio version they sing it perfect, but on the live versions one or two of the vocalists tend to go sharp or flat. Try pulling that song off vocally while traveling the road and being forced to perform it 3 or 4 times a week. It would take some very seasoned vocalists to master the song ...if for example someone decided to re-record it. Think about it. Wishbone Ash were intimidating/scary in the early 70's.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 12:29
^ Surely some fine words there, Toddler !! Couldn't agree more


Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 13:19
I have a special thing for "New England", the first Wishbone Ash album I heard. I was immediately grabbed by the hard rocker "Runaway" and loved how it was contrasted by a track like "By Candlelight"

-------------

BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue.


Posted By: Andrea Cortese
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 13:39
New England is excellent indeed. Love those contrasts beteen hard rockers and softer parts as in the first two songs.


Posted By: oldrok
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 18:35
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

^Tom....
If you drooling over their debut you should now buy the album "First Light".
"First Light" was discovered by WA's single most ardent fan as an acetate pressing in approx. 2007. The band recorded this acetate before their debut album in 1970 and was used as a way to get a record deal. It has most songs from the debut but also has probably their greatest track that was never ever released; that track is called "Roads of Day to Day" and this track is astonishing.
The fan was able to get all previous members of WA on board and released it on CD in 2008. For an acetate recording it is amazing quality.
Go buy "First Light" now and get back to me about <span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;">"Roads of Day to Day" .......I still cannot believe that they did not re record this for their debut......it should have been a monster hit.....it should have been released as a single in 2008.</span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>


Interesting. I'm a gonna have to dig into "First Light". It's always very cool to think you really know the works of a band and then come to find out there was one tucked in there that you didn't know of, and then rediscover their "newness" again. Awesome!!

A couple of mentions of Front Page News in posts above. I agree, a good listen also. I've always really liked the song "Diamond Jack", and always thought it would have been a good single. FPN in general was a very commercial sounding effort to me. I don't mean that as a negative, as there were some excellent tracks to it. Just had very slick packaging and overall mix, with just a tad of pop to it.

No Smoke Without Fire had the track "Anger in Harmony" which featured the "dueling" dual lead guitar ending that I've always thought of as the band's last truly great tune, but that's just my taste though.


Posted By: oldrok
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 19:07
Originally posted by Andrea Cortese Andrea Cortese wrote:


Originally posted by AlanB AlanB wrote:

Wishbone Four, in hindsight, wasn't a bad album - it's just that it followed Argus and fans were expecting more. Also, the mixing/production wasn't great, and sadly the original tapes have disappeared so producing a cleaner version isn't possible Cry
 

What I would recommend, since you enjoyed MTs band, is getting a copy of the "Life Begins" DVD (or CD) that they recorded a few years back. It includes renditions of what are (IMO) the four standout songs from Wishbone Four, so if you have that you probably wouldn't need the album.

 

PS. Locked in really is dire though!

I'll give W4 another listen.
Probably you're right and the problem is just that it's in between two terrific records (Argus and There's the Rub).


I think you are both on the money. I recall reading somewhere that Wishbone Four was targeted by their label as being the album to break WA into the mainstream. It was to be strongly pushed by the studio, but whether they made the effort and it fell through, or it was panned early by fans/critics and they dropped plans for strong support I'm not too clear on. I just know that they were never given the airplay that could have broadened their scope of popularity. Is that really important? To the band itself, obvious answer is yes. But I wonder if toiling along in a degree of anonymity(they are widely known as "the best band you've never heard of")didn't make their efforts stronger???


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 26 2014 at 23:20
Well, currently got 'Pilgrimage' on - up to track 2, side 2 - 'Valediction'. Just lent my LP of the debut to my boss at work. I find out tomorrow if he liked it or not. He knows them, has an album, but not the debut.....he freaked out when I was familiar with Atomic Rooster and so did I when he mentioned them !!! Lent him 'Death Walks Behind You' and he was impressed, though he has grown out of that 70's mindset (musically speaking).


Posted By: TODDLER
Date Posted: February 28 2014 at 09:03
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

Well, currently got 'Pilgrimage' on - up to track 2, side 2 - 'Valediction'. Just lent my LP of the debut to my boss at work. I find out tomorrow if he liked it or not. He knows them, has an album, but not the debut.....he freaked out when I was familiar with Atomic Rooster and so did I when he mentioned them !!! Lent him 'Death Walks Behind You' and he was impressed, though he has grown out of that 70's mindset (musically speaking).
Your boss listens to Atomic Rooster? No sight of Progressive Rock in "Green Acres".


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 28 2014 at 17:12
^ Green Acres - ???
Oh, my boss loved Wishbone S/T - esp. side 2 !!


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 03 2014 at 03:32
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

^Tom....
If you drooling over their debut you should now buy the album "First Light".
"First Light" was discovered by WA's single most ardent fan as an acetate pressing in approx. 2007. The band recorded this acetate before their debut album in 1970 and was used as a way to get a record deal. It has most songs from the debut but also has probably their greatest track that was never ever released; that track is called "Roads of Day to Day" and this track is astonishing.
The fan was able to get all previous members of WA on board and released it on CD in 2008. For an acetate recording it is amazing quality.
Go buy "First Light" now and get back to me about <span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;">"Roads of Day to Day" .......I still cannot believe that they did not re record this for their debut......it should have been a monster hit.....it should have been released as a single in 2008.</span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>
<span style=": rgba255, 255, 255, 0;"></span>
Just got this 'First Light' on order as an LP !! Syn-Phonic has copies of it fresh in-stock so without hesitation.......
Still obsessing over S/T - the first 5 minutes of 'Handy' is some of the most inspired music I've heard for ages.....

Hey Tom....I hope you didn't buy the vinyl LP called First Lights, I have a horrible feeling that it is a b**tleg.



Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: March 03 2014 at 03:53
^ Yep, sh*t, that's the one.........just got my batch of LP's in the mail today. First album I put on - Wishbone. It looks legit, has the acetate tracks plus some extra studio material from the 'Pilgrimage' sessions. The tracks are significantly different enough from the debut proper to be another special listen for me. I didn't expect it to be a b##t.....


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 03 2014 at 04:48
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

^ Yep, sh*t, that's the one.........just got my batch of LP's in the mail today. First album I put on - Wishbone. It looks legit, has the acetate tracks plus some extra studio material from the 'Pilgrimage' sessions. The tracks are significantly different enough from the debut proper to be another special listen for me. I didn't expect it to be a b##t.....

Oh dear.  What gives the "First Lights" LP away as being a b**t are the extra tracks that are lifted directly from the Pilgrimage album.....these are not on the legitimate CD release of "First Light"....oh an the added "s"  to "Light" also hints it being a suspect release.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: March 05 2014 at 02:53
I have to admit - the vocal version of 'Alone' is just superb - love the emphasis on the arpeggio guitaring. These guys must've been onto something special back in the day.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: March 06 2014 at 23:45
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:



Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

^ Yep, sh*t, that's the one.........just got my batch of LP's in the mail today. First album I put on - Wishbone. It looks legit, has the acetate tracks plus some extra studio material from the 'Pilgrimage' sessions. The tracks are significantly different enough from the debut proper to be another special listen for me. I didn't expect it to be a b##t.....

Oh dear.  What gives the "First Lights" LP away as being a b**t are the extra tracks that are lifted directly from the Pilgrimage album.....these are not on the legitimate CD release of "First Light"....oh an the added "s"  to "Light" also hints it being a suspect release.

To be honest, when I made my selections from an updated list of 'vinyl availables', I thought " yay, First Light on LP "      
I just assumed that the extra 's' on 'light' was just a typo.....
How many times has anyone heard Genesis 'Nursery Cryme' referred to as 'Nursery Crymes'......?
BTW, the volume control of my stereo has to be cranked up really high (mid 20's...whatever that means...) to have a decent listening volume.......(no, I'm not deaf..... )......
I don't wilfully purchase b##ts, though my lack of knowledge on certain vinyl issues hampers me somewhat, and excitement kicks in and it mostly pans out in favour of me (and the artist.....). I'd give a few bob to Mart and his buddies should I ever get a chance to speak with him in person.............


Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 16 2014 at 15:44
It was a choice between the 1st album and NE. I went for New England because I love Laurie Wisefield's solo's. He is my fave Wishbone Ash guitarist.
I used to play in a Wishbone Ash tribute band before forming a Budgie tribute band. In fact Martin Turner is a personal friend of mine i'm pleased to say. Here he is playing on my old Rickenbacker 4001 in the studio, which he borrowed for his "Argus Through The Looking Glass" album that he released with his current band. I have not been active on this forum for a long toime so forgive me if you've seen this before!




-------------
Tony C.


Posted By: proggman
Date Posted: March 16 2014 at 18:31
Argus

-------------
God took the Promised Land and put it in my bloodstained hand. I can sell you grace for your soul or you'll burn in hell far below.


Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: March 17 2014 at 00:57
^^ Nice pic - thanks for posting that.
Always good to see Mart in action. Wishbone S/T is just plain AMAZING, I wouldn't change a thing on it.
New England is an album I have to keep an eye out for.


Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 17 2014 at 01:58
Originally posted by Tom Ozric Tom Ozric wrote:

^^ Nice pic - thanks for posting that.
Always good to see Mart in action. Wishbone S/T is just plain AMAZING, I wouldn't change a thing on it.
New England is an album I have to keep an eye out for.


You are welcome! Smile


-------------
Tony C.


Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 18 2014 at 04:57
That's the biggest pic of Martin Turner in the history of this Earth ...thanks for posting...he is a real hero of mine.






Posted By: clarkpegasus4001
Date Posted: March 18 2014 at 15:01
Originally posted by BarryGlibb BarryGlibb wrote:

That's the biggest pic of Martin Turner in the history of this Earth ...thanks for posting...he is a real hero of mine.


No worries, but i'm not sure why the pic came out so big! LOL he's a bit of an hero of mine too! Cool


-------------
Tony C.



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