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Prog albums recorded in the sixties

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Topic: Prog albums recorded in the sixties
Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Subject: Prog albums recorded in the sixties
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 22:43
A lot but not all prog fans seem to think that King Crimson's debut album "in the court of the Crimson King" was the first "true" prog album(as in not proto prog). I do believe there are some other contenders out there though or maybe albums released at the same time or a few months later. So what I want to know is what other prog albums were recorded before the end of the sixties. They can be released later just as long as they were recorded before 1970.

I have a few in mind but I'll chime in later. Wink



Replies:
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 22:50
The Thoughts of Emerlist Davjack by The Nice came out in '67.
The self-titled by Touch came out in '68.
The self-titled by Renaissance and Ad Gloriam by Le Orme came out in '69.

Atomic Rooster comes to mind but their self-titled came out in '70. Ditto for Hawkwind.

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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 22:57
Recording for Atomic Rooster's debut album began in December of 69(according to wikipedia it was recorded in Dec and Jan)so it qualifies. :) The first Hawkwind album was recorded in April of 70(when I was born Smile). Good call on Renaissance though.


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Posted By: HemispheresOfXanadu
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 23:19
The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles, and Fripp
Several Miles Davis albums (if we're counting Fusion)
The Beatles (if they count)
Jethro Tull--This Was, Stand Up
Van Der Graaf Generator--The Aerosol Grey Machine
Pink Floyd--The Piper at the Gates of Dawn, A Saucerful of Secrets, More, Ummagumma
Frank Zappa--Freak Out!, Absolutely Free, Lumpy Gravy, We're Only in it For the Money, Uncle Meat, Hot Rats


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 23:37
Tangerine Dream-Electronic Meditation (recorded in October 1969)
Frank Zappa-Hot Rats(released in October 1969(same day as ITCOTCK actually)
"             "        -Uncle Meat (also released in 69)
Van der Graaf Generator-The least we can do is wave to eachother (recorded in Dec. of 1969)
Pink Floyd-More (released in June of 1969)

Probably a bunch of English proto bands also recorded in 69 but not released until 1970 but I'm not sure.


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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 23:41
Moody Blues - Days Of Future Passed
Caravan debut
Doors - Waiting for the sun
Kaleidoscope - Tangerine Dream
Procol Harum - A Whiter Shade of Pale

Other 60s bands and artists: Pearls before Swine - Pretty Things - Ron Geesin - Stormy Six


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Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: November 14 2013 at 23:43
I believe the Beatles Strawberry Fields/Penny Lane single was the first prog release in mid Feb 1967 so my list begins there:

1967
Beatles : Strawberry Fields/Penny Lane (single), Sgt Peppers, Magical Mystery Tour (US album)
Pink Floyd : Piper at the Gates of Dawn
Doors : Strange Days
Procol Harum : A Whiter Shade of Pale
Rolling Stones : Satanic Majesties Request

1968
Beatles : White Album
Pink Floyd : A Saucerful of Secrets
Procol Harum : Shine On Brightly
Simon & Garfunkel : Bookends
Soft Machine : Vol 1
Zappa/Mothers : We're Only in it for the Money

1969
Beatles : Abbey Road
Syd Barrett : The Madcap Laughs
King Crimson : ITCOTCK
Grateful Dead : AOXOMOXOA
Juniors Eyes : Battersea Power Station
Pink Floyd : Ummagumma
Procol Harum : A Salty Dog
Renaissance : s/t
Soft Machine : Vol 2
Jethro Tull : Stand Up
Van Der Graaf Generator : Aerosol Grey Machine


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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 01:00
The Nice - Ars Longa Vita Brevis was recorded and released in November 1968 in the same week as Procal Harum - Shine On Brightly. Both featured a side long peice of music.


Posted By: Wafflesyrup
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 02:25
This thread again >.<

Lurker post.


Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 06:38
How do you define "prog album"?

Few or none of the albums listed so far are prog from start to finish.

Someone claimed the Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane single is prog while it's only 50% prog at max.

You will find many proto prog albums but not prog albums from the 60's.


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Posted By: brainstormer
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 11:11
The Electric Prunes "Mass in F Minor."
"Release of an Oath"
Both in 1968.  


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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 11:15
Originally posted by Wafflesyrup

This thread again >.<

Lurker post.



What do you mean again? Was there another one? If so can you direct me to it? Wink


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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 11:17
Originally posted by earlyprog

How do you define "prog album"?

Few or none of the albums listed so far are prog from start to finish.

Someone claimed the Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane single is prog while it's only 50% prog at max.

You will find many proto prog albums but not prog albums from the 60's.



So what prog albums(if any)do you think were recorded in the sixties?


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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 11:57
Whether one agrees with it or not... According to a wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_progressive_rock_%281960%E2%80%9369%29" rel="nofollow - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_progressive_rock_(1960–69)

Release Date Artist Album Country
June 1964 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Zombies" rel="nofollow - The Zombies http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shes_Not_There" rel="nofollow - She's Not There England
October 1964 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moody_Blues" rel="nofollow - The Moody Blues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_Now_%28song%29" rel="nofollow - Go Now England
May 1966 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beach_Boys" rel="nofollow - The Beach Boys http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Sounds" rel="nofollow - Pet Sounds USA
27 June 1966 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Zappa" rel="nofollow - Frank Zappa & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mothers_of_Invention" rel="nofollow - The Mothers of Invention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freak_Out%21" rel="nofollow - Freak Out! USA
October 1966 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beach_Boys" rel="nofollow - The Beach Boys http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Vibrations" rel="nofollow - Good Vibrations USA
March 1967 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Velvet_Underground" rel="nofollow - The Velvet Underground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Velvet_Underground_%26_Nico" rel="nofollow - The Velvet Underground & Nico USA
May 1967 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Procol_Harum" rel="nofollow - Procol Harum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiter_Shade_of_Pale" rel="nofollow - Whiter Shade of Pale England
26 May 1967 Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absolutely_Free" rel="nofollow - Absolutely Free USA
1967 Jun http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Procol_Harum" rel="nofollow - Procol Harum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Procol_Harum_%28album%29" rel="nofollow - Procol Harum England
5 August 1967 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd" rel="nofollow - Pink Floyd http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Piper_at_the_Gates_of_Dawn" rel="nofollow - The Piper at the Gates of Dawn England
1967 Sep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Beefheart_%26_His_Magic_Band" rel="nofollow - Captain Beefheart & His Magic Band http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safe_as_Milk" rel="nofollow - Safe as Milk USA
11 November 1967 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moody_Blues" rel="nofollow - The Moody Blues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Days_of_Future_Passed" rel="nofollow - Days of Future Passed England
1967 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nice" rel="nofollow - The Nice http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thoughts_of_Emerlist_Davjack" rel="nofollow - The Thoughts of Emerlist Davjack England
1967 Late Frank Zappa http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumpy_Gravy" rel="nofollow - Lumpy Gravy - On Capitol, but pulled quickly because of threatened legal action by MGM. Popularly released by MGM/Verve on 13 May 1968. http://www.lukpac.org/%7Ehandmade/patio/vinylvscds/lumpy_gravy.html" rel="nofollow - [1] USA

Albums

Release date Artist Album Country
4 March 1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Zappa" rel="nofollow - Frank Zappa & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mothers_of_Invention" rel="nofollow - The Mothers of Invention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Were_Only_in_It_for_the_Money" rel="nofollow - We're Only in It for the Money USA
6 March 1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_United_States_of_America_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - The United States of America http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_United_States_of_America_%28album%29" rel="nofollow - The United States of America USA
1968 Mar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Burdon_%26_The_Animals" rel="nofollow - Eric Burdon & The Animals http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twain_Shall_Meet" rel="nofollow - The Twain Shall Meet England
13 May 1968 Frank Zappa http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumpy_Gravy" rel="nofollow - Lumpy Gravy - An original rare release appeared in late 1967 on Capitol, but was pulled quickly because of threatened legal action by MGM. This MGM/Verve release was the first popularly available version. http://www.lukpac.org/%7Ehandmade/patio/vinylvscds/lumpy_gravy.html" rel="nofollow - [2] USA
29 June 1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd" rel="nofollow - Pink Floyd http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Saucerful_of_Secrets" rel="nofollow - A Saucerful of Secrets England
1968 Jul http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Family http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_in_a_Dolls_House" rel="nofollow - Music in a Doll's House England
26 July 1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moody_Blues" rel="nofollow - The Moody Blues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_Search_of_the_Lost_Chord" rel="nofollow - In Search of the Lost Chord England
1968 Sep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giles,_Giles_and_Fripp" rel="nofollow - Giles, Giles and Fripp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cheerful_Insanity_of_Giles,_Giles_and_Fripp" rel="nofollow - The Cheerful Insanity of Giles, Giles and Fripp England
1968 Oct http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caravan_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Caravan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caravan_%28Caravan_album%29" rel="nofollow - Caravan England
25 October 1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jethro_Tull_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Jethro Tull http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_Was" rel="nofollow - This Was England
1968 Nov http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nice" rel="nofollow - The Nice http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ars_Longa_Vita_Brevis_%28album%29" rel="nofollow - Ars Longa Vita Brevis England
1968 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pretty_Things" rel="nofollow - The Pretty Things http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S.F._Sorrow" rel="nofollow - S.F. Sorrow England
1968 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soft_Machine" rel="nofollow - The Soft Machine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Soft_Machine_%28Soft_Machine_album%29" rel="nofollow - The Soft Machine - the original album was only available in USA, an import in the UK; later re-issued as Volume One. England
1968 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Procol_Harum" rel="nofollow - Procol Harum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shine_on_Brightly" rel="nofollow - Shine on Brightly England
1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Harvester_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - International Harvester - originally called http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C3%A4rson_Sound" rel="nofollow - Pärson Sound (recordings from Pärson Sound weren't released until 2001) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sov_gott_Rose-Marie" rel="nofollow - Sov gott Rose-Marie Sweden
1968 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touch_%2860s_band%29" rel="nofollow - Touch Touch USA

Albums

Release Date Artist Album Country
7 March 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genesis_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Genesis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_Genesis_to_Revelation" rel="nofollow - From Genesis to Revelation England
21 April 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Zappa" rel="nofollow - Frank Zappa & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mothers_of_Invention" rel="nofollow - The Mothers of Invention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncle_Meat" rel="nofollow - Uncle Meat USA
25 April 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moody_Blues" rel="nofollow - The Moody Blues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Threshold_of_a_Dream" rel="nofollow - On the Threshold of a Dream England
16 June 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Beefheart" rel="nofollow - Captain Beefheart & His Magic Band http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trout_Mask_Replica" rel="nofollow - Trout Mask Replica USA
25 July 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yes_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Yes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yes_%28Yes_album%29" rel="nofollow - Yes England
27 July 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd" rel="nofollow - Pink Floyd http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soundtrack_from_the_Film_More" rel="nofollow - Soundtrack from the Film More England
1 August 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jethro_Tull_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Jethro Tull http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_Up_%28Jethro_Tull_album%29" rel="nofollow - Stand Up England
26 September 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beatles" rel="nofollow - The Beatles http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbey_Road" rel="nofollow - Abbey Road England
1969 Sep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nice" rel="nofollow - The Nice http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nice_%28The_Nice_album%29" rel="nofollow - The Nice England
1969 Sep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soft_Machine" rel="nofollow - The Soft Machine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volume_Two_%28The_Soft_Machine_album%29" rel="nofollow - Volume Two England
1969 Sep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_der_Graaf_Generator" rel="nofollow - Van der Graaf Generator http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Aerosol_Grey_Machine" rel="nofollow - The Aerosol Grey Machine England, however album was originally released only in USA
10 October 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Crimson" rel="nofollow - King Crimson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Court_of_the_Crimson_King" rel="nofollow - In the Court of the Crimson King England
10 October 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Zappa" rel="nofollow - Frank Zappa http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_Rats" rel="nofollow - Hot Rats USA
25 October 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink_Floyd" rel="nofollow - Pink Floyd http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ummagumma" rel="nofollow - Ummagumma England
21 November 1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moody_Blues" rel="nofollow - The Moody Blues http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_Our_Childrens_Childrens_Children" rel="nofollow - To Our Children's Children's Children England
1969 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairport_Convention" rel="nofollow - Fairport Convention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liege_%26_Lief" rel="nofollow - Liege & Lief England
1969 Dec http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - Renaissance http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_%28Renaissance_album%29" rel="nofollow - Renaissance England
1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amon_D%C3%BC%C3%BCl_II" rel="nofollow - Amon Düül II http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallus_Dei" rel="nofollow - Phallus Dei Germany
1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_of_Eden_%28band%29" rel="nofollow - East of Eden Mercator Projected England
1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_Beautiful_Day" rel="nofollow - It's a Beautiful Day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_Beautiful_Day_%28album%29" rel="nofollow - It's a Beautiful Day USA
1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wigwam_%28progressive_rock%29" rel="nofollow - Wigwam Hard 'n' Horny Finland
1969 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catherine_Ribeiro_%2B_Alpes" rel="nofollow - Catherine Ribeiro + 2Bis Catherine Ribeiro + 2Bis France

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I would mention Phallus Day by Amon Dull II, Can's Monster Movie, The Advancement's self-titled, Arzachel's self-titled, David Axelrod's Song of Innocence and Songs of Experience, the Pink Floyd albums, the Van der Graaf Generator one, COlloseum's Valentyne Suite, Zappa's Absolutely Free and  Hot Rats, The Soft Machine albums, especially Volume II, Captain Beefheart albums, The United States of America album the Catherine Ribeiro + 2bis album, and I would mention  Fifty Hose's Caudron and I  know that I'm almost alone in this, but I consider Cream to have a been a  sort of Prog band with Wheels of Fire and Disraeli Gears to an extent.. I know I have a lot more in my collection from the 60s that I consider on the prog-side, but then I tend not to use the prog designation for a lot of my music..  I could even mention various Ennio Morricone albums, but I think a lot can depend upon how loosely one uses the term Prog....


Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:05
^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:14
The Advancments? Do you mean The Advancement who were a US band who released one album in 1968? It's pretty obscure apparently.

Anyway, a lot of the above albums you mentioned could be considered psychedelic(maybe not all though). However, here's how I look at it. First off I don't really buy into the term "proto prog" too much although it is worth mentioning and it does have it's purpose and can even be helpful at times. However, something is either progressive or it isn't. If people want to say the first proggy prog rock album was King Crimson's debut fine they can think what they want. However, the rock based music of the sixties that was not deliberately trippy or psychedelic and had structure and diverse instrumentation was progressive no matter how you want to look at it. One album that hasn't been mentioned yet(although it is on that wikipedia list) is Family's "music in a doll's house." There's mellotron, saxophones and violins on there. Sorry but I can't think of too many psychedelic bands with saxophones. Smile It might not have been prog in the same way as YES and Genesis and maybe it was proto compared to what came later but it was still progressive and progressive plus rock equals progressive rock in my book. Obviously it wasn't the only album to be progressive back then though.


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Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:24
I'm pleased to see  Eric Burdon/Animals' "The Twain Shall Meet" on that Wikipedia timeline.  Quite a progressive album for its time, that doesn't get a lot of attention.  Though it does walk the tightrope between "progress" and "acid-inspired experimental overkill", but that's the price you pay for progress I guess.

I don't know how the heck the Zombies' "She's Not There" single made that list.  Because it has organ?

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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:35
Probably because it has organ, but why didn't this make it?

  Guess she doesn't really  rock. 

^^ Yes, instead of writing the Advancement's self-titled, I should have said sole album to be clearer.  It's pretty obscure -- I discovered the LP selling at a neat collector's site some years ago, and then recommended it for PA inclusion. I actually think that there is a ton of fairly underground/ obscure music that could fit the Prog mold -- and didn't really influence the big names (part of it depends upon whether one considers Prog to be a movement, a genre, or more of  an approach to making music).  Popular enough to have 60 ratings at rateyourmusic, though. Some of the album, especially the longest track I think of as full blown prog; whereas other stuff is more groovy psychadelia (quite an eclectic mix which is what makes it as partiaulr proggy to my ears).  Family's album  is a good call, by the way, meant to mention that one myself.
1969 http://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/the_advancement/the_advancement/" rel="nofollow - The Advancement 3 issues 11 6


Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:38
Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


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Posted By: unclemeat69
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:44
Frank Zappa's albums Weasels Ripped My Flesh (recorded in several sessions during late '60's) en Burnt Weeny Sandwich (recorded around the time of the Hot Rats sessions) should be mentioned too.

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Follow your bliss


Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:55
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.
But they were using an organ... in 1964!  JS Bach wasn't even using an organ in 1964.


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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:56
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink


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Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:00
Odyssey and Oracle is another story. "She's Not There" is waaay before that.

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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:19
Sorry getting off topic, but the electric keyboard in Sun Ra's1956 album Supersonic Jazz gives it a very early JRF feel to me:

[tube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMbC__R24t0[/tube]






Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:25
Originally posted by Prog_Traveller

Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink

I've not heard it, but the previous post was talking about their mid 60s "She's Not There" period (which was listed as the name of their album, which isn't true).  By 1968 we already had a number of "proto-prog" candidates.

Also according to wiki they used a tron because they couldn't afford session musicians.  LOL


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Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:35
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by Prog_Traveller

Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink

I've not heard it, but the previous post was talking about their mid 60s "She's Not There" period (which was listed as the name of their album, which isn't true).  By 1968 we already had a number of "proto-prog" candidates.

Also according to wiki they used a tron because they couldn't afford session musicians.  LOL

Speaking of our beloved mellotron, after seeing the wiki prog list I began wondering when the 1st recorded use of the mellotron occurred.  I always thought it was the flute intro to Strawberry Fields but according to wiki:

British multi-instrumentalist  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graham_Bond" rel="nofollow - Graham Bond  is considered the first rock musician to record with a Mellotron, beginning in 1965. The first hit song to feature a Mellotron MKII was "Baby Can It Be True", and Bond performed live with the machine in televised performances, using  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solenoids" rel="nofollow - solenoids  to trigger the tapes from his  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hammond_organ" rel="nofollow - Hammond organ . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mellotron#cite_note-FOOTNOTEAwde200891-31" rel="nofollow - [31]


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I'm using the chicken to measure it.


Posted By: maani
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 14:37
I am surprised that no on has mentioned the first Vanilla Fudge album (1967), which definitely applied some progressive elements (consciously or otherwise).


Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:10
Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.

However, seriously, when will people come to the realisation that there was no definitive first prog album? Progressive rock evolved from a whole host of influences and artists messing about.

If you have a difficulty with that, compare it to evolution in the animal kingdom. Can anyone state when the first cognitive human lived, where, and what he first said? No. He/she was the result of evolution, which developed over a number of years and different human geno types.

I know it is not the best analogy, but it is the only one I can think of this evening.

The point I am making is that you can point to a number of 1960's albums and say......that sounds like prog! The artists themselves never described it as such, because the phrase was not invented as a specific rock genre until the early 1970's. What the artists did was experiment and evolve. The end product of that was progressive rock.

It will never be possible to define the first prog rock album. Why do we keep on (and on...and on....and on...) trying to do so?



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In Lazland, life is transient. Prog is permanent.


Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:21
Originally posted by lazland

Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.


Speaking of worn to death, we've been over the reason for this about a million times.


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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:43
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by lazland

Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.


Speaking of worn to death, we've been over the reason for this about a million times.

But not as many times as the first prog album.......I have a long way to go with this one yet, especially when I am in the middle of a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile


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In Lazland, life is transient. Prog is permanent.


Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:53
Originally posted by lazland

 a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile

Clap



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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 16:24
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by lazland

 a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile

Clap


There is actually a sad story behind this tonight.

On a Friday evening, I normally travel into Carmarthen (the local town) by bus to meet two friends, where we sit down, have a few pints and a couple of shorts, and generally make the world a better place by sorting it out. Friday is my treat, if you will, after a hard week's work.

However, this morning, there was an awful crash on the local main road. Two people were killed, and my wife and mother in law missed it by a matter of two minutes. Thank God! The road was closed for hours, so no bus into town.

So, this evening, I am sitting down in the sitting room. The family is watching Children In Need (the UK telethon). And I am listening to Rush Live, drinking far too much wine for my own good.

My intentions above, BTW, were not to resurrect the additions debate, but rather to point out the pointlessness of the first prog album debate.

Of course, neither will ever be settled Wink

EDIT. My comment "thank God" probably reads very poorly and disrespectfully. It was not meant to be. A loss of life like that is awful. I am, though, relieved that Glynis and her mother were not caught up in it.


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In Lazland, life is transient. Prog is permanent.


Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 18:02
Originally posted by maani

I am surprised that no on has mentioned the first Vanilla Fudge album (1967), which definitely applied some progressive elements (consciously or otherwise).

Yep.  If Vanilla Fudge had done original material instead of cover after cover, this would be a contender. 


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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 20:44
[Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?]

Nope. That wasn't my intent when I started this thread. What others discuss on here is up to them though but I didn't say to myself "ooh let me start another thread where we can all argue about what the first prog album is." Hey, why don't we instead argue about what the newest prog album is? What prog album was released yesterday? Or today for that matter? Big smile

No, I just wanted to find out what others thought were other contenders for the first prog album besides ITCOTCK or other obvious choices. A lot of people still seem to think "court" was the first but I think a lot of that is because it was pretty well known and did admittedly kick the genre into high gear but that doesn't mean it was the very first. For me at least it's not about arguing but just throwing album titles out there(which was done mostly on the first page).


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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: November 15 2013 at 21:45
The debut album from 'Skin Alley'......


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 02:08
Originally posted by Tom Ozric

The debut album from 'Skin Alley'......


It only qualifies for this thread if it was recorded in the sixties. According to this site and one other it came out in 1970. I don't know when it was actually recorded though.


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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 02:17
Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.

Presumably only mentioned because Rod Argent was involved I guess


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 02:23
Originally posted by richardh

Originally posted by Padraic

Originally posted by verslibre

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.

Presumably only mentioned because Rod Argent was involved I guess


To be fair "Odessey and Oracle" is an album that definitely has elements of prog that was to occur just a little later. Listen to that album before you guys say they weren't prog. If people on here can mention things like Vanilla Fudge and the Electric Prunes then trust me the Zombies can be tossed in that mix too if only for the O&O album. However, even some of their early singles(not so much the ones that were hits)had some minor keys on them and were a bit different from what other bands were doing.


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Posted By: uduwudu
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 03:10
Just to add a little soupcon... while once admiring the Asia Live in Tokyo DVD John Wetton mentioned "something from 1967" before Asia then covered ITCOTCK. I think JW (Family) might've known RF (GG and F) before said RF formed KC. Perhaps (it may be widely known, I only recently leaned) that ITCOTCK might've been in the works since 1967. It doesn't make it the first just the first absolute genre classic. But the notion of the music being writen c. 1967 just underlies the school of thought of structuring experimental rock / classical ideas. A similar one is PF sketching out ASOS apparently "alienating" producer Norman Smith with this radical idea.

Any other radical ideas out there now?

Oh, the Asia thing is not that new, Wetton covered it with Hackett (still no direct involvement with the original) so it's a mere tribute. Unless... he was perhaps peripherally involved way back when.

P.S. As no one can agree as to the first...  what was the second prog rock album? Wink

NP: Miles at the Blackhawk Vol. 1 (great...)




Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 03:49
Originally posted by Prog_Traveller


Originally posted by Tom Ozric

The debut album from 'Skin Alley'......
It only qualifies for this thread if it was recorded in the sixties. According to this site and one other it came out in 1970. I don't know when it was actually recorded though.
Well, several years back I bought the re-issue Akarma vinyl and it states on the back cover P1969 & C2003, so I assumed it was from 1969. It could be like Atomic Rooster's debut and VDGG's 'Least We Can Do...' in that it may have been recorded late '69.


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 14:12
Originally posted by earlyprog

How do you define "prog album"?

Few or none of the albums listed so far are prog from start to finish.

Someone claimed the Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane single is prog while it's only 50% prog at max.

You will find many proto prog albums but not prog albums from the 60's.
 
And I totally agree....many/most of those listed above are not full blown prog imho but proto prog or even psych pop/rock.
 


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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 14:18
Originally posted by lazland

Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.

However, seriously, when will people come to the realisation that there was no definitive first prog album? Progressive rock evolved from a whole host of influences and artists messing about.

If you have a difficulty with that, compare it to evolution in the animal kingdom. Can anyone state when the first cognitive human lived, where, and what he first said? No. He/she was the result of evolution, which developed over a number of years and different human geno types.

I know it is not the best analogy, but it is the only one I can think of this evening.

The point I am making is that you can point to a number of 1960's albums and say......that sounds like prog! The artists themselves never described it as such, because the phrase was not invented as a specific rock genre until the early 1970's. What the artists did was experiment and evolve. The end product of that was progressive rock.

It will never be possible to define the first prog rock album. Why do we keep on (and on...and on....and on...) trying to do so?

 
Sounds about right......it's next to impossible to say which was first since it's subjective and many bands were doing similar things at the same time.
I started a 'your favorite proto prog album' thread about 6 months ago and it soon moved into an argument about what is proto prog vs real prog and which albums are really proto prog.
Confused


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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 16:56
Originally posted by dr wu23

Originally posted by earlyprog

How do you define "prog album"?

Few or none of the albums listed so far are prog from start to finish.

Someone claimed the Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane single is prog while it's only 50% prog at max.

You will find many proto prog albums but not prog albums from the 60's.
 
And I totally agree....many/most of those listed above are not full blown prog imho but proto prog or even psych pop/rock.
 


Ok, now you're the second person to make this kind of statement without telling us what albums mentioned so far(or not listed for that matter)you consider to be "full blown prog." Please don't leave us in suspense. Smile


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Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 18:19
You know those albums are nice and everything.  I enjoy them occasionally.  I much prefer to live in and enjoy the present. 


Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: November 16 2013 at 19:10
Past Is A Different Country I Don't Live There Anymore

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Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 17 2013 at 00:36
Everything turns into the past by the time it gets to you anyway though. It's all in the past unless it's an album you are currently recording at this very second. :D

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Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: November 17 2013 at 03:04
Originally posted by Slartibartfast

Past Is A Different Country I Don't Live There Anymore
Tell it to Ritchie Blackmore LOL


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Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half.


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: November 17 2013 at 10:58
Originally posted by Prog_Traveller

Originally posted by dr wu23

Originally posted by earlyprog

How do you define "prog album"?

Few or none of the albums listed so far are prog from start to finish.

Someone claimed the Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane single is prog while it's only 50% prog at max.

You will find many proto prog albums but not prog albums from the 60's.
 
And I totally agree....many/most of those listed above are not full blown prog imho but proto prog or even psych pop/rock.
 


Ok, now you're the second person to make this kind of statement without telling us what albums mentioned so far(or not listed for that matter)you consider to be "full blown prog." Please don't leave us in suspense. Smile
Pick any of the ones listed above......
Wink


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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 20 2013 at 10:58
There's a lot listed above. Most listed you seem to think aren't prog. Now I'm confused. Confused

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Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: November 20 2013 at 11:09
Originally posted by Prog_Traveller

There's a lot listed above. Most listed you seem to think aren't prog. Now I'm confused. Confused
I didn't notice/pay attention to Logan's list above (my mistake).....but yeah based on that list he provided most of the albums were not full blown prog imo , but obviously some of the things in  68 and in 69 qualify as early prog. Yes and KC were  certainly prog and to me Procol's Shine had a lot of proggy things going on and The Moodies have always been named as early prog also,  though to me much of it is simply not very proggy by later standards.
But yeah.....there were definitely some 'proggy' albums in those early days.


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Et In Arcadia Ego


Posted By: progbethyname
Date Posted: November 21 2013 at 13:49
1969's best album for me. IN THE COURT OF THE CRIMSON KING.
Floyd's debute was awesome too!! That was 68!! Sounds like it came out in 78! Way ahead of its time. Both albums really.

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Belhold the power and gift of BEARD! As Damian Wilson sports a beard now his voice somehow got even better than it already was. :)


Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 21 2013 at 15:33
Originally posted by progbethyname

1969's best album for me. IN THE COURT OF THE CRIMSON KING.
Floyd's debute was awesome too!! That was 68!! Sounds like it came out in 78! Way ahead of its time. Both albums really.

tbh from that year  I would rather listen to The Nice especially the track For Example. 
In The Court though was more polished , more focused and had better artwork. Fripp was no mug.


Posted By: Prog_Traveller
Date Posted: November 24 2013 at 19:31
Actually Pink Floyd's debut was in 1967 not 68. Saucerful of secrets(their second album)was from 1968 and imo is both prog and psych at the same time. That is to say it has elements of both.

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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: November 25 2013 at 01:44
Chicago debut album 'Chicago Transit Authority' shouldn't be ignored either although it does require a looser definition of prog to be applied perhaps.



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