The eclecticism can be heard in albums ranging from "The Sky Moves Sideways" to "Lightbulb Sun" to "Deadwing" to "The Incident".

 

Reminds me of the progression of Crimson from "In the Court...." to "Islands" to "Larks' Tongues...." to "Red" to "Discipline" to "Thrak".

Fear of a Blank Planet?

I suppose so but I get the feeling the style was shifting towards 'eclectic'. I guess you are right though.

 

The need to categorize is real. If for no other reason than to have a reference point of some kind for the audience to use when searching for music they enjoy or would like to get to know better or explore for the first time.

 

I think a solution would be to have two different categories: one for the artist as a singular entity, the other, for each of the artists individual albums.

 

So, KC remain Eclectic Prog as a group.

"In the Court...." becomes Symphonic Prog.

"Thrak" becomes Heavy Prog.

And so on.......

 

 

As I posted in another thread...

"You can find the progressive rock music discographies from 8,329 bands & artists, 42,079 albums (LP, CD and DVD)"

 

imho, Eclectic Prog would cover PT's catalog much more descriptively than Heavy Prog does.

 

Point well taken. I certainly do not expect the PA mods to slog through 42,079 albums to categorize each one....just throwing ideas around for discussions sake.......

I think the problem is the description that the term implies, which people take to mean a sound effect that makes it sound heavier and all it is is "lower" and amplified with more noise, and you call it "heavy" and it is not even worth the effort if you put it to a scale.

 

If "heavy" meant "meaningful", then I would say that PT fits, and REALLY well!

 

But I doubt that today's audiences know or understand the difference. There is way too much stuff out there that is totally weightless and is being hord'd around as "heavy" and all it is, is noisy! Might be heavy as in fat, but that would be a terrible description of a music sub-genre!

 

While I happen to like the Dream Theater work in general, they can be heavy musically, but lyrically they have a tendency to leave a lot to be desired and in fact I would say they are quite light in that area. But the mix works ok for them, and I won't argue it either way. Just a feeling!

 

It's not like the "heavyness" in the old days, meant that BERNARD HERRMAN knew how to scare the living sh*t out of you when something big happened on the screen that we could not possibly imagine, and that intentional "strength" and "attack" as it is known nowadays in a synthesizer context, had a way to really shake up your ideas and vision, and it helped make the film more attractive, and in many ways it WAS THE WAVE OF THE FUTURE, unlike the more insipid classical music that was coming around. Right after it came rock music with its innovative expression and forceful emotion, and that was that ... so for the record, Janis Joplin singing "Ball and Chain" is way heavier than 95 of the 100 examples you can write here as "heavy" ... but you will never hear that, will you?

 

Your posts is really on topic!

A little off topic but yes. Horrible lyrics.

I wouldn't go so far as to say their last four albums define heavy prog, but this is essentially correct   I prefer earlier stuf, myself.

They have a lot of prog elements, they have metal elements, pop, hard rock, alternative, eclectic, symphonic and psychadelia and probably others.

 

They make great music.

Jose, you are just about the wisest man on this site.

THIS

 

I learned that from someone named lazland.....

Cheers mate. Actually, I really must start listening to this lot again, it has been an age, mainly due to the fact that I found, and still do, The Incident extraordinarily dull and derivative.

That should not take away from the fact that they are one of the most important bands in modern prog.

I think Lazurus will be my final song before bed. I absolutely adore that song.

 

I agree about Deadwing, its one of my fav PT albums and that song is almost perfect. The Incident is not my fav but I do enjoy it. I hope they come out of hiatus soon, I know SW is working on another solo album probably for late 2014 release, so maybe 2015 PT return.

 

One can only hope.

Indeed. It would be a great shame if his solo output and his remastering work became all he does, because the band environment brought out the best in him.

 

Well I am selfish...'cause his remix work is the best work being done right now, and since he is such a vinyl/analog lover it really shows in the vinyl versions of the work he does....so I am happy.

 

But yes, I could put my selfishness away and hope for a PT return

 

may I suggest Wizeland, gives laz a "country" to rule!

 

Nice!

Same here. But there are several great pieces in "The Incident" as well, and I think that we're being way too critical. But I am coming to think that "The Incident" might have been better as a solo album for Steven Wilson than a group album, by all the reverie and discussion.

 

You know what? I like PT better than the solo stuff Steven is doing! How's that for weird? I find Steven's stuff glorified and too self-centered for my tastes.

heavy prog...? it is to me......

Steve Wilson solo music tops it all off though. 3 solid gold masterpeices in a row. I think PT is all but done and dusted.

I think you are right. PT would appear to be gone forever.

I got the first SW solo album, and thought it a good one, but nothing special (I haven't listened to it in an age). Haven't bothered with the other two. Knowing my tastes, would I be more impressed with the last two?

Good enough for me, Scott

I will be getting Transatlantic and Oldfield new ones at the end of the week, so The Raven will go on my February payday list.

I regard In Absentia and Deadwing as the bands peak and both masterpeices. FOABP and The Incident are merely 'excellent' so my feeling is that SW was in danger of stagnation creatively even if the standard had not noticeably dropped all that much. I think SW needed to move outside that and work with a different bunch of musicians who could offer a new challenge. It worked perfectly imo. My only worry is the Marco is no longer part of this group. As a drummer he is one of the best I've heard in recent years.

Anathema are a band I like a lot and I'm a bit suprised they are not as highly regarded as Riverside and PT.

 

I think Raven is a masterpiece.....its dark, its melodic, it jams hard in many places. Think of Marillion with some real hard jazz-fusion portions, I have a feeling you will like it.

Definitely on the list!

Yep I've got all PT from Up The Downstair onwards. I probably don't pay enough attention to Lightbulb Sun. Russia on Ice , yep I have that on my I-pod as part of a small selection of PT songs. Signify is an interesting album to me as it contains a lot of diversity and different ideas.

A Porcupine Tree is a large plant that bears spiny fruit.

Accordingly, PA should immediately add new categories to accommodate plants, animals, and things we're not really sure about.

Curiously, most prog fits in the latter category.

I certainly would not call them neo prog. Theirs is a sound which diverges greatly from that created by Marillion, IQ, etc. 

They're just as eclectic as KC are. The Sky Moves Sideways is utterly different to Deadwing. Deadwing is utterly different to Stupid Dream. 

If you have to slap a label on them , eclectic prog would fit best, i think . 

I guess the only solution is to accept that whatever category they are put in won't feel right to some people, unless this site shifts over to MMA/JMA's format - and that'd be such a big project I won't count on it happening any time soon.

Metal is the least of PT and SW's musical influences IMHO. Far more electronica, space rock, etc. Maybe my memory is failing me on some obvious tracks though...