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Bad albums made to fulfill contractual obligation
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Jaketejas View Drop Down
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Points: 2189 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 20:04
I’ve listened to it. The album cover is certainly very much like The Bee Gees. The music isn’t bad per se, but my understanding is that Keith Emerson was kind of left alone on the island to complete it and so it sounds more like his explorations rather than an ELP band album. I actually think it is sad when a band is left to slog it through final albums when the joy of creativity is waning and it is essentially a music business money grab. My understanding is that The Police had a terrible time completing Synchronicity. It’s a great album but many times these final contractual albums result in terrible experiences and burnt bridges for artists as the industry grinds on to get their pound of flesh. In many cases, you can just hear that something is off. The Camel story (good documentary on that) mentioned earlier is a good example. It was nice to see them get together much later on to do some blues songs and do some healing.
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Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Love Beach is pretty bad following only 4 years on from Brain Salad Surgery. Terrible keyboard sounds and half baked half finished compositions. For You is a decent Lake/Sinfield song and that's pretty much as good as it gets. In The Hot Seat was a disaster with Emerson and Palmer both recovering from operations to their hands for carpal tunnel syndrome. Victory Music went under shortly after as the album bombed. ELP got back up and touring a few years later but never played a single track off that album at any point. That is telling as it gets. In fact as a combo they never played any track off Love Beach either although Carl Palmer did resurrect Canario for his own band.
While Love Beach has received excessive criticism over the years, it deserves reevaluation based on its musical composition, lyrical content, historical context, and evolution of the ELP sound. Fans should approach it open-mindedly, rather than dismissing the album only based on less engaging forum discussions lacking substantive arguments. They will certainly appreciate its unique contributions to ELP's body of work.
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Na Brzegu Światła by Budka Suflera can be considered as such. It was made with the sole intention of promoting the 1980 Olympic Games in USSR. The album's artistic and musical direction was under full control by the (state-funded) label.
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richardh View Drop Down
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Points: 30055 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 16:27
Love Beach is pretty bad following only 4 years on from Brain Salad Surgery. Terrible keyboard sounds and half baked half finished compositions. For You is a decent Lake/Sinfield song and that's pretty much as good as it gets. In The Hot Seat was a disaster with Emerson and Palmer both recovering from operations to their hands for carpal tunnel syndrome. Victory Music went under shortly after as the album bombed. ELP got back up and touring a few years later but never played a single track off that album at any point. That is telling as it gets. In fact as a combo they never played any track off Love Beach either although Carl Palmer did resurrect Canario for his own band.
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richardh View Drop Down
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Points: 30055 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 16:15
^ aimed specifically at Richard Branson indeed.
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Points: 17459 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Finnforest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 14:03
Wasn't Amarok kind of a F-you/middle finger to Mike's record company?
...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell"
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Points: 3140 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MortSahlFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 13:53
Pink Floyd's "The Wall" was the last great album. But, carry on if you think it's "filler".
https://www.youtube.com/c/LoyalOpposition

https://www.scribd.com/document/382737647/MortSahlFan-Song-List
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Points: 2189 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 13:03
I knew someone was going to say Love Beach.

I think Triumph’s Surveillance was put together a bit piecemeal as they were headed for a split, but it has a couple of good songs on it and even a little dueling Steve Morse and Rik Emmett on guitars. Still not as solid as most prior albums (Allied Forces, Thunder Seven, Never Surrender, Just a Game, or Rock ‘n Roll Machine) but better than Sport of Kings and Progressions of Power … IMHO.
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FM - City of Fear was not a obligation lp. Sorry, I digressed there.

.......

ELP had contractual obligation lps???
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Points: 11684 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mellotronwave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 12:42
Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

The Sicilian Defence by Alan Parsons Project is another example.


Ok for a thematic Chess game sisiclian defense

1.e4 c5 (thematic answer leading to the Sicilian defense)
2. White to play
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Points: 2091 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Floydoid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 12:41
Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Originally posted by Criswell Criswell wrote:

stinker
True prog connoisseurs' favorite old-timey word apparently.


There was a time that such albums would be labelled as turkeys, as stinkers of movies often are.
"Christ, where would rock & roll be without feedback?" - D. Gimour
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Points: 9168 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kenethlevine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 12:10
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Michael Oldfield - Heaven's Open Thumbs Down

not great but title track is awesome, one of Oldfield's many fine pop songs 
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Originally posted by DoobieBrother6 DoobieBrother6 wrote:

Agree on "Love Beach".

This gets trashed and parroted about all the forums but its a fine lp.


Also:
FM City of Fear
Gentle Giant Civilian


Nothing the matter with these.

I actually really like City of Fear.  It's uneven but I love the dark, paranoid, claustrophobic feel to it, and the opening track "Krakow" gets into my bones.  I didn't know it was a contractual obligation album.  It's better than "Surveillance" to me


Edited by kenethlevine - February 06 2025 at 12:09
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mellotronwave View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Valdez Valdez wrote:

King Crimsons "Earthbound"...  Theres a good story behind that one. Recorded on a cassette player outdoors IIRC.  Although I wouldn't call it a BAD album.  But it does sound like a bootleg and features Boz Burrell on Vocals.  Best version of Schizoid man IMO. Too bad it wasn't recorded nicely.


... i agree this is just a "bootleg quality LP"
nevertheless the Schizoid version is a great track
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mellotronwave View Drop Down
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Points: 11684 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mellotronwave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 11:01
Lou Reed's Metal Music Machine is emblematic
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Hrychu View Drop Down
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Points: 5877 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hrychu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2025 at 10:57
Originally posted by Criswell Criswell wrote:

stinker
True prog connoisseurs' favorite old-timey word apparently.
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Logan View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Criswell Criswell wrote:

Originally posted by Hosydi Hosydi wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Love Beach?
Love Beach is not a bad ELP album at all, despite its Bee Gees-style sleeve design. On the contrary, it offers a compelling prog rock characterized by musical diversity and intricate compositions.


Concur...if you want a REAL ELP stinker, try sitting through "In the Hot Seat"...Ugh!


I'm not even an ELP fan but was feeling masochistic and did listen to In the Hot Seat; horrible.
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Criswell View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Hosydi Hosydi wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Love Beach?
Love Beach is not a bad ELP album at all, despite its Bee Gees-style sleeve design. On the contrary, it offers a compelling prog rock characterized by musical diversity and intricate compositions.

Concur...if you want a REAL ELP stinker, try sitting through "In the Hot Seat"...Ugh!
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Agree on "Love Beach".

This gets trashed and parroted about all the forums but its a fine lp.


Also:
FM City of Fear
Gentle Giant Civilian


Nothing the matter with these.
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moshkito View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Love Beach?

Originally posted by DoobieBrother6 DoobieBrother6 wrote:

... horrid
almost as much filler as Floyd's "The Wall"


I think of filler as a deliberate attempt to make an album longer despite knowing that the music does not add significant value. I would posit that what some call filler is actually mortar for The Wall. Some of what I have seen called filler I do believe helps with the atmosphere of the album and acts as useful bridges. I think that The Wall is a great concept album and some of what I have seen called filler works with other tracks as some of my fave favourite sections of the album.

That said, if the band states that there is filler (just to make the album a full double-album) then I won't disagree with them.

Hi,

What is strange is that THE FINAL CUT has stuff that was originally in THE WALL and was cut out because THE WALL was too long. It was only visible in the previews of THE WALL, that had one show in the Bay Area that we caught ... it was very good, but also over 2 hours which nowadays is too long for the pop-laden folks that can't handle longer material ... pretty soon we gonna say that WAR AND PEACE and MOBY DICK have so much filler that it makes the novels boring! Or that David Lean's well known long shot is a waste of celluloid, for someone that has no appreciation for the art form ... generally speaking!

If so many folks, here, were not onto the pop-rock thing, and more into "progressive" and "innovative" works, I would not accept such a thing ... and I'm not sure what the big deal is with musicians wanting to expand beyond the 3 and 4 minute barrier to create works that are more "novelistic" than just a pop song ... if pop song you want, please go back to the polka dot bikini days, and not post about progressive music?

THE WALL is not a bad album, and in essence neither are any of the PF albums ... but some folks don't like it an they think they have the right to say so ... good thing they are not the artist, or musician, because folks like these would not last 3 days!


Edited by moshkito - February 06 2025 at 05:58
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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