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ExittheLemming 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
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 Posted: January 13 2011 at 22:49 |
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Genesis overrated? It's certainly not a patch on the Book of Revelation for body count.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: January 13 2011 at 22:42 |
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Pile up Phil's progressive works next to his commercial stuff and the first is taller that his latter.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Nov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 28 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 523
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Posted: January 13 2011 at 18:52 |
 thehallway wrote:
But Phil Collins was certainly a bit of an arrogant t**t  when it comes to things like 'inventing one of the most famous yet easy drum fills in music history'..... |
I've never heard Phil say anything of the sort. He came across that drum sound whilst playing on PG3 and then came up with one of the most classic moments in pop history on his first solo album. He's never blown his own trumpet about it though
| or 'playing at both San Fransisco and London during Live Aid'..... |
 Firstly, it was Philadelphia and secondly Phil was just helping out wherever he could on the day. Baring in mind that at the time he was one of the biggest music stars in the world, I think that was pretty damn good of him.
| If he was more democratic in Genesis then I respect that. |
Of course he was because that was a group. He didn't need to be democratic with his solo career  You just seem to have it in for poor old Phil.............
Edited by Nov - January 13 2011 at 18:53
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CloseToTheMoon
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 28 2010
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 223
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Posted: January 13 2011 at 14:51 |
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With everyone I've ever met in the age group to have listened to them in their prime, they are not considered a serious "classic rock" band. I never hear them on the radio (the good stuff anyway). Even when clothing stores started selling vintage inspired concert shirts ironically, I never once saw a Genesis speck of merchandise.
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It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: January 13 2011 at 12:19 |
michellemjk wrote:
In other words, not much challenge. I like challenging music. 
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On the other hand, unless you are an avant partisan or maybe even then, Genesis is highly challenging music. It is sad that a band's efforts to make the difficult appear simple and easily assimilable get them the un-challenging tag. I do remember how somebody called Gentle Giant simple, which was stranger still.
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michellemjk
Forum Groupie
Joined: October 05 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 81
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Posted: January 13 2011 at 10:10 |
I'm not a big fan although I play them regularly. Ironically, their songs have everything I can enjoy instantly. Sometimes I feel they are too perfectly good. They don't require my effort to get to like them. In other words, not much challenge. I like challenging music.
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freitagg
Forum Newbie
Joined: January 12 2011
Location: Turkey
Status: Offline
Points: 2
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Posted: January 12 2011 at 14:44 |
is this a joke 
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twostikks
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 10 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 36
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Posted: January 12 2011 at 01:29 |
Man, I'm really late to the party, but gee, sarge ... your inquiry, as a few people here have already pointed out, really does come off as somewhat confrontational, maybe even a bit condescending -- but clearly provocative. Of course, the big question (and a few have asked): what DO you like?? You've indicated you're a big Beatles fan ("underrated"), so, what is it about the Beatles that you like?
Shedding a little light on what you actually like (and WHY, if you know) would be a no-brainer, if you're really looking for why you DON'T like Genesis (although, as other's here have said; if you don't like 'em, don't listen to 'em).
As for Collin's drumming: I LOVE his HH work, and his drumming style in general. He handles different time signatures brilliantly (especially 11/8, 7/8 in "Nuclear Burn" by Brand X), and is also all over the map on the Gabriel-era Genesis. If you see the Belgium TV videos, he's blowing whistles and handling the backing vocals, as well as cooking on the kit. Collins was a HUGE fan of Keith Moon, too -- another brilliant drummer (a little sloppy, but brilliant just as well).
Of course, that's just me. What is it you're looking for in a drummer, or Prog in general?
Peace.
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Gary
"... people will always be tempted to wipe their feet on anything with WELCOME written on it"
Andy Partridge
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himtroy
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 20 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1601
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 21:54 |
I don't really like them either. I thought it was going to be a situation like Yes was for me. I'd heard all the poppy Yes and was never a big fan (nor did I think Fragile was all it was cracked up to be), but then I heard Close to the Edge and saw where people were coming from. (Yes still isn't my favorite, but that is a damn good album certainly). I'd heard Genesis and not cared about them much and thought that Selling England by the Pound would change my mind. It really didn't. I got really bored listening to it and I still don't see the fascination with Genesis. I don't understand why people blow the musicianship out of the water either, it's good but I feel like it's not crazy in prog standards. (Musicianship isn't what makes good music I know, but it's so frequently praised for Genesis that I don't get it). *General Disclaimer Time*- Thats how I feel about it, I am not nor am I intending to pass this off as fact or substantial evidence, it is simply an opinion.
Edited by himtroy - January 11 2011 at 21:58
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Which of you to gain me, tell, will risk uncertain pains of hell?
I will not forgive you if you will not take the chance.
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ferush
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 26 2006
Location: Mexico
Status: Offline
Points: 363
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 18:57 |
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Genesis is not overrated, they are one of the all time top bands.
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KyleSchmidlin
Forum Newbie
Joined: December 21 2009
Location: Texas, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 22
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:55 |
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I'd say maybe you need to be in the right place at the right time for Genesis. I worked at a CD store and one day a customer brought in Foxtrot, Selling England, and Lamb, and I bought all three for under ten bucks. However, I didn't like them until quite a bit later. Foxtrot was the first one to break through. And honestly, I'm not wild about 1/3 or so of Selling England and am wild about maybe even less than that of Lamb. But Foxtrot (and now, Nursery Cryme) excite me to know end. And honestly, in the case of Foxtrot in particular, drugs helped. Sorry if that sounds blunt, but being high and hearing that soaring "Yooooooooooooou.... can't you see he's fooled you all?" in "Supper's Ready" was enough to bring me literally to my knees. I don't have a hard time understanding why a person might not like Genesis, but I don't think you've got any right to dismiss them until you've given them a chance. Have you listened to "A Trick of the Tail"? Maybe "Los Endos" will convert you (that's one of my favorites of theirs, along with that album's title track). The appeal, for me at least, lies in Gabriel's - and, to a big extent, Hackett's - ability to engage the listener emotionally, a trait typically overlooked, actively ignored, or, worse, frowned upon in so much prog music.
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soundchaser5
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 02 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 3
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:48 |
You're saying Supper's Ready is no biggy. That's like saying Muhamed Ali isn't a legend. As Classic Rock Magazine says, with Supper's Ready Genesis unleashed a genuinely brilliant musical beast whose effects on the prog genre would be felt for decades. Where the Omen meets the hall. Electrifying guitar coda, jazzy time signatures, beautiful melodies, and classical disipline. Magic on a disc. Anyway, The question was. Is Genesis overated? They are 1,000,000% underrated. And here is why. MAD MAN MOON, CAN UTILITY AND THE COASTLINERS, THE FOUNTAIN OF SALMACIS, MAN OF OUR TIMES, THE MUSICAL BOX, SQUONK, STAGNATION, SUPPER'S READY, DOWN AND OUT, RIPPLES, SNOWBOUND, FIRTH OF FIFTH, THE KNIFE, THE RETURN OF THE GIANT HOGWEED, VISIONS OF ANGELS, RIDING THE SCREE, DUKE'S TRAVELS/ DUKE'S END, UNDERTOW, LOS ENDOS, THE LAMB LIES DOWN ON BROADWAY, THE CINEMA SHOW, ONE FOR THE VINE, LIKE IT OR NOT, CUL-DE-SAC, THE LADY LIES, DANCE ON A VOLCANO, LOOKING FOR SOMEONE, WATCHER OF THE SKIES, DANCING WITH THE MOONLIT KNIGHT, CASE CLOSEDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
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soundchaser5
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 02 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 3
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:45 |
You're saying Supper's Ready is no biggy. That's like saying Muhamed Ali isn't a legend. As classic Magazine says, with Supper's Ready Genesis unleashed a genuinely brilliant musical beast whose effects on the prog genre would be felt for decades. Where the Omen meets the hall. Electrifying guitar coda, jazzy time signatures, beautiful melodies, and classical disipline. Magic on a disc. Anyway, The question was. Is Genesis overated? They are 1,000,000% underrated. And here is why. MAD MAN MOON, CAN UTILITY AND THE COASTLINERS, THE FOUNTAIN OF SALMACIS, MAN OF OUR TIMES, THE MUSICAL BOX, SQUONK, STAGNATION, SUPPER'S READY, DOWN AND OUT, RIPPLES, SNOWBOUND, FIRTH OF FIFTH, THE KNIFE, THE RETURN OF THE GIANT HOGWEED, VISIONS OF ANGELS, RIDING THE SCREE, DUKE'S TRAVELS/ DUKE'S END, UNDERTOW, LOS ENDOS, THE LAMB LIES DOWN ON BROADWAY, THE CINEMA SHOW, ONE FOR THE VINE, LIKE IT OR NOT, CUL-DE-SAC, THE LADY LIES, DANCE ON A VOLCANO, LOOKING FOR SOMEONE, WATCHER OF THE SKIES, DANCING WITH THE MOONLIT KNIGHT, CASE CLOSEDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
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Gentlegiantprog
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 31 2008
Location: Stafford
Status: Offline
Points: 238
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:22 |
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I am the only Genesis fan I know or indeed have ever known in real life.
I'd say they are underrated if anything.
If it wasn't for the internet I'd assume not one human being on earth liked them
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Let the maps of war be drawn !
http://kingcrimsonprog.wordpress.com/
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sharethemusic
Forum Newbie
Joined: October 22 2010
Location: miami
Status: Offline
Points: 3
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 14:00 |
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bottom line...opinion is opinion.....however...fact is fact..fact is the more you post your opinion the more factual becomes your utter patheticness(not a word....case closed
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soundchaser5
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 02 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 3
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 13:44 |
Your comments are nonsense. Other than YES from 1971 to 1979, Genesis from 1970-1980 is the best ever. You sound like someone who never saw them in concert. Either way, Suppers Ready is revolutionary, One of the greatest epics ever! Have you ever listened to The Fountain of Salmacis or The Musical box from Nursery Cryme?Los Endos or Dance on a Volcano from A trick of the tail. Some of the best drumming ever is on that album. The Album that you say is no good, Selling England by the pound, was voted #1 progressive album ever. In fact Genesis has 3 or 4 albums in the top 10, and that includes Foxtrot. They say the reason Foxtrot is in the top 10, 2 words. SUPPER'S READY. Have you watched any concert footage from the 1970's on youtube. 1977 has maybe the greatest lightshow and music ever. In 1977 I saw them in concert with some people that didn't want to go. 34 years later they are still thanking me. The comments were, other than YES, these guys are the best ever! Everyone is a backup band compared to these guys. Tony banks is as good as rick Wakeman.
Go to youtube and listen to Phish's Trey Anastasio's speech from the induction of Genesis to the Rock and Roll hall of fame. As he says "there are so many people that i'm speaking for tonight that know exactly what i'm talking about."
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AllP0werToSlaves
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 29 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 249
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 12:09 |
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I can see where you are coming from Friso; I felt sometimes production wise things were a bit iffy but I can't really complain, the music is the focus. If I could only choose one Genesis album to listen to, "Selling England By The Pound" is without a doubt my top choice.
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friso
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 24 2007
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 2506
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 11:00 |
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I also happen to think Genesis is bit overrated. The recording quality of almost all their albums is below average, the drums of Collins often sound amateurish on many albums and the cheesiness/romantic vibe of any album after Foxtrot can be annoying.
Still they are one of the better progressive rock bands and above all important pioneers. I must admit I think they made some very qualitative masterpieces (albeit with their flaws).
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Norman Kiddie
Forum Groupie
Joined: February 16 2009
Location: Stuttgart
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Points: 81
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 10:36 |
 Having grown up with Genesis I remember being as proud as punch when buying my brand new copy of their
newly released Selling England by The Pound. Today, some thirty seven years later I still enjoy its wonderful moments like Firth Of Fifth. Be it the piano introduction or the amazing guitar finale that always made my hair stand on end. Maybe you need to turn up the volume a bit.
The Cinema Show is another classic especially when Phil Collins erupts into that offbeat jam sequence towards the end. I have seen all of the so called top drummers and have seen Collins with both Genesis and Brand X.
He was (has had to retire due to back problems) one of the very best.
Still, I donīt care much for a lot of King Crimson. I have always found them totally overrated. But that is a different forum. If we are honest we need to be listening to what we like best.
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hobocamp
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 17 2010
Location: Fine Furniture
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Points: 525
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Posted: January 11 2011 at 08:04 |
pied piper wrote:
Please don't forget that Genesis INVENTED prog.
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Genesis overrated?
