/PAlogo_v2.gif "Progarchives.com Homepage")
|
Never Mind the Bollocks..... |
Post Reply 
|
Page 123 7> |
| Author | ||
David_D 
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote Reply
 Topic: Never Mind the Bollocks.....Posted: December 22 2023 at 14:13 |
|
|
Anyway, Never Mind is probably the most significant album of the Punk genre.
|
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
 |
||
|
Hugh Manatee
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 07 2021 Location: The Barricades Status: Offline Points: 1587 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 21 2023 at 20:04 |
|
|
Well, it seems in the end that Punk is as hard to define and classify as prog (or any other media allotted category for that matter).
For my part, the one distinctive feature of Punk (unlike any other music genre, in particular prog) is its seeming disregard for production values. There is an air of immediacy that strives to give the music "authenticity"; a DIY ethic particularly suggested by the "Never Mind the Bollocks..." artwork, even though the album was hardly as home-made as it would have you believe. "Ever feel like you've been cheated?" Edited by Hugh Manatee - December 26 2023 at 19:44 |
||
|
I should have been a pair of ragged claws
Scuttling across the floors of uncertain seas |
||
|
||
|
Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group 
RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21638 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 19 2023 at 10:48 |
|
|
I agree with your assessment
|
||
|
Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
||
|
||
|
siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15454 |
Post Options
Thanks(1)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 19 2023 at 10:29 |
|
I just did a huge extensive list of proto-punk on RYM and have gotten into the nooks and crannies of punk big time in the last few years. My conclusion is that there isn't really any first punk rock album. The Stooges, Ramones, New York Dolls, Suzi Quatro, Zolar X, Hollywood Brats, The Dogs, The Suicide Commandos, Richard Hell, early BLondie, The Gizmos, Thundertrain, Death, Berlin Brats, Nervous Eaters etc all came before the Sex Pistols and released material that is now considered fully developed punk rock. I think what Bullocks achieved was some sort of official announcement of punk becoming a dominant force. It also unapologetically introduced the concept of anarchy to punk as well therefore many consider the album the beginning of a mainstream movement but not really the first punk album proper. It's the same thing with every major musical genre. There is never any total agreement on these things but what i just laid out is how i see it ;) (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'8381569e2e2b158f',t:'MTcwMzAwNjY1OC4zODcwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
|
||
 https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
||
|
||
|
richardh
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 30320 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 19 2023 at 10:26 |
|
|
They were just more in your face and very snarly. I always hated stuff like The Ramones personally. They were sort of old style rock n roll but amped up a bit more. That's fine but not very interesting to me. The Pistols were something else entirely and probably even some influence on metal bands like Motorhead.
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 19 2023 at 10:07 |
|
|
About the early American, pre-British Punk, I think it's a good question whether to consider it as a full-blown Punk or only proto-Punk, and then Sex Pistols as the first Punk band proper - which makes Never Mind the first full-blown Punk album? Edited by David_D - December 19 2023 at 10:24 |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 19 2023 at 05:48 |
|
|
I was not much for Punk when it came in Britain, but I bought Never Mind somewhere in the first half of the '80s, when it was on sale and I had got a bit more into the genre. I've listened to it a lot of times since, even there've been also many years when I didn't. Today....yeah, you know. Edited by David_D - December 19 2023 at 06:45 |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
TheLionOfPrague
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 08 2011 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 1091 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 21:54 |
|
|
I really enjoy this album.
Holiday in the Sun, Problems and No Feelings are my favorites.
|
||
|
I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place
|
||
|
||
|
Hrychu
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 03 2013 Location: poland? Status: Offline Points: 6007 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 15:56 |
|
|
I unironically enjoy American Idiot by Green Day. It's not really punk, but more like alternative rock with punk overtones. But it's very well made and has incredibly catchy hooks scattered all over the album. My fave track is Homecoming. The "medley"-ish way, in which it is structured reminds me of some prog epics. Really.
|
||
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 15:53 |
|
Yeah, it didn't last long and ended before they started releasing albums - and I wouldn't really say, it was Punk even by the early American terms. Edited by David_D - December 16 2023 at 16:24 |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
Psychedelic Paul
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 16 2019 Location: Nottingham, U.K Status: Offline Points: 45306 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 14:47 |
|
|
The only punk band I ever liked were Blondie, although by the time I started buying their albums, they were no longer a punk band.
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 14:40 |
|
|
It looks to me that the early American, West Coast Punk was more constructive than the British one, even there were also some left-wing British punks in the '70s.
|
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 16 2023 at 04:47 |
|
 even I find it nihilistic too.Edited by David_D - December 16 2023 at 05:14 |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15454 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 19:27 |
|
|
I just listened to the Sex Pistols one and only album today. It really was the perfect punk album for 1977. For my liking it's a perfect 5 star punk masterpiece. Love the vocals, love the attitude, the F.u.c.k. it all lyrical content. Classic! S(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'83637a899c6915ff',t:'MTcwMjY5MzU1Ni44MDgwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'83637cabac591583',t:'MTcwMjY5MzY0NC4xODIwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
|
||
|
https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
||
|
||
|
Intruder
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 13 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2211 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 18:56 |
|
|
Hustle and hype.....noise, man - never mind the music, it's bollocks! Loved a lot of the different offshoots of "punk" music, but that album and the short shockwave of Pistolmania.....just don't get it. Lydon's PiL, on the other hand......the only good thing to come of the whole Pistols thing was Johnny Rotten being able to easily get a record deal and cut those groovy early PiL LPs.
|
||
|
I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
|
||
|
||
|
siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15454 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 17:48 |
|
|
^ didn't say it wasn't a real movement. I'm saying it was a manufactured movement and many took the bait. There were much better expressions of alternative rock occurring in the 90s. Grunge was basically for the hipsters who loved pop but needed it dressed up in angst. It was really just a different face of the glam metal scene but in a filthy lumberjack sorta fashion statement way. Ther(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'8362e8f9ac081568',t:'MTcwMjY4NzU5NC42MTMwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'8362eb7a3e00239e',t:'MTcwMjY4NzY5Ny4xMTUwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
|
||
|
https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 12:49 |
|
Okay, so you don't find the post-1990 Grunge to be a genuine movement, but that's then not how I see it, even I find it of course to be promoted and partly shaped by the music industry. |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15454 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 10:38 |
|
Grunge has never been my favorite style of music simply because for the most part it is nothing more than a splintering off from pop punk. Bands like Alice In Chains and Soundgarden are my favorite since they were a hybrid of metal and alternative rock. My point was that grunge was a concoction of the music industry and the last major marketing campaign before the whole NAPSTER thing decentralized the music industry. Everything changed around the year 2000 and it no musical style has really been a dominate force ever since. Billboard charts are utterly irrelevant these days and really there is no unifying musical force like there was with grunge. True grunge started in the mid-80s with bands like Green River, Skin Yard and U-Men. With the success of Alice In Chains in 1990 following the new alt rock direction Janes Addiction carved out, the music industry shifted focus from LA glam bands to Seattle grunge. It's really not about liking it or not, it's about observing the behind the scene forces which shoved it down the public's throat. Same with gangsta rap (propagated by the CIA to destabilize the black community) and other styles like pop country (think Garth Brooks). As far as liking it, i've learned to like it more than i used to. I just listened to every Nirvana album a few weeks ago and they were really talented songwriters. I still see the more polished forms of grunge as nothing more than an updated version of pop punk but doesn't mean it didn't appeal to a lot of people at the time which is why it was (is) so popular. Gr(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'836067fe9e54fb2c',t:'MTcwMjY2MTM0MC4wNDgwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
|
||
|
https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 15 2023 at 04:22 |
|
One thing more, I don't quite understand your opinion about Grunge. What is it, you don't find to be good there? |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
David_D
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15820 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: December 14 2023 at 12:02 |
|
|
For those interested in the American Punk, I can recommend the very informative and well-written book about pre-Punk, proto-Punk, Punk Rock, Art Punk and Post-Punk in the years 1961-80, From the Velvets to the Voidoids: A Pre-Punk History for a Post-Punk World (1993) by Clinton Heylin. It's very good about the New York scene and bands like Television, The Ramones, Patti Smith, Talking Heads, Pere Ubu and the early Blondie, while it doesn't include the later West Coast bands like Dead Kennedys and Black Flag. Edited by David_D - December 15 2023 at 04:17 |
||
|
quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
|
||
|
||
|
Post Reply
|
Page 123 7> |
| Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
Topic Options
David_D wrote: