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5 Bands From the Second-Tier

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Topic: 5 Bands From the Second-Tier
Posted By: mlkpad14
Subject: 5 Bands From the Second-Tier
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 06:45
I'm going to have to go with Camel.

I don't particularly listen to all of this stuff - really just Camel and VDGG. Let me know what you think! :D



Replies:
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 07:02
Alternating between Van der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant. Voted GG.

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Posted By: Manuel
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 07:33
Camel, Gentle Giant, The Moody Blues, Renaissance, and VDGG. I like them all and listen to them frequently.


Posted By: TeleStrat
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:03
Camel, then GG, then Moodies


Posted By: DeadSouls
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:05
Camel, GG, VDGG.


Posted By: Blinkyjoh
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:06
 i don't have the full catalog for any of them and i haven't gotten around to checking out Vandergraff or Renaissance.. 

But i enjoy listening to the live/best ofs of the Moody's by far the most. 
If i were to pick asked to pick a particular studio album, i imagine it would be gentle giant's free hand or octopus.




Posted By: Kingsnake
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:27
Moody Blues started before any of the known progrockbands. They formed in 1964 !!!!!! and released Days of Future Passed in 1967 !!!!.

How are they second tier? They should be at the basis of progrock/symphonic rock.
 
Gentle Giant debuted in 1969. Don't understand them to be second tier.

What does second tier even mean? Hitsucces and albumsales? Cause then Moody Blues should be way ahead of Genesis and Yes, only surpassed by Pink Floyd, I guess....


Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:29
Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:

Moody Blues started before any of the known progrockbands. They formed in 1964 !!!!!! and released Days of Future Passed in 1967 !!!!.

How are they second tier? They should be at the basis of progrock/symphonic rock.
 
Gentle Giant debuted in 1969. Don't understand them to be second tier.

What does second tier even mean? Hitsucces and albumsales? Cause then Moody Blues should be way ahead of Genesis and Yes, only surpassed by Pink Floyd, I guess....

Yeah, I wouldn't call either Moody Blues or Gentle Giant second tier.  But with GG being an option, I voted for it.


Posted By: Mormegil
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 08:58
Camel, followed by Renaissance and GG.


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Posted By: digdug
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 09:07
Gentle Giant for me

8 awesome albums in a row


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Prog On!


Posted By: The-time-is-now
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 09:12
Camel.

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Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 09:22
All five are terrific but Gentle Giant gets my vote!


Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:07
Originally posted by Mormegil Mormegil wrote:

Camel, followed by Renaissance and GG.
This....and not second tier, IMO


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Posted By: ALotOfBottle
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:09
All are great, but Van der Graaf Generator is my favorite.


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Posted By: Magnum Vaeltaja
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:34
Gentle Giant is my favourite of these, with Van der Graaf Generator steadily catching up and Camel trailing off behind, but still pacing itself well. I haven't really investigated the other two in depth, but from what I've heard I wouldn't put them up with the other three. 

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Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:38
Based on what I'm listening to most at the moment, I vote Moody Blues..

Closey followed by VDGG and Renaissance.

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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!


Posted By: kenethlevine
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:49
I wouldn't have always said this, but Renaissance is #1 out of this list for me now.  Such grace and eloquence
Moodys and Camel are both fantastic
The other 2, not so much


Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 10:57

I love Camel, but I went with Renaissance.



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Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 11:30
Wow. In another poll I got my head chewed off for suggesting some of these bands were second tier. I agree that they all are with the only possible exception being the Moody Blues who were pretty big. However, being that they maybe were never really full blown prog puts them in the second tier imo.

Anyway, for me VDGG then Camel then MB then GG. With the exception of GG I've seen all of these bands and even so I have still seen three friends. 


Posted By: The Bearded Bard
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 11:35
GG, followed by Camel and VdGG.

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Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 14:12
VDGG over GG

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Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 14:36
Originally posted by Man With Hat Man With Hat wrote:

VDGG over GG


Yep. I was really into GG for a while and thought they were really great but then I heard VDGG and realized they took things to a whole other level. Both are great bands though that easily rival the most obvious 70's bands. 


Posted By: Upbeat Tango Monday
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 15:31
Camel > VDGG > GG > Renaissance > Moody

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Posted By: Dopeydoc
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 15:41
Gentle giant, First tier!


Posted By: Wanorak
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 15:56
VDGG then the Moodies, Camel, Renaissance and GG.

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A GREAT YEAR FOR PROG!!!


Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 16:00
Van der Graaf, 'Giant, and Camel in the second tier?

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Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 16:19
1rst teer, 2nd teer... it's all opinion... 

I never said these bands weren't great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush. I may not agree entirely, but these bands still assume teer 1 in my opinion. I mean, I don't listen to Rush as much, but the influence is just out-of-the-ordinary, and that's how the bands established themselves for me.




Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 17:00
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:

Originally posted by Mormegil Mormegil wrote:

Camel, followed by Renaissance and GG.
This....and not second tier, IMO
I'd go Camel, GG, Renaissance. Second tier in terms of popularity, but definitely 1st tier in terms of quality.

Moodies are OK. Don't like VDGG at all.


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Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 17:25
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

1rst teer, 2nd teer... it's all opinion... 

I never said these bands weren't great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush. I may not agree entirely, but these bands still assume teer 1 in my opinion. I mean, I don't listen to Rush as much, but the influence is just out-of-the-ordinary, and that's how the bands established themselves for me.




Well, I would maybe replace Rush or PF with Genesis. I think Rush were prog at one point but after moving pictures I don't think they did a whole lot that could be considered prog or proggish. Just my opinion though. PF maintained a proggier sound for longer. I agree that Genesis sort of abandoned prog at some point too(even though there was still the occasional proggy track here and there)but I think their influence on prog was greater than Rush.


Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 17:38
Gentle Giant is the only of these I listen to regularly. And where exactly is the tier cutoff point...or criteria for that matter?

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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 17:49
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

1rst teer, 2nd teer... it's all opinion... 

I never said these bands weren't great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush. I may not agree entirely, but these bands still assume teer 1 in my opinion. I mean, I don't listen to Rush as much, but the influence is just out-of-the-ordinary, and that's how the bands established themselves for me.




opinion? pfff... that is cop out answer. It is not simply a matter of opinion. Quality is all over the place man... there are a hundred bands you likely haven't even heard that dust any of those choices you have listed there.

What does bands do NOT have however for various reasons (and the foundation of this site by those that built it is discussing the whys which is why some know Prog Rock.. some just listen to it) never reached the levels of influence, impact or ... VERY important for a niche genre.. mass appeal.

Those quantities are not opinion as much as degrees of understand of what Prog Rock is and was.

Most rational people who know Prog Rock.. and there have been a lot of them on this site over the years tend to agree there are the big 3.  Yes, ELP, and King Crimson. With 3 just below that.. Floyd, Tull and Genesis. Those are what you may see occaionalloy called around here as the big 6.  The notion of a 2nd tier is, to me at least, far more interesting for really the Big 6 are no brainers... the next group are much harder to pin down.

anyhow.. of your choices.. the Moodys


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Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 17:55
Lol....I can't read. I should probably not post from my phone since I can't see half or more of what is written.

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Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:01
The Moody Blues...second tier? They've sold more albums than the other bands listed combined. In fact, out of the 70 million albums they've sold, we could probably find one or two albums that sold more in total than the other bands combined.

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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:03
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Lol....I can't read. I should probably not post from my phone since I can't see half or more of what is written.


that sh*t will rot your brain more than listening to Camel albums...  do what the Big Mick does... stick with flip phones.. save the internet for the laptop at home Thumbs UpLOL


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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:08
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

1rst teer, 2nd teer... it's all opinion... 

I never said these bands weren't great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush. I may not agree entirely, but these bands still assume teer 1 in my opinion. I mean, I don't listen to Rush as much, but the influence is just out-of-the-ordinary, and that's how the bands established themselves for me.




Well, I would maybe replace Rush or PF with Genesis. I think Rush were prog at one point but after moving pictures I don't think they did a whole lot that could be considered prog or proggish. Just my opinion though. PF maintained a proggier sound for longer. I agree that Genesis sort of abandoned prog at some point too(even though there was still the occasional proggy track here and there)but I think their influence on prog was greater than Rush.

Makes sense. I actually like Genesis way more than Yes or Rush. I just didn't think to put them as first teer when it came to their influence. It's all still very opinionated and subjective, but yeah, I should've included Genesis.


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:19
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

1rst teer, 2nd teer... it's all opinion... 

I never said these bands weren't great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush. I may not agree entirely, but these bands still assume teer 1 in my opinion. I mean, I don't listen to Rush as much, but the influence is just out-of-the-ordinary, and that's how the bands established themselves for me.




opinion? pfff... that is cop out answer. It is not simply a matter of opinion. Quality is all over the place man... there are a hundred bands you likely haven't even heard that dust any of those choices you have listed there.

What does bands do NOT have however for various reasons (and the foundation of this site by those that built it is discussing the whys which is why some know Prog Rock.. some just listen to it) never reached the levels of influence, impact or ... VERY important for a niche genre.. mass appeal.

Those quantities are not opinion as much as degrees of understand of what Prog Rock is and was.

Most rational people who know Prog Rock.. and there have been a lot of them on this site over the years tend to agree there are the big 3.  Yes, ELP, and King Crimson. With 3 just below that.. Floyd, Tull and Genesis. Those are what you may see occaionalloy called around here as the big 6.  The notion of a 2nd tier is, to me at least, far more interesting for really the Big 6 are no brainers... the next group are much harder to pin down.

anyhow.. of your choices.. the Moodys

Maybe I should've taken my point a bit farther. I never said that I entirely agreed. I think Floyd is #1 and I'd put Genesis at #2. Then I'd go Tull and then King Crimson. However, what I was basing my point off of, was the common vote - not just here on the site, but what I've read.

Maybe I should stick to this website, as it seems to be far more reliable... Maybe I haven't been listening to prog long enough... but this is what I've established by listening to and researching prog everyday for the past year or so.

I've heard of and I like all of these bands though - the ones being mentioned in this poll. I haven't heard of hundreds of others, but you agreed yourself - these are the big guys (even if we have slightly different opinions on order). 


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:20
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Lol....I can't read. I should probably not post from my phone since I can't see half or more of what is written.


that sh*t will rot your brain more than listening to Camel albums...  do what the Big Mick does... stick with flip phones.. save the internet for the laptop at home Thumbs UpLOL

What's wrong with Camel? I think they were great!


Posted By: micky
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 18:23
LOL

more past history... just ignore me.


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Posted By: Booba Kastorsky
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 20:05
Gentle Giant is my vote. Although, I can see "You can not vote in this poll"...Disapprove  at the bottom of them poll result.


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 20:09
Originally posted by Booba Kastorsky Booba Kastorsky wrote:

Gentle Giant is my vote. Although, I can see "You can not vote in this poll"...Disapprove  at the bottom of them poll result.

That's strange. Micky must've closed the poll.

That's kind of ridiculous, but um... ok?


Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 20:17
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Lol....I can't read. I should probably not post from my phone since I can't see half or more of what is written.


that sh*t will rot your brain more than listening to Camel albums...  do what the Big Mick does... stick with flip phones.. save the internet for the laptop at home Thumbs UpLOL

My rural life limits my access options. Besides, its far too late for my brain.


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https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 21:18
Originally posted by Booba Kastorsky Booba Kastorsky wrote:

Gentle Giant is my vote. Although, I can see "You can not vote in this poll"...Disapprove  at the bottom of them poll result.

You have to be elevated to "forum groupie" to vote in polls. Go hang out in the Shred Rooms of "Just for fun" for a few minutes. Your post count will be like 2000 before you know it and you'll be totally jaded about polls like most of the rest of us.


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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: February 02 2017 at 21:52
Uhm, I don't know, I love them all. My understanding of loved second tier, at least on this site, would be Camel, Gentle Giant, and VdGG... but in my mind I like to include Renaissance as well. I also love the Moodies, but somehow they don't seem to fit this bunch... perhaps because they started even before the first "so called" prog album (Court of the Crimson King), or because they never seemed to have gone full on prog, or they just had shorter songs. Also, second tier can get complicated if you start thinking of particular sub-genres or interests. If you think of american bands, then you would have to add Kansas. If you think of folk, then you would have to add The Strawbs. If you think of Psichedelic, then you would have to add Hawkwind. If you think of Canterbury, then you would have to add Caravan. If you think of solo artists or side projects, you would have to add Mike Oldfield, Peter Gabriel, Steve Hackett, Rick Wakeman, UK, etc, etc, etc. If you think french bands you would have to add Ange. If you think bands from Poland you would have to add SBB. From Spain, Triana. Etc.


Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: February 03 2017 at 14:01
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush.
Who do you mean by "we"?

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"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno


Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: February 05 2017 at 11:34
I gave some love to the Moodies......I like all of the bands on that list though VDGG and GG can be difficult unless I'm in the mood. I have listened to the Moodies longer than the others....they hold a special place for me.

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Haquin


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: February 05 2017 at 12:37
Originally posted by Rednight Rednight wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

great!

However, when it comes to prog rock communities, I think we have an easy top 3 - PF, Yes, and Rush.
Who do you mean by "we"?

I meant most of the people in prog rock communities. However, I've trashed that opinion, and understand way more about prog - now that I'm off the Internet and on Prog Archives.

Something closer to may opinion can be found on a different topic, about a day after this discussion. It is my topic on the first tier, and can be found by scrolling through the polls section.


Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: February 14 2017 at 22:33
Moodies


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Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: February 14 2017 at 22:39
Van Der Giraffe 

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Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: February 14 2017 at 23:17
Camel

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Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: February 15 2017 at 03:55
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

The Moody Blues...second tier? They've sold more albums than the other bands listed combined. In fact, out of the 70 million albums they've sold, we could probably find one or two albums that sold more in total than the other bands combined.


Have we agreed what 'Second tier' actually means?

Is it to do with sales?? If so, then you're right. The Moody Blues were enormous. Throughout the 70's much bigger than Genesis and King Crimson and probably ELP too. Their mega success was chiefly around those 7 albums, I think 4 or 5 of which were in the US album charts at the same time.

Maybe by 2nd tier we're referring to how "progressive" a band is, however that is measured, but then if that were the case I would put VDGG in the top tier over Genesis, so I'm none the wiser...

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Posted By: Argo2112
Date Posted: July 21 2017 at 13:40
Renaissance by far for me. Probably the first prog band I really listened to when I was a kid.
I'm surprised these not more love here for them. They did some truly amazing stuff.



Posted By: TheH
Date Posted: July 21 2017 at 14:02
If those bands are second tier, what tier would be the multitude of other bands?
 
All of those are (among) the spearhead of Prog!


Posted By: Larkstongue41
Date Posted: July 21 2017 at 14:36
Not an absolute list by any means but let me refer you to something Micky once posted on another thread. I think he has some very good points.
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:


really... here are the latest tables hanging on the wall of the Piazza di Prog. Not a list of favorites.. obviously as there are bands here that truly suck or personally think are horribly overrated....but a list of bands based on an objective opinion of their import, influence, and relative output. 

1st Division.. ie the big 6. The Mount Rushmore of Prog
Yes
King Crimson
ELP
Genesis
Dull
Floyd

2nd Division...  the cult greats. Just odd enough to keep them off the Mount Rushmore of being the 'faces' of prog rock that even non-fans recognize. Only slightly less important in terms of importance and influence to developing and defining the genre.. and in a number of cases.. with even stronger relative output than some of the big 6 LOL

Magma
Caravan
PFM 
Can
Gentle Giant
Van Der Graaf Generator

3rd Division... the subtle greats.. a definite step down from the 1st and 2nd divisions in terms of influence importance and all that sh*t... but still vital for helping define prog rock...but still with very strong relative outputs

Dream Theater
Tangerine Dream
Bo Hansson
The Moody Blues
Hawkwind
Gong

4th Division... see 3rd division.. just a bit less impressive in assessing their overall orbit in the prog universe

Supertramp
Henry Cow
Area
Marillion DeadLOL but to deny them their rightful place in the prog heirarchy is stupid.. this isn't a personal popularity contest now is it.. camel fans.
Traffic
Kansas  (see Marillion LOL)

5th Division... beginning to scrap the barrel of important influential bands that left a significant legacy to the genre.

Talk Talk  (give them another couple decades and they move up as their importance will only gain in stature)
Renaissance - pretty much the epitome of 'symphonic prog'
ELO - 'pretty much the epitome of crossover prog.. art rock.. whatever...'
Univers Zero 'if Stravinsky had a rock band.. this would be it'  
Popol Vuh 'world music before there was such a thing...
Camel  ' ahhh.. they are popular on PA's'


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Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: July 21 2017 at 23:35
Interestingly Fripp regarded Crimson as being at the top of the 'second divisiom' which I think is accurate. They weren't as big in terms of record sales as Genesis, Yes, Tull, ELP and Floyd.

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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!


Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: July 21 2017 at 23:51
I love Gentle Giant up to Civilian and all 70's Camel but VDGG is in another league and gets my vote.  I guess if the 1st tier vs 2nd tier thing is based on popularity, radio play, and sales then GG, Camel & VDGG are tier 2, though I consider them all the cream of the prog crop Wink

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Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 26 2017 at 20:40
Mirage by Camel is one of my all time favorite albums, but Gentle Giant just has too much good prog.. gotta go with them. 


Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: July 26 2017 at 20:50
VDGG > GG > Camel > Renaissance > Moodies

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Posted By: mechanicalflattery
Date Posted: July 27 2017 at 00:54
Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

VDGG > GG > Camel > Renaissance > Moodies

Exactly right


Posted By: PrognosticMind
Date Posted: July 27 2017 at 02:14
Gentle Giant.

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"A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous. Got me?"


Posted By: b_olariu
Date Posted: July 27 2017 at 03:00
These are second tier bands??

Camel and Renaissance for me, but the rest are also excellent




Posted By: Meltdowner
Date Posted: July 27 2017 at 03:56
I'll spare some love for Renaissance.


Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: July 27 2017 at 03:58
This will be my fourth post in a row with no captcha?

Anyway, Van Damme Generator for me.

Let's see if the edit fecks me up.

Second try failDead


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Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: July 29 2017 at 19:05
gg, graaf and camel were first tier. Better than Yes and Crimson imo

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Posted By: ProfPanglos
Date Posted: July 29 2017 at 20:41
Camel>Renaissance>Gentle Giant>Moody Blues>VDGG

Many people here singing the praises of VDGG but I have never been moved by their music.  I will have to try again... I have heard Still Life, H To He, and Quiet Zone/Pleasure Dome.  I'll try again, maybe a different album.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 29 2017 at 21:27
Originally posted by ProfPanglos ProfPanglos wrote:

Camel>Renaissance>Gentle Giant>Moody Blues>VDGG

Many people here singing the praises of VDGG but I have never been moved by their music.  I will have to try again... I have heard Still Life, H To He, and Quiet Zone/Pleasure Dome.  I'll try again, maybe a different album.


There's no album I actually love as a whole from them, but there are many great songs to enjoy. At my first listens I did for a moment think I might have gone too far with this band (and I did get 5 albums at once without having heard anything from them). But I did start with the album "The Least we can do is wave to each other", and the first songs (Darkness and Refugees) are sort of more melodic and easier to get into, so thanks to them I did give them more of a chance. You might want to try this album next, and focus on those songs.


Posted By: scruffydragon
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 07:30
I love all those bands. But I had to go for Camel as I have fond memories of their very creative music at school.


Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 08:56
If Gentle Giant really are second tier and not first tier then they are by far the most well known and respected band from the second tier. Often I will see them listed on lists of "big five" and "big six." This site is the only place I know of that does not lump them in with ELP, KC, JT, Yes, Genesis etc. 


Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 09:34
From recollection, Where GG is listed as one of the giants (haha) of Prog, I usually see VdGG listed as well. Oh, and I already posted my preference in this topic, but I prefer my GG with VD.

And referring to an earlier post, The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other is my favourite VdGG album, but Pawn hearts is the album that originally made me a fan, and the first song I loved from VdGG was Man Erg..

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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.


Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 14:36
I've heard that name from time to time(Van Der Graaf Generator) but I'm embarrassed to admit I don't actually know anything about them. Embarrassed

But if they're considered better than Camel or GG on here then I guess I better get with it lol. I guess I'll start with that least we can do is wave deal that mentioned in this thread. 


Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 15:11
Camel tends to win these polls, and the results are very close at the moment.

I wouldn't say better, but VdGG is better for me than Camel and GG. I do like all three, and have loved all three. Twelve years ago I would have held a contrary opinion as I din't think VdGG quite up there with Camel or GG, and I thought it had less Prog credentials. I used to be much bigger on Camel and Gentle Giant. I've known Camel longer than GG and VdGG -- as a child the Snow Goose was a favourite album of mine in my brother's collection --, but I started listening to Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator at the same time in I think 2003. While some VdGG music clicked, Gentle Giant was an instant hit for me as I think it fulfilled better my Prog expectations of the time.

I really started to deeply explore Prog in part as an exercise in nostalgia, and I had to go a little out of my comfort zone to look into music that didn't align with the kind of Prog I grew up with. So, I was into the typical symph bands, but then moved into what we now call Eclectic Prog such as King Crimson, Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator, which then led me to RIO/ Avant prog..... GG was an easily acquired taste for me, but VdGG took a little more time for me to really appreciate, and has stood the test of time for me. Most of the bands I was listening to between 2003 and 2005 I lost interest in, and the Prog of my childhood I've moved on from pretty much. I did get drawn back into electronic, which I was big on when I was younger.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy VdGG. And I hope you grow to enjoy it more still over the years. The Least We Can Do... and Pawn Hearts are two favourite albums of mine. Some prefer Godbluff, and some prefer H to He. I started with individual tracks rather than whole albums, so maybe that's one reason why the band took longer to really click with me. Had I been immersed more in the band's albums rather than the shuffle that I tended to hear back in evil Napster days, then things might have been a bit different. I purchased my first Gentle Giant album, Acquiring the Taste, before purchasing Pawn Hearts.

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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.


Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 15:35
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Camel tends to win these polls, and the results are very close at the moment.

I wouldn't say better, but VdGG is better for me than Camel and GG. I do like all three, and have loved all three. Twelve years ago I would have held a contrary opinion as I din't think VdGG quite up there with Camel or GG, and I thought it had less Prog credentials. I used to be much bigger on Camel and Gentle Giant. I've known Camel longer than GG and VdGG -- as a child the Snow Goose was a favourite album of mine in my brother's collection --, but I started listening to Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator at the same time in I think 2003. While some VdGG music clicked, Gentle Giant was an instant hit for me as I think it fulfilled better my Prog expectations of the time.

I really started to deeply explore Prog in part as an exercise in nostalgia, and I had to go a little out of my comfort zone to look into music that didn't align with the kind of Prog I grew up with. So, I was into the typical symph bands, but then moved into what we now call Eclectic Prog such as King Crimson, Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator, which then led me to RIO/ Avant prog..... GG was an easily acquired taste for me, but VdGG took a little more time for me to really appreciate, and has stood the test of time for me. Most of the bands I was listening to between 2003 and 2005 I lost interest in, and the Prog of my childhood I've moved on from pretty much. I did get drawn back into electronic, which I was big on when I was younger.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy VdGG. And I hope you grow to enjoy it more still over the years. The Least We Can Do... and Pawn Hearts are two favourite albums of mine. Some prefer Godbluff, and some prefer H to He. I started with individual tracks rather than whole albums, so maybe that's one reason why the band took longer to really click with me. Had I been immersed more in the band's albums rather than the shuffle that I tended to hear back in evil Napster days, then things might have been a bit different. I purchased my first Gentle Giant album, Acquiring the Taste, before purchasing Pawn Hearts.

That's interesting. So Van der Graaf Generator stood the test of time for you more so than GG. I love GG at the moment.. but yeah now I'm going to have to try this other group! Sounds like The Least We Can Do and Pawn Hearts are the place for me to start. Thanks. 


Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 15:37
The crown will always belong to the Giant afaic.

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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 15:51
Originally posted by YESESIS YESESIS wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Camel tends to win these polls, and the results are very close at the moment.

I wouldn't say better, but VdGG is better for me than Camel and GG. I do like all three, and have loved all three. Twelve years ago I would have held a contrary opinion as I din't think VdGG quite up there with Camel or GG, and I thought it had less Prog credentials. I used to be much bigger on Camel and Gentle Giant. I've known Camel longer than GG and VdGG -- as a child the Snow Goose was a favourite album of mine in my brother's collection --, but I started listening to Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator at the same time in I think 2003. While some VdGG music clicked, Gentle Giant was an instant hit for me as I think it fulfilled better my Prog expectations of the time.

I really started to deeply explore Prog in part as an exercise in nostalgia, and I had to go a little out of my comfort zone to look into music that didn't align with the kind of Prog I grew up with. So, I was into the typical symph bands, but then moved into what we now call Eclectic Prog such as King Crimson, Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator, which then led me to RIO/ Avant prog..... GG was an easily acquired taste for me, but VdGG took a little more time for me to really appreciate, and has stood the test of time for me. Most of the bands I was listening to between 2003 and 2005 I lost interest in, and the Prog of my childhood I've moved on from pretty much. I did get drawn back into electronic, which I was big on when I was younger.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy VdGG. And I hope you grow to enjoy it more still over the years. The Least We Can Do... and Pawn Hearts are two favourite albums of mine. Some prefer Godbluff, and some prefer H to He. I started with individual tracks rather than whole albums, so maybe that's one reason why the band took longer to really click with me. Had I been immersed more in the band's albums rather than the shuffle that I tended to hear back in evil Napster days, then things might have been a bit different. I purchased my first Gentle Giant album, Acquiring the Taste, before purchasing Pawn Hearts.


That's interesting. So Van der Graaf Generator stood the test of time for you more so than GG. I love GG at the moment.. but yeah now I'm going to have to try this other group! Sounds like The Least We Can Do and Pawn Hearts are the place for me to start. Thanks. 


I was totally obsessed with Gentle Giant and got all of the albums in short order (never did like the final three GG albums). I burnt out on the music. I over-listened to it as I am on the OCD spectrum with an emphasis on obsessive. I remember when I heard Premiata Forneria Marconi while still a major GG fan then that became my obsession, which them became Magma (which I got every album by) and so on.

With VdGG getting into them was more of a slow burn, and that helped cause I didn't overdose (I did on Pawn Hearts at one time). Also, I still don't have various VdGG albums, so I can still discover new-to-me music by the band and keep my interest alive that way.   These days I listen to a wide variety of music without sticking to one artist, so the shelf-life has improved. In a sense I've never been as big on VdGG as I once was on GG, but that's because VdGG never become so consuming that my obsession eventually killed my enjoyment.

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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.


Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 16:06
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I was totally obsessed with Gentle Giant and got all of the albums in short order (never did like the final three GG albums). I burnt out on the music. I over-listened to it as I am on the OCD spectrum with an emphasis on obsessive. I remember when I heard Premiata Forneria Marconi while still a major GG fan then that became my obsession, which them became Magma (which I got every album by) and so on.

With VdGG getting into them was more of a slow burn, and that helped cause I didn't overdose (I did on Pawn Hearts at one time). Also, I still don't have various VdGG albums, so I can still discover new-to-me music by the band and keep my interest alive that way.   These days I listen to a wide variety of music without sticking to one artist, so the shelf-life has improved. In a sense I've never been as big on VdGG as I once was on GG, but that's because VdGG never become so consuming that my obsession eventually killed my enjoyment.

You're gonna run my post count up close to 40 lol. That's good. Smile

Anyway, Magma.. that's another band that seems to be in high regard on here. Have to check them out too.  This is going to become more bands than I can handle here pretty soon lol. But for now I'll limit it to VdGG and Magma. I've been obsessed with Caravan lately, but will put them on hold for right now! 


Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 16:10
Originally posted by YESESIS YESESIS wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I was totally obsessed with Gentle Giant and got all of the albums in short order (never did like the final three GG albums). I burnt out on the music. I over-listened to it as I am on the OCD spectrum with an emphasis on obsessive. I remember when I heard Premiata Forneria Marconi while still a major GG fan then that became my obsession, which them became Magma (which I got every album by) and so on.

With VdGG getting into them was more of a slow burn, and that helped cause I didn't overdose (I did on Pawn Hearts at one time). Also, I still don't have various VdGG albums, so I can still discover new-to-me music by the band and keep my interest alive that way.   These days I listen to a wide variety of music without sticking to one artist, so the shelf-life has improved. In a sense I've never been as big on VdGG as I once was on GG, but that's because VdGG never become so consuming that my obsession eventually killed my enjoyment.

You're gonna run my post count up close to 40 lol. That's good. Smile

Anyway, Magma.. that's another band that seems to be in high regard on here. Have to check them out too.  This is going to become more bands than I can handle here pretty soon lol. But for now I'll limit it to VdGG and Magma. I've been obsessed with Caravan lately, but will put them on hold for right now! 


Love Caravan, been obsessed with it, and still love it. I better start getting down to work or else my wife will bury me Nine Feet Underground.

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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.


Posted By: Barbu
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 16:11
One Caravan album a day keeps the psychologist away.

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Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 16:18
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by YESESIS YESESIS wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I was totally obsessed with Gentle Giant and got all of the albums in short order (never did like the final three GG albums). I burnt out on the music. I over-listened to it as I am on the OCD spectrum with an emphasis on obsessive. I remember when I heard Premiata Forneria Marconi while still a major GG fan then that became my obsession, which them became Magma (which I got every album by) and so on.

With VdGG getting into them was more of a slow burn, and that helped cause I didn't overdose (I did on Pawn Hearts at one time). Also, I still don't have various VdGG albums, so I can still discover new-to-me music by the band and keep my interest alive that way.   These days I listen to a wide variety of music without sticking to one artist, so the shelf-life has improved. In a sense I've never been as big on VdGG as I once was on GG, but that's because VdGG never become so consuming that my obsession eventually killed my enjoyment.

You're gonna run my post count up close to 40 lol. That's good. Smile

Anyway, Magma.. that's another band that seems to be in high regard on here. Have to check them out too.  This is going to become more bands than I can handle here pretty soon lol. But for now I'll limit it to VdGG and Magma. I've been obsessed with Caravan lately, but will put them on hold for right now! 


Love Caravan, been obsessed with it, and still love it. I better start getting down to work or else my wife will bury me Nine Feet Underground.

Right on! 


Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 16:19
Originally posted by Barbu Barbu wrote:

One Caravan album a day keeps the psychologist away.

Haha


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 21:16
Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

From recollection, Where GG is listed as one of the giants (haha) of Prog, I usually see VdGG listed as well. Oh, and I already posted my preference in this topic, but I prefer my GG with VD.

And referring to an earlier post, The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other is my favourite VdGG album, but Pawn hearts is the album that originally made me a fan, and the first song I loved from VdGG was Man Erg..


Oh yeah, Man-Erg is really a beautiful song. Still not a fan of the overly noisy middle parts, but I can just handle them because of the beauty of the rest of the song.


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 21:23
Originally posted by YESESIS YESESIS wrote:

I've heard that name from time to time(Van Der Graaf Generator) but I'm embarrassed to admit I don't actually know anything about them. Embarrassed

But if they're considered better than Camel or GG on here then I guess I better get with it lol. I guess I'll start with that least we can do is wave deal that mentioned in this thread. 


Yeah, another band you really should get to know. As with ELP, this band uses just about no guitars on their music, but they don't really need them. The keyboards are beautiful, but mostly it's the sax that takes the place of the guitar, and it's such a treat (my favourite sax fronted music... not that I know much of it besides this band, though). However, they can make some really cool heavy sounding music (by 70's standards) with just the sax... and Peter Hamills singing. This is another singer that really stands out, for better or for worse. I personally like him very much, but he's not your tipical vocalist... I think he could have had the chops to be a really gifter technical singer, but he rather went other ways, ending up as one of the most versatile singers out there. Just listen to "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers", and it just sounds as if there were at least two different singers; or to "The Sleepwalkers".


Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 21:25
Originally posted by YESESIS YESESIS wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I was totally obsessed with Gentle Giant and got all of the albums in short order (never did like the final three GG albums). I burnt out on the music. I over-listened to it as I am on the OCD spectrum with an emphasis on obsessive. I remember when I heard Premiata Forneria Marconi while still a major GG fan then that became my obsession, which them became Magma (which I got every album by) and so on.

With VdGG getting into them was more of a slow burn, and that helped cause I didn't overdose (I did on Pawn Hearts at one time). Also, I still don't have various VdGG albums, so I can still discover new-to-me music by the band and keep my interest alive that way.   These days I listen to a wide variety of music without sticking to one artist, so the shelf-life has improved. In a sense I've never been as big on VdGG as I once was on GG, but that's because VdGG never become so consuming that my obsession eventually killed my enjoyment.

You're gonna run my post count up close to 40 lol. That's good. Smile

Anyway, Magma.. that's another band that seems to be in high regard on here. Have to check them out too.  This is going to become more bands than I can handle here pretty soon lol. But for now I'll limit it to VdGG and Magma. I've been obsessed with Caravan lately, but will put them on hold for right now! 


Yeah, once you start out the path of prog with PA as your guide, that's bound to happen. There are many bands I have been needing to get to know... for years and just can't get there. I've come to the point where sometimes I have even been comfortable enough recommending bands I have not even heard just because of what I have read about them on this site.


Posted By: YESESIS
Date Posted: July 30 2017 at 22:53
Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

Yeah, once you start out the path of prog with PA as your guide, that's bound to happen. There are many bands I have been needing to get to know... for years and just can't get there. I've come to the point where sometimes I have even been comfortable enough recommending bands I have not even heard just because of what I have read about them on this site.

Thanks for all your input here. I'm going to just stick with King Crimson for now. That sounds like the most important one. I'll get to all those others later lol(hopefully).. Or at least VdGG. 


Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: January 30 2018 at 23:04
Tough race with all the others except GG, but then I decided to choose Moodies. Main reason was they have been with me the longest.


Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: January 30 2018 at 23:50
Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:


Moody Blues started before any of the known progrockbands. They formed in 1964 !!!!!! and released Days of Future Passed in 1967 !!!!.

How are they second tier? They should be at the basis of progrock/symphonic rock.
 
Gentle Giant debuted in 1969. Don't understand them to be second tier.

What does second tier even mean? Hitsucces and albumsales? Cause then Moody Blues should be way ahead of Genesis and Yes, only surpassed by Pink Floyd, I guess....
VDGG started out in in 1968 and debuted in 69 so they are older then GG

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Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: January 31 2018 at 02:10
THERE COMING OVER CHARATON BRIDGE!!!

Gentle Giant all the way.


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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021


Posted By: mlkpad14
Date Posted: January 31 2018 at 04:45
Originally posted by Icarium Icarium wrote:

Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:


Moody Blues started before any of the known progrockbands. They formed in 1964 !!!!!! and released Days of Future Passed in 1967 !!!!.

How are they second tier? They should be at the basis of progrock/symphonic rock.
 
Gentle Giant debuted in 1969. Don't understand them to be second tier.

What does second tier even mean? Hitsucces and albumsales? Cause then Moody Blues should be way ahead of Genesis and Yes, only surpassed by Pink Floyd, I guess....
VDGG started out in in 1968 and debuted in 69 so they are older then GG

Every time this thread gets reborn I take a deep breath... Since then, I have learned way more about music, and I wrote this after just discovering prog for the first time too!


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https://gamecrazyprofessional.weebly.com/


Posted By: tempest_77
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 01:15
Haven't listened to much of Renaissance. Beyond that, I'm going to have to go with Camel, but Moody Blues is pretty close behind.


Posted By: Squonk19
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 03:01
Camel

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“Living in their pools, they soon forget about the sea.”


Posted By: Argos
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 08:11
Can't decide between Giant and Camel... I guess going with the one I've listened to more songs of makes sense. Giant it is.

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"All the iron turned to rust;
All the proud men turned to dust
And so all things, time will mend
So this song will end"


Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: April 11 2018 at 09:11
It's nice that this poll was resurrected so those that those who joined in the past few months could participate. Smile 

It's been a while but I'm pretty sure I voted for VDGG. I'm also a big fan of the Moody Blues and Camel and like GG quite a bit too. Renaissance is a band that I know and have seen them live but haven't heard a lot of their albums. I actually even met Annie Haslam once and talked to her briefly. Not sure what  happened to the photo of the two of us.



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