Is bass guitar the new lead guitar?
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Topic: Is bass guitar the new lead guitar?
Posted By: Jim Garten
Subject: Is bass guitar the new lead guitar?
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 03:50
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I've spent a while in the last couple of days here at PA looking through the old and new versions of the Rogues Gallery (which is, may I say, the most successful thread started by lil' ol' me). Many of you post pictures posing with, or playing your favorite musical instruments (fair enough, I'd post one of me with my Hammond if I had such a piccie) - and I noticed a trend...
A majority seem to be bass guitars. When I was in my teens, there were of course many of us who had/played instruments, but a vast majority were lead guitars - nobody wanted to play bass guitar... OK, the 1970s was the time of the guitar hero, but there are just as many (arguably more) great players now as there were then; conversely, although the bass guitarist has come more to the fore in recent years (especially in certain areas of prog), we had outstanding players back in the 1970's, too (ah - the 1970s, when bass guitars only had 4 strings...). So - is it just my perception, or has the bass guitar overtaken the lead guitar as the instrument of choice, and if so, why? ...and for a bonus point, why are bass guitarists now unsatisfied with 4 strings, and prefer the 5 & 6 string versions - and don't give me the "they're more versatile" argument before listening to 4 string players like Jaco Pastorius, Jeff Berlin, Dave Holland, Geddy Lee et al. ------------- 
Jon Lord 1941 - 2012 |
Replies:
Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 03:53
I hear there are a couple songs on The Dreams of Men with pretty active bass.  ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: JrKASperov
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 05:08
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4 string are way cooler than more, I bought a five stringer, but found myself hardly ever touching the fifth. But to be honest, bass guitar is a lot easier to learn to play, I think that's why a lot of people play that instrument. The downside is it's a lot lot lot harder instrument to master.
------------- Epic. |
Posted By: erik neuteboom
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 05:17
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Perhaps because of the influence of progmetal (Dream Theater) and musicians like Tony Levin that the bass guitar is more popular?
Listening to Riverside I notice that the bass work is very powerful and omnipresent.
By the way, I love the 6-string bass guitar sound, it's so pure R&R
 ! |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 05:42
Well, I'm a guitarist and from my perspective bass guitar is a bit easier to play in the usual part-time hobby band situation. By that I mean cover bands which play standard rock/metal songs ... of course when you're in a prog or jazz band, things are quite different.  Other pro bass arguments:
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to: 
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Jim Garten wrote:Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 06:52
I can't play any instrument, but I love the bass guitar - and somebody has recently offered to teach me how to play it! I'm not sure I will ever become the next Chris Squire, but you never know... I might just put out an ad in order to find some musicians for my future band!
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Posted By: zFrogs
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 10:27
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I think that play bass and sing simultaneously is more difficult than play guitar and sing. Because the bass and drum run together and harmony is very important too and the bassist can't stop. Simultaneously is more difficult for me, in that order, drums, keyboards, bass and guitar.
In Brazil is very common people learn to play acoustic guitar and sing, maybe because bossa nova or traditional music from Brazil people is more prone for that.
I'm bass player and this is my opinion about it. ------------- https://www.instagram.com/erifrog/ |
Posted By: King of Loss
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 10:36
Guitar is still king! 
But there has been indeed a raise in love for the bass primarily due to John Myung it seems.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 10:54
Think of:
BTW: I agree that to sing and play drums simultaneously must be the most difficult task ... but in the case of keyboards it totally depends on what they're playing. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 11:27
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Don't forget Lemmy either.
-- Ivan ------------- sig |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 11:29
There are plenty more... Richard Sinclair, Glenn Hughes  , even Chris Squire (who's got an excellent voice and sings most of the backing vocals for Yes), to name but a few. Ah, and that guy from Riverside, Mariusz Duda... I've only heard a couple of songs from them, but he sure can sing.
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Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 11:39
On lead bass.... Nigel Tufnel! ------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
Posted By: Jim Garten
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 12:17
Lemmy's that most curious of animals, a bass guitarist who effectivly plays as if it's a rhythm guitar... and a bloody loud one, at that! -------------
Jon Lord 1941 - 2012 |
Posted By: Bern
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 12:52
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The guitar is still played by much more people. Among us proggers, it's a little bit different. A lot of people who are interested in music as a hobby and play music as a hobby didn't notice the full potential of a bass guitar. In simple rock music or punk music, the bass lines are often so simple that they fade in with the music. When you're not passionated about music, you just get over the bass and sees it as a instrument which isn't that important. However, as you get more interested in music, you finally notice how much of a big impact the bass really has. I just noticed that this whole thing might has come off as pretentious but I didn't mean it  -------------  
RIP in bossa nova heaven. |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 12:56
A DT cover band, eh? ------------- 
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 12:59
Of course... In any case, you can't hear Myung's bass on practically any DT recording, so no one would notice if I couldn't play to save my life! |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:00
I actually find it amazing that Claypool can play bass lines like Jerry Was a Racecar Driver and Tommy the Cat and sing at the same time. -------------
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Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:00
I'm going to assume Micky will be on lead guitar? And Tony on drums?  -------------
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Posted By: Tiresias
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:04
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well, a lot of it is because people realized that bassists were needed and there were too many bad guitarists. Bassist were in high demand, and yes, songs when you start out are much easier (smells like teen spirit, money, etc.).
I play a four string myself. A lot of the motivation behind 5 and 6 strings are because some bassists wanted to have more interesting tones or lower sound so they could easily be heard (low b is very noticeable). It makes an interesting blend. Also, they wouldn't have to detune. With the influx of specialty bass players (les claypool, john myung, justin chancellor, and, unforunately, bassists like Fieldy of Korn and all the terrible new metal bassists, fivers or sixers have become trendy. People think # of strings = talent (b/c guitarists have 6 and are often viewed as the one with the most talent.
However, in the prog realm, most younger bassists are good, b/c we have exposure to a variety of different playing styles, time sigs, keys, rhythms, and regional styles.
------------- Wh'ghal ng'fth mglw'y Ry'leh, Cthulhu fhtagn... 
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Posted By: Tiresias
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:05
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what about glass prison?
------------- Wh'ghal ng'fth mglw'y Ry'leh, Cthulhu fhtagn...
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Posted By: AtLossForWords
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:06
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Allow me to defend my favorite instrument which I play on a professional level.
1. The bass guitar is not easier to play than lead guitar. It's actually more difficult when it comes to the physical demands of the instrument. The strings are heavier, the freting space is wider, and it's much more double any line on a bass than a guitar because of the fretting demands.
2. Less strings is not better. I play a six string bass, I honestly can't understand why more musicians don't use six strings. There is an entirely new dimension to the music with six strings that with four. Not only does the range increase, but the fingering positions increase as well lifting some old physical demands of an already demanding instrument, but replacing them with newer, easier ones.
3. Bass can never be compared to guitar. It's a totally different dimension of playing. Bass lines are about supporting melodies and grooving, with every once in a awhile showing of great technique. Lead guitar is primarily about flashy techinques.
4. Flashier bass styles don't indicate better players. Guys like Claypool and Wooten have mastered special techniques, but when it comes to traditional bass playing, guys like Jonas Reingold, John Myung, John Pattituci, and Michael Manring are much more interesting and respectable players. -------------  
"Mastodon sucks giant monkey balls." |
Posted By: JrKASperov
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:19
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Let's never forget Jaco Pastorius, Jeff Berlin and Percy Jones.
------------- Epic. |
Posted By: Eetu Pellonpaa
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:22
| Eddie Gomez does some great stuff! Quite impulsive and impressionistic in classical context. |
Posted By: Tiresias
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:23
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while were at it, what about Stan "The Man" Clarke, or Rick Laird. ------------- Wh'ghal ng'fth mglw'y Ry'leh, Cthulhu fhtagn...
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:31
Perhaps.... Would you like to play keyboards for us? And who's going to sing? There's no way I will ever try to sound like LaBrie... unless I was subjected to unspeakable acts of violence while singing! BTW... why is this thread in the OT section? It seems very much IT to me...  |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:35
I'm sorry, I wouldn't mesh well with you people as I happen to be a fan of Dream Theater (and the Rudess era more specifically). -------------
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Posted By: Dan Bobrowski
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 13:36
| I picked up bass recently because my wife is a better guitarist than I am and I wanted to accompany her playing, adding that lower end. I'll still grab my guitar for fills and some leads, but I'm playing bass more than anything else. |
Posted By: heyitsthatguy
Date Posted: August 09 2006 at 20:51
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Gah, I wish so. Our band needs a bassist and we can't find one ------------- 
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Posted By: crimson thing
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 03:45
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Talk of those 6 string basses reminds me that in a book on Zep I recently read, there were several mentions of JPJ playing an 8 string bass. Anyone tried or seen one of those?
Also, since we're in the deep end here , a probably dumb question from a non-muso: I see references to a "string bass" on KC albums such as Islands....is that just a double bass, or an acoustic bass, or what? ------------- "Every man over forty is a scoundrel." GBS 
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Posted By: Rust
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 05:24
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This is true not only in prog, but in mainstream as well. "Guitar Solo's" just got out of fashion and everyone has done them for forever, its the bass' turn to shine in the music world. ------------- We got to pump the stuff to make us tough from the heart Its astart What we need is awareness we cant get careless Mental self defensive fitness Make everybody see in order to fight the powers that be |
Posted By: Australian
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 05:31
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Bass is too constant and it sounds too blunt, even with 6 strings. You may as well use a guitar as it has the same strings as a bass plus a G and E string, and more things can be done on it. Chris Squire's Fish Out of Water is the best example of a Bass dominated album. ------------- 
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Posted By: JrKASperov
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 06:33
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No, Fish out of water is a good example of a bad bass dominated album. He doesn't play any intricate parts. If the bass is constant and sounds too blunt, you're talking about a BAD bassist. If you want good bass albums, listen to Bruford's Feels Good to Me or any Pastorius album (Heavy Weather is good too!) ------------- Epic. |
Posted By: EssentialFaris
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 14:06
| I don't know, it seems everyone I know plays guitar, few basses, no drummers, none, what so ever. |
Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 14:27
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Using the bassguitar, designed as a background instrument, as a lead
instrument makes for new and interesting sounds. Personally, I play a
four string bass. I try to get as much out of the four strings as I
can. I agree that five and six string basses are more versatile though.
I don't own one because of the previous statement, and because I don't
like the broad necks on six strings. Yesterday, I watched a live performance on TV, by three bassists. They took turns playing lead over piano and drums. The interesting thing was that they all played upright bass. It was very interesting to listen to, and also to look at. |
Posted By: AtLossForWords
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 14:53
It's an upright double bass.
@Phileas
Yeah, six string basses certainly do have wide necks. They can be hell on some hands, but I've grown so addicted to the B and C strings, I can't stop using one. -------------
"Mastodon sucks giant monkey balls." |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 14:55
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^ the discussion reminds me of guitarists arguing about the usefulness of 7 string guitars. Personally I think it's more important to have 24 frets as opposed to 21 or 22, simply because it makes sense to have two octaves on the fretboard. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 14:57
As a fellow 6 stringer I couldnt agree more, and I recon that the 6 string has more to offer than what any one has done so far, as in that it could be used for both bass and melody similar to how a Chapmen Stick does, but to nowhere near as complex a level. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005 
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 15:04
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Well the ease of the instrument depends a lot on the style. For bass, it's probably about the same level of difficulty for pop, punk and R&B, but for prog, I'd assume the bass get's tougher, because guitar gets quite easy to play after many years and practice. I'm still working on getting faster, but I canwork my way around the neck with much ease usually. It's hard to get emotion out of that son of a bitch, though. That's why Gilmour deserves just as much props as the fastest of metal guitarists. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 15:45
If were talking about how difficult it is to play the instruments, then I think their going to be equal (having never played a guitar, I wouldnt know for certain). Get a really good groove and not just holding the rhythmn is a difficult. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Posted By: Arrrghus
Date Posted: August 10 2006 at 21:49
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I think on the mainstream, the bass is still in the background and the guitar still rules, but lots of prog from all eras has bass as the equal (or close to it) to the guitar. However, on a ride with my cross country teamates, my coach turned on a rock station and Green Day was on. It seems basslines suck these days on the mainstream. (Plus, the riff ripped off 25 or 6 to 4) ------------- 
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Posted By: Zoso
Date Posted: August 12 2006 at 12:22
That's total rubbish. Like others have stated, you are describing bass when played poorly. Bass can be very intricate, delicate and beautiful sounding. It all just depends on who's playing it. Also, bass is in no way easier than guitar. It is more physically demanding to play, with heavier strings, wider frets, and the need for extremely strong fingers on both hands to play it. The bass also has potentially more style of play than any other instrument. There's your standard finger style, or it can be played with a pick. But there's also pop and slap. Bass has a much wider range of harmonic capabilities than guitar, and two handed tapping has just as many capabilities, if not more than guitar, because it will give you a strong lower sound just by tapping, which guitar cannot. Also, bass is, if anything, harder to play while singing than guitar. I've been playing bass for 6 years, and I still can not sing and play the bass well at the same time. However, singing while playing the guitar comes very easily for me. This is probably because when you play bass, you are the only person in the band that has two roles. You play with the melodic part of the music, and the rhythmic, two things which will keep you busy enough. To add in singing is a lot to ask. One other thing that makes the bass difficult; When you are playing bass in a band, everyone notices when you make a mistake. You stick out like a sore thumb. A great thing about being a bassist is that you are always in demand. I play both electric and upright, and I play in Jazz bands, orchestras, Rock, Prog, Indie...it's almost impossible to name a genre of music where a bassist is not needed. This however does not hold true for guitar. I personally am a big fan of the 4 string bass. I find myself getting lost when I play more than that, especially when I play a 6 string. Though I do love that high C. I just am much more comfortable with the the feel of a 4 string, the necks on extra stringed basses are just too wide. Let me just say that I do not hate guitar or guitarist. I love playing guitar, it's a beautiful and incredible instrument. I just sometimes have to stick up for my other 4 string players. As far as bassists that have influenced me the most, I'd have to say Flea of the Red Hot Chili Peppers is very high up on the list, as cliche as it may be. I love his style, and he makes the bass very very fun to play. Also, John Patitucci just blows me away, both on upright and electric, as do Eddie Gomez, Christian McBride, both who I have seen play live, and Stanley Clarke. They are truly scarily talented men who deserve more recognition. And of course there is the great Jaco Pastorius, who began the bass guitar revolution, and Victor Wooten, who continues to expand the horizons of the bass today. -------------  |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: August 21 2006 at 08:17
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^Actually, I think it's Sir Paul McCartney who led the bass revolution - left-handed, I might add!
He brought bass to the fore - as part of the ensemble instead of a mere backing instrument. ------------- The important thing is not to stop questioning. |
Posted By: Zoso
Date Posted: August 21 2006 at 23:49
One could make that argument, but if you want to talk rock bassists from the 60's, John Entwhistle of The Who takes the cake. As far as what I meant by Jaco, I think he's the first person to ever be widely aknowledged in his time as a bass virtuoso. ------------- |
Posted By: Barla
Date Posted: August 21 2006 at 23:58
Nice words !!
 I'm a bass player too and I feel very proud of the instrument and obviously love playing it !!
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Barla/?chartstyle=LastfmMyspace">  
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Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: August 21 2006 at 23:59
Very true, but it still took time for wide recognition of bass "heroes." Jaco might have actually been one of the first. His was the first name I recall being spoken with true reverence. The younger guys came up during the time when these icons were finally getting their due. That could have a lot to do with it. ------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Posted By: Zoso
Date Posted: August 22 2006 at 00:52
Thanks man. Glad to see we have so many bassists on this forum.------------- |
Posted By: Eetu Pellonpaa
Date Posted: August 22 2006 at 06:48
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I also like to play bass, I have an Aria Pro 2, which I believe is a Rickenbacker copy with cheaper electronics.
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Posted By: Jay440
Date Posted: August 24 2006 at 23:52
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I've been playing Bass for almost 13 years now, and this weekend will be 10 years since I got my Rickenbacker. I've always preferred 4-Strings because my hands are relatively small for a Bass player. I have come across a few 5-String models that feel good to my left hand, and I would have bought one too if I had the funds at the time. I used to play the String Bass/Double Bass/Upright/Bas Viol, etc. in Orchestra back in High School. It's a beautiful sounding instrument, but either my hands aren't right for it or my technique wasn't correct because I had to give it up or risk Carpal Tunnel Syndrome...in which case I couldn't play ANYTHING ever again! The choice was simple. By the way, Jaco may have been the first regarded by the mainstream as a ground-breaker, but get Magma's "Inedits" and listen to Janik Top's solo on "K.M.X.", recorded in 1973. What a frightening bass solo! |
Posted By: Eetu Pellonpaa
Date Posted: August 30 2006 at 16:15
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I managed to try today a 6-string Washburn... There is no return!
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Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: August 30 2006 at 16:54
the topic was playing bass guitar and singing - that's probably why... Lemmy's great fun, though... ------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: August 30 2006 at 18:26
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I notice some people complain that the neck of a 6 string is too wide for their hands, dont let that stop you as you will get used to it, I did and I have small hands. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Posted By: kingofbizzare
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 23:15
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I started teaching myself a bit of bass when my friend left his at my house. I'm right handed, but I founf that it was much easier to play left handed because I wanted to do faster stuff on the fretboard that my left hand couldn't do.
Incidentally, my band has two bass players (although the second one joined more recently, so we haven't had a chance to record anything with this lineup, but it sounds cool). ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/kingofbizzare/?chartstyle=asimpleblue5"> 
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Posted By: Leningrad
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 23:09
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Gah. The only bassist I know thinks anyone with more than 4 strings is a sell-out, and you suck by using a pick. I told him that Squire uses a pick, and he replied, "Well then, Chris Squire sucks!" Funny thing is, when he found out Jack Bruce uses more than 4 strings, he went, "Oh, well Jack Bruce is different."
Only bassist I know, and he's a close-minded prick.
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Posted By: tuxon
Date Posted: September 12 2006 at 09:00
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Another reason for more people playing Bass nowadays instead of lead guitar is the current popular music.
R&B and Rap and assorted music which dominates MTV currently is mostly bass oriented.
so naturally young people start apreciating the bass as the lead instrument. ------------- I'm always almost unlucky _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Id5ZcnjXSZaSMFMC Id5LM2q2jfqz3YxT |
Posted By: Eetu Pellonpaa
Date Posted: September 12 2006 at 09:17
^ Also "Red Hot Chili Peppers" and other funk stuff promote bass playing!
 Got my self a Washburn 6-string, and I'm completelly crazy about it! |
Posted By: Camel_APPeal
Date Posted: September 29 2006 at 20:07
I also started playing a 6-string bass a few months ago! It certainly feels good when you play it and you get used to the wider neck after not too long, so my left hand didn't complain that much. But my back did!! The only downside of the 6-string bass I'm playing is that it's way much heavier than the regular 4 strings!! I don't know if that's only the case of the model I'm currently playing or if anyone else had this issue as well! ------------- 
"After all, it's music what we're talking about here, so there's no best or worst; just what you like and what you don't" |
Posted By: Mumakil
Date Posted: October 02 2006 at 17:07
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I didn't read the whole post, but I would like to add (or confirm) that the 5 and 6 stringed modern basses added a responsibility that many (rock) bass players used to overlook: learning chords. I even knew some lazy guitarrists that just 'became' bass players with the intention of skipping learning harmony / chords. I say that because on the 80's, when I started playing guitar on my first bands, the bassist would say: "What's the key?" and I would reply: "G minor" and the guy would say: "Cut the 'minor' bullsh*t, for me, G is G and that's enough!" And everybody knows it is not true. Every bass player must know all chords, with all variations (7th, diminished, etc) so that they will create suitable basslines according to the songs' harmony, not being limited to the root notes. Now I note that with the 5 and 6 strings, the bass players are more keen to learn and perform full chords instead of keeping themselves playing 'Roots + fifths + octaves' only. This of course improves the bass player capacity to solo as well, as once they know the harmony, they can improvise much more creatively and accurately. Best regards, you prog-heads! ------------- "Fly, you fools!" |
Posted By: Camel_APPeal
Date Posted: October 02 2006 at 22:01
I partially agree with you here.
I agree with you in the fact that a respectable bass player should know all chords and scales with their variation, for it will give you a wider work frame; now if only my 12 year old bass student could understand that instead of complaining...
 I'm just not to keen on playing chords on the bass, unless you mean playing the notes of a chord (but not at the same time) or playing chords on the first three strings of a 6-string bass (that's the C, G and D strings), because otherwise I think it sounds too "overloaded" (for lacking a better word right know, but I hope you get what I mean). -------------
"After all, it's music what we're talking about here, so there's no best or worst; just what you like and what you don't" |
Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: October 03 2006 at 16:10
| I play chords on my four strings... |
Posted By: Sasquamo
Date Posted: October 03 2006 at 19:57
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I don't know, I think guitar is still quite a bit more popular than bass. I don't play bass, but don't the strings cost a lot more for base than for guitar? Maybe that contributes a little to guitar's popularity. Also, the bass has always been very popular in music. In a jazz band, the bassist is arguably the most important part of the rhythm section, as they keep the time of the band by playing (hopefully) perfect time on their walking basslines. |
Posted By: sleeper
Date Posted: October 06 2006 at 08:11
I've seen in the "show us your axe" thread, looks better than my Brice, would be interesting to see how they compare when played, I'd suspect that the Washburn would be superier as the Brice is only a cheap bass. ------------- Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Posted By: progismylife
Date Posted: November 08 2006 at 12:38
That stinks that you have had a bad experience with a bass player. We're not all that close-minded about things. I do not think that bass will ever be the lead guitar. I think of the typical bassist (according to my friends and family), laid back and not really caring about being in the limelight. Not the best choice for a lead guitar spot. |