The acts mentioned in this thread so far would all be potential members of the prog-related category.  None of them, I think are deserving of being included in a prog category.

 

 

Obviously, because without the proto-prog bands there would not be half of the prog bands we have today. And this is all subjective anyways, nowhere on the site does it classify prog-related bands as progressive.

 

Although, I don't agree with your statement, I do agree with your position that both Journey and Toto are good bands that both deserve consideration for inclusion on PA.  As has been mentioned by other posters, there are a number of threads discussing the prog merits of both Journey and Toto.  Unfortunately, there is somewhat of a bias against AOR bands amongst many proggers.  In general, this bias applies to most bands that are well known in other styles of music. 

 

Each and every one of the bands that you mentioned caused extreme amounts of controversy for their inclusion on PA, mostly because of the fact that each of these bands are better known in other categories of music.  There are many members on PA who feel that Prog-related and Proto-prog bands should not be included on PA.  Personally, I think they help to tell the whole prog story.  If you search around you will find many threads discussing the prog-related controversies.  If you haven't read these, I suggest that you give these a read so you can have a better understanding of the time, thought, and effort that goes into the inclusion of bands on PA, and especially these controversial bands. 

 

I am by no means an expert in categorizing music.  I don't necessarily agree with every decision to include or not include a band, but I respect the fact that the people who volunteer their time to run this site do put a lot of thought into these decisions before they are made. 

 

It might take some time, but personally I expect that Journey will probably eventually be added to the jazz/fusion area based on the strength of their first 3 albums.  I also expect that their inclusion will be controversial because of all of their albums after their first 3 albums. 

 

In regards to Toto, while definitely deserving of at least a prog-related spot, I am not sure if they will be included on PA.  I have most of their albums which I find to be high quality rock and roll, but whether or not they are progressive enough to be considered prog for PA tastes is beyond my area of expertise. 

 

In regards to the prog-related category the other threads that I refer to will give more insight, but please keep in mind that as a general rule the volunteers that run this site try and concentrate their time and efforts towards the inclusion of bands in the prog categories before their inclusion in the prog-related categories.  There are probably hundreds or thousands of bands that a case can be made that they had some influence on prog bands and therefore are either prog related or proto prog, but there are also hundreds or thousands of lesser known bands or new bands that are definitely prog that still need to be listened to and added to PA and this is where the time and efforts are better spent.  As previously mentioned, many of the bands that are in prog related or proto-prog only made it there after much thought and discussion.  Bands like Journey and Toto are still in that discussion phase, although based on Easy Livin's post it sounds like Journey might be being discussed actively whereas Toto may only being discussed here in the Forum.

 

You've exaggerated more than a bit.  The site only has included 32 acts that are considered proto-prog, which is quite a small category as far as the categories go.  (Zeuhl may have less, but that's about it.)  Most of those acts are fairly obscure, all of them are included for good reasons, and I agree with the reasons most of the were included out of the groups I'm familiar with.  

 

This being said, the man has got a point. On the strenghth of two full-blown prog albums (which is more than Zep or Sabbath have done), Journey now deserves inclusion.

 

To me, prog-related changed nature once Zep got included, and therefore Journey's inclusion (a non-no for me) has now become almost urgent.

 

I think the definition of "metal" has changed with time. When I was in high school, Creem and Circus used to do "Special Heavy Metal" issues and Rush was always included, along with Zep, Van Halen, Heart and other bands no one thinks of as metal since Metallica, Megadeth, Antrax and other bands of that generation re-wrote the metal rule book.

 

   well, I think Beatles, Who, Zeppelin and Sabbath deserve to be on PA simply because of their diversity, noncomformity, they were ahead of their times, they had the courage to experiment.

   Iron Maiden was an influence on a lot of prog-metal bands, that's why they deserve a place here; even The Doors, I don't have a problem with them being here, their first two albums show experiment and progression. Also Celebration of the Lizard is a brilliant epic, played only live - if that song ain't progresssive, i don't know what is.

    As much as i love Journey and Toto, they don't belong on a prog site; I don't think Asia or GTR belong here, but that's another story; both Toto and journey show great skilled musicianship but it's not enough to consider them as prog-rock or prog-related.

 

   feel free to contradict me if i'm not making much sense.

 

Have you posted it in the forum then? If so, where is it please?

I think it is very difficult to say what bands are really Prog-Related bands and what not.

 

 

Nudge

 

The rest of your post is disrespectful to the hard work done by our collaborators, without who the site would not be all that it is now. I don't think any of us would maintain that the site is perfect, but it is pretty damn good though.