The First ProgAlbum?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Polls
Forum Description: Create polls on topics related to progressive music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=80479
Printed Date: August 08 2025 at 10:24
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Topic: The First ProgAlbum?
Posted By: Varon
Subject: The First ProgAlbum?
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 12:01
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Personnaly I think that VdGG's debut is the first progalbum - it's not http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychedelic_rock" rel="nofollow - psychedelic rock neither jazz-fusion etc. +++++++ It was released earlier (in September, 1969) than ITCOTCK that can be considered the first Prog Masterpiece . Sorry if I've missed smth important
------------- Would you catch the final words of mine? Would you catch my words??? |
Replies:
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 13:26
Other early prog album worth mentioning:  ------------- 
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Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 13:45
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Shine on Brightly for me. ------------- A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life. |
Posted By: Progosopher
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 13:47
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Even thought I do not believe in any such thing, I voted Pet Sounds, which was so remarkable, the Beatles tried to emulate it and ended up with Sgt. Pepper's. Pet Sounds has actually aged better. ------------- The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty" |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 15:55
| Close run thing between Ars Longa Vita Brevis and Shine On Brightly which were both released in the same month of 1968. I voted for ALVB as I think it had more influence on other prog bands than Procal Harum's release. |
Posted By: giselle
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 16:12
| I voted for The Clouds Scrapbook because it is the bridge that links pop and prog; but my instincts still tell me that the first true Prog album was In the Court of the Crimson King. It's just that without 1-2-3 this album couldn't have happened. |
Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 18:09
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I think Sgt Pepper because the Beatles did what every one is doing now in prog but they didnt realise it was prog and they didnt realise it was creating a genre of music.... if you listen though the album has all the prog elements, and it was before 1969. Then King Crimson's debut was the definitive article.... ------------- 
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Posted By: Prog Geo
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 18:24
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Freak out!!
------------- Sonorous Meal show every Sunday at 20:00 (greek time) on http://www.justincaseradio.com |
Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: August 14 2011 at 19:27
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Prog Geo wrote:Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 00:49
Another annoying statement. ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Posted By: Alitare
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 00:51
| Shine On Brightly definitely beats Court. Sgt. Pepper is iffy, but I'll bite. It certainly had a bigger hand in 'progress'. Days of Future Passed as well. |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 02:55
I don't think so. Musicians infuence each other and early KC must have had its sources for inspiration. I don't know if there is any link between 1-2-3/Clouds and King Crimson, but it is possible at least. Anyway, In the Court of the Crimson King was the first sign of maturity for Prog (the two albums I mentioned earlier are Proto-Prog).
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Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 03:51
| ITCOTCK |
Posted By: friso
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 04:58
| The United States of America (1968) |
Posted By: frankbostick
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 08:50
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ITCOCK, the first true ProgAlbum. |
Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 08:50
Of course. I'm not saying musicians don't influence each other, it's just the whole "without this album, that band could not have created anything similar" gets on my nerves. As if everything was set in stone. ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Posted By: Bosh66
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 10:04
| Seventh Sons' Raga (1964)? Sounds pretty proggy to me! |
Posted By: Gandalff
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 10:29
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The one with screaming face on its cover. ------------- A Elbereth Gilthoniel silivren penna míriel o menel aglar elenath! Na-chaered palan-díriel o galadhremmin ennorath, Fanuilos, le linnathon nef aear, sí nef aearon! |
Posted By: thehallway
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 15:23
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King Crimson's was the only one that is all prog. Shine on Brightly: only the second side is prog. Sgt Pepper: only the last song. Most of the rest are just normal albums with some eccentric sounds or extended jamming. ------------- http://www.thefreshfilmblog.com/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: KABSA
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 16:06
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Deffo Other early prog album worth mentioning: Excellent Soft Psychy Rock-Prog ------------- Tall Tales of Topographic Inconsequence |
Posted By: DiamondDog
Date Posted: August 15 2011 at 23:44
| Got to be Scrapbook. The way the poll is structured, it contains a lot of psychedelia, many of the albums can be defined that way, and that was all leading up to Prog. But out of those on the list, only Scrapbook genuinely contains prog elements that predate and link up to ITCOTCK, the real moment it all gelled. Really, this is two polls in one. |
Posted By: The-time-is-now
Date Posted: August 16 2011 at 04:35
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In the court... -------------  One of my best achievements in life was to find this picture :D |
Posted By: Pastor Rex Cat
Date Posted: August 16 2011 at 22:39
Which artist did Scrapbook? Some of the titles I'm not familiar with. ------------- http://revbookburn.blogspot.com/ http://www.youtube.com/user/rexcat http://www.myspace.com/prxcat Greetings! And Welcome to The Global Internet Church of Prog! Hail the Prog and Praise "Bob"! |
Posted By: Slaughternalia
Date Posted: August 16 2011 at 23:01
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Court seems like the easiest decision ------------- I'm so mad that you enjoy a certain combination of noises that I don't |
Posted By: mrbean667
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 00:15
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King Crimson's is the only album there I call prog, the others, while good, don't really come close.
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Posted By: giselle
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 01:55
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 02:07
| Just out of interest why is Sgt Peppers a 'prog album'? |
Posted By: irrelevant
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 02:21
Influential to prog sure, but not a prog album IMO. ------------- https://gabebuller.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow - New album! http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385 |
Posted By: giselle
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 02:44
| I'd call it psychedelic, rather in the style of early Pink Floyd, but with those great songs. |
Posted By: akaBona
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 04:12
jep  |
Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 05:51
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The received wisdom is that In the Court was the first but I voted for Ars Longa Vita Brevis. There are still some vestiges of The Nice's psychedelic beginnings but most of it (all the second side and the lengthy Karelia) are symphonic prog to my ears. ------------- "And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!" "He's up the pub" |
Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 05:53
You mean like that ten minutes on Moonchild?  ------------- "And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!" "He's up the pub" |
Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 06:54
To my knowledge Ars Longa Vita Brevis was released November '68 while Shine on Brightly was released December '68 (UK dates).
If you have reliable sources stating otherwise I would be interested in knowing these.
But Shine on Brightly was recorded before Ars Longa Vita Brevis. Some material of the former even back in '67 I believe.
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Posted By: JeanFrame
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 09:20
| No one band can claim to be responsible for Prog, though it's true that the genre kicked off publicly with ITCOTKC. But if you had to choose one band from this list whose importance to the genre was crucial, it would have to be Clouds, who were playing the Prog elements on Scrapbook, two years before the recording. |
Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 09:44
I agree with what you say. In addition to Clouds/1-2-3 another major early prog figure is Don Shinn, who also played at the Marquee and has been acknowledged a number of times as a major influence by Keith Emerson. He was doing rocked up classics in 1966.... My efforts to get the very worthy Mr Shinn included in PA have so far met with a deafening wall of indifference.  ------------- "And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!" "He's up the pub" |
Posted By: FunkyHomoSapien
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 09:51
| Yeah, I remember Don Shinn, and Emerson has mentioned him too as you say. |
Posted By: BenevolentBehemoth
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 10:36
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The Soft Machine debut is certainly psych, but their second album is true prog from 1968. Still, Absolutely Free is from 1967 and recorded in 1966, and probably half of it was written by Frank in high school.
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Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 11:01
+1
 The Softs for me.... -------------   
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Posted By: Luna
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 11:30
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They're going to freak out somewhere in Kansas ------------- https://aprilmaymarch.bandcamp.com/track/the-badger" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 11:38
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Somewhat biased voting as it seems to imply that itCotCK is definitely a full prog album although a simultaneous release by Renaissance is listed (actually think the latter came before itCotCK). Less biased had '69 releases by East Of Eden, Amon Duul II, The Collectors, Betales (Abbey Road) been mentioned.
It seems to me that itCotCK was the realization of prog as an album genre perhaps even the realization of symphonic prog as an album genre. Now, which was the first prog folk album or eclectic prog album? The realization of the various prog sub genres as album genres seems to be the more inspiring question to ask.
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Posted By: giselle
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 13:51
| I would personally have been happier with a poll about the elements leading up to Prog and excluding ITCOTKC, which was, at least in the public mind, a defining moment. |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 14:49
| I'd vote for Ummagumma. Should've been on the list methinks. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 16:59
Ok was a month out.  Anyway here is some amazing early footage of The Nice doing Ars Longa Vita Brevis in September 1968 with O'List still in the band (just). |
Posted By: Sheavy
Date Posted: August 17 2011 at 17:11
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Freak Out! ------------- 
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Posted By: resurrection
Date Posted: August 21 2011 at 00:06
| 1-2-3, the logical link to ITCOTKC. |
Posted By: DiamondDog
Date Posted: August 27 2011 at 06:04
| Yep defo |
Posted By: thehallway
Date Posted: August 27 2011 at 15:46
Ouch. Can't argue with that. I'll put you through to Robert Fripp...... ------------- http://www.thefreshfilmblog.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: August 28 2011 at 04:41
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Days of Future Passed from 1967, a full 2 years before ItCotCK. Mike Pinder's use of the mellotron is the best early example of that instrument's capabilities. ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: JeanFrame
Date Posted: September 03 2011 at 11:54
| Mike Pinder was definitely a pioneer of the mellotron, but I don't think Days of Future Passed can be considered prog or anything significantly pre-dating it, though it was certainly stretching the boundaries of art-rock and pop. |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: September 03 2011 at 14:48
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The Moody Blues invented art-rock as I see it. Which was very progressive at the time. It makes me sad how the significance of this fantastic band is constantly downplayed at this otherwise well informed forum. |
Posted By: iluvmarillion
Date Posted: September 04 2011 at 06:05
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[/QUOTE] Anyway here is some amazing early footage of The Nice doing Ars Longa Vita Brevis in September 1968 with O'List still in the band (just). Thanks. Really great performance of the band performing Ars Longa Vita Bravis live on stage. The studio version of the song doesn't do itself justice when compared to this U tube version. Anyway there's a really fine difference between psychedelic rock and progressive rock and since there's no doubt that ITCOTCK is anything but progressive rock, my vote goes to the King Crimson work.
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Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: September 04 2011 at 09:29
------------- 
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Posted By: JeanFrame
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 01:56
"Progressive at the time" is the moot phrase here; I don't downplay the significance of this band, though "invented art-rock" is a bit too strong for me, contributed to the future, certainly. |
Posted By: Stool Man
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 08:23
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Piper - which was the first album by any of The Big Six ------------- rotten hound of the burnie crew |
Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 09:37
Those Nice clips are from a series called Colour Me Pop - the first music show broadcast by the BBC in colour (1968-1969). The original recordings of most of the shows, including the Nice, were wiped by the BBC. I've seen some of the (few) episodes that survive in full colour and they look amazing. Some of the shows lost include Giles, Giles and Fripp, Caravan, Jethro Tull, The Mothers of Invention, Spooky Tooth, Family and Strawbs. Makes you want to weep! ------------- "And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!" "He's up the pub" |
Posted By: kenethlevine
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 11:32
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ditto on the Moodys. Groundbreaking album, not even close to my favourite by them, but cannot be ignored, especially given its year of release and its maturity Out of the hundreds upon hundreds of reviews of ITCOCK, I saw one relatively recently that pointed out the Moodys influence in songs like the title cut and Epitaph, which I had never fully appreciated. Not just the mellotron but the whole grand sweep. Before Crimson fans descend upon me, I actually prefer ITCOCK to DOFP (5 stars vs 4 if I remember correctly), but Moodys got there first IMO |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 14:07
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At least one member of KC has admitted to being inspired by the Moodies. They even brought Tony Clark in as a producer, it didn't work out however. Also, by the time ITHCOTCK was released, Moodies had already made three albums and a fourth came only a month after. (I'm not counting the first, Hayward/Lodge-less album). |
Posted By: kenethlevine
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 14:13
yeah, In Search of the Lost Choprd was pretty progressive too, although also very psych. I thought On the Threshold of a Dream was a bit of a strep back, with more simple pop songs. The 4th of which you speak is "To Our Childrens..." I think. It was very proggy too, perhaps the most in their career, and also the least accessible. But maybe it's because the Moodys are crossover that they don't get as much respect as some of us would like. They were no progressive in the KC sense for sure |
Posted By: DisgruntledPorcupine
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 17:07
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Days of Future Passed |
Posted By: ghost_of_morphy
Date Posted: September 05 2011 at 17:40
-------------
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Posted By: Nash
Date Posted: September 06 2011 at 01:33
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Ars Long vita Brevis, pure innovation and Symphonic Prog ------------- http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/191/sydbarrettg.jpg/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: FunkyHomoSapien
Date Posted: September 14 2011 at 08:22
| Not crazy about Clouds, and some of Scrapbook is naff, but have to admit they were the nearest thing to prog pre Crimson. |
Posted By: DiamondDog
Date Posted: September 18 2011 at 03:05
| A real shame 1-2-3 didn't release anything. |
Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: September 18 2011 at 03:14
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Plenty of worthy contenders available and if forced to go from the list would plump for Renaissance début from '69. There are lots of precusors to this of course but I just feel that their 1st album is the most fully formed and mature statement from the infant genre. If I was allowed to go outside the list, I would take a stab at the Crazy World of Arthur Brown début from '68 ------------- 
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Posted By: motoprog
Date Posted: September 18 2011 at 12:17
| Shine on Brightly |
Posted By: claugroi
Date Posted: September 18 2011 at 18:03
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I really don't know how many of you agree with me, but I think the very first Progressive album (as we know it today) was "Days of Future Past", released in 67 (although the "progressiveness" of Moody Blues would be kept at that level for many years to come, always being consider just as Crossover Prog)... Rubber Soul, Pet Sounds, Freak Out, Revolver, A Quick One, Sgt. Pepper's, The Piper at the Gates of Dawn, Procol Harum, Magical Mystery Tour, The Who Sell Out, Thoughts of Emerlist Davjack, We're Only in it for the Money, Odessey and Oracle, Shine On Brightly, The Beatles (White Album), Ars Longa Vita Brevis, S. F. Sorrow, Yellow Submarine, Tommy, A Salty Dog, Abbey Road and others have all influenced Prog in a way, being cited as influences by prog musicians years later... (I think it's even useless to cite In the Court of the Crimson King and explain about it's importance to the genre, as we all know it, but the thing is that it was released in October 1969...)
------------- Symphonic Prog Master |
Posted By: giselle
Date Posted: September 21 2011 at 06:01
| The crucial band for UK prog was definitely 1-2-3, but as they didn't record (till much later as Clouds), they don't tend to get the credit they deserve, except in the 'serious' reference books. |
Posted By: paganinio
Date Posted: September 22 2011 at 09:47
I listened to it the other day and it reminded me just how far away from prog this was. Progressive music =/= progressive rock. This was lazy, vicious, and probably germ-infested art punk. ------------- 
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Posted By: resurrection
Date Posted: September 25 2011 at 13:24
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Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: September 26 2011 at 08:15
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Shine on Brightly. "In Held 'Twas in I" set the tone for all extended suites that were to follow. And "Skip Softly (My Moonbeams" is pretty progressive as well, going into some strange unexpected territory. the rest of the songs aren't prog per se, but so what.
------------- My other avatar is a Porsche It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
Posted By: NickHall
Date Posted: September 30 2011 at 16:35
| Scrapbook was first genuine prog, but not my favourite. |
Posted By: FunkyHomoSapien
Date Posted: October 05 2011 at 09:43
| listen to America by 1-2-3, from 1967. |