In the Wake of McDonald & Giles

Last thread of this topic was in 2011.

What if the original King Crimson lineup of Fripp, Lake, McDonald, and Giles (and Sinfield) stayed together to record one more album?

Fripp once wrote "Poseidon is half of a stunning album. The Birdman Suite from MacDonald & Giles would have provided the other half.", suggesting that Birdman would have formed the basis of side two.
https://www.dgmlive.com/diaries/Robert%20Fripp/motel-acceptably-modest-rising-to-210916

"Flight of the Ibis" from McDonald & Giles likely would have retained the "Cadence and Cascade" lyrics. The other songs from that album could have been reworked by the whole band for inclusion, possibly creating a double album.

Greg Lake's "Lucky Man" was also rehearsed by the band.
https://www.dgmlive.com/news/basement-dwellers-in-1969

With two full albums plus Greg Lake's compositions from Emerson, Lake & Palmer's debut album, there's a ton of material for a single or double album. What would an alternative "In the Wake of Poseidon" with the original lineup look like?

And what afterwards? How would this have affected the rest of King Crimson's history and Emerson, Lake & Palmer?

Feel free to share your hypothetical track lists for what could have been.

Poseidon would qualify as one of those albums with the thread "Bonus tracks/B-Sides replacing actual album tracks" with Groon replacing those useless Peace pieces. I'm not a big fan of the Mars (Devil's Triangle) piece either.

The A-side is rather good if you don't mind repeating Court's A-side. Cat's Food is excellent, and with Groon and Birdman, this would've been an outstanding album side.


Sooooo, a perfectible album.

If McD (now RIP) regretted leaving decades later, Giles is not sorry, because he couldn't stand the gradual control take-over of the band from Frippy - the latter who called PG a "c**t-in-chief" in the ultimate rockumentary of the band.

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Edited by Sean Trane - June 10 2025 at 11:48

Sean Trane wrote: The A-side is rather good if you don't mind repeating Court's A-side. Cat's Food is excellent, and with Groon and Birdman, this would've been an outstanding album side.

It would if Birdman was more concise so that all three songs would fit on that one side. If not, maybe Cat Food and Groon still get a non-album single release.

Sean Trane wrote: If McD (now RIP) regretted leaving decades later, Giles is not sorry, because he couldn't stand the gradual control take-over of the band from Frippy - the latter who called PG a "c**t-in-chief" in the ultimate rockumentary of the band.

We can't predict exactly what would happen, but something tells me McDonald, Giles, and Lake all would have left right after this album and we still would have gotten the rest of the King Crimson albums as they were, and ELP would be unaffected unless "Lucky Man" or "Take a Pebble" ended up on Poseidon.

Several songs on McDonald and Giles were actually written when King Crimson were touring ...which is telling. Somewhere along the way it seemed that they planned to record some of these songs for the next K.C. release. They were in fact performing "Trees" in 1969, but in the end was chosen for the Birdman Suite.

Michael Giles couldn't stand the road. As he stated in the past..you were cooped up on a bus or flown by plane....then in a hotel...then on to a stage...then back on a bus...which!..is the routine of a circus worker or circus animal . Constantly being caged back up after a performance then transported ...then let loose to perform again. I actually lived that life in the 70s and 80s. If you're not cut out for it ...it will drive you mad.

On the Michael Giles album Progress you see him standing by the railroad tracks with his drum gear ...possibly waiting for the train into London to do sessions. Maybe he was happier knowing that he could return home each night. Nevertheless traveling with King Crimson wasn't a healthy way of life for him.

Edited by Jacob Schoolcraft - June 10 2025 at 17:06

Dellinger wrote: I really wish Crimson had recorded this one other album with the original lineup.

Hi,

I can honestly say, I do NOT.

It would have been the same thing, chapter 2, more than likely, even though we think that some parts and pieces might have shown up and be somewhere else.

I like how things ended up. I feel bad for the 2 folks that got hurt in the whole thing, and even for RF's attitude at the time, though in the special on KC he regretted some things he said or did.

I kinda think that we are spending time, regurgitating some really bizarre and weird stuff. In general, all we are doing is second guessing everyone's choices and parts in all this. And while things might not have turned out as we might have liked to see, in my book they turned out perfect ... ELP went on to do magnificent work. KC continued to do magnificent work.

It is the nature of things ... and rock music is not going to change that anytime soon, specially when it is controlled by fans, and has nothing to do with an art form at all when the special parts that make it progressive or different from anything else, are removed ... so it can become the same as all the other pieces out there ... just what many folks here want ... a top 40 and more pop music to be a hit!

Logan wrote: I'm really out of my depth here without doing any research. I wish I had something intelligent and knowledgeable to add to this topic now, but I want to mention that I love In the Wake of Poseidon as it is.

Me too. All of the ‘what if’s’ are interesting to ponder, but It’s a fine album as is. I’ve heard many of the re-mixes as well, and my favorites are the 30th anniversary mixes. They sound so good at high volume and middle settings. Excellent mixes.