Two 19 minute epics from 2025
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Printed Date: July 17 2025 at 23:34
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Topic: Two 19 minute epics from 2025
Posted By: Logan
Subject: Two 19 minute epics from 2025
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 11:37
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Two bands formed in the 80s known for being heavy (in rather different ways) each with an epic of similar lengths, but also are apples and oranges, so to speak, stylistically. There is no both or neither option. If either of these are at all to your tastes, which do you prefer? Dream Theater - The Shadow Man Incident (Parasomnia) Swans - [Rope] Away (Birthing) ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Replies:
Posted By: Saperlipopette!
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 11:48
| (Swans video unavailable, at least for me) - Rope (Away) is amazing, so I just voted for it without giving Dream Theater a listen. |
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 11:48
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One is Swans, one is Dream Theater. I'll go with Swans. ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 11:56
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^^ Here it is on bandcamp for those whose region it will not show up in from youtube and don't know it already. And I too find it amazing (that and "Birthing" were the two that stood the most for me at first, EDIT: And "The Healers" of course, whole thing I really like). https://swans.bandcamp.com/track/rope-away" rel="nofollow - https://swans.bandcamp.com/track/rope-away One criticism of both based on these tracks might be that they are rather each repeating their same formulae rather than trying to be innovative and fresh with something new... It's not problem for me with Swans, as I love that kind of Swans. ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Posted By: Gnik Nosmirc
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 12:02
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I couldn't care for DT or metal, but Swans is amazing! ------------- Jazz Rock / Fusion · Canterbury · Psych / Space Rock · Krautrock · Prog Electronic · RIO / Avant-Prog · Post Rock |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 12:12
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Swans has been one of the most important bands to me, especially this decade which is when I got to deeply exploring its music especially from Children of God up. I love Swans. ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Posted By: verslibre
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 12:49
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I didn't bother with the first and played the second. The vote goes to Swans. ------------- https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_ipg=50&_sop=1&_rdc=1&_ssn=musicosm" rel="nofollow - eBay |
Posted By: essexboyinwales
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 12:55
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The love for DT is surely unrivalled on this thread….. ------------- Heaven is waiting but waiting is Hell |
Posted By: Saperlipopette!
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 13:04
Only very few are best at being an ever-changing artistic chameleon, and I don't really look for that quality in art. |
Logan wrote:Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 13:52
I agree with you. It's unmistakably Swans (unless someone ripped them off very well). It's part of a universe of its own creation. And if the next album is something of a throwback to the folkier side of Gira like Angels of Light, My Father Will Guide Me Up a Rope to the Sky, White Light From the Mouth of Infinity, and leaving meaning. music, I won't complain. ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 15:53
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I'm a big DT fan, but in this case I have to go with Swans. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to: 
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 15:59
Yes, but only in terms of style. And I think that's really fine! Both bands have established a recognizable and quite unique style for themselves. Putting out a new record in that signature style is awesome. But they also need to have an important message to communicate. I think that DT kind of hopped over that part when they got together and wrote the album in a hurry. I really think it had the potential of putting them back on the map as the kings of prog metal, had they given it some more thought instead of just going "through the motions". ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa" rel="nofollow - Release Polls Listened to:
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Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 16:04
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Yeah, 0:8 now. ------------- I make typos so you see I'm not a machine, but I may be a machine pretending to not be a machine. |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 07 2025 at 17:22
Agreed on style. I have no problem with it. Both releases are very significant ones in heir own ways, and I might have expected Dream Theater to try to be a bit more mind-blowing, I guess, with the return of Portnoy, but seems fine to me. And Gira said that for Swans it is supposed to be the last of the big-sound albums, which makes it something the end of an era. I'd be very happy to see an eclectic album from Swans that has one epic track that leads to one of those big crashing crescendos, some much smaller sounding tracks (with or without a crescendo diminuto, perhaps also known as the little orgasm to some), and a variety of "medium-sound" music (maybe with a "medius crescendo"). ;) I'd like to see the return of Jarboe for one more Swans album. Not only has she had a significant stylistic influence on Gira/Swans, but it brought some wonderful contrast to Swans. ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: June 08 2025 at 01:34
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^ I don't think DT have it in them anymore. JP is too busy selling Whiskey and beard grooming products. JR is goofing around with AI and learning to play the guitar. JLB is barely managing to sing some simplified version of their songs. JM has never been a driving force from what I can tell. MP is just happily drumming along in his signature style. All well and fine, but unfortunately it's not the kind of environment which yields exceptionally good music. It's much more likely that they'll keep playing it safe. |
Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: June 08 2025 at 07:59
| Another Swans vote. I got the Swans album but don't have a proper listen yet, though (Rope) Away was one I liked and remembered from the show I saw last year. For me, style-wise, Swans is going to win over DT. But I did listen to the first 5 minutes of the DT song. |
Posted By: Enchant X
Date Posted: June 09 2025 at 05:41
Oh I voted for DT I don't think Swans are my type of thing. 
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 09 2025 at 06:27
Hi, I was thinking that MP was more worried about having 2 sets of drums, half of which never get used, to show how he, and DT, can throw money out the window for music that is no longer ... relevant. I'm not sure they will stick to keeping it safe, but I think the band is close to going poof, to the magic dragon. and seeing the Rick Beatto thing with Jordan Rudess, I get the feeling that he is working on his ticket out of the band, since he can't do a whole lot of the quality of music that he can bring up, and end up doing some more thrashing instead. Hard to tell, but I think that they are about to get a wake up call, sooner or later. I hate to see that on any band, but when all you're doing is repeating yourself, and not working to include the other musicians talents and abilities, it begs the question as to what the band is there for. ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 09 2025 at 10:25
I would hope that people don't judge Swans based on very limited material as this is a project (of Michael Gira) that has been going since the early 80s and has had various iterations and can be quite eclectic. There are significant differences between, say, Filth (1983), Children of God (1987), The Burning World (1989), White Light From the Mouth of Infinity (1991), The Great Annihilator (1995), Soundtracks for the Blind (1996), To Be Kind (2014)... But it sure helps if one is into experimental rock (and kinds of folk and alternative rock). Being into things like post-rock and Krautrock helps, as well as various folk music... And my impression has been that your tastes are more on the melodic metal/ melodic rock and conventional side (we do seem to have some very different tastes). Looking at your ratings page, the closest band I can immediately associate any of its music with is Pink Floyd like with The Sound: But then that is hardly worlds apart from the track I posted so I would not expect you to like it. That's also the "big sound" Swans. You might quite enjoy the not big sound and more conventional stuff like Blind, for instance: I really got into Swans after exploring the music due to someone being dismissive of Swans after only hearing the earliest material. I did not turn that person into a fan, although he does at least like some music from them now, but I did turn myself into a big fan, and Swans has had a very significant influence on my tastes and interests. By the way, Swans, has worked with your fellow countrymen, The Necks. ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: June 11 2025 at 02:56
 I voted for DT , I have no shame
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Posted By: Grumpyprogfan
Date Posted: June 11 2025 at 03:15
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Posted By: essexboyinwales
Date Posted: June 11 2025 at 06:52
Me too. I tried the Swan’s track for about 7 minutes but it was pretty boring…. ------------- Heaven is waiting but waiting is Hell |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 11 2025 at 13:17
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^ Maybe it should come with a warning. This music builds very slowly, do not attempt unless one is into very atmospheric, ambient music else boredom is almost sure to ensue. To me it's panoramic and immersive and not at all boring, but of course it depends on what music one is used to and into. There is Swans that to me is satisfyingly mesmerising, cathartic and transcendent that will just be a total borefest, or in one ear and out the other, or just noisy, to others. Vive la difference. I can appreciate that it would test the patience of many. Swans can require something of a commitment. Time for the BTS ("Bring the Sun", is there any other BTS?) girls reaction video to Swans 1996's "Helpless Child" (one of the greatest tracks ever for me) to hopefully breathe a little more emotion (and a little less boredom) into this: ;) ------------- Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me. |