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Stefanovic 
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Joined: November 01 2006 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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 Posted: November 04 2006 at 16:59 |
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Indeed, that was a lot of crap from someone who listened a sh*tload of times to the album then spent a sh*tload of time destroying it just for the sake of it... Tell me about counter-productive reviews... It's okay to have harsh opinions about a band, an album, a song... It's okay to write it on the forums but wouldn't time be better used pointing at what you actually like when writing a review?...
Imo, this is just plain provocation...
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Easy Livin
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 16:58 |
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Atkingani and I have it under consideration. Some editing may be the result.
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Certif1ed
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Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 08 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 7559 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 16:49 |
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I'd like bristolstc to sign up and discuss this in the forums - I'd be happy to set him right
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Certif1ed
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Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 08 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 7559 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 16:47 |
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I agree entirely. I could rip that apart - but why bother? The insults are there for all to see - they're not even veiled. Insulting language is against the rules, as we all know. It's OK to trash an album you don't like - but you can't just spew out a stream of insults and stand by them as "just my opinion, man". |
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 15:48 |
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Everybody has the right to give his opinion but I have my severe doubts about Bristolstc his review because he spents an awful lot of time to nail an album in a very theatrical agressive and provoking way, this is a bridge too far in my opinion. I am on the brink to nail some of Bristolstc his favorites in the same way but I have just grown up last year
 Edited by erik neuteboom - November 04 2006 at 15:51 |
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eugene
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Joined: May 30 2005 Location: Ukraine Status: Offline Points: 2703 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 15:45 |
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Be condescending, people. Guy used to listen seriously to this album, and suddenly he realised what a crap it is. This is serious crash of illusion. Illusion is dead, and he feels terrible about it, it's like being robbed of something very precious. It will take time to realise that Hoggarth is no way better than Fish, and we shall have a pleasure (or displeasure) to read another review of the kind (or even worse). Anyway everybody has the right to express his feelings on free forums in free society.
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carefulwiththataxe
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stonebeard
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Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 15:25 |
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Stonebeard angry!
Smash and crush!
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Atkingani
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: October 21 2005 Location: Terra Brasilis Status: Offline Points: 12291 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 14:36 |
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Oh! My ears...
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Guigo
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Ricochet
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Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 27 2005 Location: Nauru Status: Offline Points: 46301 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:55 |
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MARILLION — Script For A Jester's Tear
Review by bristolstc
color: agressive tone the "cloning" issue how..."subjeKctive" & "objeKctive"sorry for the tone. Edited by Ricochet - November 04 2006 at 13:55 |
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Ricochet
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Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 27 2005 Location: Nauru Status: Offline Points: 46301 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:47 |
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I believe I must express my opinion that even the 1 star opinions can be made objectively, interestingly and diplomatically, above everything else. Contrary to that peach type of a reviewer, this one can only complain, like it's the grossest thing ever to experience. His language is vile and exactly harsh as to shock and to stirr. Plus that he sounds deeply purist, towards the neo-prog movement, he also doesn't understand the difference between a rip-off and a major influence (the eternal conflict of Fish "imitating" Gabriel, Marillion doing the Genesis-like steps etc.) please re-consider, Easy, because things like this can go better and more...appealing. |
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stonebeard
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Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:34 |
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Taken form his review of Tales from the Lost Attic:
"A great band who don't deserve to be called "neo prog," that's not what they were about. IQ were and are a real progressive band, and they will always be one of my favourite bands of the 80s, particularly for having really moving vocalists (especially Peter Nicholls)."
Wouldn't it be nice if in every one of my reviews, I made mention of a genre I don't like and said how much better this album is than that annoying, piece-of-sh*t, RIO eh?
This guy would probably jump at the chance to sniff Peter Gabrial's used costumes just to remember the smell when he goes to w**k off at night is his lonely apartment.
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tardis
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Joined: October 02 2005 Location: Victoria, BC Status: Offline Points: 14378 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:29 |
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Shoddy circumcisions...
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stonebeard
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Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:27 |
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That person is a douchebag and needs to be repeadly given shoddy circumscisions until he passes out.
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tardis
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Joined: October 02 2005 Location: Victoria, BC Status: Offline Points: 14378 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:24 |
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The production is horrible and sounds like any other bad 80s production
job, the lyrics are made even worse by Fish's delivery which is to
scream, grunt, and yowl every word like someone has just stuck a knife
in his back (wishful thinking)...
Even if you dislike Fish, doesn't wishing a knife to be stuck in his back go a little over the edge, even for extreme dislike of a musician? Btw, hopefully Cyggie won't see this... Edited by tardis - November 04 2006 at 13:25 |
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Easy Livin
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:15 |
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We need to be careful to differentiate between reviews which we disagree with, and those which need to be dealt with.
Here, I believe the reviewer is giving his honest opinion of the music. While his comments are harsh, I do not believe they are insulting or breach any guidelines.
On a personal basis, I find the review to be unpalatable as I disagree strongly with the opinions expressed. From a reviews moderation point of view though, I can see nothing which warrants intervention.
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Stefanovic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 01 2006 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 287 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 13:05 |
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I'd second that Ricochet !
"Fish is a TECHNICALLY HORRIBLE SINGER who writes awful lyrics"
 show us yours Mystic Fred...
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Ricochet
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Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 27 2005 Location: Nauru Status: Offline Points: 46301 |
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Posted: November 04 2006 at 12:59 |
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I just hate that. please admin, arse him!
 Edited by Easy Livin - November 04 2006 at 13:09 |
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Atkingani
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: October 21 2005 Location: Terra Brasilis Status: Offline Points: 12291 |
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Posted: November 03 2006 at 12:17 |
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OK, eventual discussions about Kansas' "Power" review to be done here. Thanks!
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Guigo
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 46805 |
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Posted: November 03 2006 at 04:58 |
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Posted Tuesday, December 30, 2003 This review has troubled me big time. Power may not be a Kansas masterpiece but stating that it is "pop-rock a la Bon Jovi" is an exaggeration, a huge mistake. It's a mean and close minded thing to say. Any thoughts? Edited by Cristi - November 03 2006 at 04:59 |
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Atkingani
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: October 21 2005 Location: Terra Brasilis Status: Offline Points: 12291 |
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Posted: October 19 2006 at 19:40 |
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Not neccessarily, Ansen... reviews discussed here may be edited, kept untouched or, sometimes, even deleted. For the case of edition (what seems to be the case) we normally contact the reviewer but first we have to be sure about the extent of the edition.
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Guigo
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erik neuteboom wrote:
I used to LISTEN seriously to THIS!!!!? What was I on!? Marillion together with
Arena (who just happened to be a much later spinoff/imitation) were the most
vulgar insult to progressive music ever created, because they not only created
"neo prog," but all the evil hypocrisies that go along with it. Let's start first in the
vocal/lyric department. Fish is an awful singer who tried not very hard to clone
Peter Gabriel's approach circa Lamb Lies Down and Trespass. His screeching,
histrionic, overbearing vocals sound more like a really bad imitation of Iron
Maiden's Bruce Dickinson and though I'm not a great fan of Maiden, at least they
didn't pretend to be something they weren't. The lyrics are written at first you
think from someone whose heart is at least in the right place, but then you
realize a tantrum throwing track like "Forgotten Sons" which sounds pro British
Soldier anti IRA on first listening is just an excuse to write another twisted and
violent song about death (what is by the way wrong with that,hm?). Fish is the real problem here, choking you and
suffocating you, but the whole band are a problem. This whole record is a lie.
Progressive rock? No way!!! Marillion like all neo prog are like a bad marriage of
overproduced heavy metal and smug allusions to a kind of music not only the
band could care less about or understand, but a kind of music people didn't
understand who liked this nonsense. There isn't one passage here that I can
listen to, in fact I will never listen to anything by Marillion with Fish again and
haven't for years! To give credit where credit is due, after Fish left Marillion
released TWO good albums (oh,marillion are suddenly good, with Hogarth on vocals,hm?)- Season's End (I've really just been told its good by a
friend of mine) and Holidays In Eden (this is great and you should listen to what
an improvement Steve Hogarth is), actually- make that two good records and one
pretty good attempt at making a concept album- the underrated and very
listenable Brave. Back to this disaster, though, no matter how hard Marillion
would try to avoid the mistakes of their past (what past was there before Script, hm?), they had commited the worst insult
to progressive music ever with Fish and there is no forgiving them for it. The
production is horrible and sounds like any other bad 80s production job, the lyrics
are made even worse by Fish's delivery which is to scream, grunt, and yowl every
word like someone has just stuck a knife in his back (wishful thinking), and the
playing is so clunky that every tempo or mood change turns into a nightmarish
exercise in inept arrogant w**king (didn't know w**king is a legit word, hm?) The whole sound is bad, and Fish gets the
bad music he deserves here. Neo prog? I'm even growing tired of IQ who I still
have to admit I have a soft spot for (maybe because they didn't fake things and
were honest) and I strongly feel there were things more "progressive" in Shy,
Grand Prix, Tobruk, and the other Brit/American hard pomp rock bands. Pomp was
what prog turned into, not this neo nonsense. The absolute worst track on the
album is "Forgotten Sons" made even worse by the fact you know a bad imitation
of "The Knife" is coming for a whole album. He even has the nerve to use the line
"For Those Who Trespass Against Us" in it! What would the average soldier who
Fish is trying to convince do to him? Sock him in the jaw! He'd probably more
likely be a Deep Purple fan than a Marillion fan anyway. Give me Maiden if I want
to be put into a painful state of mind when listening. The problem is that Bruce
Dickinson was technically a very good singer who didn't always have the best
material, Fish is a TECHNICALLY HORRIBLE SINGER who writes awful lyrics to go
with awful material. There is no way to erase the shameful stain left on music by
neo prog, and it began and was obnoxious here. Not even music 
I used to LISTEN seriously to THIS!!!!? What was I on!? Marillion together with Arena (who just happened to be a much later spinoff/imitation) were the most vulgar insult to progressive music ever created, because they not only created "neo prog," but all the evil hypocrisies that go along with it. Let's start first in the vocal/lyric department. Fish is an awful singer who tried not very hard to clone Peter Gabriel's approach circa Lamb Lies Down and Trespass. His screeching, histrionic, overbearing vocals sound more like a really bad imitation of Iron Maiden's Bruce Dickinson and though I'm not a great fan of Maiden, at least they didn't pretend to be something they weren't. The lyrics are written at first you think from someone whose heart is at least in the right place, but then you realize a tantrum throwing track like "Forgotten Sons" which sounds pro British Soldier anti IRA on first listening is just an excuse to write another twisted and violent song about death. Fish is the real problem here, choking you and suffocating you, but the whole band are a problem. This whole record is a lie. Progressive rock? No way!!! Marillion like all neo prog are like a bad marriage of overproduced heavy metal and smug allusions to a kind of music not only the band could care less about or understand, but a kind of music people didn't understand who liked this nonsense. There isn't one passage here that I can listen to, in fact I will never listen to anything by Marillion with Fish again and haven't for years! To give credit where credit is due, after Fish left Marillion released TWO good albums- Season's End (I've really just been told its good by a friend of mine) and Holidays In Eden (this is great and you should listen to what an improvement Steve Hogarth is), actually- make that two good records and one pretty good attempt at making a concept album- the underrated and very listenable Brave. Back to this disaster, though, no matter how hard Marillion would try to avoid the mistakes of their past, they had commited the worst insult to progressive music ever with Fish and there is no forgiving them for it. The production is horrible and sounds like any other bad 80s production job, the lyrics are made even worse by Fish's delivery which is to scream, grunt, and yowl every word like someone has just stuck a knife in his back (wishful thinking), and the playing is so clunky that every tempo or mood change turns into a nightmarish exercise in inept arrogant w**king. The whole sound is bad, and Fish gets the bad music he deserves here. Neo prog? I'm even growing tired of IQ who I still have to admit I have a soft spot for (maybe because they didn't fake things and were honest) and I strongly feel there were things more "progressive" in Shy, Grand Prix, Tobruk, and the other Brit/American hard pomp rock bands. Pomp was what prog turned into, not this neo nonsense. The absolute worst track on the album is "Forgotten Sons" made even worse by the fact you know a bad imitation of "The Knife" is coming for a whole album. He even has the nerve to use the line "For Those Who Trespass Against Us" in it! What would the average soldier who Fish is trying to convince do to him? Sock him in the jaw! He'd probably more likely be a Deep Purple fan than a Marillion fan anyway. Give me Maiden if I want to be put into a painful state of mind when listening. The problem is that Bruce Dickinson was technically a very good singer who didn't always have the best material, Fish is a TECHNICALLY HORRIBLE SINGER who writes awful lyrics to go with awful material. There is no way to erase the shameful stain left on music by neo prog, and it began and was obnoxious here. Not even music 