Giving A Clone Five Stars

AAAAH!

Textbook wrote: I intended to participate more in this discussion but I still haven't recovered from Octopus 4's claim that Fugazi were a Genesis clone.

rdtprog wrote: JS19 wrote: Slartibartfast wrote: A clone is an exact musical duplicate so I can only apply that to some tribute bands.  Just because a band borrows heavily from a style that's been done before doesn't mean that they can't put out a five star. Never quite got the whole 'clone' thing. People say Phideaux sounds like older prog. No, Phideaux sounds like Phideaux. Each and every band I hear is influenced by others yes, but only when you can't tell the difference between the two (try Asgard and Fish era Marillion), can you use the word clone. I see a difference between Asgard and Marillion. Listen only to the use of Keyboards, or the album Esoteric poem wich is the opposite of any Marillion's cd...

I don't hear any similarities between the two, aside from a general 80's type production sheen (including 80's sounding keyboards and guitars).  Frankly, I've always been baffled by the idea that the singers of those two groups sound even remotely alike (or even Asgard's singer and Gabriel........or Fish and Gabriel for that matter).  To me, I just don't hear it at all (and I'm a singer and musician).

Now, if you want to compare Citizen Cains first album to Marillion, or second album to Genesis, that's a different story entirely..............

But they are still not "clones" by any stretch of the imagination.  I've listened to the Wobbler album a couple times now, and I think the Yes comparisons are a little overblown.  The vocals, sure.  Any vocalist that can sing in the registers Jon Anderson does is bound to sound like him to proggers who have listened to Yes before.  The bass sound is a bit like Squire's, but I hear that on all sorts of prog albums.  The bottom line is that the lyrics, compositions, and arrangements don't sound like anything from Yes.  Because they aren't.  So, not a clone.  Also not the most innovative and original music you'll hear, but since when has that ever been a criteria for enjoying, or making, music?  Of course, the OP may not believe Progressive Rock is a genre at all, but instead an approach to making music, so in that sense I guess a lot of what is on this site would be "clones" (including a lot of Yes albums, since Close to the Edge sounds an awful lot like Fragile to me, and so on )

Anthony H. wrote: If I have to see ANOTHER thread like this on PA, I don't know what I'm going to do.

It seems to be the OP's MO. Cloning indeed. I'm just surprised how many people take the bait.

SEB2112 said: "to be honest my well-documented beef with the Wobbler album isn't as much that it's a clone, but that it is clearly a throwback album. They go out of their way to sound like its still the 70's, and that, to me, is quite the opposite of being PROGRESSIVE"

Slartibartfast wrote: A clone is an exact musical duplicate so I can only apply that to some tribute bands.  Just because a band borrows heavily from a style that's been done before doesn't mean that they can't put out a five star.

Edited by JS19 - August 08 2011 at 14:45

richardh wrote: Guldbamsen wrote: richardh wrote: Guldbamsen wrote: What about artists who clone themselves? Biglietto per L´Inferno recently re-did their debut, Tangerine Dream has done several new versions of old material like Phaedra and Tangram, Nik Turner´s Sphinx underwent considerable surgery as well, and how about that Mike Oldfield? None of the mentioned examples here would get anything near 5 stars just for the record. Especially the TD and Nik Turner ones are really awful. We´re talking classic albums thrown in the "let´s make it modern and contemporary"-machine, and such a thing should be outlawed if I had my say. The scary thought however is, that these fabulous musicians at some point in time honestly felt it was a brilliant idea....   I havn't heard the re-recordings of Tangram or Phaedra but I do like the Booster series that features reworkings of old tracks like Logos and Sphinx Lightning (+ some new material)   Does JM Jarre's reissue of Oxygene count? Apparently it was totally re-recorded yet can anyone really tell the difference compared to the original release?         I like the Booster series as well, although I much prefer Cloudburst Flight in its original form Back on topic: A very good "clone" album is Babylon´s sole album from 78. I really like The Mote in God´s Eye.  As to giving a clone five stars - I don´t know what to think. I´d rate Marillion´s Fugazi 5 stars, and a lot of people write them off as Genesis clones - although I don´t hear it on Fugazi. The one where I hear the Genesis parallels is the debut.    Fugazi is my favourite Fish era Marillion album and I agree that it sounds nothing like Genesis. The main connection was Fish's voice sounding like Peter Gabriel .Pete Nicholls (IQ) also had the same thing levelled at him. ( I love IQ btw)   My favourite 'clone album' would likely be Glass Hammer Chronomotree which sounds like Yes,Genesis and ELP at various points but is very enjoyable. Personally I think they have now become too much of a Yes clone with their latest album If.

richardh wrote: Guldbamsen wrote: What about artists who clone themselves? Biglietto per L´Inferno recently re-did their debut, Tangerine Dream has done several new versions of old material like Phaedra and Tangram, Nik Turner´s Sphinx underwent considerable surgery as well, and how about that Mike Oldfield? None of the mentioned examples here would get anything near 5 stars just for the record. Especially the TD and Nik Turner ones are really awful. We´re talking classic albums thrown in the "let´s make it modern and contemporary"-machine, and such a thing should be outlawed if I had my say. The scary thought however is, that these fabulous musicians at some point in time honestly felt it was a brilliant idea....   I havn't heard the re-recordings of Tangram or Phaedra but I do like the Booster series that features reworkings of old tracks like Logos and Sphinx Lightning (+ some new material)   Does JM Jarre's reissue of Oxygene count? Apparently it was totally re-recorded yet can anyone really tell the difference compared to the original release?

Guldbamsen wrote: What about artists who clone themselves? Biglietto per L´Inferno recently re-did their debut, Tangerine Dream has done several new versions of old material like Phaedra and Tangram, Nik Turner´s Sphinx underwent considerable surgery as well, and how about that Mike Oldfield? None of the mentioned examples here would get anything near 5 stars just for the record. Especially the TD and Nik Turner ones are really awful. We´re talking classic albums thrown in the "let´s make it modern and contemporary"-machine, and such a thing should be outlawed if I had my say. The scary thought however is, that these fabulous musicians at some point in time honestly felt it was a brilliant idea....

tamijo wrote:  (...) and there could never be a rule that "We Can't Dance" should not get 5 stars (...)