Why did Roger Waters never get beyond The Wall? |
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silverpot
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: March 19 2008 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 841 |
Posted: July 14 2015 at 10:18 | ||
Gilmour's tour starts in Croatia september 12, so the album will probably be out by then. I have tickets to the Royal Albert Hall the 24:th. Yay!!!! |
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Gentle Yes
Forum Groupie Joined: July 07 2015 Location: greece Status: Offline Points: 65 |
Posted: July 14 2015 at 12:37 | ||
Well first of all I think we can agree that The wall was the peak of Waters' lyricism and creativity. (musically i'd rather say it was DSOTM) . Second of all, i'm preety sure that Waters was the brains behind Floyd without showing it. I think that when he left , Pink Floyd contined selling that much because of the name they had already built as PF and of course because of Gilmour, I mean you can clearly see the difference in songwriting on Division Bell, you hear Gilmour and not Waters..at all.. it was something different and was well perceived by the audience whereas Waters' solo career was just not that well accepted... it may be that simple :)
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20619 |
Posted: July 14 2015 at 16:27 | ||
He ran out of decent ideas.......?
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 17370 |
Posted: July 16 2015 at 08:34 | ||
I tend to not look at Roger, singled out, any more than I do any of the other members of the group. They are/were all very good, given the personality differences, and I'm not sure that criticizing Roger's opinionated nature is a good reason to criticize a work, when most works of art in the 20th century have all had their own way, in this area. Criticism and opinion has always been a part of art ... like saying that a Delacroix, or Goya or many other romantic painters, for example, did not have any "ideas" in their work. My favorite example was the Goya painting that Luis Bunuel memorialized in "The Phantom of Liberty", when the character screamed "freedom" before he was shot! I tend to think that as a society, we're starting to be critical of people that have opinions, because we can not articulate, or agree, on anything ... and this board's comments are the perfect example, of some of the things that hurt the arts the most. We're here to uphold "one" art, but we spend time criticizing it. I do not find that very "progressive" as an attitude, or appreciation for the music. Roger, in my book, is a part of an artist in the 20th century, called "Pink Floyd" ... and as such is a part of my admiration for the century's exciting and important artistic ideas, that happened to involve many of us! Edited by moshkito - July 16 2015 at 08:44 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Intruder
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 13 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2142 |
Posted: July 18 2015 at 22:41 | ||
Right on, mosh. The Floyd after Syd were a group and the music reflected that....it started to go south when that Roger and Rick magic peaked on Dark Side. Wish and Animals were great albums but, to me, some of Rick's parts drag a bit, especially on Animals - like Roger said, if Rick had brought some of that stuff he saved for those solo records that nobody listened to, thing might have been different.
Roger's solo stuff began with the Wall and everything after sounds in that same vein - nice stuff but no spacy Rick, no Gilmore gravy on top of everything and no heartbeat Nick.....and everything from the Wall to Amused suffers greatly because of these holes. Clapton, Beck et al bring KAOS and Amused to life a bit but not nearly enough to make me return to either record very often. Pros and Cons is a great idea....wish Floyd had chosen that and left the Wall for later. What must grate Roger even more than the Floyd case is that, solowise, Gilmore is just hitting his prime at his advanced age - he always was a spacy, slow motion bluesy guitarist. His newer solo stuff is full of groovy atmospheric playing, perfect for those Floyd fans from the early days who are now pushing 70. Somnambulant - should be a new genre on PA. .
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I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator Prog Folk Joined: April 29 2004 Location: Heart of Europe Status: Offline Points: 20193 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 02:56 | ||
Did Waters actually say that ?? I have for the better part on the last 3.5 decades, but I've never actually read that anywhere that he stated so as well. And he might have thought the same of Gilmour in that case.
Well, TFC is so different because it goes back to oragn & piano (no synths we'd gotten so used to since DSOTM) Yes, P&C is a great idea (I'd also have loved to have the full Floyd doing it), but I can undertsand that the choice between that and The Wall , they chose what they did. OK, what must be said, is that despite the fact that Gilmour & Wright didn't propose anything worthy, Waters came with these huge blocks, where there wasn't that much space for the others. Sure, Gilmour gets 4 credits (and not the least songs either) on The Wall, but imagine how so much better it would've been if if Wright had had the same amount.
You've got to be kidding!!! On An Island is a total bore and if you've heard the future single (Rattle That Lock)? It sounds like it is a leftover from About Face, with bad 80's production values to boot. TBH, I'm not impressed much with Gilmour songwriting abilities without the help of both Wright (for the arrangements) & Waters (for lyrics) Ever since that "Waters left Floyd" thing, Gilmour has only written one really good song (High Hopes) that didn't sound like it was derivative of old Floyd tunes, such as Cluster One or Signs Of Life - who both sounds erected from Shine On You CD. I was not impressed with About Face at all, and only half of the songs on his debut album are good or really good; while I like that DG77 album, it's clear that it's lacking something... something I don't find lacking in Wright's Wet Dream album of that same era (even if it sounds like an APP album) |
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Intruder
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 13 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2142 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 18:51 | ||
Wright's solo stuff is at least interesting, especially Wet Dreams (Mel Collins!), but like the first Gilmore solo record it is missing something.....but that could be said of all Floyd solo albums, including the Final Cut (that second side could use a bit of "music").
Edited by Intruder - July 19 2015 at 19:05 |
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I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Intruder
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 13 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2142 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 18:56 | ||
There's an Uncut magazine with Roger from 2000 where he made that remark about Wright's solo stuff. There was some great stuff on Wet Dreams - even Snowy White doing his best Gilmore. Waters felt if he'd brought some of that music to the Floyd, then things would've been different.
Gilmore's About Face has a few great moments.....even a radio "hit", but the whole thing sounds like he's trying too hard for airplay.
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I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Barbu
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 09 2005 Location: infinity Status: Offline Points: 30850 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 19:55 | ||
Nothing wrong with About Face as far as I'm concerned : a good record from a great guitarist. What were you expecting, a Floyd record?
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Chris S
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 09 2004 Location: Front Range Status: Offline Points: 7028 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 20:54 | ||
^
I would say there is nothing wrong with it but not as good as his debut. Mind you the 80's was a challenge for these guys with all the synths and mullet hair do's.
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...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...[/COLOR] |
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Dellinger
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: June 18 2009 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 12695 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 21:57 | ||
I never knew Waters had those opinions about Wright... and that puts his grudge against Wright in a slightly better light for me. At least I do agree with him in this matter. I used to think it was Waters who wanted to take control of the band and the writing of the music, even though I did read about him complaining that Wright and Gilmour were not contributing enough. Now, even though I do find Wet Dream an enjoyable album, indeed if Wright had offered the music for Floyd, and it was used in The Wall, this album might have ended up being a really wonderful record... for I do feel that it lacks something... and that something is exactly more Wright (and even some more Gilmour). |
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 22:04 | ||
And this is a well known fact : Roger Waters fired Richard Wright during the sessions for 1979's 'The Wall,' but then brought him back as a contract-labor sideman for the subsequent, money-losing tour. That made Wright the only member of Pink Floyd not to lose money on the tour. He wouldn't become a full-time member of the group again until 1994's 'The Division Bell.' |
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 22:08 | ||
No one in their serious mind can believe that Gilmour's new album is better than anything Waters made after he left PF, seriously
Welcome to the bad 80's here: David Gilmour - Rattle That Lock (Audio) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHP7l0EaouM
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 22:11 | ||
My final verdict is no Floyd is better without either Waters or Gilmour. They are like Lennon and McCartney
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 22:17 | ||
Everyone thinks problems between Roger Waters and David Gilmour surfaced around 'The Wall.' In truth, friction already existed during the run-up to 1969's 'Ummagumma.' Each member had been tasked with constructing a solo contribution. When Gilmour asked Waters for some lyrical help, his response was a simple "no."
hahahaha!!! Waters is very naughty lol |
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Chris S
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 09 2004 Location: Front Range Status: Offline Points: 7028 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 23:33 | ||
IMO The Wall lacks nothing :-)
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...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...[/COLOR] |
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 19 2015 at 23:39 | ||
ditto Chris, it lacks nothing! more to you!
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Barbu
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 09 2005 Location: infinity Status: Offline Points: 30850 |
Posted: July 20 2015 at 00:29 | ||
I won't listen to this track until I buy the record and I'll take About Face over Radio Kaos any day. |
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 20 2015 at 00:31 | ||
hahahahaha!!! Barbu you killed me right now hahahaha!!!! I am laughing here so much haha!! hugs
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Kati
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: July 20 2015 at 00:44 | ||
I have to admit that Roger Waters - Home Album: Radio Kaos 1987 is just too awful for me to listen. Damn I forgot about that, Barbu! To be honest even atleast YMCA atleast had a rhythm tune lol bah I want to forget that part of Waters, everything on and about that track is awful bah
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