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The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway... |
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cstack3 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: July 20 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ USA Status: Offline Points: 7514 |
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No tomatoes from this Yank, I agree with basically everything you said! Foxtrot had an amazing wealth of gems, including the under-appreciated (IMHO) "Can and the Utility Coastliners" and "Time Table." SEBTP had some fantastic stuff, but not as consistently as Foxtrot, and "Lamb" was very inconsistent overall. Amazing how we continue to discuss and analyze these works from over 40 years ago!
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I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!!
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Frenetic Zetetic ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 09 2017 Location: Now Status: Offline Points: 9233 |
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I can't lie, friends; for some reason the entirety of SEBT just doesn't hold up to me as a "10/10" record compared to Foxtrot.
I think I've come to articulate my stance on Gabriel-era Genesis: Trespass is stellar. Nursery Crime is even better. Foxtrot is absolutely perfect. SEBT has very strong material but the whole isn't as solid as Foxtrot, track-for-track for me. Lamb has some of the best music, some of it's even better than the music on all of the previous albums - but it's so diluted and drawn out that if it were condensed it'd truly give the previous records a true run for their money. It's like they peaked with Foxtrot (IMHO), then continued to write better songs but those better songs never gelled to create an entire big picture that was as solid-gold (IMHO) as Foxtrot. Supper's Ready is the apex Genesis prog piece IMHO. Battle of Epping Forest and Cinema show are fantastic extended pieces with some of the best music Genesis has ever written, but they still fall short of the total package on Foxtrot for me. Tracks like Fly, Back in NYC, Slippermen, The Cage, etc. are also some of the best music Genesis has ever composed...but the total of the album is too diluted as I stated above. Lots of fat on that album. I find it very interesting that most people's least fave track is Epping Forest, when that's the one that captures the most essence of what made Gabriel-era Genesis great, lol. How can you sit through a 22 minute epic in Supper's Ready, but not an 8.5 mini? I never got that lol. To each their own! *dodges tomatoes* :P
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
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Dellinger ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: June 18 2009 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 12856 |
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Firth of Fifth was the first song I loved from this album, actually. For me it's just one gorgeous passage after another, just perfect. Now I'm not really sure which I prefer, if this one or Dancing with the Moonlit Knight (specially the live version). Cinema show is very close too (also the live version). |
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Frenetic Zetetic ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 09 2017 Location: Now Status: Offline Points: 9233 |
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I think Foxtrot is Genesis' best offering in this era. That album is perfect to me. SEBT is almost perfect. The parts that are good are some of the best, but the album overall from start to finish isn't as perfect as Foxtrot for me. Same with Lamb. The parts that are killer are really killer. It's not as consistent as Foxtrot all the way through.
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
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Rednight ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 18 2014 Location: Mar Vista, CA Status: Offline Points: 4812 |
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"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno
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The Anders ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 02 2019 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 3535 |
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I quite like "More Fool Me" for what it is. A sweet little song that counterpoints the most proggy elements on the album. Not so much more than that though.
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HackettFan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: June 20 2012 Location: Oklahoma Status: Offline Points: 7951 |
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It wasn't until about when I turned 40 when More Fool Me quit making me wince. I kind of appreciate it now. I love Battle of Epping Forest. I'm not always in the mood for it, but when I am I really get into it. Battle of Epping Forest is a problem for a lot of people on here. I know you (Dellinger) don't like Gabriel's voice much to begin with. For others who do, I can't really understand not liking it. I don't like Firth of Fifth much, not as an entire piece. Oh yes, I like the the opening piano and the guitar solo, but the rest of it drags. |
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A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)
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HackettFan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: June 20 2012 Location: Oklahoma Status: Offline Points: 7951 |
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Yes. I even like Nursery Cryme better than SEBTP. When I was in school I didn't like SEBTP much because it was wimpy. It didn't hold up well against Hard Rock, while the Lamb did. Everyone I knew in school who knew of Old Genesis hailed the Lamb as a classic and were sometimes unaware of what came before it. It was the first Genesis album I ever heard (it belonged to a friend). I'm some number of years younger than most of the elders on here (53 y.o. in one half hour), and the interest for the time with me and my peers was with heavier music. But so there's no mistake though, I have indeed come to appreciate the merits of SEBTP since those youthful days. |
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A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)
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Dellinger ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: June 18 2009 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 12856 |
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More Fool Me hasn't ever really been too much of a problem for me on Selling England... too short and inoffensive to really do much harm to the overall greatness of the album... it's Battle of Epping Forest the one that really ruins the album for me... too annoying and long to allow me to consider the album a true 5 star masterpiece. |
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OafofBread ![]() Forum Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: January 13 2019 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1 |
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Definitely my favorite Genesis album and album overall. Some truly brilliant musical moments, but Chamber of 32 Doors always stuns me. Such emotional intensity packed in a perfect prog package!
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Slartibartfast ![]() Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
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Still my favorite Genesis album. Those that knock it clearly just don't get it. I tend to have some really weird dreams that often make no sense and that is the what the concept is all about for me...
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Frenetic Zetetic ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 09 2017 Location: Now Status: Offline Points: 9233 |
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"More Fool Me" has always kept it from a perfect 10/10 score for me. It's still a 9.9/10; the other parts more than make up for it for me. Something about Gabriel's delivery and timing on Lamb really stands out to me.
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
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The Anders ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 02 2019 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 3535 |
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I prefer Lamb to SEBTP too. I just listened to SEBTP yesterday, and to be frank I don't think it is quite the masterpiece it is often hailed as. I really like tracks such as "Firth of Fifth", but tbh. they kind of lose me on side 2. On Lamb I think the compositions are more focused and much more tense, plus sonically I find it much more elaborate.
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Frenetic Zetetic ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 09 2017 Location: Now Status: Offline Points: 9233 |
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6/5 stars, ha! ![]() So you're one of the rare few whom prefer Lamb to SEBT?
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
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HackettFan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: June 20 2012 Location: Oklahoma Status: Offline Points: 7951 |
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It's the greatest album ever. Six stars out of five. Side three ensures that sixth star. The Waiting Room to me is core of the weird sheet I conceive of as Progressive Rock. The musical continuity went beyond song and elevated to whole album in a way that was never successfully accomplished before.
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A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now)
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jayem ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: June 21 2006 Location: Switzerland Status: Offline Points: 997 |
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This album contains material... Lamb for its great groovy "It seems they cannot leave their dream" sequence (too slow on the album, I find ); Lamia for how all those sumptuous ingredients were managed, Grand Parade, if played (on YT) at 1,25x speed has a great summit at 2'24, one rare short possible escape from the everlasting scent of melancholy (in which the very similar Giant Hogweed's remains deeply, er, entangled) that prevents me from really enjoying (prog) Genesis.
Edited by jayem - January 12 2019 at 17:09 |
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The.Crimson.King ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 29 2013 Location: WA Status: Offline Points: 4596 |
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I couldn't imagine The Lamb any different than it is as every song is required to advance the written story, with the exception of one: Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats. I always considered it filler, but as I looked at the running order listed above it finally hit me that Silent Sorrow fulfills a vital function as well. PG needed that 3:07 to change into his Slipperman costume
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Gerinski ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5160 |
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I love the concept sir
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Tom Ozric ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: September 03 2005 Location: Olympus Mons Status: Offline Points: 15926 |
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^ Dude, Ravine is super.........
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Sean Trane ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() Prog Folk Joined: April 29 2004 Location: Heart of Europe Status: Online Points: 20590 |
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The Lamb is hardly my fave Genesis album, but it's still up there in the top tiers of the band's whole catalogue. here is what I would keep as must keep for an edited version then there is the stuff that is somewhat worthy of inclusion But I'm not keen on the rest (side 4 is fairly poor FTM or ITR) Disc1 1. The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway (4:50) 2. Fly on a Windshield (4:23) 3. Broadway Melody of 1974 (0:33) 4. Cuckoo Cocoon (2:11) 5. In the Cage (8:15) 6. The Grand Parade of Lifeless Packaging (2:45) 7. Back in N.Y.C. (5:42) 8. Hairless Heart (2:13) 9. Counting Out Time (3:42) 10. The Carpet Crawlers (5:15) 11. The Chamber of 32 Doors (5:40) Disc 2 1. Lillywhite Lilith (2:42) 2. The Waiting Room (5:24) 3. Anyway (3:07) 4. The Supernatural Anaesthetist (2:59) 5. The Lamia (6:57) 6. Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats (3:07) 7. Colony of Slippermen (8:13) 8. Ravine (2:04) 9. The Light Dies Down on Broadway (3:32) 10. Riding the Scree (3:57) 11. In the Rapids (2:26) 12. It (4:15) |
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