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Second tier of "big" bands? |
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Icarium ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: March 21 2008 Location: Tigerstaden Status: Offline Points: 34099 |
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Supertramp is also there as a logical member of the progressive family tree as second tier.
They have and are of same generation and ambission as the prog originator but alongside Roxy Music and 10cc founded crossover prog. Cements a also they share DNA with King Crimson with Richard Palmer James. Procol Harum are also second tier Edited by Icarium - November 25 2019 at 10:52 |
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Foxprog ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September 05 2018 Location: Finland Status: Offline Points: 236 |
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ELP is out for me. VDGG for the win! Oh and for me it only Big Five, so Jethro Tull is out too :) Some of possible from the next 6? (not in order) Camel Gentle Giant Rush (even though i'm not the biggest fan) Renaissance Jethro Tull Caravan Mike Oldfield Magma Robert Wyatt New school Steven Wilson/Porcupine Tree Opeth Anekdoten and so on... Impossible to make these lists Edited by Foxprog - November 25 2019 at 11:39 |
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Lewian ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 15610 |
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Zappa was very influential IMHO. Camel and Renaissance not so much. Renaissance probably somewhat more due to being the archetypical symphonic band. Henry Cow would probably beat Art Zoyd on impact, despite Art Zoyd having a catalogue of the size of all other first and second generation RIO bands combined, all of which is highly original work. When it comes to impact there's also hardly a way around Magma. Should probably have listed Gong and Soft Machine as further contenders (or members, if the tier of six rule is dropped). Tangerine Dream were hugely influential as well (not least on Art Zoyd), if somewhat marginal to prog rock.
Edited by Lewian - November 25 2019 at 11:52 |
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dougmcauliffe ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: February 23 2019 Location: US Status: Offline Points: 3895 |
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I know camel has been very influential on me and the music I make at the very least!^^ but I’m not about to argue their influence compared to Zappa.
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The sun has left the sky...
...Now you can close your eyes |
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Dellinger ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: June 18 2009 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 12883 |
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For me, it's
- Camel. - Van Der Graaf Generator. - Gentle Giant. - Renaissance. And then, thinking about subgenres, other countries besides England, solo artists, post 70's artists, etc, some that come to my mind (and some of which I don't even know): - Strawbs. - Hawkwind. - Caravan. - Rick Wakeman. - Steve Hackett. - Peter Gabriel. - Rush. - Kansas. - PFM. - Banco del Mutuo Socorsso. - Le Orme. - Ange. - SBB. - Marillion. - Dream Theater. - Porcupine Tree. |
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miamiscot ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: April 23 2014 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 3635 |
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The Big Six were all UK bands from the 70's - so if we keep that in mind the next six should be:
Gentle Giant Camel Van Der Graaf Generator Hawkwind Renaissance Mike Oldfield Or we could do a new Big Six comprised of contemporary artists. That might look like this: Porcupine Tree/Steven Wilson Spock's Beard/Neal Morse The Flower Kings Big Big Train Dream Theater Opeth
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TheLionOfPrague ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 08 2011 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 1091 |
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If we go with Big 6 contemporaries: Camel, VDGG, Rush, Kansas, Gentle Giant, Supertramp. (Maybe ELO?)
If we go with post-70's bands: Dream Theater, Tool, Porcupine Tree, Marillion, Opeth, The Mars Volta
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I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place
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richardh ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 30507 |
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Personally I would take Tull out of the Big Six and put PFM in. The next tier VDGG Gentle Giant (both criminally underappreciated in the day) Rush (for influence as already said) Marillion ( the only neo prog band that broke through) Dream Theater ( easily the biggest prog metal band) Spocks Beard ( kinda of post modern symph prog band that have stuck around) I would rather include Anathema, IQ and Par Lindh Project but none of these have enough traction.
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Blacksword ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
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The influence of Rush will be broad throughout the industry. From Metallica to Iron Maiden, to Dream Theater to The Smashing Pumpkins to The Manic Street Preachers many have cited Rush as either an inspiration or an influence. Of the agreed top tier acts, I would actually say only Genesis and Floyd have been of any real significant influence. Acts like ELP and Tull, although mighty in their tiem, have not had an obvious, far reaching influence on the music of others IMO. In fact the less high profile 'Krautrock' bands, and the likes of Hawkwind and VDGG were probably far more influential, going by their admirers in the punk, New wave and indie scenes. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Dellinger ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: June 18 2009 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 12883 |
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Oh yes, Mike Oldfield, how could I have forgotten about him? He's one of my very favourites. |
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Psychedelic Paul ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September 16 2019 Location: Nottingham, U.K Status: Offline Points: 45669 |
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I didn't choose Mike Oldfield in my list because you were asking for a second tier of *bands*.
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AFlowerKingCrimson ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 19461 |
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Next to Pink Floyd Rush are by far the biggest prog band with the biggest album sales.
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AFlowerKingCrimson ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 19461 |
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No way would I put Big Big Train ahead of Transatlantic, Echolyn, Ozric Tentacles or Anglagard. They are a good band though. I guess maybe it depends if you are going by popularity, influence or just personal taste though. If you go back just ten years BBT were barely on anyone's radar.
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Nogbad_The_Bad ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21691 |
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Oldfield would certainly make my list
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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kenethlevine ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Prog-Folk Team Joined: December 06 2006 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 9189 |
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Camel was very influential among 3rd tier and below prog bands. Not a value judgment. There are a bunch of bands with strong Camel influence
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Blacksword ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
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They didn't outsell Genesis, and I'm not convinced they outsold Tull, I'd have to check, but yes they are up there. Edit, Tull sold around 60 million albums, Rush sold around 40 million. Genesis sold around 150 million, and Floyd around 250 million. Edited by Blacksword - November 27 2019 at 00:58 |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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miamiscot ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: April 23 2014 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 3635 |
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I was trying to account for popularity, influence, etc. If it were up to me Dream Theater and Opted would not be there!!!
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AFlowerKingCrimson ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 19461 |
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Well, I live in the US so I'm going by US sales. But you might be right. Over all Genesis and Yes might have sold more. Oops I mean Genesis and Pink Floyd. A lot of those sales figures aren't updated a lot of times anyway. It just seems these days Rush are number two behind PF. I'm referring to prog influence anyway not pop(most of Genesis sales are from their pop period).
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - November 27 2019 at 11:38 |
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AFlowerKingCrimson ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 19461 |
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It can be tricky to gauge popularity and sometimes depends on the subgenre. Regardless as of right now I would put Haken and Thank You Scientist above BBT. TYS have two albums that landed in the top 200 with the latest coming in at number 73. I don't think you can say that about BBT(or TFK or SB for that matter). Haken have cracked the charts too although maybe not in the US.
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - November 27 2019 at 11:37 |
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Psychedelic Paul ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September 16 2019 Location: Nottingham, U.K Status: Offline Points: 45669 |
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I never even thought of Rush as a prog band until I arrived here. To me, they've always been a Canadian Hard Rock band.
![]() I doubled my Rush albums collection recently when I bought their Live album, "All the World's a Stage."
Edited by Psychedelic Paul - November 27 2019 at 11:42 |
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