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ClassicRocker 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 02 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 894
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 Posted: June 20 2008 at 12:44 |
 Visitor13 wrote:
Treasure wrote:
For me, it's mainly something with a higher quality of musicianship and ideas than average music. Also long songs rule. |
Substitute 'something' and 'music' with 'rock', and you'll be there, I guess, at least to some extent.
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So: "It's mainly rock with a higher quality of rockianship and ideas than average rock." ? 
Certif1ed wrote:
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My god, do you realize what you have done sir?! ...I actually like that Intermezzo song! 
Edited by ClassicRocker - June 20 2008 at 12:46
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Visitor13
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 02 2005
Location: Poland
Status: Offline
Points: 4702
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Posted: June 20 2008 at 13:39 |
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Certif1ed
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: June 20 2008 at 15:19 |
ClassicRocker wrote:
My god, do you realize what you have done sir?! ...I actually like that Intermezzo song!
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Up there with Sky and Ekseption, I'd say... 
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: June 20 2008 at 17:47 |
Genesister wrote:
Visitor13 wrote:
Treasure wrote:
For me, it's mainly something with a higher quality of musicianship and ideas than average music. Also long songs rule. |
Substitute 'something' and 'music' with 'rock', and you'll be there, I guess, at least to some extent.
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No progressive hip-hop? |
Think OutKast fits that bill perfectly well
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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Treasure
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 09 2008
Location: Bland Street
Status: Offline
Points: 298
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Posted: June 20 2008 at 22:05 |
dzx wrote:
Genesister wrote:
Visitor13 wrote:
Treasure wrote:
For me, it's mainly something with a higher quality of musicianship and ideas than average music. Also long songs rule. |
Substitute 'something' and 'music' with 'rock', and you'll be there, I guess, at least to some extent.
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No progressive hip-hop? |
Think OutKast fits that bill perfectly well |
Does it O.o
Outkast is pretty different, making concept albums and whatnot, but I would consider prog hip hop to be more along the lines of Toca and maybe even some Upsilon Acrux.
Outkast rules though, I love Roses.
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 03:57 |
Treasure wrote:
dzx wrote:
Genesister wrote:
Visitor13 wrote:
Treasure wrote:
For me, it's mainly something with a higher quality of musicianship and ideas than average music. Also long songs rule. |
Substitute 'something' and 'music' with 'rock', and you'll be there, I guess, at least to some extent.
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No progressive hip-hop? |
Think OutKast fits that bill perfectly well |
Does it O.o
Outkast is pretty different, making concept albums and whatnot, but I would consider prog hip hop to be more along the lines of Toca and maybe even some Upsilon Acrux.
Outkast rules though, I love Roses. |
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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dzx
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 23 2008
Location: france
Status: Offline
Points: 117
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 04:00 |
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sorry forgot to add comment. must check out those bands and possibly add another contender as Ozomatli
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was that just an Am augmented minor 9th i heard? nice!
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Toaster Mantis
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 12 2008
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 5898
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 10:08 |
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I think of "progressive" as referring to song structures that progress in a narrative way... not necessarily in a completely linear way that builds up to a climax, just not all cyclically like a typical verse-chorus-verse pop song. A progressive rock song can have a chorus, though, it's just not all the song revolves around.
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"The past is not some static being, it is not a previous present, nor a present that has passed away; the past has its own dynamic being which is constantly renewed and renewing." - Claire Colebrook
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Hawkwise
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 31 2008
Location: Ontairo
Status: Offline
Points: 4119
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 16:21 |
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Well as someone who grew up through the 70s Classic Prog era coming to this site has been a
Bit like going to supermarket going to the Produce Dept looking for bananas and finding Chainsaws, but once i waded through the Nuts and Bolts i found my Bananas
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Sacred 22
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 24 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1509
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 18:22 |
Hawkwise wrote:
Well as someone who grew up through the 70s Classic Prog era coming to this site has been a Bit like going to supermarket going to the Produce Dept looking for bananas and finding Chainsaws, but once i waded through the Nuts and Bolts i found my Bananas |
Yes, as times it can seem a bit like a hardware store.
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debrewguy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 30 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 3596
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 20:42 |
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PA defines prog for me. Then I wait until someone post a thread and disagree with its' opening statement vehemently.
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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Imadofus
Forum Groupie
Joined: December 07 2007
Location: Brasil
Status: Offline
Points: 87
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 20:50 |
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To me, it is rock that is (or at least tries to be) somewhat different from the common pop songs we hear on the mainstream. If they experiment with new structures, or instrumentation, etc, they're prog.
Edited by Imadofus - June 21 2008 at 20:51
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The T
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: June 21 2008 at 21:02 |
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Whatever appears on PA listed as prog is prog for me. I've dropped it trying to define the undefineable.
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 10:02 |
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Here we go again....
For me 'prog' is any music that attempts to confound my habitual expectations of stylistic form.
Time for a nap now methinks....
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CCVP
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 15 2007
Location: Vitória, Brasil
Status: Offline
Points: 7971
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 14:47 |
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Weston
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 26 2008
Location: Tennessee
Status: Offline
Points: 188
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 15:29 |
I don't think you can define prog, but you can list some attrributes.
Pieces longer than 3 minutes.
Unusual instrumentation for the time -- i.e. in the 70's the synthesizer was unusual. Today a crumhorn might be unusual.
Complex arrangments which may include odd time signatures or motif developement
Grandios ideas - i.e. pieces about something other than the mainstream subjects "I love you," "I'm so down she left me," or "I want to party all night."
Singers who sound like they just toked on a helium balloon.
A bass that sounds like it wants to be a lead instrument.
Influence from classical music - i.e. folk or jazz mixed with rock does not by itself make prog.
A piece can have one or more of the above attributes, but they more they have, the more prog they are. (Okay, I was joking about the helium balloon.)
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CCVP
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 15 2007
Location: Vitória, Brasil
Status: Offline
Points: 7971
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 15:35 |
Weston wrote:
Pieces longer than 3 minutes. |
What about side 2 of Tarkus?
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Weston
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 26 2008
Location: Tennessee
Status: Offline
Points: 188
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 16:18 |
CCVP wrote:
Weston wrote:
Pieces longer than 3 minutes. |
What about side 2 of Tarkus?
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Tarkus has a side 2?
Oh, I see. A Time and a Place could have been an epic. I wish it were longer. It's still prog for me because it has a couple of other attributes in my list. I skip over the other two short pieces.
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peskypesky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 25 2005
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 359
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 18:12 |
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To me prog is rock with an added complexity. That complexity can be the incorporation of influences from classical music and jazz, or it can be the use of "strange" time signatures, or it can be compositional complexity (multi-part songs). To be able to play prog necessarily requires advanced musical skills.
Prog is the opposite of punk, which I also love.
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The T
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: FL, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 17493
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Posted: June 22 2008 at 19:58 |
CCVP wrote:
The T wrote:
Whatever appears on PA listed as prog is prog for me. I've dropped it trying to define the undefineable. |
maybe its only undefinable because we are not scholars who studied prog for over half a century and thus we are not able to come with general rules. But neither can the scholars agree with all the rules, so f*ck all that sh*t and be happy!   
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Now that's some good answer.... 
And the second side of Tarkus falls into another genre, the songs-which-are-utter-crap-that-happen-to-appear-next-to-prog-masterpieces genre.....There's a lot of those....
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What defines Prog, for you?
