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Topic ClosedRoger Waters & middle East politics

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javajeff View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Roger Waters & middle East politics
    Posted: October 30 2016 at 11:33
It is hard to like a guy when he spreads hatred. I don't understand why these people get involved in politics. You would think they would be gracious of all fans.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 11:38
Originally posted by javajeff javajeff wrote:

It is hard to like a guy when he spreads hatred. I don't understand why these people get involved in politics. You would think they would be gracious of all fans.


Well, to be fair, he has been writing political songs for forty odd years, now. Floyd music, and his solo stuff, brim with political opinions.

As a youth, I bought into Waters' lyrics in a big way, and still do, to a certain extent. I do, though, draw the line at his opinion of Israel, without ever denying his right to speak. I simply do not agree with him, and it is also, btw, one of the biggest reasons why I fell out of love with left wing politics.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 11:43
True that. And I'm not listening to Roger Waters (whether he talks or plays) anymore. Not just because of his twisted political views, but simply because this guy hasn't got anything creative on offer at all. Let's not bother ourselves with him, he doesn't matter.
Writing about truth is a little bit like getting your dick out in public and hoping no one laughs (Steve Hogarth)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 11:46
Agreed....I'm used to having to ignore the politics of my favorite artists....and many friends  ;)

And Darious....your signatureLOLLOL

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 11:48
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

I simply do not agree with him, and it is also, btw, one of the biggest reasons why I fell out of love with left wing politics.
Hah, I selfishly thought it only happened to me! Good to know others maintained their rationalism too.


Edited by Darious - October 30 2016 at 12:21
Writing about truth is a little bit like getting your dick out in public and hoping no one laughs (Steve Hogarth)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 12:10
Well, I'm still on the left side of political alignemnent, but I'm not sure what it has to do with Roger Waters and his unsollicited opinions about Israel.
Anyway, when creating a thread about Roger Waters and his views about the Israeli/Palestinian non-stop fun since 1949, it could be useful to remember what he said and/or wrote... At least, it could be useful for me, since I haven't really read anything about that... Ermm
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 12:34
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Well, I'm still on the left side of political alignemnent, but I'm not sure what it has to do with Roger Waters and his unsollicited opinions about Israel.
Anyway, when creating a thread about Roger Waters and his views about the Israeli/Palestinian non-stop fun since 1949, it could be useful to remember what he said and/or wrote... At least, it could be useful for me, since I haven't really read anything about that... Ermm


I am still on the left side of political alignment. However, one of the biggest issues in modern left wing politics in Britain is the undying love for various Islamic causes, and undying hatred for anything to do with Israel, and it is, btw, anti Semitic, not anti Zionist. Waters has released a couple of songs which are, undoubtedly, anti Israel and lovingly pro Palestinian. He has refused to play in Israel.

I contrast this with the incredible track Gaza, from Marillion's 2013 album, Sounds That Can't Be Made. This told the story of said territory from a child's perspective, and was incredibly even handed in its approach. Waters' approach is nothing like this.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 12:50
Well he's a communist, so...


Edited by The Ghost - October 30 2016 at 12:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 12:58
Originally posted by The Ghost The Ghost wrote:

Well he's a communist, so...

So communists normally opt to ally themselves with conservative religious fundamentalists? I've got to reread my Karl Marx.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 13:42
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Originally posted by The Ghost The Ghost wrote:

Well he's a communist, so...

So communists normally opt to ally themselves with conservative religious fundamentalists? I've got to reread my Karl Marx.

So should they, because it is a fact that modern day fundamental left wing activists, Trots, and the like, most certainly are allying themselves with an assortment of distasteful religious fundamentalists. The farcical "investigation" by Shami Chakrabarti (now Lady Chakrabarti) into anti Sematism in the Labour Partyis the latest in a long line of very sad occurrences in modern left wing politics.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 16:46
He seems to have attended a guided tour through the so-called Palestine areas that has ended somehow on the wrong side of the Anzio bridgehead. This initiated a sequence of tarnishing scenes that makes it a bit harder to cherish his earlier output. Too bad he has become one of the worms he once described by acting as a spokesman of the BDS movement.
 
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Well, I'm still on the left side of political alignemnent, but I'm not sure what it has to do with Roger Waters and his unsollicited opinions about Israel.
Anyway, when creating a thread about Roger Waters and his views about the Israeli/Palestinian non-stop fun since 1949, it could be useful to remember what he said and/or wrote... At least, it could be useful for me, since I haven't really read anything about that... Ermm
 
Well, no one has ever mentioned Palestinians before 1964...


Edited by someone_else - October 30 2016 at 16:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 16:51
What bugs me is that it's so easy to criticize either Israel or its enemies.   I mean really?   Is that it?   Is that all?   Israel shouldn't do bad things?   Give me a break, grow up, read a little history, and please tell me something new that you thought up all by yourself.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 16:56
I understood Waters is standing for an oppressed people - Palestinians.

He is against the actions of the Israeli government.

As most regard all political views from an extremist view (which is not where real politics happen) he is thusly anti Semitic something which he denies and would be consistent with his humanistic principles.

There is a lot of false equivalency assumptions and very easy to lock onto a simple view (the extremist paradigm).

He probably should also include in his diatribes anti Syria, Jordan and Hamas all of whom back and conspire to put the Palestinian people in danger and create an anti Zion, anti-Semite, Anti Israel view. He should also note that Jews have been persecuted for millenia and under the modern state of Israel are now 100% determined that no holocaust shall happen again. That may mean killing others. The mix of religion (bloody beliefs above facts..!), extreme political stances (... again...) all fueled by irresponsible government who do not want any peace accord ever (sorry about the extreme view but this is abetted by the corporate interests profiting from perpetual war).

I think his heart's in the right place but he's adopting extremist tactics (Star of David on a flying pig) that are causing ire among RW and PF fans.

As usual the blame for deaths of civilian populations can be laid at the door of government. Perhaps he should push an anti-government agenda that promotes sacrifice of its own.

It's not simple, easy but it is very dangerous. He links the Israeli government with Nazi views which has such an irony. He's fueling the fire.

The PC left (UK in this instance) will via their own extremism create an environment for extreme right wing growth. Really, there is not too much of a difference. Passive aggression really brings out the worst in me.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 17:05
This seems like it would fit well here.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 17:23
Zionism is actually anti-Judaism. Zionists  use the Almighty's promise of the Holy Land, and at the same time they laugh in His face and violate His law. The Almighty commanded us to go into exile, and with three oaths forbade us to create our own country before the coming of the messiah, when the redemption of the world will take place and all mankind will willingly worship the One G-d.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 19:50
Anti-Semitism about 5800 years old . Zionism about 150 . Wonder which came first? Hmmmmm! 
BTW Waters is not a communist , he is a rich opportunist and a poo disturber. He probably never visited the Holy land , and seen for himself the differences, which explains his simplistic and opportunistic views. 
I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 19:52
Being against the Israeli government and its occupation of Palestinian land is the only sensible position to have. I'd be very disappointed if he felt differently.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 19:56
I am completely agree with the above.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 20:11
Recently watched his The Wall stage show and fought his overly anti-Israel positioning on material that was never originally that way quite disturbing. Could amount to hatespeak.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 30 2016 at 20:22
Originally posted by A Person A Person wrote:

Being against the Israeli government and its occupation of Palestinian land is the only sensible position to have. I'd be very disappointed if he felt differently.
Perhaps but you need to go there and see it for yourself , both sides have their fanatics but there are more-peace Israelis than any  pro-peace movement  in Arab all countries combined. I sadly, have visited the Holy Land as I choose to call it and I have an rather precise opinion based on what i had witnessed. Just sayin' in order to not be disappointed. 
I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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