PFM with Fabrizio de André

The de Andre albums are a little too poppy for my taste - though they do contain some nice moments.  And I agree, PFM, by this point, were already on the road to pop oblivion, after losing Pagani and Lanzetti (who, in my opinion, completed PFM's finest line-up for Chocolate Kings & Jet Lag).  Passpartu was listenable, if not what I'd come to expect from PFM, but sorry Mirco, Suonare Suonare for me was just the pits.  Compared to their immediate follow-up works such as Come Ti Va In Ziva Allla Citta, it was a masterpiece, but SS epitomised the fall for me.  It wasn't so much the rot setting in, as the entire infrastructure disintegrating, sending the band and its new synths and moustaches careering headlong through 14 dank floors of mediocrity to their musical deaths.    

To their credit, they actually managed to survive and go back on the road again, though sensibly, the current set lists rarely include material from later than 1978 (although they still insist on playing insipid mince like Maesto Della Voce (?????) and of course, Suonare Sounare).

Have you heard Pagani's solo stuff?  Mussida et al guest on some sections of it, and its wonderful music.  The man is a genius. PFM never recovered from his departure. 

I got a pleasant surprise listening to JET LAG and Passpartu - havent' heard the other one you mention - but I though them two were v. good LPs' - not "classic" PFM, more jazz-influenced - and you can hear the pop elements beginning to come in - but only in the very far distance

Hey micro - if your Italian - you could perhaps explain somehting remarkably that has always interested me - why do Italian records have that little ink-stamped symbol stamped ontot he label - d'ya know what I mean, Wrath of ninian - nearly all my Italian prog LP's have them - the originals anyway -

 

Edited by mandrake

Yes, I have noticed those - never understood it either, but always thought it was kind of cool - like it had been individually marked by hand, rather than flung out of a machine! 

I think you're right Mirco, that understanding Italian will probably add a meaning to the music - I speak limited Italian (I learned a little because I've been working in Sicily recently), but find it difficult to comprehend Italian song diction sometimes - one word can be a short sentence in Italian as you know and its easy to misinterpret vowels.  Usually with PFM, the music tells the story itself and the lyrics are not as important.  I think the de Andre albums are (not surprisingly!) all about de Andre - the music is much less complicated, and leaves plenty of room for the singer to work his magic. 

The collaboration was fondly remembered in Italy, especially in the wake of de Andre's death in 1999, and many PFM fans I met over there often quote them as some of their favourite PFM albums. 

I find PFM's evolution in the late seventies totally baffling - in 1976, they released what was for me THE finest album ever made in Chocolate Kings.  With Jet Lag, I was a little disappointed at first that they had gone for shorter 'songs', and put it down to the departure of Pagani, but I soon grew to love the mellow grooves and sun-drenched melodies.  Passpartu continued in the same vein, although they started using additional musicians and I felt it mired the creativity a little.  Then from absolutely nowhere, the horror show began - certainly parts of Suonare Suonare do hark back to the previous two albums, but I thought the decision to let di Cioccio sing (probably a decision made by himself) was a huge mistake.  Soon after this album, Premoli left and all of a sudden the creative heart of the band had been ripped out.  Mussida immediately sounded stranded  - his intricate guitar work of old, was replaced with fuller sounding chords to fill out the sound, and new singer di Ciocco's astonishing drumming was replaced by Calloni's uninspired beat-keeping.  In the space of 2 years, the band had gone from jeans, t-shirts, long hair, and side-burns, to moustaches, shades, yellow suit jackets with the sleeves rolled up and slip-on shoes.  The music had gone from intricate, beautifully arranged classical suites laced with hard-edged rock-outs, to synth-driven mindless pop with all the musical integrity of a Cliff Richard Christmas howler.  

Nowhere is this drastic, heartbreaking changeover more visible than on the bootleg TV DVD of performances ranging from 1972 (when they were just mind-bogglingly incredible) through the BBC's Whistle Test in 1974 (when simply no-one could touch them), to 1980 and the horrifc nightmare of the Musicalamente show. 

How did it happen? And why?  What was going on in Italy / US that caused this? 

to be honest - i think it was the same thing that happened all over the world in 1977 - the market changed momentarily (for at least 6 years till the neo-progger's resurgence) -

and suddenly prog wasnt' as bankable as it was before - certainly wasn't confined to Italy - in fact I think Europe got away with it a bit longer actually - nowhere was prog supported more  - and bands were still coming up with the goods into 1980-81 - Spain's Bloque's Music Para La Libertad for e.g - and lots of great eastern european prog - were punk's tendril's arrived a bit late - however I think the big chill that was punk would eventually stretch everywhere - giving prog acts two choices really - go a bitty poppy or just GO!

Thank God Sense prevailed and it didnt' go away for ever though! - real quality always outlast fads and fashions and now prog is back and this time unlike the majority of 80s neo-prog) with real integrity with The Mars Volta, Tool, M83, etc.. Morte Macabre, Anekdoten etc..

Have either of you heard the stuff by fellow Italians Celeste? - its up there with Photos of ghosts and Cook!

sorry to interupt, thought I had something to say...

Spanish Prog mid 70s to late

Los Canarios - Ciclos(english vocals, great to fair)
Mezquita - Recuerdos de mi Tierra(spanish)
Gotic - Escenes(instrumental)
Atila - Reviure(instrumental?)

are some excellent choices in my opionion, Ciclos is
a concept album from 1975, comparable with
Genesis - Lamb and The Who - Quadrophenia.
Gotic compares with Camel - Snow Goose.
Nothing copycat here just Spanish scene influenced.

Edited by DallasBryan

Thanks for all that , I shall check them out.

I know about the Scented Gardens book and considered buying it, but I was SO disappointed with Jerry Lucky's Progressive Rock Files, that I decided not to bother.  I should've realised by the size of Lucky's book, that it wouldn't contain the kind of depth I was looking for.  Its little more than a summation of what bands were releasing in what year.  I really wanted stories and a bit of gossip!  And his section on criticism was woeful - how NOT to construct an argument.  If that book took him 10 years to write (as I think he says in the intro), he really shouldn't be writing books.  I've read deeper, wittier, and more coherently constructed efforts by 1st year undergrads!

If Scented Gardens is the same as PRF, I'll avoid it, but if it contains some genuinely interesting anecdotes, then I would definitely try and acquire a copy.  Advice gratefully received.  A nice big section on PFM would be an excellent starter for 10.

mirco wrote: mandrake wrote: Hey micro - if your Italian - you could perhaps explain somehting remarkably that has always interested me - why do Italian records have that little ink-stamped symbol stamped ontot he label - d'ya know what I mean, Wrath of ninian - nearly all my Italian prog LP's have them - the originals anyway -   Mandrake: i'm not italian, but  being a son of an italian couple that emigrates in the late 50's to Veezuela, my first language is Italian. Well, I review my italian records and find that stamp. You can read "societá italiana degli autori ed editori - Roma", which stands for "Italian Authors and editors society - Rome". I think it's a sort of anti-piracy thing, but not so sure...

Yes, it's just this... An Italian Legalized Fraud...

Stratos sings a track on Pagani's first solo album, but although I'm only just beginning to track down Pagani's late-70s appearances on other albums, I have yet to come across a definitive collaboration. Pagani certainly appeared on and produced numerous other albums in Italy in the late 70s and early 80s, and was a good friend of Stratos at the time of his death, so its not inconceivable that they made a record together. 

I shall look into this and report back!

Pagani recently appeared with PFM again at a huge concert in Siena, which is now out on DVD and CD release, though I think you have to source it from Italy. 

Wrath_of_Ninian wrote: Stratos sings a track on Pagani's first solo album, but although I'm only just beginning to track down Pagani's late-70s appearances on other albums, I have yet to come across a definitive collaboration. Pagani certainly appeared on and produced numerous other albums in Italy in the late 70s and early 80s, and was a good friend of Stratos at the time of his death, so its not inconceivable that they made a record together.  I shall look into this and report back!

May I humbly draw yours and others' attention to my thread entitled Carnascialia? You might find some useful info there.