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M27Barney
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Joined: November 09 2006
Location: Swinton M27
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Topic: The FIVE STAR rating system Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:05 |
Is anybody as frustrated as I am with a rating system with ONLY five levels of granulation?
What about the propensity (I have just reviewed all of GH studio works) that some people have of being mainly a fan of (Genre A) then give the whole of a bands CD's who are (Genre B) and thus not their cup of tea and thus all get ONE STAR!
Thus a CD should have in effect THREE ratings, one given by persons who's main predilection is the main Genre of the band and thus a good indication of CD against other CD's in the Genre. Another rating for FANS of that particular band, and another rating for fans of Other Genres.
Mainly in need of a score out of 100 for each of the three categories and these scores can be used to compare and contrast a CD against same Band CD's other same Genre CD;s and also see if a CD is popular to fans outside the Genre!
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Finnforest
Special Collaborator
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Joined: February 03 2007
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:19 |
Barney, I partially share your frustration in that I abhor the overuse of 5-star ratings by some people, as I feel it should be only given to about the top 5% of albums, true masterpiece albums of the century. But beyond that, most people are going to tell you (as they tell me) that it is the review that matters, not ratings and numbers. Most people want an honest appraisal from a human more than a statistics class. Your suggestions would certainly be interesting but with all of the other things on the plate of site's Admin, I doubt they will be implementing such a system. But you never know, good luck
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The T
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:21 |
No.. but I'd love a 10-degree rating system... either one from 1 to 5 with half-points (3.5, etc) or a 10-point system. I find myself too often not knowing how to rate a band... "this is better than that album that I gave 3 stars to, but worse than that which I gave 4...so I could lower both ratings... but then those two are better than that one which I gave 2 stars, which is better than this one with one, but it should be 1.5 because it's in the middle and not quite in the same level, so maybe if I take the square root of this value I'll come up with the right parsec count necessary to hyper-analyze the rating and hence.....  ..."
It's a dilemma having only 5 steps....
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The Quiet One
Prog Reviewer
Joined: January 16 2008
Location: Argentina
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Points: 15745
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:27 |
^LOL!
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Tuzvihar
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:42 |
Wrong section.
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"Music is much like f**king, but some composers can't climax and others climax too often, leaving themselves and the listener jaded and spent."
Charles Bukowski
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:54 |
Tuzvihar wrote:
Wrong section. |
fixed. 
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What?
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Tuzvihar
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 17:58 |
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"Music is much like f**king, but some composers can't climax and others climax too often, leaving themselves and the listener jaded and spent."
Charles Bukowski
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 18:33 |
I agree with The T about the half points.
There are a lort of albums that I rated with 5 stars that don't deserve to be at the peak, but neither they deserve a 4 stars.
Mainly becauise we have albums that are ESSENTIAL but not MASTERPIECES, so this albums should deserve more than 4 stars but not the maximum rate.
Some time ago I proposed a .5 system rating in the Collaborators section that I can't find, but it was similar to this:
5 stars: Essential, a Masterpiece of Progressive Rock
4.5 stars: Not a masterpiece (even wen close to this status), still essential for any Prog Collection
4 stars: Excellent addition to any prog music collection
3.5 stars: Excelent addition to most fans of the genre
3 stars: Good but no essential
2.5 stars: Average
2 stars: Collectors and fans only
1.5 stars: Diehard fans only
1 Star: Poor. Only for completionists
0.5 stars: Better avoid it
I believe this would work, but it would be hard to adapt the system.
Iván
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TGM: Orb
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Joined: October 21 2007
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Points: 8052
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Posted: July 12 2008 at 19:25 |
I prefer the current 5. Professional and simple, and I think further graduation would merely exaggerate the value of the indiscriminate top ratings. I feel that fan/non-fan distinctions are a little useless.
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moreitsythanyou
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Location: NYC
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Posted: July 13 2008 at 00:18 |
I think Ivan's model is perfect but concede that it would be difficult to switch and people who have already written many reviews would have to go in and re-edit ratings. That being said I still like the .5 system.
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 <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR]
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M27Barney
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 09 2006
Location: Swinton M27
Status: Offline
Points: 3136
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Posted: July 13 2008 at 13:47 |
Thanks for the replies,
What about the problem of a Reviewer, who clearly isn't into Band A, yet reviews all the output and gives them one star! Whats the point? It's like me reviewing all of Abbas CD;s and trashing every single one!
Thats why a review must be from the aspect of the reviewers MAIN taste.
Eg. I know Reviewer A has given band X CD Y a four star and I correlate this review with others by the same person and reason that Rev A has very similar taste to me, thus he reviews another and gives it a FIVE, I would be very interested in that CD.
Also high star ratings have lead me into purchasing some right turkeys, I'lllet you guess which ones!
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ClassicRocker
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 02 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 894
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Posted: July 13 2008 at 16:32 |
moreitsythanyou wrote:
I think Ivan's model is perfect but concede that it would be difficult to switch and people who have already written many reviews would have to go in and re-edit ratings. That being said I still like the .5 system.
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I agree with both The T and Ivan in regards to the need of the .5 system. I really don't think it's all that much of a problem to change the options, as people who feel the need to adjust their ratings can either take it up with an admin (as is the usual procedure), or change it themselves (prog reviewers/collabs, etc.) The switch wouldn't really be that difficult; if someone really doesn't care or feel motivated enough to change their rating, then that's fine! Leave it! At least give others the option of being more precise! The change wouldn't harm the accuracy of the ratings at all...
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Zargus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 08 2005
Location: Sweden
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Posted: July 13 2008 at 17:31 |
1-10 is no doubt the best IMO.
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The T
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Posted: July 13 2008 at 21:08 |
Let me use GENESIS as my perfect example of how imperfect is the rating system for me...
Selling England, Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot and A Trick of the Tail would get 5 stars no question. And I gave them 5 stars.
And then there were Three (an album I love and think it's THE underrated album) would get a 4.5 from me... but I'll have to give it a 5.
The Lamb, Tresspass and Wind and Wuthering would receive 4 stars. And they have.
Duke would receive 3.5, but I'll have to give it either 3 or 4. But I think it's better than:
We can't Dance would receive 3, and has.
Calling all stations and Abacab would receive 2.5, but as unavailable, have received 3.
From Genesis to Revelation would get 2, and has.
Genesis ("shapes") would receive 1.5, as it's better than the one below but worse than those above, but as unavailable, in this case I round off and gave it one.
Invisible Touch gets a 1.
So, 10 rating-steps are necessary... 
(same case with my lowest reviews: Kayo Dot's DAWCT would get 1.5, and Sigur Ros a 0.5... and some of my 5-star would be 4.5.... ) The system is too rigid!!
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 00:01 |
Genesis is a good example T.
I rated Foxtrot, Nursery Cryme, The Lamb and Selling England and Archives 1 all with 5 stars.
While Trespass with 4 stars as well as ATOTT and W&W (Won't go with the post W&W, because all have very low ratings in my book), but all thids albums deserve IMO more rating than ATOTT and this last album no way should receive a 3 stars rating.
I believe Foxtrot, The Lamb and Nursery Cryme deserve 5 stars, so this are OK
I don't like SEBTP (but I know it's an essential album) as well as Trespass which I love, so this albums would go with Archives I and W&W all with 4.5 (All are a step bellow the three top albums)}
ATOTT is the a step bellow all the above mentioned, so it deserves (Of course IMO) 4 stars.
This would reduce the number of five stars ratings from five albums to three and place all of them in the levels I believe they deserve.
Iván
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Certif1ed
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Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 02:49 |
M27Barney wrote:
Thanks for the replies,
What about the problem of a Reviewer, who clearly isn't into Band A, yet reviews all the output and gives them one star! Whats the point? It's like me reviewing all of Abbas CD;s and trashing every single one!
Thats why a review must be from the aspect of the reviewers MAIN taste.
Eg. I know Reviewer A has given band X CD Y a four star and I correlate this review with others by the same person and reason that Rev A has very similar taste to me, thus he reviews another and gives it a FIVE, I would be very interested in that CD.
Also high star ratings have lead me into purchasing some right turkeys, I'lllet you guess which ones! |
I think there should be a system of "Rate the Review", similar to the system on Amazon.
This can be tied into the album's rating algorithm, so if a review gets high marks from readers, then the album's score gets a corresponding bonus score.
Just an idea...
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Kestrel
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 18 2008
Location: Minnesota
Status: Offline
Points: 512
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 04:35 |
I completely agree with the "need more than 5 steps" crowd. It seems like so many albums I will eventually review will just get 3 stars even though there is more variation within the 2-4 range than 1 step. Review rating is an idea I've thought of from time to time and I think it would be pretty cool.
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 04:47 |
I'd be happy with a 6-star system - anything to remove the middle option.
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What?
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 05:26 |
I support Ivans idea of .5 star system. That would help to put a slight + or - shading on an album review. I dont think it needs to be more complicted than that.
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MikeEnRegalia
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Posted: July 14 2008 at 05:49 |
I think that one effect of the limited choices is that often albums which are really good are only given 3 stars, simply because the reviewer doesn't want to be regarded as a "fanboy" who gives 4 or 5 stars to all his favorite albums. If there were more choices in the upper ranks, this could be avoided. 3/5 stars is the same as 6/10 stars ... and I'm sure that most people would agree that a 6 out of 10 ratings doesn't really look like a recommendation.
I think that the ideal solution for the archives would be to offer two additional choices:
4.5
3.5
You don't really need the fine grained steps in the lower ranks - but even introducing 4.5 alone would be a major improvement. The only question: What to do about the old ratings?
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