Do the Beatles get too much credit.. |
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Meltdowner
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Mortte
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 11 2016 Location: Finland Status: Offline Points: 5538 |
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Lots of funny posts here, I am going to go serious again, so everybody who is already bored to this issue, just don`t read this.
I have said this many times before, but some people seem to mix facts & their opinions, specially with the Beatles. Fact is before Beatles became, popular music was going into really boring direction. Rock`n`Roll and Blues were really down at the moment. Beatles haters are saying that if Beatles wasnīt happened, there would have been some other. But thatīs impossible to know. There might been difficult to say artists of these days directly influenced by the Beatles, but if Beatles had never happened, itīs possible we would have then 2000`s versions of Pat Boone & Petula Clark at the moment. I donīt say theyīre absolutely horrible, but I really understand why teens of that time really got into Beatles. But on the other hand Beatles were overrated by hardcore fans at sixties. Beatles become a cult and it was enough to hardcorefans to see Beatles moving and opening their mouths at the stage. Even Beatles themselves couldnīt hear each other (Ringo has said he played according how John & Paul moved, I think itīs amazing how good they played together in those concerts). This madness caused of course their split in 1970, itīs quite amazing they stayed together even that long. I really understand their decision to quit concerts and just make good music in the studio, but it was enormous risk in that time. Today bands donīt have to tour when there is internet with youtube & spotify, but that time tours were the ones the keep bands alive. But again I think all Beatles-fans are just glad they did what they did because that resulted "SGT" etc. Also, we can estimate, would Floyd and also other prog band have opportunity to use as much studiotime as they used without Beatles. EMI really wasnīt glad about those endless hours of making Sgt. But great thing was that Sgt sold that much (I think at least in the seventies Sgt was second best Beatles-album seller), so the recordcompanies also started to think it is useful to use lots of studiotime making better albums.
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20625 |
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Of course I read the first post...but apparently ...if you don't have a sense of humor..it just ain't funny.
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 36050 |
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Mortte, really interesting post. Thanks. I was tryng to repnd before, but I got too windy again.
Doug, I just wasn't sure. I think I lost my sense of humour after a certain someone said "I could stand in the middle Of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose any voters", but then later failed to demonstrate this by standing in the middle of Fifth Avenue, while slowly pulling out his piece, only to get run over by a taxi cab driven by an immigrant in the process. Missed opportunity! |
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Ok honestly
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SteveG
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
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IIRC, Engelbert's cover of Release Me knocked Penny Lane off no.1 on the charts in 1966. Yeah, totally overhyped band that robbed other unbelievable artists of their time. Anyhow, I wonder if you are acquainted with Ivan. Ivan: Welcome back to PA. Wondering if micky will post here, that would really complete the picture.
Edited by rogerthat - March 26 2020 at 06:43 |
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SteveG
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20625 |
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Even the god of Prog ...Robert Fripp said he was influenced by the Beatles:
Robert Fripp once stated that King Crimson was his way of uniting the music of Hendrix, Bartok and The Beatles. Hearing A Day In The Life, an experience he later described as incredibly powerful, certainly opened the door to In The Court Of The Crimson King. So put that in your pipe and smoke it.... |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20625 |
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_impact_of_the_Beatles
"If it weren't for the Beatles, there wouldn't be anyone like us around." -Jimmy Page, Led Zeppelin "If it weren't for the Beatles, I wouldn't be a musician." -Dave Grohl, Nirvana/Foo Fighters "Everyone was influenced someone. But everyone was influenced by the Beatles." -Alice Cooper "Everyone thought the Beatles will just pass by. But to me, they had staying power." -Bob Dylan "The Beatles are the reason I'm a musician." -Sting, The Police "The Beatles' songs are in my genetic material." -Robin Williams but....naaah...an overrated band. |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 36050 |
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I of course agree and have all along that the Beatles were massively influential, I don't think that should be in dispute, the central question is, have The Beatles been given too much credit as innovators and originators?
Again, I think, like with most things, the Beatles are both overrated and underrated by individuals. One can't discount the personal experience of many artists, and I would not dispute that the Beatles had a tremendous effect on many musicians and on music. A favourite album of mine is William Sheller's Lux Aeterna, the Beatles changed his life, and as he relayed it, while at music conservatory studying formal classical/ art music, his teachers were very disappointed. Now I would have to see the context, but if you take this as a contained statement (no additional info or context needed): "Everyone was influenced someone. But everyone was influenced by the Beatles" (Alice Cooper), then he is overrating the Beatles. That is a claim that could not be substantiated, and in fact easily could be proven false. It comes across as hyperbole. That said, of course he didn't literally mean everyone,. I have heard ludicrous claims made by people about the significance of the Beatles. Clearly some have underrated them and others have overrated them, it would amaze me if it could be otherwise as we are not omniscient, and often not rational nor intelligent creatures. Edited by Logan - March 27 2020 at 20:02 |
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Logan
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Said it already, but while I voted yes, the Beatles do get too much credit, had I been asking if the Beatles get too little credit, then I also would have voted yes. This need not present a contradiction.
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Mortte
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I think Cooperīs statement is true when thinking sixties. Beatles were then everywhere and I think you couldnīt avoid their influence even if you had wanted. Ian Anderson has said he wasnīt influenced by the Beatles, although he liked them. I understand his point, he wanted to make Jethro unique, so he wanted to get influences to his band from much more rare artists. But I think he also couldnīt at least unconsciously avoid Beatles-influences. Beatles were masters of the sad melodies, these same kind of melodies I hear for example Jethro`s "Alive and Well & Living In", "Life`s a Long Song" & "Really Donīt Mind"-part in Thick as a Brick.
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Mortte
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At the moment my fav Beatles album is that compilation US version of Magical Mystery Tour, but of course it canīt be said official studio album, Revolver has stayed itīs place.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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That's my opinion. Honestly, even if there were no better albums, this doesn't make an album good, just a poor year for music. But there were better albums for me, like Freak Out (Zappa), Roger The Engineer (Yardbirds), Pet Sounds (Beach Boys) and the underrated Psychedelic Lollipop (Blues Magoos). But again, just my opinion. Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - March 28 2020 at 02:05 |
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rogerthat
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The entirety of his ratings above are highly debatable, to say the least. I know no Beatles fan who rates Let It Be above Sgt, White album or Revolver. Let It Be had potential but combined with the brass gloss of Phil Spector turned into a rather soporific affair.
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Mascodagama
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Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to.
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Mascodagama
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Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Do you know there's something called personal taste? Taste is not debatable. BTW: I'm not a Beatles fan. P.S. Spector saved Let it Be from oblivion, the work he did with Across the Universe is brilliant. |
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rogerthat
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Your taste doesn't determine whether an album is great or good or average. Your taste only tells you whether you like an album or not. But let's leave that aside, what your taste doesn't decide is whether a band gets too much credit.
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