| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Djam Karet 
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 09 2013
Location: Topanga
Status: Offline
Points: 12
|
 Topic: Is Djam Karet really a "prog" band?
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:08 |
Howdy, Ever wonder if Djam Karet is really a prog band? Me too!!
Maybe we are not a prog band because we do not have any songs about dwarfs, fairies or castles! And we don't sound like Genesis. And some of our albums are entirely Electronic.
But maybe we really are a prog band ... because we try to make an expanded, enlarged, bigger version of Rock music, with multiple changes in rhythm, tempo, key, instrumentation, style, etc.
You decide!
Gayle
|
 |
Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:36 |
|
That's a silly question, you are an instrumental prog band. I first found y'all when AOL had an internet streaming progressive rock radio station. Never any doubts in my mind.
|
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
|
|
timothy leary
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 29 2005
Location: Lilliwaup, Wa.
Status: Offline
Points: 5319
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:36 |
|
Only if Steven Wilson offers to remaster your early work.
|
|
irrelevant
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 07 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 13382
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:38 |
 Djam Karet wrote:
Howdy,Ever wonder if Djam Karet is really a prog band? Me too!!
Maybe we are not a prog band because we do not have any songs about dwarfs, fairies or castles! And we don't sound like Genesis. And some of our albums are entirely Electronic.
But maybe we really are a prog band ... because we try to make an expanded, enlarged, bigger version of Rock music, with multiple changes in rhythm, tempo, key, instrumentation, style, etc.
You decide!
Gayle |
That describes prog a bit better than dwarfs, fairies, castles and sounding like Genesis.  Welcome to the site. Cool of you to join us!
|
|
|
|
The Pessimist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 13 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3834
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:49 |
Djam Karet wrote:
Howdy,Ever wonder if Djam Karet is really a prog band? Me too!!
Maybe we are not a prog band because we do not have any songs about dwarfs, fairies or castles! And we don't sound like Genesis. And some of our albums are entirely Electronic.
But maybe we really are a prog band ... because we try to make an expanded, enlarged, bigger version of Rock music, with multiple changes in rhythm, tempo, key, instrumentation, style, etc.
You decide!
Gayle |
I've heard there is controversy behind it. Personally I don't think you guys PROGRESS enough for it to be called prog, and nor do you pay that much homage to the earlier prog bands. I mean I like that one tune you did with the Shostakovich type cluster chords in the D section, but if you ask me the rest of the harmony was a little too trite for that section to work. Also your rhythm is slightly stereotypical... I mean you phrase all your 5/4 stuff like 3 3 4 (quavers), and it gets very samey. Try reversing that pattern? But as I've always said, odd time =/= prog. I think with a bit more creativity you could be called PROG band, but for now I'd consider you guys alternative rock, although some other folk would dispute this... Hope this helps
|
|
"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg
|
|
Earthmover
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 03 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 1509
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 11:51 |
timothy leary wrote:
Only if Steven Wilson offers to remaster your early work. |
Case closed.
|
|
|
|
warrplayer
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 18 2010
Location: Charlotte, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 111
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 12:33 |
The Pessimist wrote:
I've heard there is controversy behind it. Personally I don't think you guys PROGRESS enough for it to be called prog, and nor do you pay that much homage to the earlier prog bands. I mean I like that one tune you did with the Shostakovich type cluster chords in the D section, but if you ask me the rest of the harmony was a little too trite for that section to work. Also your rhythm is slightly stereotypical... I mean you phrase all your 5/4 stuff like 3 3 4 (quavers), and it gets very samey. Try reversing that pattern? But as I've always said, odd time =/= prog. I think with a bit more creativity you could be called PROG band, but for now I'd consider you guys alternative rock, although some other folk would dispute this... Hope this helps
|
They don't progress enough nor pay enough homage? Based on what ( non musical ) scale? i hear Floyd and KC nods almost every time I bust out some DK. Progress isn't only measured by changing up compositional aspects. Reflections from the Firepool wouldn't sound any more brilliant if it had thrown in more compostional variation. Like Pink Floyd it is based on adherence to blues and rock based figures. And, many consider it a classic.
Anyway, you certainly dance about architecture well, but the whole thread is doomed by the opening question...Is this Prog?
I always considered DK instrumental rock.
|
|
The Pessimist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 13 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3834
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 12:35 |
warrplayer wrote:
The Pessimist wrote:
I've heard there is controversy behind it. Personally I don't think you guys PROGRESS enough for it to be called prog, and nor do you pay that much homage to the earlier prog bands. I mean I like that one tune you did with the Shostakovich type cluster chords in the D section, but if you ask me the rest of the harmony was a little too trite for that section to work. Also your rhythm is slightly stereotypical... I mean you phrase all your 5/4 stuff like 3 3 4 (quavers), and it gets very samey. Try reversing that pattern? But as I've always said, odd time =/= prog. I think with a bit more creativity you could be called PROG band, but for now I'd consider you guys alternative rock, although some other folk would dispute this... Hope this helps
|
They don't progress enough nor pay enough homage? Based on what ( non musical ) scale? i hear Floyd and KC nods almost every time I bust out some DK. Progress isn't only measured by changing up compositional aspects. Reflections from the Firepool wouldn't sound any more brilliant if it had thrown in more compostional variation. Like Pink Floyd it is based on adherence to blues and rock based figures. And, many consider it a classic.
Anyway, you certainly dance about architecture well, but the whole thread is doomed by the opening question...Is this Prog?
I always considered DK instrumental rock. |
I was bluffing, I thought this was spam  Flame me if you wish...
|
|
"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg
|
|
Evolver
Special Collaborator
Crossover & JR/F/Canterbury Teams
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: The Idiocracy
Status: Offline
Points: 5493
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 12:59 |
Hi Gayle. I've been listening to your music since the mid-1980s, thanks to the old "On Reflection" newsletter. If not prog, how would you describe your music? Notice from the bands listed here, we use the term somewhat loosely.
|
|
Trust me. I know what I'm doing.
|
|
The Pessimist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 13 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3834
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 13:03 |
Gayle, Just listened to your music... It's awesome, sorry for trolling earlier My mistake!
|
|
"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg
|
|
warrplayer
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 18 2010
Location: Charlotte, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 111
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 13:21 |
|
|
|
The Pessimist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 13 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3834
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 13:27 |
Yeah I really didn't have a clue what I was talking about... After listening to a few tunes I'd say they are definitely prog though
|
|
"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg
|
|
HolyMoly
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: April 01 2009
Location: Atlanta
Status: Offline
Points: 26138
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 13:45 |
|
Since joining this site, I've learned that the term "prog" indeed covers a relatively narrow scope of music - i.e. it doesn't necessarily apply to every band who is adventurous, complex, etc, otherwise you'd have to include groups like Wire, Sonic Youth, et al. I don't wish to critique nor defend this convention, but there it is.
Even with the restrictive scope, however, I think Djam Karet is an easy fit for the "prog rock" tag. Not as a value judgment, but as a stylistic description. Prog rock is far more than elves and castles and stuff.
Ironically, Djam Karet's least prog-like album I've heard (Suspension and Displacement, which I consider more an ambient album, not that ambient can't be prog, but you get my gist), is one of my all time favorite albums. So they've covered a lot of things and covered them well. But at their core, I'd call em prog.
|
|
My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.
-Kehlog Albran
|
|
Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23184
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 13:58 |
HolyMoly wrote:
Since joining this site, I've learned that the term "prog" indeed covers a relatively narrow scope of music - i.e. it doesn't necessarily apply to every band who is adventurous, complex, etc, otherwise you'd have to include groups like Wire, Sonic Youth, et al. I don't wish to critique nor defend this convention, but there it is.
Even with the restrictive scope, however, I think Djam Karet is an easy fit for the "prog rock" tag. Not as a value judgment, but as a stylistic description. Prog rock is far more than elves and castles and stuff.
Ironically, Djam Karet's least prog-like album I've heard (Suspension and Displacement, which I consider more an ambient album, not that ambient can't be prog, but you get my gist), is one of my all time favorite albums. So they've covered a lot of things and covered them well. But at their core, I'd call em prog.
|
Great post Steve. It perfectly illustrates my thoughts on this issue. Just for the record, Suspension & Displacement is my fave too 
There are a lot of prog bands on this site, but it's not all who are progressive. The Trip is what I'd call a genuine progressive album though. Anyway this is just splitting hairs. I know what I like, and I genuinely adore the mish mash of the Berliner school electronics paired together with the more psychedelic rocking sections Who cares whether or not Djam Karet is prog anyway? It's not a badge of honour.
|
|
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
|
|
HolyMoly
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: April 01 2009
Location: Atlanta
Status: Offline
Points: 26138
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 15:05 |
|
Thanks for the kind words, David.
I just bought The Trip, btw, and after one listen am not yet sure how I feel about it. I was not in a good state of mind while it was playing. Work stress and rush hour traffic dontcha know.
|
|
My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased.
-Kehlog Albran
|
|
warrplayer
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 18 2010
Location: Charlotte, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 111
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 16:16 |
HolyMoly wrote:
Thanks for the kind words, David.
I just bought The Trip, btw, and after one listen am not yet sure how I feel about it. I was not in a good state of mind while it was playing. Work stress and rush hour traffic dontcha know.
|
Yeah. this album is totally old school. you have to set aside the whole 45 minutes ahead of time. I've heard some complain it takes too long to get anywhere. Nope. It takes 45 minutes to get where it's going. Very ballsy move imo.
|
|
verslibre
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 01 2004
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 19721
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 16:52 |
warrplayer wrote:
I've heard some complain it takes too long to get anywhere. |
Absurd. The Trip's 45 minutes go by so quickly, they could've tacked on another 10-minute'r!
|
|
|
|
verslibre
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 01 2004
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 19721
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 16:58 |
Djam Karet wrote:
Howdy,Ever wonder if Djam Karet is really a prog band? Me too!! Maybe we are not a prog band because we do not have any songs about dwarfs, fairies or castles! And we don't sound like Genesis. And some of our albums are entirely Electronic. But maybe we really are a prog band ... because we try to make an expanded, enlarged, bigger version of Rock music, with multiple changes in rhythm, tempo, key, instrumentation, style, etc. You decide! Gayle |
Hey, Gayle!
"Is Djam Karet reall a 'prog 'band?"
a) Despite being a SoCal resident, I first heard of DK in Wayside's catalog — Check!
b) All-instrumental, rock at the core, but with many other styles blended in — Check!
c) A clear affinity for Berlin School (and other) electronic music/ambient genres — Check!
d) "Themed" albums — Check!
e) NCP = No Commercial Potential — Check!
f) ALL OF THE ABOVE!
|
|
|
|
Djam Karet
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 09 2013
Location: Topanga
Status: Offline
Points: 12
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 17:25 |
Howdy, Thanks for the kind words and fun slam on our music by "The Pessimist"!! Our recent album The Trip is rather unusual for us, because it is not "in your face" music, like some of what we do, but rather its much more "laid-back" and casual. And its so damn slow that it could be boring to some. And if you are not in a good mood, you really might not like it. But with headphones on, its kinda cool (in my totally biased opinion).
Actually, it was recorded between takes of The Heavy Soul Sessions CD. To relax and chill out we would improvise spacey moody textures for fun and distraction. then we'd go back and work on the Heavy Soul CD.
But they sure came out really different (not just because we used a room mic on the drums on The Trip, and close mics of Heavy Soul).
Anyway, I ramble on ...
Gayle
|
|
The Pessimist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 13 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 3834
|
Posted: August 29 2013 at 17:37 |
Djam Karet wrote:
Thanks for the kind words and fun slam on our music by "The Pessimist"!! |
It was a bluff, honest I'd never heard your music before this thread...
|
|
"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg
|
|
/PAlogo_v2.gif "Progarchives.com Homepage")
Is Djam Karet really a "prog" band?
Dude, legendary bluff! They do tend to play all their 5/4 stuff in 3 3 4 (quavers)! But, they are still some of the baddest rockin' mofos on the planet. 