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A Liberal Decalogue: Russell's Ten Commandments |
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Logan 
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Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 38394 |
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 Posted: April 25 2021 at 10:23 |
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Just a little bump as I find this a really interesting topic and would be interested to get more takes on any of the issues raised in this topic.
I remain ultimately agnostic on all things (lacking absolute certainty), including that last statement, but that doesn't mean that I do not believe/ am not confident about a great many things. |
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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I observed before. It can be much like that with music for me; immersed in experiencing the moment.
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dr wu23
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Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20697 |
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Posted: April 25 2021 at 10:45 |
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Your Plato quote/tagline is right on the money and I often quote RAWilson who said, " If you think you know what's going on then you are probably full of s**t." (apologies if that sounds flippant) I'm also agnostic when it comes to religion as I mentioned on the other thread. You said there are many things you are confident about...which specific things? And what was your main core point so far in this thread?
Edited by dr wu23 - April 25 2021 at 10:46 |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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Logan
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Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 38394 |
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Posted: April 25 2021 at 11:08 |
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I'm confident that I exist in some sense, that those around me exist, that I won't start falling into the sky in a second, that I should be careful when it comes to COVID-19, that eating poison would be bad for my health, and philosophically that maximising well-being generally is better than maximising suffering. For survival, it helps to believe certain things.
As for the core point, it is about epistemology, about belief and knowledge and the limits there-of, free-thinking (or as free as it can be as I am a determinist -- don't believe in truly free will) and dogmatic thinking. An open-minded "liberal" and sceptical outlook as opposed to a rigid, orthodox, dogmatic outlook. In regards to the God belief, I am agnostic in that I ultimately do not know and an atheist in that I lack belief in a God or gods. I tend not to use the atheist label for my weak atheism as it confuses many people and some can't seem to understand the difference between, or nuances of, knowing something and believing something. Many people do seem to have very black and white thinking and rigid world views, are not open to new evidence, ideas or arguments, live in echo chambers, and confirmation bias is a problem. Too many assumptions are made and held onto, and people seek patterns to fit the assumptions and desires rather than trying to keep a more open mind. This is favourite Russell quote of mine: "One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision" (Bertrand Russell). Edited by Logan - April 25 2021 at 11:22 |
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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I observed before. It can be much like that with music for me; immersed in experiencing the moment.
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dr wu23
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Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20697 |
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Posted: April 25 2021 at 11:25 |
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Great quote from Russell....one of my favorites from Terrance McKenna...(not on everyday social and political aspects but about the deeper mysteries of life),
"Is what we moderns have remaining to learn about the nature of reality slight and will it require only light fine-tuning of our current way of looking at things; or do we understand very little , missing the point entirely about the nature of our situation in being ?"
-T McKenna |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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moshkito
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Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 18497 |
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Posted: April 30 2021 at 10:06 |
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Hi,
I so hoped that this would turn into KEN RUSSELL's Ten Commandments ... it would be fitting, given his incredible list of films going way back to the early stuff he did for the BBC, of which Elgar is fantastic, his version of Isadora Duncan is better than the Hollywood schmuck, and the one on Dante Gabriel Rossetti is fantastic. No one, in film, has touched the arts, more than Ken Russell. And specially music, although it is hard to let go things like SAVAGE MESSIAH, DANTE GABRIEL ROSSETTI, ISADORA DUNCAN, and even GOTHIC, although I thought that film was kinda making the whole thing look weird, instead of showing its literary side and how it grew ... I think that by that time the studio expected a film with excesses that were just showy and forgot what the film was about! The early stuff can be seen in a box set that has just about all of them.
Edited by moshkito - April 30 2021 at 10:10 |
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Logan
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Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 38394 |
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Posted: April 30 2021 at 10:51 |
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Yes, it never did. If you like, I'll quote your earlier posts on it, and see if people find that a more interesting topic than Bertrand Russell. Ken Russell is one of my favourites too. I'm happy to see digressions and am a great fan of the fine art of the segue. I do find Bertrand Russell to be a fascinating personality, and he has a Prog connection because of course Gong's Flying Teapot is a reference to Russell's teapot analogy.
"If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time" (Bertrand Russell). Your earlier posts: One page two:
On page six:
I tried to tie the two together badly with these quotes:
I do suggest looking more into Bertrand Russell if you aren't familiar with him. Edited by Logan - April 30 2021 at 10:53 |
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Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I observed before. It can be much like that with music for me; immersed in experiencing the moment.
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Logan wrote:
