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Topic ClosedGood lyrics in prog.. ? Where are they ?

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Zeromus218 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2010 at 14:36
My favourite part of the songs by Peter Hammill is when in Man-Erg he says: 
"How can i be free? How can i get out? Am i really me? Am i someone else?" 
he sings it in a way that is perfectly linked with the feelings he has to transmiss.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 25 2010 at 10:52
Man-erg lyrics are as simple as totally genial. I like the lyrics from begining to end.
And yes im Peter Hammill freak and Man-erg is close to perfection.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 25 2010 at 10:55
And i too live inside me
and very often dont know who i am
i know im not a hero ..well i hope that im not damn
 
Hammill are you trying to make me cry?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 04 2010 at 03:59
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Originally posted by Esben73 Esben73 wrote:

I love the music, but my main problem with prog is that the poets are simply not there.

Come on, they aren't. Admit it. You would never read the "Collected poems and love stories of Jon Anderson". You would not pick up the "Novels of Fish in 19 volumes with a foreword by Steve Wilson".
 
Or maybe you would. I started the topic as a statement, but what I meant was just the question: are there any good prog lyricist out there ?? Or is Prog just the music ??? Who is the Bob Dylan of prog ?? Who do you think are truly fine prog lyricists ?


Yes I do admit it. Prog does at least have the lyrics of Peter Hamill, Roger Waters and at a pinch Kevin Gilbert and perhaps as a talented young 'bench warmer' Steven Wilson. (Although I note that John Cale has been sneaked into the first team of late on a free transfer) The remainder are but the overreaching adolescent drivel of those who read Tolkien, Science Fiction, fantasy literature, oriental mysticism and never recover.

Prog does not have a Lloyd Cole, Stan Ridgeway, Lou Reed, Bob Dylan, Tom Verlaine, Robert Smith, Neil Hannon, Patti Smith, Elvis Costello, Tim Finn, Robert Forster, Nick Cave, Morrissey, Frank Black, David Byrne, Elliott Smith, Ray Davies, Mark Smith (the list goes on)

For reasons I've never been able to fathom Prog would have still come up with something as overwrought as Tales From Topographic Oceans even if Jon Anderson's remit had been to write about the secular concerns of simple fisher folk from Hull. Draw your own conclusions of course but ain't it funny that both Floyd and VDGG appear to be less than comfortable with the appellation 'Progressive Rock' when it's applied to their work ?
 
What is so inherently bad about these things? Is it wrong for a lyricist to have an interest in things like literature and eastern religion? Why is that so terrible? These topics didn't only inspire these bands lyricically but it inspired the actual music as well, why shouldn't they write songs about these things? Because you don't like it? Yeah you probably shouldn't be a prog fan if fantastical lyrics bother you that much. Tongue
 
And rock music has a very adolescend quality to it in general, I'm always turned off by critics who hate on music for being "immature".
 
I don't really care if Yes and KC don't have lyrics as good as the people you mentioned if they make superior music (though I am a fan of some of those you mentioned) and because lyrics don't matter that much to me anyway but really, if you were just to read Frank Black's lyrics without musical context you would laugh your ass off, "SLICING UP EYEBALLS WOAH HO HO HO". Actually some of those lyrics are pretty ridiculous even with the musical context. LOL
 
I have to go with the guy who said that lyrics are really just a form of self expression, even when it's just random stuff somebody comes up with because it fits with the music. And that's the key word, fitting with the music, it would be boring if all musicians wrote lyrics like Bob Dylan. While Jon Anderson's lyrics aren't my idea of reading material, that's the point, they're NOT reading material, they're freaking lyrics, the guy is a lyricist, not an author.
 
I listen to music to listen to it, not to read it.


Edited by boo boo - May 04 2010 at 04:02
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 04 2010 at 04:53
That being said, one big part of prog's appeal  for me is the whimsical and fantastical nature of it both musically and lyrically.
 
Some lyricists like Hammill, Waters and Wilson can go beyond the fantasy stuff and write some really profound lyrics but most of the time I like that prog bands have an impenetrable lyrical style, the lyrics may not have anything terribly important to say, but that's because the focus is on the music.
 
Most prog even "sounds" whimisical and fantastical on a music level, so if the lyrics were about the same things that people like Dylan and Costello write about, it wouldn't be a good fit. Prog has an out of this world sound and thus works best with out of this word subject matter. The fantastical, the mythological, the abstract and the surreal. Often that works better in prog than stuff about more social issues like what the punk and American folk movements were more concerned with.
 
I see nothing wrong with such "immature" subject matter, after all it's always the punk guys who say rock n roll needs a little immaturity amirite?
 
Take for example how Peart works better with geeky sci fi stuff than with corny Ayn Rand lite logician rants. Prog wouldn't fare as well with standard rock n roll lyrics either, like how Sinfield works best with lyrics about crimson kings, moonchildren, circuses and ladies of the dancing water and isn't so great with lyrics about getting "A taste of my love".  Wink
 
Most prog lyrics are cryptic as all hell but weither it's for a laugh or meant to be taken seriously, it suits the music. Weither or not guys like Ian Anderson, Jon Anderson or Peter Gabriel are full of crap, the cryptic nature of the lyrics add a mystique to the music and makes you wonder. That's kinda the beauty of prog, it f*cks with your head. If you want "straightforward" music, prog isn't the place to look. LOL
 
Prog lyrics don't really need to have anything to do with "reality" since it could be argued that the music itself doesn't, so much prog has it's roots in classical music and lets not forget that classical music very often had romantic and fantastical themes rather than social ones.
 
People have been giving Jon a hard time on this thread, while I agree that he's no Dylan, you have to remember (and I think he even admitted) that he often comes up with words not for their meaning so much as for how they compliment the music, if that's what his goal is as a lyricist I would call him a successful one, and that's something many lyricists do especially in prog. It isn't really any different from what Thom York of Radiohead or Michael Stipe of REM does, they sing about gibberish too, but they make it SOUND important. And that's not a talent just any random hack possesses.


Edited by boo boo - May 04 2010 at 05:42
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