As I have read several threads in this Forum with questions about some Genesis`songs and albums, I think that this interview could be interesting for some people who likes this band. The interview was available in a website from Holland called "Los Endos", but today I searched for it using Google, and fortunately I found it in:

http://genesis-path.net/art82-03.html - http://genesis-path.net/art82-03.html

tony banks "Misunderstanding is not represantitive of our sound"

NetsNJFan wrote: tony banks "Misunderstanding is not represantitive of our sound"

Yes, Tony.  Much applause.

Syntharachnid wrote: NetsNJFan wrote: tony banks "Misunderstanding is not represantitive of our sound" Yes, Tony.  Much applause.

"It`s not representative of us, but it is just another zone of the band" (Tony Banks).

Why they chose it for a single? It was a decision done as a band, IMO.

Cluster One wrote: Great interview and very telling. Steve is blatantly not mentioned AT ALL until AFTER Wind & Wuthering when he gets fed up and leaves, and then the three remaining guys lay into him by saying "we didn't miss him" or "it was time for him to go" NO CLASS! To overlook his contribution(s) to Selling-Lamb-Trick-Wind is a sin that Banks/Collins/Rutherford should feel ashamed about!

It's really a shame - the three of them treated Steve like sh*t.  He's a much better writer than Mike Rutherford (who every now and then did write a good song)

I feel bad for him, some of him, but I would have stuck around in Genesis, just for $$$$ (yes i have no integrity)

Cluster One wrote: Great interview and very telling. Steve is blatantly not mentioned AT ALL until AFTER Wind & Wuthering when he gets fed up and leaves, and then the three remaining guys lay into him by saying "we didn't miss him" or "it was time for him to go" NO CLASS! To overlook his contribution(s) to Selling-Lamb-Trick-Wind is a sin that Banks/Collins/Rutherford should feel ashamed about!

I agree, no class at all....

This is Tony talking about "the Lamb....":  "The three of us got on like a house on fire with the writing."

Tony hints that the reason why they began giving individual credits is because Steve wasn't pulling his weight.  Well how about Phil, he never even wrote anything until 'Misunderstanding', which we all know is crap.  They don't even show too much respect for Pete either, they didn't like him handling all the lyrics on tLLDoB and it seems that they were pleased when he left.  It appears that they were sick of not getting enough attention-- these guys are clearly not giving PG and SH enough respect out of pride/ego's.

I agree with you all that the indifference to Steve's departure was quite sad.  No real announcement, just a quick "I'm leaving"....and no real response from the others, just relief.  I think a little less of the remaining three after reading that part....

Also a little surprised that Tony isn't too fond of 'Can-Utility...'.  That is far and away my favourite track on that album....

How would the interview after CAS have been?

Tony: We never cared much for Phil. He was quite a loser who didn't know anything about music and we had to tell him his stuff all the time.

Mike: (laughs) Yeah, what an untalented douchebag he was. I felt so relieved when he finally got the message and left. Just like the thing with... I've forgotten their names.

Tony: Yeah, the two of us wrote 99% of the material anyway. We could have been so much more succesful if we had dropped them all right away.

Sir Hogweed wrote: How would the interview after CAS have been? Tony: We never cared much for Phil. He was quite a loser who didn't know anything about music and we had to tell him his stuff all the time. Mike: (laughs) Yeah, what an untalented douchebag he was. I felt so relieved when he finally got the message and left. Just like the thing with... I've forgotten their names. Tony: Yeah, the two of us wrote 99% of the material anyway. We could have been so much more succesful if we had dropped them all right away.

I don't normally say this but: LOLOLOLOLOL

How about:

Tony: Finally Phil left. Then we got some guy in to sing some stuff that me and Mike wrote by ourselves...What was his name again?

Mike: Erm...Anthony Philips or something?

Tony: Something like that, yeah. Or wasn't that our old singer?

Mike: Doesn't matter really. It may have taken nearly 30 years but we managed to shake off the deadweights, and do what we love doing without hindrance.

Tony: Even though nobody likes us any more...

Mike: Shut it. They'll learn.

stonebeard wrote: can someone please answer my question?

Well, I hope so... !

In October 1982 there was a concert to help Peter Gabriel to earn money for him to pay for the WOMAD Festival that he organized. He lost a lot of money, it seems. So, he asked Collins-Banks-Rutherford to play with him in a one-off concert. The band was in the last dates of their "Three Sides Live Encore Tour". They finished the tour (with Chester Thompson and Daryl Stuermer) and they (the trio plus Thompson and Stuermer)   rehearsed a bit with Gabriel. It is not clear to me if Hackett was invited. But I also read an interview with Hackett on which he said that he was in Brazil at that time, and that his father called him there to  tell  him  the news about the "Reunion Concert". So, Hackett travelled to England and only played in the Encores ("I know what I like" and a short version of "The Knife") with Peter & the band. There is a book called "Genesis, from One Fan to Another", with photos by Armando Gallo. There are photos of that concert, with Steve playing on stage with them and smiling with Mike while playing.There is another photo, a "Backstage Photo" I think, on which the musicians are celebrating the success of the concert with a cake and some drinks. Steve and Peter are together, on one side of the photo, and in the other side are Tony Smith (cutting the cake),  B-C-R and Stuermer. There is also another photo of Steve chating with Daryl.

In February of 1983, Hackett invited Gabriel and Rutherford to play some songs during one of Hackett`s concerts.

In one interview, Hackett also said that he respected Banks as a musician but that he never considered him as a close friend.

In 1998, there was a "Reunion Photo" at London`s Heathrow Airport (is it the right  name of the Airport?) of  several members of the band (Hackett, Gabriel, Rutherford, Phillips, Banks, Collins and John Silver). It was at the time of the release of the "Archives 1967-75" Boxed Set. They are all  smiling in the photo.

In September 2000, two or three months after Rutherford and Banks fired Ray Wilson, they played a short concert with Collins and Stuermer (a semi-acoustic concert) to celebrate that Tony Smith won an award in England as manager. Gabriel appears with them in one photo on stage, but he didn`t sing with them.

I don`t know if they are only "Business Partners" and if they only have "apparent good relations" for this reason.

Bj-1 wrote: Thanks for the interview link, BTW

It`s good that you and other persons liked this interview.

I thought one comment by Tony Banks spoke volumes of the realtionship with Steve Hackett. When speaking about Foxtrot he said:

 "The way it turned out gathers momentum and has a very strong overall mood, which makes it our most successful song from those early days. I'm less fond of "Can-Utility and the Coastliners"

If I remember right this was Steve Hackett's song. I also think it intersting that they thought they could do nothing with any of Steve's songs that became Please Don't Touch.  I thought there were a few that would have been good starts to Genesis songs. 

Wow, after reading that, I no longer think Collins is the evil little monster. I would place that title on the shoulders of the very arrogant Banks and Rutherford. I love the way they completely downplayed Hackett's contribution to the band. The way they make him sound, one would have thought he was just a notch above a session musician.

I can now see why Gabriel and Hackett left as I am sure they could see these 2 guys were a couple of arrogant SOB's. Well perhaps we can guage the truly talented ones by who had the better solo careers. Hands down, that would go to Peter and Steve.

Garion81 wrote: I thought one comment by Tony Banks spoke volumes of the realtionship with Steve Hackett. When speaking about Foxtrot he said:  "The way it turned out gathers momentum and has a very strong overall mood, which makes it our most successful song from those early days. I'm less fond of "Can-Utility and the Coastliners" If I remember right this was Steve Hackett's song. I also think it intersting that they thought they could do nothing with any of Steve's songs that became Please Don't Touch.  I thought there were a few that would have been good starts to Genesis songs.

Ah, Can-Utility was Hackett's song. That explains a lot since I've allways loved that song and Tony seems to want to bring it down. He also mentions The Return Of The Giant H. in a quite negative way. Was that also a Hackett song? Or Seven Stones? (which I also like).

gdub411 wrote: Wow, after reading that, I no longer think Collins is the evil little monster. I would place that title on the shoulders of the very arrogant Banks and Rutherford. I love the way they completely downplayed Hackett's contribution to the band. The way they make him sound, one would have thought he was just a notch above a session musician. I can now see why Gabriel and Hackett left as I am sure they could see these 2 guys were a couple of arrogant SOB's. Well perhaps we can guage the truly talented ones by who had the better solo careers. Hands down, that would go to Peter and Steve.

I also hated Phil for quite some time as the sole destroyer of Genesis, but this interview gave me some new insights. Thanks Guillermo!

Hackett's solo output is far better than anything Genesis released after W&W IMO.
Denigrating a fellow band members contribution shows a lack of integrity and class.

Of course it is Hackett and Gabriel who maintained their musical integrity and Banks,Rutherford and The Poison Dwarf who sold out....

Ah, Can-Utility was Hackett's song. That explains a lot since I've allways loved that song and Tony seems to want to bring it down. He also mentions The Return Of The Giant H. in a quite negative way. Was that also a Hackett song? Or Seven Stones? (which I also like).

I believe that Hogweed was a Gabriel composition, and Seven Stones was Banks.  I don't think Hackett had anything to do with either of these songs, because he was new (Banks mentions that the material was written before Steve joined the band).  Hogweed is historically important, because it contains the first recorded "hammering" from Steve Hackett on the intro.  Perhaps this is why Banks doesn't like it.

gdub411 wrote:   I can now see why Gabriel and Hackett left as I am sure they could see these 2 guys were a couple of arrogant SOB's. Well perhaps we can guage the truly talented ones by who had the better solo careers. Hands down, that would go to Peter and Steve.

This probably has something to do with Phil, Tony, and Mike's comments.  They could've been jealous of Steve's solo success, so they downplay his role in Genesis because they are proud, and too stubborn to admit that Steve was a crucial element in their band.  This is even more evident in the case of Peter- they were tired of playing behind his shadow.

It's been a while since this interview though, and P, T, and M have probably changed their attitude by now.

Great interview.

And yes, I don't like the mentality of the three of them about Steve leaving.

But, other than that, they are good guys.

kotti wrote: It never ceases to amaze me how much false information and silly rumours get posted here about the band. The Musical Box has guitar parts from 4 people. The bulk of the song comes from the days before Hackett joined the band and goes back to the Anthony Phillips days. After Ant left they hired Mick Barnard for a few months and the writing of the song continued in this period. Hackett joined in January 1971 and the song got its final form after that, Steve sort of "rocked it up" with his style of playing. The 12-string parts are Mike Rutherford's speciality. As for the relations between the guys - they are all good friends with each other. Here's one part from the "Genesis General FAQ" on their official site. 7. Is there animosity between Steve Hackett and other members of the band? Is that why he left?   Steve Hackett's departure from the band has always been shrouded in mystery and rumours of unpleasantness, but the simple truth is that Steve felt torn between the band and a solo career. After the success of "Voyage of The Acolyte", and the freedom that came with making a whole album away from the confines of Genesis, remaining in the band became a struggle in many ways.   Writing a solo album had made Steve more prolific as a composer, and he was happy to remain in the band as long as they were prepared to accept a certain percentage of his material. The group, however, did not work in that way, preferring to use whatever material the band as a whole deemed fit for the albums, regardless of who had written it. Seeing some arguably lesser tracks making it onto "Wind and Wuthering" at the expense of his own material ("Wot Gorilla?" versus "Please Don't Touch" being a favourite topic of discussion amongst fans!), Steve felt that the group could no longer accommodate all the material he wanted to write. He therefore decided to quit after the 1977 tour to pursue his own musical direction, something which he continues to do to this day, to the delight of his many fans.     As for the suggestion of any animosity between Steve and the other members of the band - although it seems that Steve's departure did not hit the band as hard as Peter's or Ant's before him, the fact is that they knew they could carry on, having already survived the loss of those two members, and as Tony Banks said "By then, we were getting used to it!"   Steve joined the band on stage for the encores at the Milton Keynes Reunion show in 1982, and although it seems that he was not initially invited to take part in the whole event, this was because he was in Brazil at the time and the band were not sure if he would want to take part. Once he contacted them to offer his services, the band were only too happy for him to come along and help them out for the encores.    Although Steve initially seemed keen to distance himself from the band and its members, more recently he has embraced the music of early Genesis more so than any other ex-member, and shows a genuine fondness for this period in his career. Tony Banks is known to have attended Steve's 2003 show at London's Royal Festival Hall, and even Steve's birthday party!   Steve was also in attendance at the Archive set interviews, Mike's "This Is Your Life" show, and has expressed an interest in being involved in any reunion which may or may not take place. Fearless wrote: This is Tony talking about "the Lamb....":  "The three of us got on like a house on fire with the writing." Yet another quote blown out of proportion. Steve himself has said that he wasn't too keen on the Lamb and did NOT take that much part in its writing. Most of the music on the album was by the Phil, Mike and Tony trio. http://hit.demonhosting.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi/YaBB.cgi?board=news;action=display;num=1084802654 - The Genesis General FAQ http://hit.demonhosting.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi/YaBB.cgi?board=music;action=display;num=1084802712 - The Genesis Music FAQ

The Interview that I found gives the impression of other things. Maybe things have changed since then, but as I said before, they are "Business Partners" and by this reason they have to give the impression of being "good friends" to the fans.The information that you posted is from their official website, so it is "Their Official Version". They want to sell albums, so it is better to give a good impression of being "good friends".

I was a member of the Genesis Forum in 2001-2003. There was a thread started by other members which talked about Tony Banks` arrogance. A lot of the members that participated agreed that he is an arrogant person. I commented there that I saw on TV one interview with the trio done in 1992 which was  broadcasted in my country. Banks answered the questions almost as he was angry. Rutherford laughed and said  "Sorry!" after Banks`answer to one of the questions. I also read an interview, for a Mexican magazine, done in the U.S. during their 1983-84 tour. Banks gave me the same impression of  being arrogant, for example: "Question: tell me about the lights of the show"; Answer: "We shouldn`t talk about the lights...we should talk about the music...but if you want to talk about the lights...". etc., etc. A very impatient person.

I read another interview done with him in 1979 for the Spanish magazine called "Vibraciones". He said (more or less as I remember): "Yes, my album is going to be released by the end of the year. Mike`s album is going to be released next year (1980). But my favourite of all  the solo albums is my own solo album, of course! One of the ex-members which has amazed me as soloist is Steve. He has improved a lot. I don`t listen very much to Brand X because their style of music  is not one of my favourites". This interview was done in mid 1979, when the trio was on vacations as a band after the long "and then there were three" tour of 1978.

Banks could be arrogant but I recognize that he is a very good musician.

Another example of "giving the impression of being good  friends". I read one interview with Chris Squire done in 1998. He was asked about the booklet notes of YES` "Beyond and Before-The BBC Recordings" album, which were written by Peter Banks. "What album you said? Was it recopiled by Peter? I didn`t know that it was released!". The journalist said to Squire that Banks wrote in the booklet that he was fired by YES. Squire said: "No. Nobody in YES  has being fired. They left by mutual agreement".

In another interview done in 1973 (available in the "YES Museum" Website) Jon Anderson  said about Banks and Kaye: "Peter was more interested in his clothes than in the music. He was lazy. I had very good conversations with Tony, but he wasn`t very creative in the music. So, we looked for other musicians".

Great article!

But I think it really shows almost how jerky Rutherford and Banks are.

I respect Collins a lot more after reading this. I think Rutherford and Banks need to turn down the E-G-O.

Props for Peter and Steve!

kotti wrote: Guillermo, First of all the band isn't involved in the forum in any way. The FAQ and all the other posts are written by fans. I wouldn't call Tony arrogant but he has always been a perfectionist and likes to have things his way. He was for the keyboard-based sound of Genesis whereas Steve obviously wanted his guitar to be heard more. When Peter was in the band the guys often had arguments about the music - five people all trying to push their ideas is a bit too much. This became less of a problem when Peter left but the keyboard vs guitar argument was still there. One of the reasons Peter left was because he needed time for other things than the band. For the other members Genesis had to come first and any outside activities were looked down upon. When Genesis was in hiatus Steve released his first solo album in 1975 after Peter had left and before 'Trick' was recorded. It was "accepted" by the fans and Steve knew he could do it in his own. During the making of Wind And Wuthering Steve became unhappy with how things worked in Genesis. The band worked as a 'committee' whereas Steve wanted some of his own songs included. He wasn't pleased with Wot Gorilla making the album instead of his song Please Don't Touch. But he was never pushed out of Genesis, he left because he was clearly going in a different direction than the others. This small tention between the guys is why his leaving was seen by the others as a relief. Everyone knew it was only a matter of time and when Steve finally left it was the end of that era and the start of a new one.

The Forum is part of their official website. They have a webmaster, and a main moderator (who at the time that I was in the Forum was a bassist called McCormick, I can`t remember his first name, but once he said that he played with Phil Manzanera and the band called 801, and with other musicians too). So, IMO, if that Forum is part of their official website, the FAQ section has to be sanctioned at least by the main moderator or by  Genesis` management (Hit and Run Music). The main moderator said that the ex-members of the band sometimes visited the Forum, so, IMO, that FAQ has to be "the official history".

I have read all the comments that you wrote  about the history of the band in several websites.

The Interview that I found is a "real interview" which was published in 1982. So, one can read and see their attitudes as they were in 1982.

If I consider Banks as "arrogant" I`m not underrating his musical talent. Many musicians have a "Big Ego". For example, Sting is "arrogant" IMO, too, but he is a good composer and a very good singer. He also considered that he "lost the floor" during the last years of The Police and that he became almost "impossible to work with". He said that in the TV Programme "VH1 Behind the Music" dedicated to the history of the band.

Steve Howe doesn`t like to shake the hands of people and fans because "they could hurt my hands to play".

In the "Genesis -A History" video (1990), Banks and Rutherford gave "more amicable" answers about the split with Hackett:

Tony:"I was surprised, because in "Wind and Wuthering" he did some of the best writing that he never did for us before".

Mike: "I think that he left at his strong... strongest point as a guitarist".

If you have seen that video, you can see different attitudes. More "polite" answers. That video was almost an official release, I think.

Another example is the "Yesyears" video. At the end of the video, Bruford said how "wonderful" was to be playing with YES again. In interviews published in the "Notes from the Edge" website,years later Bruford said the truth:"I only joined YES again only for the money. I`m not interested in playing that "old" music again. But if the Fans want to listen again to that songs played by me, and if the music industry plays tons of money for doing that,  I`ll  do it, to earn enough money to record my jazz albums with my band. YES and King Crimson became musical bonanzas for me".

kotti:

Tonight I visited the Genesis Official Website. In fact, the website has several FAQs in the main pages (one for the band, and others for Banks/Collins/Rutherford, etc.) and one in their Forum. I was surprised to see your nickname in that Forum. You are an "Admin. Full Time Forum Member" there and you appear in the "Ask the Moderator" threads!

Anyway, as I wrote before, the "The look at themselves Interview" was done in 1982. Maybe you have other sources of news about the relationships between the former members of Genesis in the present. But, again, in 1982 "they said what they said" in the Interview.

I have a question for you (not a very "nice" question  ):

Why Genesis composed and rehearsed the music for "The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" in Led Zeppelin`s Headley Grange for 3 months? I have read in Phil Collins` Official Website that he says that  house "was infested by rats, at least one hundred". I searched for more information about Headley Grange using Google. I found some websites. In one of that websites, they quoted Steve Hackett saying the same about the house. Other bands rehearsed and recorded albums in that house (Led Zeppelin recorded  "Stairway to Heaven" and the "Physical Graffitti" album in that house!). Another musician was Elvis Costello. He is quoted in other website  saying the same about the house. Why they used this house? Many people like me can`t stand seeing just one rat, less living with a lot of them for a long time!

Fortunately, Headley Grange is not in the present infested by rats, and it is not used anymore as a house rented for Rock bands. It is owned now by people who doesn`t work in the music industry.

Cluster One wrote: Great interview and very telling. Steve is blatantly not mentioned AT ALL until AFTER Wind & Wuthering when he gets fed up and leaves, and then the three remaining guys lay into him by saying "we didn't miss him" or "it was time for him to go" NO CLASS! To overlook his contribution(s) to Selling-Lamb-Trick-Wind is a sin that Banks/Collins/Rutherford should feel ashamed about!

I totally agree. This interview clearly shows that the music is larger than the people who made it.

Fearless wrote: I believe that Hogweed was a Gabriel composition, and Seven Stones was Banks.  I don't think Hackett had anything to do with either of these songs, because he was new (Banks mentions that the material was written before Steve joined the band).  Hogweed is historically important, because it contains the first recorded "hammering" from Steve Hackett on the intro.  Perhaps this is why Banks doesn't like it.

Thanks for that information. I always asked myself if he invented "hammering" but did not know it for a historical fact. On Fountain of Salmacis he performs that technique with even more "Balls". I guess that proves he at least composed his own parts.

Reading this made me sad.  When Steve left the magic was gone.  This band worked because it had a good balance of styles.

Gabriel's emotion and twistedness, Hackett's epic mysticism, Banks chord theory, Rutherford's melodies, and Collins' top notch feel for rhythms.  I think Hackett and Gabriel come from the same place musically while the rest of the band were more on the technical side of things, which is why they still sounded good after Gabriel left.  But once both were gone, the band lost that emotional mysticism that made the music so fantastic and interesting.

I got into Genesis 10 years ago.  Many years too late.  They are probably my favorite band.  But it seems the best music is made when there is a conflict of interest in the band.  It's too bad none of the bandmembers will probably never sacrifice their comfortable control of their own music to risk another band effort.