(No further comment necessary - Frank Zappa: Jesus Think's you're a Jerk from Broadway the Hard Way)

There's an ugly little wasel 'bout three-foot nine
Face puffed up from cryin' 'n lyin'
'Cause her sweet little hubby's
Suckin' prong part time
(In the name of The Lord)


Get a clue, little shrew
Oh yeah, oh yeah
Jesus thinks you're a jerk


Did he really choose Tammy to do His Work?
Robertson says that he's The One
Oh sure he is,
if Armageddon
Is your idea of family fun,
An' he's got some planned for you!
(Now, tell me that ain't true)


Now, what if Jimbo's slightly gay,
Will Pat let Jimbo get away?
Everything we've heard him say
Indicated that Jim must pay,
(And it just might hurt a bit)
But keep that money rollin' in,
'Cause Pat and naughty Jimbo
Can't get enough of it


Perhaps it's their idea
Of an Affirmative Action Plan
To give White Trash a 'special break';
Well, they took those Jeezo-bucks and ran
To the bank! To the bank! To the bank! To the bank!
And every night we can hear them thank
Their Buddy, up above
For sending down his love
(While you all smell the glove)


Jim and Pat should take a pole
(Right up each saintly glory-hole),
With tar and feathers too --
Just like they'd love to do to you


('Cause they think you are bad --
And they are very mad)


'Cause some folks don't want prayer in school!


(We'd need an ark to survive the drool
Of Micro-publicans, raised on hate,
And 'Jimbo-Jimbo' when they graduate)


Conviced they are 'The Chosen Ones' --
And all their parents carry guns,
And hold them cards in the N.R.A.
(With their fingers on the triggers
When they kneel and pray)


With a Ku-Klux muu-muu
In the back of the truck,
If you ain't Born Again,
They wanna mess you up, screamin':
"No abortion, no-siree!"
"Life's too precious, can't you see!"
(What's that hangin' from the neighbor's tree?
Why, it looks like 'colored folks' to me --
Would THEY do THAT...seriously?)


Imagine if you will
A multi-millionaire Television Evangelist,
Saved from Korean Combat duty by his father, a U.S. Senator


Studied Law --
But is not qualified to practice it


Father of a "love child"
Who, in adulthood, hosts the remnants
Of papa's religious propaganda program


Claims not to be a "Faith Healer",
But has, in the past,
Dealt stearnly with everything from hemorrhoids to hurricanes


Involved with funding for a 'secret war' in Central America
Claiming Ronald Reagan and Oliver North as close friends


Involved in suspicous 'tax-avoidance schemes',
(Under investigation for 16 months by the I.R.S.)


Claims to be a MAN OF GOD;
Currenty seeking the United States Presidency,
Hoping we will all follow him into --
The Twilight Zone


What if Pat gets in the White House,
And suddenly --
The rights of 'certain people' disappear
Mysteriously?


Now, wouldn't that sort of qualify
As an American Tragedy?
(Especially if he covers it up, sayin'
"Jesus told it to me!")


I hope we never see that day,
In The Land of The Free --
Or someday will we?
Will we?


And if you don't know by now,
The truth of what I'm tellin' you,
Then, surely I have failed somehow --


And Jesus will think I'm a jerk, just like you --
If you let those TV Preachers
Make a monkey out of you!


I said:
"Jesus will think you're a jerk"
And it will be true!


There's an old rugged cross
In the land of cutton --
It's still burnin' on somebody's lawn
And it still smells rotten


Jim and Tammy!
Oh, baby!
You gotta go!
You really got to go!

marktheshark wrote: "This man cannot be a true Christian. He's a fascist," Robertson has made controversial statements in the past. In October he suggested that the State Department be blown up with a nuclear device. He has also said that feminism encourages women to "kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians."

This pretty much sums it up.

Incredible.

that's a generalization, KOL. but that doesn't mean i don't agree with you. 

i think robertson should meet his maker himself if he's so eager to send others to Him.

JrKASperov wrote: I'd like to point out that according to Christian prophecy, the church (people who follow) of YHWH and Yahshua, or Jesus, will be the first to be judged.

Is this a good or bad thing?  educate me...

Christianity is biggest disaster.

spectral wrote: The issue with all this is how different people are treated in different ways.  Robertson can say all this stuff and get away with it scott free.  If a Muslim said anything remotely similar, he would be banged up on incitement to hatred charges, or a similar offence.  The inequity is astounding and worrying.  The likes of Robertson and most of the Fox News anchors (like O'Reilly) should be locked up!

Lets S  T  R  E  T  C  H this out a bit.

Such a thing as free speach (sort of) left in this country.  So what he said it on his own show. What muslim has been prosecuted for speaking his mind? Do you have some proof?  As for Robertson oh well, .  All he really said is If the guy is saying that the US is trying to kill him maybe the government should.  He didn't say he was going to do it. Whether or not you agree with that is one thing to prosecute him is something else.  Do what most of us in America do.  Don't pay any attention to him.

Robertson, 75, founder of the Christian Coalition of America and a former presidential candidate

David Brock, president of Media Matters, a liberal media watchdog group, said the remarks should discredit Robertson as a spokesman for the religious right.

Glad to see someone with a Prog Rock background has something sensible to say on the matter

Garion81 wrote: spectral wrote: The issue with all this is how different people are treated in different ways.  Robertson can say all this stuff and get away with it scott free.  If a Muslim said anything remotely similar, he would be banged up on incitement to hatred charges, or a similar offence.  The inequity is astounding and worrying.  The likes of Robertson and most of the Fox News anchors (like O'Reilly) should be locked up! Lets S  T  R  E  T  C  H this out a bit. Such a thing as free speach (sort of) left in this country.  So what he said it on his own show. What muslim has been prosecuted for speaking his mind? Do you have some proof?  As for Robertson oh well, .  All he really said is If the guy is saying that the US is trying to kill him maybe the government should.  He didn't say he was going to do it. Whether or not you agree with that is one thing to prosecute him is something else.  Do what most of us in America do.  Don't pay any attention to him.

In the UK there are laws/bills relating to incitement to hatred.  if a muslim cleric had uttered words similar to those he would have been arrested.  However, I bet someone similar to Robertson uttering those words in the UK, the police/authorities/govt would not even batter an eyelid.

You're right though, the likes of Robertson should be ignored entirely.

Look, let's call a spade a spade.  Robertson is not simply out of line, but he is suggesting a course of action that is 180 degrees from any reasonable understanding of Jesus' life and ministry.  To his credit, Robertson has done a great deal of good over decades of time, though most of you probably don't know it, and would not accept it.  However, he has been making these types of statements - irrational, and often extremely non-Christian - with increasing frequency, especially over the past couple of years or so.  All this means is that even Christians are subject to the vagaries of age, and the often accompanying diminution of mental powers, whether as a result of dementia, Alzheimers or other disease or condition.

Clearly nothing excuses this type of comment.  However, it would be equally inexcusable coming from a Jew, a Muslim, a Buddhist - or an atheist.  In this regard - and because I believe, from watching him over the years, that he is in fact "showing his age" vis-a-vis his mental faculties - I really don't believe his faith or religion has anything to do with it.  Thus, I find the "pot shots" being taken at Christians and Christianity in this particular thread to be inappropriate, offensive and opportunist.

Peace.

i have no problem with Christianity. i'm Christian, though i rarely attend church.
what i do have a problem with is people like pat robertson trying to make America
a overtly Christian authoritarian state. i think this is incarnated in his recent campaign
to get Judge Roberts,(whom i personally have no big problem with) electedto the
Supreme Court by making is a vote for God vs. a vote for Godless heathens.and with
every action by Evangelicals and fundamentalists to insert as many extremely
religious and what i would fanatical Christians into seats of power to serve their own
special interests, i believe these "devout" Christians are trying to appeal to good
Christians through manipulation and devious methods.

The only solution to world peace is eradication of all religions.

Marx once said religion was the opium of the masses, and this is so f***ing true!

Brainwashing diddleheads incapable to believe in what is real! Religion is a tool of power, a way of doing politics and is used to have the upper moral superiority of those believers!

Chavez supporters have now the right to eradicate Robertson from this planet!

Dickheads such as all televangelists are using God and religion to make a fortune! nothing more than that: Give me your dough , and I'll buy you a place in heaven.

JrKASperov wrote: May I chime in and comment that your beloved 'logic' and 'reason' is a belief in what is real too?

you talk in riddles!

This is an example of the measures being proposed by the UK govt.; comments like Robertson's would get included I imagine (if they were said in the UK), but of course these measures are aimed at muslims and not "others" who incite hatred!

HATE PREACHERS TARGETED

Sean:

I would like to respond to your comments:

"Marx once said religion was the opium of the masses, and this is so...true!"

Marx was also a hypocrite, in that he stole the basic precept of the communist politico-economic state from the New Testament.  Marx 101: "From each according to his ability to give; to each according to his need."  Compare that with the following statement from Acts 4:32-35: "now the multitude of those who believed were of one heart and one soul; neither did anyone say that any of the things he possessed was his own, but they had all things in common...Nor was there anyone among them who lacked; for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the proceeds of the things that were sold and laid them at the apostles' feet; and they distributed to each as anyone had need."

It is the height of arrogance and hypocrisy to base one's philosophy on a stolen idea, and then call the system that created that idea "the opium of the masses."

"Brainwashing diddleheads incapable to believe in what is real! Religion is a tool of power, a way of doing politics and is used to have the upper moral superiority of those believers!"

As has been discussed in other threads, a belief in science and other "rational, empirical" things - i.e., "what is real" - and a belief in God and Christ are not mutually exclusive.  Also, religion can be a "tool of power" and a "way of doing politics," but it is not always, nor need be.  As for "moral superiority," I know plenty of atheists and agnostics (and peoples of faiths other than Christianity) who have better "moral groundings" than many Christians I know.

"Chavez supporters have now the right to eradicate Robertson from this planet!"

I am guessing this was said in jest.  Because if not, it is as absurd and inappropriate as Robertson's original statement, and you are simply lowering yourself to his level.

"Dickheads such as all televangelists are using God and religion to make a fortune! nothing more than that: Give me your dough , and I'll buy you a place in heaven."

Again, a totally incorrect and unnecessarily denigrating and demeaning "broad-brush" statement.  Not all televangelists are "using God and religion to make a fortune."  There are many televangelists who do not even ask for money, either from their congregations (except at regular services during the offering) or from the "home audience."  Indeed, many of today's televangelists are not (as in the 70s and 80s) running their own companies and thus truly "lining their pockets" a la Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker, Pat Robertson, etc.  Rather, they are ministers of specific churches who make use of the broadcast media to expand their reach.  In these cases, the ministers earn salaries determined by the Board of Trustees of the specific church they are employed by, and are not permitted to accept anything other than their salary and, in some cases, "speaking fees" or honoraria for guest preaching in other places.  The "offering" made at a church does not belong to the minister - indeed, he is not even permitted to "touch" it even in the literal sense - but to the church, and is handled entirely by others.

As for "give me your dough, and I'll buy you a place in heaven," this is patently absurd.  The days of "buying absolution" via "indulgences" is long, long gone.  Even the most sheep-like Christian knows this.

You have every right to your cynical, even mean-spirited view of religion.  However, if you are going to make mean-spirited, broad-brush statements, at least get your facts right.

Peace.

King of Loss wrote: Robertson is such a dipsh*t, Christian Fundamentalists are so stupid.

Any form of religious fundamentalism is stupid.

There's millions of sh*t-heads that say that sort of thing. We choose to ignore these people. This makes me wonder: why do we listen to Roberson? Robertson has no actual political power. He doesn't have the power to assassinate/murder Hugo Chavez. People like him should simply be ignored. 

At the same time, however, if someone said these things about any of us, it would be slightly scary. Especially in the tone. He just talks about assassination in such a non-chalant way. It's a little scary.

When one is raised to be a religious fundamentalist, that particular person begins to bypass science, logic, and true morals (in favor of what the religion "says" is right or wrong). We should worry more about religious fundamentalists that have actual power (the ones that start the inquisitions/crusades, etc...).

I thought some of his statements were rather funny though (escpecially the one about feminists). It's funny how he thinks that people can "become lesbians." Who gives this guy media coverage anyway?

If this man claims to be a Christian, he should indeed be a Christian. Who would Jesus assassinate anyway?

MtS:

He just puts his foot further down his throat, doesn't he?

Toob-Wurm:

You said, "If this man claims to be a Christian, he should indeed be a Christian. Who would Jesus assassinate anyway?"   Right on target!

As an aside, let's not let Donald Rumsfeld off the hook, either.  For him to state that the U.S. doesn't engage in political assassination is patently absurd.  The U.S. has indeed engaged in covert ops - including the assassination of world leaders and/or the sub rosa destabilizing of governments - when it suited our needs.  Any claim to the contrary is hogwash.

Peace.

Not from a Christian but still on-topic because it relates to the Old Testament:

Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a east coast resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:

When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted fan,
Jim

 Tony R

Not much to add, except to repeat that I'm quite amused at how similar the thinking of most (but not all) Christian fundamentalists is in relation to the thinking of most (but not all) Islamic fundamentalists ...

If I didn't know better I'd say that Robertson just issued a fatwa!

I'd be more amused if I didn't think that some of them are capable of causing great harm ... albeit usually through indirect means

Oh Moo...

Your'd think the long-lasting thread on ELP would be the end of religious discussion- but no.

Well- I'm happy so long as Destiny Church don't take over NZ by force.

It is not right to blame the religion, I say. It's how people interpret it.

There are plenty of Christians that are reasonable and honorable people.

This guy, on the other hand, is f**king nuts. This is the same hate-filled extremist crap that has people in the Middle East blowing themselves up.

Starette wrote: Oh Moo... Your'd think the long-lasting thread on ELP would be the end of religious discussion- but no. Well- I'm happy so long as Destiny Church don't take over NZ by force.

What is the problem with discussing religion?

IMO anyone not comfortable with the subject is unable to approach it from an intellectual standpoint.Whether one "believes" or not,no adult should be afraid of sticking their head above the parapet so-to-speak.

It's a good way of routing out the brainwashed fanatics anyway.........