Do believe that females are progressive musicians?
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Topic: Do believe that females are progressive musicians?
Posted By: Marissaelene
Subject: Do believe that females are progressive musicians?
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 16:07
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Of course not...I have read your comments from Googling...so many men on here or even women think that this is a man's genre. I arrange music on over twenty instruments...compose Baroque music, progressive rock, neo-classical music, psychedelic folk/ rock, and I play and write real jazz not jazz standards. I also write some avant garde music and film scores. I work with electronic and acoustic instruments of all kinds. I also do not sing covers. I also sing... I play all my instruments on my records...because I want women to play on my music and men, not just men Women would never answer my ads not because women have no talent. I do not need men to help me create quality music. I refuse to have men back me up...when I do not need them to. I arrange music...and engineer all my music... My music is complicated and sometimes long but writing lengthy music is not the goal.. Are there females who are good progressive rock musicians who do not need all male bands to back them up? Sure..that is why they do not speak out ...that is why they are obscure and unknown...the kinds of women who are supported love to play male cover songs. I refuse to do that when I can compose quality music and support female composers rather than play male cover songs to promote male domination and male pride. I believe that I should support female composers who do not have all male back up ONLY...and I do support men but they are getting a lot more support in serious music genres. I am not a feminist...I believe in equality....however, I refuse to have men play for me when I can play numbers of instruments well and compose my music... The way men refuse to acknowledge or hire women in this genre..or even give them record deals if they do not have an all male band... I am not unusual...I believe that many women have been falling through the cracks due the kind of oppressive culture we have... I do karate kicks too.... look out ...you may delete this but who cares ahahahha.... I am not allowed to promote myself or I will kicked off...only men are allowed to be seen via the net and off Women can only be seen with all male band...ahahhah Men also feel that it is appropriate to harass women in gangs to tell them that they should be in the kitchen with babies. Highly evolved humans think that this kind of thinking is archaic. Marissa Elene Nadieja
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Replies:
Posted By: altaeria
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 16:12
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So what are you implying? Stop beating around..... oh, never mind. |
Posted By: Larkstongue41
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 16:20
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????????????????????????????????????????? ------------- "Larks' tongues. Wrens' livers. Chaffinch brains. Jaguars' earlobes. Wolf nipple chips. Get 'em while they're hot. They're lovely. Dromedary pretzels, only half a denar." |
Posted By: DamoXt7942
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 16:20
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Love quite a few female progressive combos with incredible technique and sensitivity. There is no difference amongst superb acts, regardless of gender. Thanks. ------------- http://www.facebook.com/damoxt7942" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Marissaelene
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:21
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It did not take you two seconds to ban me, block me and come on my youtube channel to vote me down because I am a female composer in the progressive rock genre etc...etc...etc... Why not warn women ahead of time that they are not allowed to say that are in this genre...without a male band? I am not against having men playing for me, I do not "need" them to play anything for me..I am a composer... an arranger...for over 20 instruments..that is why you immediately came to my channel to put me down and vote my videos down There was no reason to lock the topic that I posted..I did not say that I did not want men to play for me...I said that I do not need men to play any instruments on my albums or arrangements... Composers do not need help from bands...really they don't.. You will claim that I am imagining some of you just coming to my youtube channel to vote my videos down on purpose. But it is o.k to not hire female arrangers, producers, drummers, bassist, writers..guitarist...keyboardist. (sarcasm).etc...etc...it is o.k to have NO women in the prog....who are competent and just men with men...with only one female singing in a band at most...you think that is acceptable...it is NOT acceptable..I compose film scores, I compose modern classical music, I am a jazz musician who does not play covers or standards, I also write avant garde music, write progressive rock music/ psychedelic rock and folk, neo-baroque music, medieval music in the modern sense and world music fusion...I play numbers of instruments...in a competent way....do I need men? No.... Do composers need bands? No.... Marissa Elene Nadieja |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:35
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I hear you. You're largely correct and it sucks. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Evolver
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:40
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Would you like to post a link to your youtube channel, so we can listen to some of your music. I doubt anyone here at this site banned you, or voted you down. And I presume that your other thread was locked because it sounds like trolling. We have plenty of open minded members who wouldn't mind having a discussion with you, without the hostility of your first two posts. ------------- Trust me. I know what I'm doing. |
Posted By: Easy Money
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:41
| I'm surprised your other thread got locked, it didn't seem to me that you had broken any site rules. |
Posted By: Marissaelene
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:49
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The internet is also not friendly towards women, and I have been ganged stalked by mostly men for a long time. This happens to a lot of women, also they are not seen as composers. Not nearly as many men are being stalked and threatened on the internet as women either...The internet is not female friendly....groups of men congregate to create hostile environments towards women... I read comments and threads on this forum about the lack of women in the genre of prog rock...and it is laughable how men perceive women as lazy, disinterested in serious things or music.... The entertainment industry is not a realistic depiction of what kind of talent or minds that really exist in the world... Women are suppose to need all male bands or all male accompaniment in every genre... This is seen as acceptable...It is o.k for men to go it alone, but not women... I have tried to support women in music, but only women who are very empowered would not want an all male back up band...It is healthy to be inclusive.. I do not do music to prove that I am empowered though...I am just into music... But it is very sad, that we have a music industry that looks down upon women in a major way and a society that thinks very little of women in general... Yet, our culture thinks that we are progressive and forward thinking but we are not.... I am... The music industry has created a hostile environment for women...because when you have women being backed continually by all male bands, it speak volumes to the world as to what role in society women must take....What people in general in that industry think of the competency level of women ...Almost all bands in that industry have all male bands backing one woman...that is a bit unbalanced...a pervasive attitude that women are incompetent or less competent or in need of help...That is really not progressive thinking...
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Posted By: Larkstongue41
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 17:58
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Why don't you appreciate the fact that a lot of women are at the FRONT of bands instead of whining about males being the back-up band? There are more males playing traditional rock n' roll instruments than females (which does not mean they are better at it in any way) so it's only normal that the male gender is more represented among rock musicians. I don't mean to be offensive but it seems to me like you're delusional about this whole thing. ------------- "Larks' tongues. Wrens' livers. Chaffinch brains. Jaguars' earlobes. Wolf nipple chips. Get 'em while they're hot. They're lovely. Dromedary pretzels, only half a denar." |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 18:02
Oh internet forums are jungles, and it happens to a lot of men too. In fact on a male-dominated site it happens mostly to men. I've had many fistfights at other sites, got banned from one for speaking my mind. You'll find that you are quite welcome here as long as you don't assume too much about the members. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Marissaelene wrote:Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 18:16
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Hi Marissaelene, First of all, you seem to have some sort of impression that most or many or whatever of us have this hang up about women performing progressive music. I would simply like to state that it isn't true at all. From my experience, most women simply are not interested in it (composing it that is). It tends to be more abstract and by nature that is unfortunately a male characteric of perception. I don't find that men are preventing women from participating in prog, it's just that women tend not to gravitate towards it. Not a good or a bad thing, just a "that's what's happnin' thang." Of course there are exceptions to every generalisation (and yes i know some) but if any female human being wishes to create some beautiful music that everyone can enjoy, i can't think of a single person who would object to that. Maybe i live in a bubble? Please share any info here if you have any cool music that needs more ears. -------------  https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 19:25
| There are women prog composers, musicians etc but they are in the minority. There are however a good number of prog women singers(especially in prog metal)but for whatever reason women musicians just don't get into prog. I'm not saying it's right but if you look at the gender ratio as far as fans go it sort of makes sense. I would guess that at least eighty percent of prog fans are male and even if you count female singers as musicians it's probably just as low if not lower. There was this one young woman named Nell(I forget her last name)who played all her own instruments and recorded an album entirely by herself. She was influenced by Yes, Nektar, Gentle Giant and the Flaming Lips if I'm not mistaken. So yes, they are out there but they are few and far between unfortunately. |
Posted By: Marissaelene
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 20:28
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They are not the minority...they do not exist in the commercial world...due to a pervasive attitude are weaker, smaller, less intelligent and less worthy of money or praise. Female composers like myself are not the minority. These women probably do not have money for expensive...etc..and tons of equipment... There are female Chopins, Female Beethovens..and women who are amazing composers in Asian music etc..eastern music etc... Hedy Lamarr invented Wi Fi...and other inventions...she was a movie star due to not having men taking her seriously in the area of engineering and inventions. When she was almost dead, they gave her a small plague to thank her for patent. It is not very intelligent to think that women are smaller, weaker, less competent, less creative, less motivated, and therefore less worthy of praise outside of cooking a four course meal or cleaning the toilet. I buy records from some Asian women who are female composers..etc...The music industry creates an illusion that serious female composers and prog rock musicians who are female in the minority...They have reinforced their illusions with the creation of their ideology that women are less competent...Some men think women can't cook as well as men either, since most chefs are men who are making the most money...But the images that we see everyday of men dominating music has created an illusion that they are more talented..and much more motivated and/ or disciplined....or that the more you rock out the more masculine you are ...or the longer your piece of music and the more instruments the better you are.....pomposity is what exists...I met a man once who claimed that women were way behind men in everything due to our culture and that they will never be on the same level as men in anything. Men have a really negative attitude about women in general in terms of thinking of them in high regard...and also women just constantly praise men and put them pedestals...it is part of our culture...the Trinity...the patriarch...This is the actual history of the world.. Women were not allowed to be actors in Ancient Greece...they were not in Olympics either...Men really believe that they are stronger, more intelligent, more competent, and more worthy of respect and praise ...they just do ...that is why there are so many men in Prog rock and almost no women...mostly just singing..
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Posted By: Larkstongue41
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 20:34
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^ I don't know if NYC has suddenly gone back to the Middle Ages or something but otherwise I don't see why you feel the need to argue that females are as intelligent as men. I can assure you that most people who regularly frequent this forum are not bible beaters or primitively conservative. ------------- "Larks' tongues. Wrens' livers. Chaffinch brains. Jaguars' earlobes. Wolf nipple chips. Get 'em while they're hot. They're lovely. Dromedary pretzels, only half a denar." |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 20:37
| Yes, of course they are in the minority otherwise they would be in the majority which obviously is not the case. |
Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 20:42
Exactly. Most of us are just stating opinions that reflect the reality rather than trying to manipulate it or control it. The reality isn't something we are always proud of but we can't deny it either and try to pretend the truth is something other than what it is. If there are many women prog composers then great but if that's the case they should not hide. They should make themselves known. Esperanza Spalding isn't hiding in the closet is she? There are a lot of women musicians but maybe most of them don't discover prog. I'm not sure. Anyway, I suggest checking out the band Bent Knee. They have two women in their band both of whom play an instrument(one also sings). Also, check out the all female Japanese band Ars Nova from the 90's. I'm sure there are other examples but these are the two that jump to mind immediately.
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 21:11
| I wouldn't have anything against a more prominent role of women in bands and writing music... it's just that I don't know many of them. But if I hear anything I like, I would be most interested, and indeed I see no reason why they shouldn't be more represented. |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 21:43
I'm sorry but why are you complaining about all this? Instead of comparing women to a male dominated paradigm why don't you and other women simply go out and create your own alternative version of what you see fit to do? Oprah Winfrey did it. Marie Curie did it. Nobody stopped them and nobody's stopping you or any other woman from achieving great things. My advice is just do and don't worry about what other people think. There are plenty of women virtuoso musicians but the thing i find they generally lack is the same drive to achieve financial success in the way that men do and because of that, they are usually subjected to the male paradigm of business practices. Until that changes at the root level then you and other women will be complaining about this until the end of time. In this day and age when it's so easy to be an independent artist on the internet, i would imagine the only thing stopping anybody from achieving great things is themselves. If you truly have composed great things, please share them here and i'm positive everyone would love to support your arts. If you're only here to complain about things, i'm afraid it's starting to get a little stale in this chat room. ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 27 2017 at 23:26
| I think you Marissa started very important discussion. I started also same kind of, but didnīt manage put my words right way. I think the main point in that was, why still in 2000 there are so little women in prog? Yes, world have gone forward in this male/female thing, but I think itīs still menīs world. What proves is that "me too"-campaign. I have heard many actors, musicians that are female said, itīs still very common if you try to go forward in your career "you have to please so certain producers (that are men)". I think also itīs very naive to say "nobody in this forum doesnīt want to ban you". I think here are quite much people round the world and really all the men donīt think like I think. In Finland for example certain way thinking female politics get the most of the rubbish through the internet (well quite often also men who are feminists). And the reactions "donīt claim, just quietly do your thing" just shows that this is important issue the world really shouldnīt quiet. And if somebodyīs going to attack against me, I am not answering anymore, I think I have said what I have to say. |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 02:08
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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 03:12
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I haven't seen the locked thread, so I cannot comment. I do know, though, that admin rarely do this without good reason. The OP has, reasonably, been asked to place a link to the YouTube channel. We can then have a decent conversation about the merits, or otherwise, of the OP's music and tastes. If this is not done, then I would tend to the opinion that this is not what it seems, and also lock this thread and ban the OP for trolling, sorry. BTW, to avoid all doubt in the matter, I love women, whether in a band, in the workplace, in the home, anywhere. Far nicer than all those horrible, sweaty, blokes............ ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 03:24
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WTF ?? Prog chicks rule !! Overall, Id say Progressive Rock is not gender-defining........Extreme Metal is NOT gender defining either. Folks who think that certain music appeals to any one gender are severely deluded.......... |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 04:02
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Welcome to the site. I hope you realise that you are barking up the wrong tree. I can't remember the last time we had one of those 'men are superior to women' kind of fellas on here...and if we do come across them we mock them and throw them in the pillory for all to see. The occasional women who do make music inside the prog sphere are welcomed here in the same way men are. It's just music. Loads of members on here who listen to music either made or contributed by women. As a matter of fact I am putting on some Diamanda Galas right this minute. Then again, as Laz mentioned, this whole two-thread crusade against something the OP thinks she can infer by some old thread where supposedly old timey male bigots acted all midieval, smells like trolling and/or like the OP has got a score to settle. Methinks she'd be better off actually locating the proper arena/person before she makes her accusations. I certainly can't indentify anyone member that correlates with what she's saying. ------------- The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 04:29
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Women in rock are indeed second class citizens as rock has always been a "boys club". There are sociological reasons for this that are beyond my understanding. However, I've been a long time live sound engineer for many big and small rock artists. Mostly all male bands. I can tell you that I feel that females don't help their cause by being groupies. I could probably count the number of groupies I've seen over the years in the hundreds. And this extends to some prog bands too! Believe it or not. Does this excuse your plight? Absolutely not. But no effect exists without some self inflicted causes, unfortunately.
------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Frankh
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 04:42
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Two words. 1. Rachel 2. Flowers Possibly as fine a musician as exists upon the face of the planet right now. ------------- Perhaps finding the happy medium is harder than we know. |
Posted By: Manuel
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 05:44
| I don't think gender has anything to do with talent. When you are good, the music will speak for itself. Male or female artists/composers does not determine my listening or buying the music, but it's quality, so don't think that because you are a female I will not give your music the attention it deserves. As far as I know, most people would do the same. |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 07:05
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I think Annie Haslam, Kate Bush, Christina Boothe, Heather Findlay, Maire Brennan, Angel on Heavy Syrup just to mention a few, are all female...where's the point? ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 07:16
Exactly. It sounds as if the OP is suffering attacks from a very small but very vocal group of trolls who have little else to do but post sh*t on the internet. How small their lives must be. ------------- We all live in an amber subdomain, amber subdomain, amber subdomain. My face IS a maserati |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 07:18
I agree it is an important discussion as to why there are more women in prog, however is it really men keeping women from becoming part of it? A female band can just as easily self-create and self-produce any music and put it out on Bandcamp as can men. So in effect, the music industry is no longer a big boys club that grabs women by the throat and makes them do things against their will in order to put out their music. I am quite sympathetic to women who are subjected to such crimes against their volition but i'm just not convinced that most women are interested in the more abstract forms of music in my experience. Personally i would LOVE to see more female equality in this department. BTW, the same goes for extreme metal. I have not met a single female specimen who's into Gorguts, Atheist, Cynic and the most extreme examples of metal as males are. Let's fact it. Men and women have differences and it's OK. We don't have to be so politically correct that we forgot our own natural differences. As i stated before. Women should band together and create an alternative industry if they feel they are being held back. ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 08:04
 ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Evolver
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 08:17
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On the last Purson album, composer Rosalie Cunningham played most of the instruments herself. This album was very well received, not only here, but at other prog sites as well. ------------- Trust me. I know what I'm doing. |
Posted By: altaeria
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 08:36
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I can't imagine why anybody wouldn't want to collaborate with you. You sound like a real pleasure to work with.
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Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 08:52
| I think there's more to this story than the OP is letting us in on... |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 08:59
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One thing that pisses me off regarding this is the choice of words used. Very confrontational in all black and white. No room for in-betweens. It is also rather unpleasant to see so many friendly responses completely neglected by the OP. Instead she seems fixed on whatever agenda she is pushing. The tone in which she initially started all this does not deserve the welcome it got...but then again in these metoo times we're all walking on eggshells and beating around the bush. The fact of the matter is, a rude person is not rude because of gender just like great music is great music regardless of gender. I don't run down to the American embassy in Copenhagen and spit on the people who work there because I am cross with Donald Trump. There is no hidden agenda here on PA. We believe in equal rights for women and men. We are modern like that. ------------- The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 09:27
I believe that the lady was trying to elicit a response from the male PA members. And she succeeded!  ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 09:50
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She hasnt posted any link to her music. She might be a troll ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 09:58
The same thought occurred to me. But I just checked her. She has a YouTube account under the nickname https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCa-ps_NC-21Q9s9TirMQJ3g" rel="nofollow - virgorouge , at least this account serves as a channel for the music of a certain Marissa Elene Nadieja. There is also a website http://virgorouge.com/" rel="nofollow - virgorouge.com . -o0o- For introduction purposes, here is one of her vids. A homebrew performance in the vein of "Kate Bush with batwings meets Nico": -------------
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Posted By: Hercules
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 10:05
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Women complaining bitterly that they are somehow being persecuted (when they are not) is one of the main reasons why some men react in an adverse manner to women. I know of no-one on this site who has an anti-woman agenda. Anti-militant feminist, maybe, and I include myself in that category, but I am equally against misogynists as well. Personally, I love the contributions that Annie Haslam, Heather Findlay, Olivia Sparnenn-Josh, Anne-Marie Helder, Rachel Jones, Rachel Hall, Karen Matheson, Kate Bush, Sonja Kristina, Christina Booth, Joanne Hogg, Angela Gordon, Tarja Turunen, Anneke van Giersbergen and many, many more women have made to prog. So please, get that chip off your shoulder. If you have talent, it doesn't matter which gender you are. ------------- A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life. |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 10:25
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I really wish there more were female members here -- I've collaborated on more creative projects with women than men. Anyway, I love the music of plenty of women. Just yesterday I listened to music of Vashti Bunyan and Linda Perhacs (I adore progressive folk music) and Kate Bush is a favourite of many here, including me. And in the last week I've played Aranis and Charming Hostess, both of which have female and male musicians. I am aware of more female vocalists than musicians, and more female musicians than composers, it's true. Anyone who uploads original videos to youtube needs a thick skin and need to not develop any persecution complex -- there will be criticism both constructive and otherwise. Take it in stride. Get too defensive or offensive, and expect that people will be offensive. An antagonistic attitude makes it look like one has a chip on one's shoulder and people are likely to be less sympathetic and tolerant. I'm sorry of you've had really bad experiences. Incidentally, by looking up you name I checked out your music on youtube and enjoyed it, but if I didn't, then it wouldn't be because of your sex. I'm often appalled by what people say in places such as Youtube and Twitter. I think a s general rule people should think, if one is posting something that one wouldn't be willing to say to a person's face they should think twice before saying it online. In these days of self-produced music, there is more opportunity to create music. I personally have known many women who play instruments (mostly classical music), and if women want to learn to play, create bands, and release music then they can (of course there are more fredoms in some societies than others). If people wish to purchase it or attend concerts, that's another matter. Even IF, and I don't believe this to be the case, no men would give them the time of day, there's an opportunity with fifty percent of the human population (at least depending upon the society one lives in). Incidentally, we have other female musicians at PA despite women being the minority here -- while it seems that not so many women are into prog as men, and Prog is male heavy, maybe that will change over time. Rock, in general, has something of a machismo image, but Progressive Rock I rather think tends to appeal to more sensitive people (not classifying women as "sensitive" in case my point is missed in the context of my ramblings). I also find Progressive Rock fans generally tolerant and appreciate diversity (I mean, we accept lots of styles of music thrown into Prog and enjoy such music from around the world with very diverse influences). It is a shame that this wasn't approached in a different manner. Had a friendly newbie introduction without assumptions been posted, I expect there would have been a very warm welcome. In this thread I think people have been quite understanding and considerate. On another, another note, I have seen sexist comments here now and again, but such stuff has commonly not been tolerated. While you music is easy to find without links, maybe try posting some of your music and ask for honest feedback. We have a policy here to be considerate of our fellow members (avoid sniping, trolling, personal attacks), but that doesn't mean that people can't be critical (and constructive criticism can be really helpful). EDIT: multi-taking so hadn't seen that your music has been linked to. I also got a Kate Bush vibe from it. Welcome to PA, and maybe we can put any negativity behind us (I don't think people here are generally the types to bear grudges so don't worry if you feel we may have got off on the wrong foot). I would like to hear more details of your story as it does seem, as has been said, there's more going on here than is obvious and spelled-out. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Various music I am very into: a youtube playlist with two tracks per act |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 10:42
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I reread her initial thread and it looks like she stumbled over some of the old threads where there were quite a few discouraged old men spewing non-sense - trying to figure out why they couldn't get the love of their life to enjoy prog or bemoaning the fact that every prog gig turned out to be a sausage fest. We don't really see that on here today, but if and when we do we often ridicule said person for sporting such antique views on the opposite sex. There are not a lot of women at prog gigs. I know, I've been to quite a few. I've seen a lot of women play in prog bands though, yet the audiences almost always consist of men. This is not me trying to underline a point by twisting reality - no this is merely a representation of the real world. The prog world IS largely male dominated but not because of some secret misogonistic conspiracy. There are just more men that gravitate towards the genre is all. ------------- The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 10:50
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I've checked her youtube samples. I don't know...I should listen better, but at this moment I struggle to get into her music. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 10:51
As long as it's not because she's a woman, that's fine.  Edit: Do you like Dagmar Krause? She reminds me a bit of Krause meets Bush (with a touch of Hammill). Here's another track, which has a VdGG vibe to it: EDIT again, for those who don't know Dagmar Krause (I suspect there are a few). Love this song. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Various music I am very into: a youtube playlist with two tracks per act |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 11:14
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I've never been mocked on Progarchives for being a woman. I'm more likely to get mocked for liking The Big Generator. I like female oriented prog. Kate Bush, Renaissance, Magenta, White Willow, and Unreal City has a female guitarist. |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 11:18
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Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 12:40
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Wow, what the hell did I miss?! *re-reads entire thread* ------------- "I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 13:07
There are really lot of examples in the history, how serious music making has been really difficult to women. The Raincoats never achieved the attention they deserved (not as great band Slits got more attention, well I think their almost naked cover in their Cut album has something to do with that, Raincoats never done anything like that). Even Kate Bush got lot of really bad attention in the beginning of her career, because she told to the press sheīs interested in spirituality. Then the press is thinking "sheīs just one of those fool women". Björk got lots of disturbing from Lars Von Tier. What I am trying to say that it is so easy to say as a man "women donīt have any problems into todayīs musicgenre" because no male musician have ever such experiences in this male world as females. Although Marissa may overreact, why there was so much attacking towards her from men? What about if everybody just have said "sorry to hear you experience that?" Of course I understand, if she personally accused somebody, but I didnīt notice anything like that.
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Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 13:08
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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 18:10
Get over the past. It's over. Go to therapy if you need to but all the road blocks of the past no longer exist. If anyone has the talent, they can share it. Don't blame any other sector of humanity if you think you have talent and nobody else seems to think so. There's a difference between real abuse and self dillusion. I've had plenty of chats with my lady friends about these things and they have assured me that women are just as capable of abusing men as the other way around. Personally i have never detected even the slightest whiff of gender discrimination on this site or in the prog universe in general. True that the music industry has been tradtionally evil and that's why i've avoided it myself by remaining independent. Perhaps the way this conversation started immediately provoked a "fight or flight" response and it might be prudent to approach these topics with a little more finesse since this is indeed a sensitive topic. I dont' want to demean or underemphasize these issues in the least bit. I'm merely trying to clarify obvious misunderstanding that have ensued in this minefield of emotional outpour. ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 18:30
I adore The Big Generator and your homeland- Finland. I've done speeches at local Universities extolling the virtues of Finland's educational system. I admire your country!  I feel The Big Generator is Yes's most underappreciated album, I can't understand how such a high percentage of prog people could listen to the Big Generator 4 or 5 times and hate the album. Over half the Progarchive reviews and ratings give The Big Generator a one or a two. My guess? Folks feel vicious Steve Howe vitriol blasphemy against Trevor Rabin.
 But remember, Steve Howe was exploring Asia. Give Trevor a break. Relax, go in open minded, accompanied by Mary Jane and give the Big Generator an unbiased listen, as if you didn't know it was YES sans Steve Howe album. I dare ya! It's possible that I've listened to The Big Generator more than any YES album. It's a toss up between Close to the Edge and the Yes Album and Big Generator. |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 18:30
Utterly false, check the first page. But this is how misunderstandings start, isn't it: Bad listening skills. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 20:29
I did get Big Generator without much knowledge about it suposedly being a bad album, or a less proggy album, or whatever. Still, well, I did not hate it, it was just meh. I don't really care for it, and I could easily do without it. And yes, it was just about the same thing with Asia. |
Posted By: yam yam
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 20:38
Check out http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=8134" rel="nofollow - Oh. (Olivia Hadjiioannou) from Greece too. Oh. released a debut progressive rock EP "Sleeping World" in 2013 with the award winning video "Trials - A Song for a Lost Generation", and followed it up with the metal album and vinyl release "Synemotion" in 2015. There followed two singles, "Love Will Heal" and "Love of Avalanches" in 2016 - with a handcrafted 360° fully immersive virtual reality music video to accompany the latter. A single "I'm in Love" was released back in the summer, and another new song "Deserted Eyes" is coming up for release in a couple of weeks time. A prog metal EP "Metallia" and progressive rock album "Prog Unshaven" are being worked on at the moment. Olivia composes, performs and produces her music, plays the guitar (electric and acoustic), bass, drums, violin, piano and percussion. She is also an accomplished sound engineer and mixes and masters her work. She lives between New York, NY and Athens, Greece. https://olitunes.com" rel="nofollow - https://olitunes.com . http://music.olitunes.com/" rel="nofollow - http://music.olitunes.com/ . Not bad for a female eh?
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Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 23:37
About my English, yes itīs not my mothers tongue. Really try to learn it more all the time.
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Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 28 2017 at 23:53
I really love 90125, but Big Generator is even better. I heard it first time immediately when it came and loved it right then. I remembered when I think it was really great there were more prog than that earlier album. I am not AOR-fan at all, but I think Yes and Genesis succeeded put in their "AOR" enough prog that their albums become interesting (well invisible touch is song that I donīt like really much). Only Genesis album that I donīt like is Calling All Stations, because it doesnīt sound Genesis at all. But I think all the Yes albums are less or more good.
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 01:02
It's not only prog. Rock has this problem in general. Meanwhile you have female musicians leading jazz bands so I presume jazz is not as abstract as rock. Whatever. The issue is rock is seen as male music and bands start out with a bunch of young men playing together. This tends to exclude women at the very inception and that is why we see female singers rather than musicians in prog. However, Bent Knee's bassist is a woman so it is changing. Maybe far too slowly but the only option we have is to keep building upon such progress. It is admittedly difficult; came across a bizarre news item which said a pub had banned bands with female singers purportedly at the instigation of the patrons. |
Posted By: Tillerman88
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 01:52
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^And afaic Finland does have a good history of Jazz bands. IMO, Jazz is even more abstract than Rock.... Yes we're still far from an equality, but I think this problem will not persist over time, just see the ever increasing amount of female musicians in the pop, electronic and classical milieus - and what a GREAT news for the music btw ;) ------------- The overwhelming amount of information on a daily basis restrains people from rewinding the news record archives to refresh their memories... |
Posted By: octopus-4
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 03:49
Personally I love 90125 but Big Generator is really too much "80". I feel it the same as GTR even if it contains a couple of very good tracks. Not as disappointing as GTR, anyway. ------------- Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half. My poor home recorded stuff at https://yellingxoanon.bandcamp.com |
Posted By: twseel
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 04:11
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I guess this thread has lost its spark by now but anyways, doesn't it make a bit of sense that rock in general, a genre built on the characteristics of thick, banging, loud instruments and dumb power would be mostly filled by men, while women tend to take to more melodious genres like pop and classical? And if you're talking about the industry and unfair treatment there, I wouldn't know since I'm not in the industry and it's not a very transparent one either so maybe this is a topic better discussed amongst insiders? Anyway I don't think many people here care specifically whether the musician they're listening to is female because the private lives and personalities of the people behind the next random band you listen to is just not relevant to the purpose of the music... ------------- 
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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 07:08
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[/QUOTE]I think I made a mistake when starting this with you. If you donīt see, this world has been menīs world and still is many ways (there are still different wages for men and women in FINLAND), this is just useless. I have been a little time in this forum, so I canīt say has there been gender discrimination or not here. But that discussion I started I think there were opinions about earlier discussions that there had been men who started to analyze womenīs psych, also I got very strong reactions even I think my starting was really neutral. Also I donīt think Marissa has been the only one who has got really big emotions with this issue. Yes, today`s world talent is the thing that donīt automatically get yourself attention, no matter are you man or woman. But that doesnīt mean this world is equal even in the western countries and women automatically can do as much as men. Itīs really hard to believe me prog music is isolated area from the other world and anyone, who listens prog is not chauvinist pig. But I had anyway no need to continue this anymore, you seem to live so wonderous world that I leave you there. About my English, yes itīs not my mothers tongue. Really try to learn it more all the time. [/QUOTE]
If you aren't prepared to speak in a logical manner then yes you made a mistake  The problem is that this thread started as why aren't there more women in prog And it has turned into women don't get equal pay in general? The world never has been and probably never will be fair or just Men are physically more agressive and are attracted to more bombastic arts Women have made the mistake of trying to compete with men instead of developing their own talents and characteristics If men are not awarding women equal pay then WHY (i keep asking) why don't women create an alternative paradigm to the male dominated society? As 50% of consumers, why don't more women support women musicians? With half of the population on the same side, things SHOULD even out But we know that doesn't happen otherwise the sexually assaulting prez of the US never would have been elected. All i'm saying is that we can talk about this all you want but you're preaching to the choir on this site. The men who control the world not only control women, they control all life on the planet. I wish i had a magic wand to make everything better but this is what we're stuck with and of course i symphathize for all effected
------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 08:43
| When hostages are taken the women and children are always released first. Titanic sinks... men go to a watery grave while women and children escape. Women want to cherry pick equality. "I'll take equal pay but I don't want to pay for "movie and dinner date."" |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 08:46
Cindy, I have to say that, coming from a lady member of the forum, that is a very interesting statement, and one that, if it came from a bloke, would attract opprobrium of the highest order! ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 09:32
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^Yes, and an old friend of mine wants to know if Cindy has a sister. ------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 12:27
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I've read through all the pages of this rather odd thread, and if I'm correct that the
OP's point is that she's a woman prog musician and isn't getting enough
notice or recognition for her abilities because of her gender, then
guess what? It happens to ALL prog musicians male or female so get over
yourself. Maybe your music just isn't good enough, or maybe it's
amazing but nobody cares? So what. Welcome to the world where art intersects commerce and very few are lucky or good enough or good and lucky enough to break through. Meanwhile, hope you keep making music because you want to not because you think there's some carrot at the end of a stick awaiting your efforts ------------- https://wytchcrypt.wixsite.com/mutiny-in-jonestown" rel="nofollow - Mutiny in Jonestown : Progressive Rock Since 1987 |
Posted By: HemispheresOfXanadu
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 19:10
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Full stop. ------------- https://twitter.com/ProgFollower" rel="nofollow - @ProgFollower on Twitter. Tweet me muzak. |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 29 2017 at 23:17
About my English, yes itīs not my mothers tongue. Really try to learn it more all the time. [/QUOTE]
If you aren't prepared to speak in a logical manner then yes you made a mistake The problem is that this thread started as why aren't there more women in prog And it has turned into women don't get equal pay in general? The world never has been and probably never will be fair or just Men are physically more agressive and are attracted to more bombastic arts Women have made the mistake of trying to compete with men instead of developing their own talents and characteristics If men are not awarding women equal pay then WHY (i keep asking) why don't women create an alternative paradigm to the male dominated society? As 50% of consumers, why don't more women support women musicians? With half of the population on the same side, things SHOULD even out But we know that doesn't happen otherwise the sexually assaulting prez of the US never would have been elected. All i'm saying is that we can talk about this all you want but you're preaching to the choir on this site. The men who control the world not only control women, they control all life on the planet. I wish i had a magic wand to make everything better but this is what we're stuck with and of course i symphathize for all effected
[/QUOTE]You can call me naive, but I have always believed and still believe this world will become someday much more fear place than itīs today, although it has been harder to believe older I get. Also, I have lived my life in the way I have always been on the side of the weak and doing little things according my life philosophy. Too many people just think they canīt do anything and thatīs the reason why everythingsīs stay the same. But as we have earlier discussed, this world has gone better direction in many ways (although there has been bad direction in some years now). I agree you that women also keep up the old structures, but I donīt think that gives me right to be "better" as a man. I donīt think nobody should have a magic wand, I think those little things I do is enough.If I am preaching, sorry about that. I am not saying somebodyīs wrong and somebodyīs not, these are just my opinions. What I saw in this discussion, is that there was one with her opinion and quite many against her with different opinion. I have been in the situation in internet where I tried to myself explain my opinions when everybody else just attack towards me. itīs not great place to be. And if I am not a part of this community anymore because of this discussion, then I am not. I can live without this place.
My thoughts tend to fly, but I donīt think the real issue here has ever been just "Why there are so little females in prog". If it had been, I donīt this would have become to discussion every year and this lot of emotions with it. And I think you also have admitted the aswer isnīt "Women donīt like prog". |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 03:29
| Noticed I wrote fear instead of fair. Not really want this planet to become a fear place where it seems to now going on... |
Posted By: Tillerman88
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 05:13
Too late now.... It seems that people called for "Mr. and Ms. Bojangles' as a much better song name...... ------------- The overwhelming amount of information on a daily basis restrains people from rewinding the news record archives to refresh their memories... |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 09:13
Hey, no worries! You are quite welcome to express your opinions here. I'm just not a complainer but rather a solution seeker. So i guess i want everyone else to be that way too You would be correct that i have not experienced that kind of situation because i do indeed have an y chromosome so i should be a little more sympathetic to what you have to say. https://www.omniglot.com/soundfiles/finnish/christmas_fi.mp3" rel="nofollow - Hyvää joulua ja onnellista uutta vuotta ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 10:27
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Well this turned out to be quite the innovative promotion thread. We (almost) did the work ourselves. I won't be checking out her music though. Not because of her gender but because I find this sort of thing utterly tasteless. ------------- The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 10:47
Plus despite requests, she never posted any of her own music. I mean, maybe her problem is that she's totally clueless as how to self-promote more than her gender. I'm not interested in her music either but this thread has made me want to hear Kate Bush, Renaissance and other goddesses worthy of my attention ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 11:11
Yep, this really isn't rocket science, is it David? I was the first to invite her to post her efforts, and, had she done so, we could all have had a decent conversation about the merits of her music. As it stands, I couldn't give a toss, really, and we have had yet another tedious discussion about, in effect, feminism in prog, which holds absolutely no interest to me whatsoever. You are right. Utterly tasteless, and a really good example of how to piss people off in the name of self promotion. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 11:23
 . Well, this thread now gives me much more sense. Well, I think too I wonīt become Marissa-fan when saw that clip that was here. But itīs of course possible she can do something great sometime in the future. And yes, she really got much promotion from this thread. I think somebodyīs said there is no meaning is it good or bad.Anyway, happy new year!
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Posted By: AFlowerKingCrimson
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 11:29
Boom. Spot on. Men still have to approach the woman, ask her out, pay for everything especially the first date and early on, make the first move and sexual advances and on top of all that risk being accused of date rape, sexual assault, etc etc. This is why more and more men are choosing to just bow out altogether. Gender equality should mean equality in all aspects and not just the ones that are convenient for you.
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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 11:32
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https://kiwifarms.net/threads/virgo-rouge-marissa-morris-marissa-elienne-jamie-morse-marissa-marchant-rachzel-grezbian.27030/" rel="nofollow - Poor girl ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Various music I am very into: a youtube playlist with two tracks per act |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 12:26
Blimey......  ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 12:52
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This is one of the most entertaining threads i've seen on this site in a loooooong time ε=ε=ε=ε=ε=ε=┌(;￣◇￣)┘ ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 13:25
Not sure which is sadder. The troll, or that entire sub-forum dedicated to discussing trolls. Suddenly makes the listening to and discussion of prog a productive use of time. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Tillerman88
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 17:37
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Hey Mortte, I know where you are getting at, but don't think the reality is that dark as you're painting.... I suggest you don't generalise what you've experienced, particularly on niches like this. You know ... women truly have been inventing and singing melodies since the very beginnings of history, and it's fact for many artists that their mothers were their first unofficial art teachers... BTW, we know that babies bond with their mothers at birth for several reasons, among them the fact that, in utero, they learn to recognise the sound of their mothers' voices. Imagine what might be achieved were expectant mothers trained in the singing of a small repertoire of lullabies ;) ------------- The overwhelming amount of information on a daily basis restrains people from rewinding the news record archives to refresh their memories... |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 20:01
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What! How can she be so cruel/heartless/deluded to spew hate on Rachel Flowers? I have seen that virgorouge id before. Don't remember the exact vid but it was a subtle put down of Annie Haslam, so it's fair to say there's a pattern here - she hates talented female artists much more than men. I am normally never ever for bans but I would love to see this thread along with her id thrown right out of the window and into the garbage bin which is its rightful place.
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: December 30 2017 at 21:43
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Hi, I find this thread really sad ... regardless of who wrote it and why. The one fact that happens here is that the folks that "designed" the top ten for "progressive" music, are not listeners of MUSIC at all, so complaining about a group that does not know "music" and what it entails, in favor of their favorites, is a dead end, and a silly fight that is not going to get anyone anywhere. One look at this board, even, though it has gotten CONSIDERABLY better in the past 5 years, is that the threads continue to say and think that these 5 groups are "progressive" and that kate Bush, and many others, can not even be considered in the same breadth as YES, ELP and GENESIS, even though the whole catalogue suggests just as much "progressive" material as those bands, all of which went "pop" and "single" and "hit" ... to make money and get away from the "progressive" and "art-rock" idiom that the rock press was ridiculing them with. The advent of the Internet, early 's let's say, kinda helped women a lot more than before, however, the ideals and "designs" and thoughts, are still aligned with an imaginary ideal of what "progressive" is, and should be, and this prevents any new artists from being appreciated for their work. It's a gross shame, that things like Incredible String Band, that bent, crossed, kicked, and turned it over like a dead dog, treated "folk music", which was a heck more progressive and experimental than the three previously named bands ... but it will never get that appreciation because of the "database" design and syndrome. We are not people. There is no choice. Only the numbers in a database matter. So, nothing against women, they deserve their spot, a lot higher, but until the day that you replace those database folks, the chances of your music being more appreciated and seen around the world, are next to nil. As the world of "corporate" likes to state all the time with their new hits ... "we don't like competition, and will give you cereal fit for rats for comments .... and we, of course ... continue to do nothing about except support an invisible, totally NON_PROGRESSIVE system that supposedly is defining what we love as music ... the total and complete irony, is just ... astounding!
------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 00:02
I donīt think you have got right picture of me. Hope is my power, although there is lot of bad in a world, there is also hope. And I really believe womenīs influences in this world will risen. Now I donīt think I havenīt got anything more to say about this issue, letīs concentrate into music thatīt the great light of this world!
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Posted By: Frenetic Zetetic
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 02:17
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I've been trying to keep up with this thread, and I still can't figure out why this is even a thread? It seems like a loaded question seeking conflict. "No one to blame, it's just a shame, that's all..." ------------- "I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
Posted By: scruffydragon
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 04:13
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I have also been trying to keep up with this thread. I think I know where this has gone. Let's just say the music world has always been a cut throat place to be. Just look at how many great prog and non prog bands have fallen by the wayside and left for dead over the decades. Forums like this great one here has helped us to find and appreciate this wonderful music. It does not matter who ,or even what produced the music, if it tickles our taste buds we will eventually buy into it and take and make it as our own. Your sex has nothing to do with it, and you cannot blame the rest of the population for that. Perhaps you need to look harder at what you are doing and try another angle with it. I believe women can become extremely fine progressive musicians. But it depends on what you are trying to sell us. All you have to believe is one thing......IT'S THE MUSIC THAT MATTERS. |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 04:31
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I am not sure this thread should keep going. If this discussion ever is going to be of help it needs to start off decisively more sober and evenhanded. It would also be of immense help to the gist of the thread that the OP isn't some mad megalomaniac who feels her work is so incredibly fantastic that she needs to flaunt it by denigrating every other hardworking artist. Her hatred for Rachel Flowers for instance reeks of jealosy and is just painful to read. No if this discussion ever is to succeed in anything, then it needs to start off in a factual and infinitely more friendly tone. This thread fx never had a chance though mostly because the OP comes off so terribly unsympathetic. Like I mentioned earlier, rudeness does not pertain to gender. ------------- The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 09:35
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^ Well, she did create another thread first and it was immediately locked. She had a tantrum and created another one. It seems that the little ploy has backfired and now she looks like a shmuck. I say let this play out or she'll just start another. Of course you can ban her from the site but i don't feel she's done anything horrible on the site itself. Let the rotton tomato throwers giver her a faceful. She brought it on herself and we're not very tolerant when it comes to bad conduct on this site. Just my 2 cents (euros, reales, yuan, etc) worth ;) ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 09:49
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I don't see progressive rock as being anymore misogynist than any other art form ...musical or otherwise. It seems that the OP came in with a chip on her shoulder rather than looking for an honest open discussion. And as many others have already said I have not seen any sign of 'anti women in prog rock' attitudes on this forum....beyond that I'm not sure of the need for the thread either. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: Mortte
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 12:21
| I donīt want to throw rotten tomatoes towards anyone, not even any idiot president. I think the best way is just not comment. I think everybody now knows whatīs the case. And if there are more people full of negative energy, let them cook it themselves. What they can do this site? I believe that kind of thread is quite short, if there are no-one giving back anything. Of course people can do what they want, but I am not the one who likes this kind of threads at all and want to be a part of it, even yesterday it may have shown that way. |
Posted By: Dopeydoc
Date Posted: December 31 2017 at 16:12
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Listen to the Kanevsky sisters's Eternal Wanderers. A real masterpiece coming from Russia. "The end of the satellite age" is one of my preferred prog tracks. |
Posted By: Carcharodon
Date Posted: January 01 2018 at 10:57
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This site collects several thousand reviews of underground rock albums by female musicians and bands including female members... http://rf3769.wixsite.com/richardfalksreviews |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: January 01 2018 at 12:01
Thanks for the ad. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: January 01 2018 at 12:23
Ad or not, it's an impressive site and totally relevant. In his posts I've never seen him mention that site, nor would I know if he has any affiliation, so I wouldn't assume it is at all spammy or an ad. In fact, I would have suggested it myself. ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Various music I am very into: a youtube playlist with two tracks per act |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: January 01 2018 at 12:23
I am reminded of the words of G.K. Chesterton when he commented on another, earlier era: "Ten thousand women went marching through the streets shouting, 'We will not be dictated to,' and went off and became stenographers." ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: January 01 2018 at 14:15
Then, I apologise unreservedly. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: awaken77
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 01:32
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In music world, there is no sex difference. But, there is prejudice regarding certain instruments. My friend is classical guitar player and she studied in musical academy. She told me that's its a big challenge to pursue a career of guitarist, because nobody consider female guitarist seriously. Even teachers (because most of them are men). Basic stereotypes are: piano is OK for both, violin family is for girls, but guitar is mannish instrument. so if you a girl and you want to play guitar, that's kind of weird thing. More weird is girl drummer or bass player. |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 01:47
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It may be true that hand strength and reach allow male guitar players an advantage, but that can be overcome by talent and originality, e.g. Kaki King. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 02:26
| Today we do have mainstream female artists who play guitar. Sara Bareilles and Lianne La Havas for example. I believe St Vincent too? But they are all singers. Except in jazz (Mary Holvorson for instance) and classical music, women aren't sought out as musicians, just as singers. And if these singers can play an instrument, they tend to take creative control and gig in their own name. |
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 02:27
| Ok St Vincent isn't really mainstream but the point stands. |
Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 08:47
You did not see, or hear, the fat old ladies in their perfumes and high heels, coming out of the concert hall in Chicago way back when after seeing Yehudi Menuhin and Ravi Shankar (East Meets West tour) ... and their comments ... "... how can anyone call that ... music? ... " "... way too much improvisation!..." And you know those ladies will never buy another Yehudi Menuhin album, and definitely not one by Ravi! A loud perfume, ALWAYS comments, even if it does not say anything! And maybe that is the problem! ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: HackettFan
Date Posted: January 05 2018 at 20:30
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I watched three YouTube vids by virgorouge, two in which she plays guitar. I recommend she make more effective use of her fret hand pinky. ------------- A curse upon the heads of those who seek their fortunes in a lie. The truth is always waiting when there's nothing left to try. - Colin Henson, Jade Warrior (Now) |