Bands not standing the test of time
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Topic: Bands not standing the test of time
Posted By: earlyprog
Subject: Bands not standing the test of time
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 06:09
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Over the years I have found that a band like ELP does not grace particularly well with time but sounds dated. I think it's because of an improper balance between keyboards and guitar. I have heard ELP played live by Greg Lake with Gary Moore on guitar and wauw that's just what was needed.
Which bands do you think do not stand the test of time?
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Replies:
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 06:29
dated music turns me on  (musically speaking, of course  )------------- "PA's own GI Joe!" 
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Posted By: eugene
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 07:07
All those band which will not be listened to anymore in a 100 years time. ------------- carefulwiththataxe |
earlyprog wrote:Posted By: clarke2001
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 07:19
Prog will stand the test, and high-quality non-prog as well. Industry-produced pop will fade away soon. And I guess I will never think that ELP's Toccata sounds dated. It was ahead it's time, and still is. ------------- |
Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 07:44
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ELP stands the test of time for me.
It's good to see Emerson playing with Marc Bonilla or Dave Kilminster on guitar (not sure about Greg lake with Gary Moore, I found that tedious), but you can't beat the classic sound of Tarkus, trilogy or BSS.
the only thing about ELP that has failed to stand the test of time is Greg Lake's voice which is now shot to peices. ------------- Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005 |
Posted By: A B Negative
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 08:03
That's always been my problem with ELP. Don't get me wrong, I love some ELP music but the sound of some of it leaves me cold. It seems to me there's a hole in the sound where the guitar should be! I don't think this is a dated sound, just a sound which doesn't appeal to me.
To me, the really dated stuff is the plastic music of the 80s.
 ------------- "The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time." |
Posted By: CrazyDiamond
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 08:59
I have been loving some bands for a long time (ex. Matching Mole, Soft Machine, Procol Harum, Nice, ELP and many others  ) and I still like them a lot, but yes, I agree with you. Now they sound dated to my ears, and I need something new and fresh to listen to.
But on the contrary, some other band's music still sounds modern and enjoyable (ex. Gong, PinkFloyd but also Genesis, King Crimson, Camel, Yes, Caravan and many others )
 Interesting subject, let's see what other people think. ------------- 
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Posted By: salmacis
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 09:33
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ELP sound fine to me- the 60s/ early 70s keyboards have dated a lot better than the rubbish used in the 80s- arguably some 80s prog has dated more.
I'd say the most dated band I have is Quintessence. I find the whole 'groovy man' package with chants and drones a bit much nowadays. |
Posted By: billbuckner
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 09:42
| Some of Rush's synth songs sound a bit dated, though a stellar exception is Subdivisions. |
Posted By: Kimoi
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 10:33
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Impossible question. Time will continue forever on without us. If you mean relatively then don't underestimate market forces |
Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 10:38
| This question makes little sense, since (as you can see in this topic already) everyone have different opinions on the subject. |
Posted By: Frasse
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 11:18
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I like "dated" music. It has something to do with exotism and long lost times.
It's mostly the things surrounding the artist which are dated though, things like concert ads, fashions and record sleeves.
The music may be dated it that you can hear it was recorded with a more "primitive" technology than what is available nowadays.
Generally speaking I think 90s Pop is the most dated music today. In ten years it will be popular again and the Pop of the "noughties" (I hate that word.) is hopelessly dated (for some time before it, too, will be popular again). Retro trends.
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Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 11:27
in the long term , I hope the 80's will be remembered as the decade showing what not to do in music.
But most likely, this is wishful thinking, because I do not have much hope for the general overall music quality rising anytime soon... ------------- let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
Posted By: el böthy
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 13:41
Only thouse tedious drums and sounds from the 80 seem dated for me... oh, and maybe the moody blues
------------- "You want me to play what, Robert?" 
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Posted By: Tormato
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 13:55
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Only the ones that were radio single hits are dated for me, like "another one bites the dust", "owner of a lonely heart", Genesis Radio-Pop, "another brick in the wall II", etc., because they were so aired and then disappeared. each time I listen to them I go back to those days. ------------- I like Tormato, so shoot me! Every person in the world can't think the same. |
Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 14:59
Exactly, that's why i'm asking the question
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Posted By: earlyprog
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 15:06
| When I was asking the question it may have sounded like I don't like ELP. But I do, alot actually. But only because they are so unique and affected so many bands that folowed. Don't get me wrong, they are on my top 10 of all time prog greats - just below top 5! But they are still dated. |
Posted By: sm sm
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 15:08
| Fashionable recording techicques don't sound the test of time - I would love to remove the psychellca element of a lot of bands at that time, likewise remove the new wave element in the late 70's/early 80's |
Posted By: Philéas
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 17:17
But isn't that a waste of time? If the question doesn't make sense, neither will the answers.  |
Posted By: peter_gabriel
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 17:42
| WHAT IS DATED?? |
Posted By: Losendos
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 18:07
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ELP are brilliant.
I considered dated music music that for some reason gained prominence at the time but later on when everyone woke up the only word was yuck.
Disco,the Archies, the Sex Pistols , 80s pop (Invisible Touch ) , rap , techno are examples.
They are there in every era ------------- How wonderful to be so profound |
Posted By: echocharlie
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 19:08
| Emerson Lake and Palmer's musical exploits exemlplify the word timeless. |
Posted By: Gyllir
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 19:46
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I would imagine that those dated bands would come from the glorious 80's. I think the 90's will hold up, and the 70's are good. I'm not big into the 60's except for the Beatles, and the 50's is before my time. It's that whole ugly generic synth sound and the elec drums thing. Talk about corporate rock. The worst rock song ever made is We Built This City by Starship according to some poll/critics thing. MTV is probably to blame. |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 20:18
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ELP???!!!???!!!
Maybe their SOUND is not up to modern standards (sound meaning in this case production values, and off course every band from the 70's will sound dated because of recording....), but their music? Just one word:
TARKUS
There's no better epic in prog... EVER. How can it not stand the test of time?
How can music not stand the test of time???
There's music from the middle ages that we can buy today... so.... music never dies... IF IT's GOOD... for if it's not, it won't stand the test of time... not even for 10 MINUTES!! ------------- 
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Posted By: Tommy
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 21:52
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ELP sounding dated, you must be kidding! Emerson used keyboards that are still prominent in todays bands,
Of all the prog giants, I would say that Genesis sound more dated than anyone else.
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Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: November 24 2006 at 21:59
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Good and creative music is never dated. ELP were ahead of their time, and they are now what we can called "a Classic prog group", and for me, what is classic never get dated, like Beethoven, Mozart, or the Corn Flakes cereal. When it's good, it's good.
On the other hand, the Disco music, the Sex-Pistols, Rod Stewart and many more others who made the charts are dated. They are related to a certain period of time and to a certain type of music wanted by the music industry to be sold in a relatively short time and be forgotten after. Who still listen to the Sex Pistols right now ? ------------- C'est la vie |
Posted By: greenback
Date Posted: November 25 2006 at 00:39
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Styx - babe is VERY dated! ------------- [HEADPINS - LINE OF FIRE: THE RECORD HAVING THE MOST POWERFUL GUITAR SOUND IN THE WHOLE HISTORY OF MUSIC!> |
Posted By: Bryan
Date Posted: November 25 2006 at 07:01
Tons of people actually, albeit probably no one you'd find on this forum. |
Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: November 25 2006 at 09:34
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Sex Pistols, this is not music at all to my hears, just a lot of noise with shouting all the hangers of the moments ( when I was 20 , I thought the same thing of this crap...). That's dated, and it definitly not stand the test of time. It's dépassé. On the other hand, the Beatles are not dated at all. They are classic. ------------- C'est la vie |
Posted By: eugene
Date Posted: November 25 2006 at 09:42
When you were 20, you thought the same thing of this crap, as you do now - hence this crap stands the test of time... ------------- carefulwiththataxe |
Posted By: A B Negative
Date Posted: November 27 2006 at 04:14
I do. And so do many of my friends. We're going to see Rezillos, Damned, Beat, Meteors, GBH, Blood or Whiskey and Sex Pistols Experience in Glasgow on Sunday! ------------- "The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time." |
Posted By: M. B. Zapelini
Date Posted: November 27 2006 at 04:46
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The Mamas & The Papas, Scott McKenzie, Jefferson Airplane, all this flower power generation sounds very dated to me. As Zappa once asked, "who needs the Peace Corps"? About punk rock: punk bands will never sound dated - IMO, if you say they're dated, you must assume that there were some kind of evolution in this style, making previous bands sound out of time. And punk cannot evolve or make progress (I'm not saying this is bad - if you're into this type of music, sit down, relax and enjoy it) - it's against the whole concept. As a final word: if this site were PUNKARCHIVES, Yes would be dated. ------------- "He's a man of the past and one of the present" PETER HAMMILL |
Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: November 27 2006 at 04:50
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THE NICE |
Posted By: A B Negative
Date Posted: November 27 2006 at 04:57
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I know it's moving away from the point slightly but bear with me! Punk can evolve. The Damned progressed from New Rose to Curtain Call (a prog punk classic). Not all punk bands think it's still 1977 in the same way that not all prog bands think it's still 1971. ------------- "The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time." |
Posted By: creation_curve
Date Posted: November 27 2006 at 20:31
| Heavy metal bands with keyboards sound dated as they were produced, To say a sound is dated, means that humans grow old...curious. |
Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: November 28 2006 at 08:50
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David Coverdale's hair is looking extremely dated ------------- Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005 |
Posted By: Dee Snarl
Date Posted: November 28 2006 at 13:32
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As an "outsider" (note post count), I'd say that conventional wisdom (and I'm talking about "serious" popular music listeners) would find ELP MUCH more dated than the Sex Pistols! Never Mind the Bollocks... has aged remarkably well. Thus its "classic" status.
While production techniques can easily date a band, they're not the only things. Following trends is a good way to sound dated in a few years. Those artifacts that transcend their time are those that can truly lay claim to the term "classic" (a designation which, BTW, I think it's too early to bestow upon anything from the pop era, strictly speaking). The same principles hold throughout the arts, and in various other areas as well - notably fashion. What makes us laugh at old yearbook pics? Outdated trends, not the "classic" look.
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Posted By: jalas
Date Posted: November 28 2006 at 13:56
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Frank Sinatra. Also, big band jazz groups. ------------- 
JOIN THE COMMUNIST PARTY! |
Posted By: jalas
Date Posted: November 28 2006 at 13:56
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And Elvis -------------
JOIN THE COMMUNIST PARTY! |
Posted By: bucka001
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 10:27
Yeah, I'd agree with that. I grew up listening to their albums (or, rather, worshipping those discs as Genesis was my absolute fave for several years in the 70's). But not having heard them for several years, I listened to Trick of the Tail at a friend's the other day. While I remembered every note of every song - still etched into my head after all these years - I was floored by just how dated (almost silly) Tony Banks' keyboards sound today. The solo on Robbery, Assault, & Battery is great from a technical standpoint, but just sounds horribly dated in that 70's "mega-synth" sort of way. It struck me the same way that hearing that overproduced drum sound of the 80's strikes me, where you immediately say to yourself, "That's so 80's." A lot of their stuff sounds that way, and I think it's a trend that started with Selling England (the synth solo on Cinema Show, etc).
------------- jc |
Posted By: laplace
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 10:50
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Kraftwerk sounds impossibly dated at this point, but there wouldn't be a retro scene if there wasn't a subset of people who absolutely adore music of bygone eras. Boing bong tschak. |
Posted By: Stjernestøv
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 14:16
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Well, one can hear that 70's records are produced in the 70's, but that's not a bad thing. In general, 70's production values were great. Then came the 80's, and everything started to sound crazy. Luckily, heavy metal pretty much gave the finger to the general 80's sound and instead proceeded to evolve great production values. The 90's and 00's sound generally great, with some exceptions, as the insistence on higher volume and extreme compression can ruin some of the listening experience. As far as the bass goes, though, I say the 70's were the best decade for it. :) And a band that sounds dated on many of their records: Queen. I love'em, but their production values, while technically good, sound slightly off. ------------- "My stories? No, my little lord, not mine. The stories are, before me and after me, before you too." |
Posted By: Chris H
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 17:41
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Personally, I like to think of Genesis as a band that couldn't stand the test of time. Sure the band has, but the sound didn't. When Peter was gone and the 80's were here they completely commercialized. Oh and please don't trash punk bands anymore guys. The Sex Pistols started music revolutions around the world, and bands such as The Damned, The Cramps and The Buzzcocks are some of the most influential bands to record, even though it may not be in your tastes.
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Posted By: bucka001
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:01
Amen to that. It may not sit well with many prog fans, but when the critics and professional chroniclers of our time pound out their "25 Most Important Albums of All Time" lists, Never Mind The Bollocks will definitely be there, but Foxtrot, Close to the Edge, and Pawn Hearts (which I think is brilliant) won't.
We may disagree with the critics/public at large, but that's how the rest of the world sees it.
And anyway, I think the Pistols are cool and Lydon's follow-up band, P.I.L., was even cooler! Don't forget, John Rotten/Lydon was a BIG fan of PH/VdGG, Beefheart, Hawkwind, and Can. ------------- jc |
Posted By: Rocktopus
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:16
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I think these: Prodigy ELP The Nice Massive Attack Warrant Seal Dream Theater Ekseption Sky New Trolls Goldie Fatboy Slim Enya Jean Michel Jarre Wings Queensrÿche Eloy But not Kraftwerk! 80's (and 90's) version of Jethro Tull, Rush, Yes, Rolling Stones, Eric Clapton, Tangerine Dream, Elton John, Bob Dylan.. almost every big name of the 60-70's sounded awful in the 80's, but I still love a lot of music from that decade. ------------- Over land and under ashes In the sunlight, see - it flashes Find a fly and eat his eye But don't believe in me Don't believe in me Don't believe in me |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:21
I do actually. And I must add many, many thousands of others. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:23
I wouldn't be proud of that!  ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/ocellatedgod" rel="nofollow - last.fm |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:24
You are definitly wrong. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:26
I certainly would. Gives me a bit of street cred at least! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: The Miracle
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:30
I guess. Fo' sho. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/ocellatedgod" rel="nofollow - last.fm |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 20 2006 at 18:31
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: edible_buddha
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 02:38
Strange you should say that about Kraftwerk... Their early stuff was timeless, but the stuff they did in the '80s and beyond was obsolete the moment their fingers hit the keyboards. Thats what happens when an inovative band with a good idea dosent progress that idea... They appear to be still on the 'trans europe express'.
Oh yeah, and Eloy, Jefferson airplane (used to like 'white rabbit', etc), and the more naive 1st generation 'hippy' bands like Iron Butterfly... Enjoyable, but in an 'Ed Wood' kind of way.
------------- I really like this jacket, but the sleeves are much too long. |
Posted By: edible_buddha
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 02:41
Damn right... Cant get to the complex without a history of the basics (yes their music is basic). I remember slammin to em in the teen yrs... Wasnt there a period in your lives (pre prog) where the three chord wonder was king??? ------------- I really like this jacket, but the sleeves are much too long. |
Posted By: Rocktopus
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 04:01
Strange you should say that about Kraftwerk... Their early stuff
was timeless, but the stuff they did in the '80s and beyond was
obsolete the moment their fingers hit the keyboards. Thats what
happens when an inovative band with a good idea dosent progress that
idea... They appear to be still on the 'trans europe express'.
Oh yeah, and Eloy, Jefferson airplane (used to like 'white rabbit',
etc), and the more naive 1st generation 'hippy' bands like Iron
Butterfly... Enjoyable, but in an 'Ed Wood' kind of way. [/QUOTE] What Kraftwerk stuff are we talking about exactly? '81's Computer World is one of the best releases of that year, and '83's Tour de France EP, is great too. That leaves us with Electric Cafe from '86. No classic, but still sounds better that most other progrelated albums of that year. Then there is no real studio album release until 2003's Tour de France - Soundtracks. So it doesn't really exist more stuff from the '80's and beyond. The Mix? Well its just a mix album. I'd say about 0% of Eloy, 5% Iron Butterfly, 15% of Jefferson Airplane, (and ca. 25% of Genesis or Yes ) and 85% of Kraftwerk dates well. So I guess we're agreeing on some things, Buddha. ------------- Over land and under ashes In the sunlight, see - it flashes Find a fly and eat his eye But don't believe in me Don't believe in me Don't believe in me |
Posted By: Radar Love
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 07:46
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I would say GENESIS'S 70'S output sounds the most dated from that era, probably due to Bank's over use of the mellotron & overall poor production.
ELP still sound freshest of all to me & that's probably due to Emerson's synths & Palmer's electronic kit, oh! and the excellent production!
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Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 07:53
| Everything that's badly produced |
Posted By: cuncuna
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 07:56
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¿¿¿Kraftwerk dated???... no way. Hammond bands, all dated. Art Bears will sound like something new forever. ------------- ¡Beware of the Bee! |
Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 09:06
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Sex Pistols are probably good when you are an angry teenager, but when you are 30 something and over, it's dépassé, unless you always want to be a stupid teenager or an attarded teenager...
------------- C'est la vie |
Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 09:10
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On the other hand, ELP, Genesis, PF and so on, were making music listenable for adults, even my grand mother liked it. She was an ELP fan, and I knew several adults in the seventies ( meaning people over 40 at that time) who were progressive rock fans.
------------- C'est la vie |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 09:17
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What will they be listening to in 2106?
Robbie Williams? The Sex Pistols? Kylie Minogue - i doubt it, but The Beatles, Pink Floyd, ELP and Genesis certainly!
-------------  Prog Archives Tour Van 
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Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 09:23
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Dated... No quality music shall sound dated, as it will have newer, younger fans. ------------- sig |
Posted By: Rocktopus
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 13:26
Very interesting... never thought of it like that before. ------------- Over land and under ashes In the sunlight, see - it flashes Find a fly and eat his eye But don't believe in me Don't believe in me Don't believe in me |
Posted By: tdbark
Date Posted: December 21 2006 at 14:22
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This is an interesting topic. If I were to look at music through my eyes/ears, I would say that there is very little out there that sounds "dated" if you listen to them strictly musically. I am right now listening to the Allman Brothers Band (Midnight Rider) and it does not sound dated in the least. The craftmanship is excellent. Paranoid follows it up and it sounds great as well..... We THINK something is dated when we decide to call it such.... but what happens then is we handcuff modern musicians, making them think if they use a Hammond organ they'll sound "dated" and no one will buy their albums.... All sounds and forms of music sould be open for use by today's musicians.... Unfortunately, producers today steer musicians away from their own instincts and tell them things like "Do a rap here... That's the sound you need today!" I cringe when I hear a heavy metal band rapping because I know a producer somewhere is saying that very thing...... Everything is relative. I dare anyone to tell the world that Mozart is dated.............. ------------- Twenty men crossing a bridge into a village, are twenty men crossing twenty bridges into twenty villages. Wallace Stevens |
Posted By: A B Negative
Date Posted: December 22 2006 at 04:38
Music is good is if your grandmother likes it?
 ------------- "The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time." |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 22 2006 at 06:23
No point in this argument, you are simply being convrontional for the sake of it. Simply put, The Sex Pistols are timeless, unlike many prog bands! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: December 22 2006 at 06:27
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: December 22 2006 at 09:10
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I am proud of my late grand mother; she was a progressive music fan because of my cousin Jimmy who was brought up by her. Jimmy was and maybe still a great progressive music fan since 1969. My grand mother always found something interesting in this music; she liked the organ sound and the synthes and more... ------------- C'est la vie |
Posted By: Prog.Sylvie
Date Posted: December 22 2006 at 09:17
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About the Sex Pistols, it's a generation gap here, no doubt about it.
When the Sex Pistols became popular, I was not a teenager anymore. When you grew up with some intelligent and sophisticated music like I did, it is really difficult to find something good in the Sex Pistols music. Punk was a movement for me, that's all. I went to London in summer 1980, and I went to see a punk concert given by UK.Subs. The music, I did not care. The real show was in the hall while the young people were jumping and dancing around. We were at the balcony looking to this jungle. That's what this show was all about, not the music. ------------- C'est la vie |