IS GOD RUINING PROG?
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Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6555
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Topic: IS GOD RUINING PROG?
Posted By: Dazo
Subject: IS GOD RUINING PROG?
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:26
| What with some artists now preaching through their music,e.g Flowerkings,Niel morse,etc.Do you think the usual meaniningful lyrics associated with prog will fail to get through to the discerning? |
Replies:
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:26
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Wait, the Flower Kings preach? ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:29
Who do you think the Flowerking is?
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Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:33
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I don't really think that the Flower Kings preach, they certainly do talk about the divine a lot, though. ------------- 
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:33
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I'm probably the biggest Flower Kings fan on this board. Roine's
said many times that he belongs to no religion in particular, that he
just believes in positivity and kindness. He uses the Flower King
as a symbol of that. He's also used the Christian stories, as
well as stories of other religions, to illustrate that
positivity. Devil's Playground mentions the Holy Mother of
Hinduism, for example. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:36
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Why I said they talk about the divine a lot, but it's never preaching. -------------
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Man Overboard wrote:Posted By: strawberry
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:36
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I don't see it will. Many proggers that like Neil Morse and aren't concerned with the lyrics. Perhaps I am wrong though. won't be a first time. ------------- taste is but a matter of oppinion. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:39
| I was not Taking the p*ss when I posted this topic.I love The Flowerkings,I was just wondering if people found the singing of GOD/Religion offputting to their liking of the music? |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:39
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Prog has always been about preaching, Pink Floyd,
ELP, Yes, the Moody Blues, Jethro Tull and on and on! They just preached a different gospel! 
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Posted By: Ivan_Melgar_M
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:40
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Sounds like you're describing Jon Anderson, a guy obsessed with divinity, philosophy specially oriental, but this didn't caused that Yes music went down. God doesn't ruins music, the man creates and ruins music, God is not guilty of a person's beliefs or disbeliefs. BTW Since when kindnes and positivity is a bad influence for music? Unless you're a Marilyn Manson fan, I belief it's ok. Iván ------------- 
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:42
I was referring to Dazo, actually, I should've used the quote feature. -- I personally think that the uplifting spiritual aspect of The Flower Kings' music makes it better, not worse. It makes their scope broader, their aim higher, their lyrical convictions stronger. Humanizzimo just wouldn't be the same without Roine or (currently) Daniel wailing about "the blood of Jesus on a nail, we turn the balance on scal; in pain and fearless suffering lies a message from the King of Kings..." ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:48
|
A lot of prog's about religious concerns. What's it's not about though is exclusively one religious orthodoxy, which is great and why it is universally appealing. I think part of why progressive rock is "progressive" is because it posits a system of belief that is a synthesis of all the great religions. And this, imo, is the direction the world woud be quickly progessing to, if it weren't for pin-headed narrow minded literalists who have to have their truth spoon-fed to them by myth-obsessed psychopaths. ------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: May 23 2005 at 23:48
I was aware that you were talking to Dazo, I was using that quote to strengthen my opinion, you said what I was going to say. I also agree with your bottom statement 100%. -------------
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:12
|
Dazo: What about it? They also say "Getting even
altogether, hiding from the Holy Mother". The Holy Mother is a
Hindu thing. Did Roine have a change of religion? OH WAIT,
in the same song, he says "This is how you raise the Cain, this is what
you teach our children", a light Christian reference that is actually
more about the mainstream phrase "raising Cain" than an actual
reference to Christianity's Cain. Then again, for ever Judas Kiss or Devil's Danceschool, we've got that clip at the end of Underdog talking about the John Holmes Pizza, 18 inches of deliiiicious... pizza.  Edit: Where the hell did Dazo's post go?  ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Philrod
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:21
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What is wrong with preaching anyways? Pink floyd preaches a hell lot, same thing for Jethro Tull! That does not diminish the impact of the lyrics or the music! Religion has always been a big subject in music, the denial or acceptance of it. Not only in lyrics: John Mahavishu Mclaughlin is a great example! I don't know for you guys, but Mu God from Jethro Tull Kicks ass and it does talks about, well, God! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Philrod/?chartstyle=Geldropdown-small"> 
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Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:21
| The holy mother could surely be Mary mother of god? |
Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:25
What´s positive about Religion ???  ------------- Billy Connolly Dream Theater Terry Gilliam Hagen Quartet Jethro Tull Mike Keneally |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:25
Possibly. I had a Hindu boyfriend for a while, and we both thought of the Hindu Holy Mother immediately when listening to that track for the first time. Coincidence? Maybe. Still... THE JOHN HOLMES PIZZA! ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:27
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You mean why is it good to wonder about how the universe was created? And how we came into being? That sort of thing? ------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:28
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Yes, what´s the point ??? ------------- Billy Connolly Dream Theater Terry Gilliam Hagen Quartet Jethro Tull Mike Keneally |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:29
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You could almost say that the first 6 Kansas albums were Kerry Livgren's (at least the songs he wrote) spiritual search. His choice was Christianity which was kind of preachy in the 80's but has backed off a bit since. ------------- 
"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:36
| Didn't he play on the Neil Morse album Testimony? |
Posted By: Garion81
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:39
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Yes he did.
-------------
"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?" |
Posted By: bluetailfly
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:39
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Well, I don't know. If it's not in you to yearn for that, then hey no problem. There's other ways to stimulate the mind. ------------- "The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle." |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:42
He played a single guitar solo, yes. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Velvetclown
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:43
  ------------- Billy Connolly Dream Theater Terry Gilliam Hagen Quartet Jethro Tull Mike Keneally |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:45
|
Kerry Livgren played on the album.I was right then. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:47
Neal Morse also wrote a song featuring the lyrics "**** YOU!" screamed over and over. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 00:51
He was also in a band with roine stolt. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:04
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Didn't Daniel Gildenlow play in a band with roine stolt & neil morse?
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:05
Daniel Gildenlow was a 'special guest' on Transatlantic's European
tour, filling in thin areas on vocals, guitar, keyboards, and
percussion. Not the same as "being in a band" with them, I'd say.
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:12
| O.K.I'll give you that.He was definately on Unfold the future,Meet the Flowerkings & ADAM & EVE. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:15
|
Yes, Daniel is an official member of the Flower Kings since Adam and
Eve, and was a special guest from Unfold The Future onward. Neal
Morse is not a Flower Kings member, though. On either the Transatlantic DVD or the Flower Kings DVD (not sure which, both were stolen from me  ),
Daniel is shown giving the "devil horns" while kneeling and
sneering. Which is funny, and almost adorable, but would that
really be tolerated in a band with as much 'religious focus' as you're
implying?------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:21
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What do you mean the "devil horns"? Do you mean the sign Ronny James Dio's Grandmother Invented? |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:22
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Yes, that. And yes,
I'm being silly, but Roine's gone on record saying they aren't a
religious band, what more needs to be said except for how amazing they
are?
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:26
|
ADAM & EVE,not religious? |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:32
|
Not in the least! Did you listen to the LYRICS of the
album? The title track, Adam & Eve, is about relationships
between men and women developing over time! "He looked at himself
like some kind of porn star", a Biblical reference?
Eve was referred to as being "dressed like a hooker", and Adam crossing
the lines between "make love and rape". He simply used the names
as a reference to men and women.
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:33
Have you read the lyrics to that song? Those are the opposite of religious I believe. -------------
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:34
My conclusion: It's not religion or God ruining prog, it's people
who pass judgement about music WITHOUT KNOWING A DAMN THING ABOUT IT.
 Agreed, Cygnus? ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Cygnus X-2
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:38
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Yep. -------------
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:39
GOD, if he/she exists, is surely behind ALL music
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:40
Except nu-metal. 
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: transend
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:43
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Am a DEVOUT Atheist. 'Testimony' almost made me puke. I loveD Spocks bread and that so called God of yours ruined a great band. Will NEVER EVER understand any organization that believes it is OK to kill people, for priests to be moved around to avoid prosecution for child molesting, then allow the guy that did the moving to vote for his churches leader (Mr.Pope). Not say anything against blowing up abortion clinics. But worst of all; say that evolution did not occur, dinosaurs did not exist (even though fossils exist) and that some 'super person' was responsible for all this? Sorry, as always, it makes no bloody sense. Then to dedicate your life to this 'imaginary' being and write songs, raise your hands in the air and talk to this being is utterly confusing to me. Ok, ranted enough. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:45
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Please, Don't quote one line from a song that is obviously about the story of ADAM & EVE (see the Bible)read the Lyrics .
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:45
Way to be an ignorant prick. You just lumped in several different religious sects and stamped the same belief system on all of them. Neal Morse has no dealings with the pope, no desire to let innocent die, no love for child molesters, yet you dump him in with that group? LEARN TO DEBATE YOU USER OF FALLACY! ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:46
Show me the lyrics, then. THE SONG IS NOT ABOUT THE STORY OF ADAM AND EVE.  That's hawt.------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:50
| Surely you have the cd which is supplied with the lyrics to the whole album? |
Posted By: con safo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:51
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As long as the bands make quality music they can believe in god all
they want, i personally think religious subjects can add alot to a song.
------------- 
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 01:52
|
The majority of my CD collection was stolen in January. Which was
actually somewhat referred to earlier in the topic, so you can't accuse
me of making that up. So I invite you to LISTEN TO THE SONG.
"Eve would claim her right to say no / But she was dressed like a hooker, reading go, go, go" Another part of the story from the Bible? Oh, another song from the album, "A Vampire's View"... another Bible story? ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:00
| Quote from ADAM & EVE - "Adam would hope for a talk with god,with his half eaten apple,waiting for the flood.Eve would admit they were all but innocent and did appologize if god was offended." |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:03
|
What is Starlight Man about?
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:04
^^^^ which is about the closest the song comes to touching upon story, basically to give the name something concrete. Considering Starlight Man features the line "I can be your backup plan", it's not likely about God. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:11
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If You Can quote one line (wrongly by the way)I will use the Quote on the rear inside cover. "We are stardust,we are golden and we got to get ourselves back to the garden" - Joni Mitchell 1969.
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:14
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That's a Joni Mitchell quote! Don't tell me she's a Christian artist too now.
The Flower Kings are spiritual, very much so, I've said it
before. But they don't promote any particular religion, and Roine
has stated he doesn't belong to any, either. Do you honestly
believe that Adam & Eve is a pro-Christian telling of the story?
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:19
|
The Flowerkings used that quote on the rear inner cover of the cd booklet. Maybe I am wrong and the garden in question is madison sqaure garden? |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:21
|
Yes, the quote is used in a Flower Kings cover. I believe that
not only is it used to refer to the Garden Of Eden (to tie in with the
album's title), but also to refer to what Mitchell was referring to,
the Garden of Eden SYMBOLICALLY, as in, our natural roots, inner peace. Or is A Vampire's View about Lazarus? ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:28
| No it's a song about the folly of being a sinner. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:32
|
Is it? Is it really?
They make it sound so sexy... and the soundbite with the girl
taking off her shirt... and Daniel Gildenlow being ****ing
hot... Roine said it was inspired by Anne Rice's vampire novels.
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:40
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YES IT IS REALLY!Could we please get back to my original Question.
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Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:46
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Give me some sort of proof, ANY sort of proof that A Vampire's View has anything to do with sinning. Roine says: "A Vampires View" is obviousy a song about the world, seen from a Vampire point of view, a bit inspired by Anne Rice's "Confession of a Vampire". It is telling a gloomy story of a very sad and isolated soul that is forced live in the darkness, feeding on the blood, flesh or soul of others and hate every minute of it, but can't get out and cannot see an end to the grind either. A Smeagol or Gollum if you want or a Zombie too. At the same time, in parallel, it is a song about a possible "bloodsucker", a successful businessman or an entire empire or political system that have to walk over dead bodies to increace his/it's profits or power, finding himself loved and missed by no one in the end, isolated in a sinister world of profit and corruption only. It is indeed lonely at the top. As for your question, I think that TFK's lyrics are as meaningful as any, and there is absolutely no preaching going on, they're simply spreading a message of love. Or do you disagree? ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:48
|
Actually... A short look back at making the new CD by Roine Stolt: After being involved with the production and release of "Meet The Flowerkings" DVD that came out in October last year(2003) it was quite a difficult task to come up with a new and fresh idea for a new studio album concept, so I think I just said to myself "let's start by writing songs" and then see where it takes us. http://www.flowerkings.se/?s=news&p=poster"> 
After all, the songs have always been the foundation of all Flower Kings music
recordings or performances, even if we lately have had the chance of working with
some fine musicians that can certainly groove and improvise as well.To make a slight change I decided to mainly work with just an old nylon stringed acoustic guitar and a pocket memory mp3 recorder. This provided some real scaled down writing, I mean there were no big fat synth chords to impress or no electric guitar or drum loop to hide behind. Just me, my voice and the guitar. Still I found this "simple" way of working out songs very rewarding and I came up with more music than I've done in a long time, some of it you can find on the new CD "Adam & Eve" and some more will surely see the day on possible solo projects of mine. It is always hard, or I'd say impossible, to come up with totally fresh and different sounding music. Well it is still me writing and I guess I have, by now sort of, defined my writing style and standards, regardless if it is for the FlowerKings, Transatlantic or Kaipa. I know what I like and what I want to achieve and I know my standards are set high and I know my self criticism is sometimes painful, but I get the job done. I started writing for the new CD in October and after finishing a FlowerKings European tour supporting the DVD release I just did continue writing music and words in the same simplistic manner, I did a few rough demos of the songs in a slightly more developed fashion and sent it out to the other guys and then left for Costa Rica with my family for 3 weeks. In January we did meet in Jonas Reingold's Studio to hammer out a few background tracks, the songs we picked should match the profile we have decided on for the album, meaning they should be clearly recognizable as FlowerKings tunes, but still contain new elements, if possible. Well, you always try to come up with sensational things, don't you ? But I've come to realize that for me the sensation lies more in the feeling or the "soul" of the songs, than the complexity of odd meters or the impossible or possibly "fiddly bits" or the production tricks. Music is a strange bird isn't it ? We cannot exactly put the finger on what it is that makes us go "wow" or what makes our hearts beat faster. It's almost like love....! I do trust that feeling and can only hope other people feel the same as I do. Of course a minimal dose of speculation or constructual guidance is needed to keep away from doing the same music over and over. I hope we don't ? At least it seems that the strenght of Flowerkings is that we always try to re-invent ourselves in a way so that the fans can get a feeling that we or on our way to something new, unexpected and we wanna take you there, but still keep enough of the great old Flower Kings vibe so it feels familiar. We kept it very much open so that any tune we felt was a good tune could find it's place on this CD, however specificly we looked for symphonic pieces with strong melody as for the core material. We felt no need to dive deeper into the jazz fusion thing we've been doing on and off previously, because we're not really that type of band as a whole, some of us dig jazz, blues and fusion but rather put it into our side projects, instead wanted to concentrate on good symphonic and melodic stuff, where every aspect of the band could shine. I had this great epic tune "Love Supreme" that I've been working with and was very pleased with and I had a few very cool vocal harmony ideas for Hasse, Daniel andmyself for that one, the lyrics was also important for that song and I was very pleased with that whole concept. Starting to work on that one and a few other classic prog ideas felt very good and I could see the other bandmembers gradually getting more enthusiastic about the bulk of material and we got to the point where everyone was feeling "we are making a good record here ". "Vampires View" is a sort of bolero style dramatic song that felt like a new approach, almost like from a musical, I'm sure it's gonna be great live, a bit depressing but also very romantic. "Adam & Eve" was another song that stood out as a somewhat heavier song but still with a FK twist, built on riffs and an attitude. "Cosmic Circus" has a late jingle jangle 60's feel to it and has echoes of both Beatles and the San Francisco flowerpower movement. We worked on one of Jonas songs that had a trashy metallic intro that went into a vocal Lennon like section that didn't quite work out 100% satisfactory, so I later re-wrote the whole vocal section and added new lyrics and melody, but still over Zoltans old drumtrack, quite funny and a bit strange, it ended up being "Timelines". We worked for a week tracking drums mostly, now all in 24 bit digital for Emagic Logic Audio on macinosh as usual and then I went back home to write some more. I then wrote "Drivers Seat", another one of the epic songs, a song that has both a sort of Swedish folk music theme and also a classic prog theme. Also "The blade of Cain" is a powerful thing that was from the beginning a ending instrumental piece of the Adam & Eve song the we lifted out, but now it worked perfect as a album closer instead, very majestic. Lyricwise I did work quite fast and most of the lyrics were written way before we even started recording, some of it was actually written in Costa Rica at the otherworldly beach or strolling around with the kid notebook. "Love Supreme" is a song about the search for the ultimate love, meaning a love that trancend, goes far beyond woman or man or family members, or even the human race. If you search and learn enough about the complexities of our environment and how all elements, plants, animals and humans work, or should work, in harmony with each other, you can begin to see the perfection and the unity, it's all very beautiful and a delicate balance to behold. Some call it "God", by different names in different regions, and some call it "the great spirit" or "the great mother" or whatever, It is likely to all mean the same. "Cosmic Circus" is also a song about the wonders and mysteries of life, but also the confusion as it is not always easy to understand what is going on and why bad and good things happen or fall on our plate. We question the right or wrong and how to find one's specific role in this cosmic circus. Much of what surface in the world politics and the global schemes tend to be nonsence but the next minute it suddenly fall into it's right place, mysteriously. History can teach us great lessons, but some refuse to see it. Sometimes we watch, sometimes we go with the flow, sometimes we wrestle to get out and sometimes we just stand still stare in awe. "A Vampires View" is obviousy a song about the world, seen from a Vampire point of view, a bit inspired by Anne Rice's "Confession of a Vampire". It is telling a gloomy story of a very sad and isolated soul that is forced live in the darkness, feeding on the blood, flesh or soul of others and hate every minute of it, but can't get out and cannot see an end to the grind either. A Smeagol or Gollum if you want or a Zombie too. At the same time, in parallel, it is a song about a possible "bloodsucker", a successful businessman or an entire empire or political system that have to walk over dead bodies to increace his/it's profits or power, finding himself loved and missed by no one in the end, isolated in a sinister world of profit and corruption only. It is indeed lonely at the top. "Adam & Eve" is a song about the complexity and difference of male and female sexuality and views of how the society, now more than ever, exploit sexuality in all shape and form, on daily basis, in magazines or TV or on the internet, in books or in shops. You can almost sell everything if you do it with a sex twist, big or small. It occupies our brains heavily, or at least at some point, day or night, on and off. No one goes free of lust, not priests, nor presidents. When lust dies mankind dies. It is the spark of life but also a shameful thing for the moralists. Adam & Eve is just fictious figures in this song, it has nothing to do with the Bible's Adam & Eve. They cannot live together and they cannot live apart, as God had put an incurably urge to bread in Adams brain to secure the existence of the human race for all generations to come. Adam loves sex and need it badly to feel alive, but Eve want to be loved for different reason, they do not understand each other, they play a tiresome game that leave a lot to be desired for both of them. "Starlight Man" is about love, friendship, holding out a helping hand and the ultimate power of kindness, the great boomerang of LOVE. But also about enlightenment. The "starlight man" can be our parents offering us protection or our teacher opening our eyes to hidden knowledge or a spiritual leader or even someone who create great music or art that makes us feel alive and in that way helping opening up our senses. "Timelines" is a song that deal with time and to come to terms with time passing and how time, bit by bit, change us outside and inside and all that surround us. Nothing is constant, everything is changing and everything is in development. We get hurt, we learn, we suffer and "no facelift will cover the scars" but even the wrinkles or scars can be beautiful if we accept changes as a part of life. We get older, our kids grow older, our parents will pass away some day, so will we. It is all a journey & we cannot stop time, all we can do is sit back and relax or hopefully we can fill our time with some significant substance. What we call a "meaning of Life". We can make some noise. We can send out good vibes and get a few back. "Drivers Seat" is a song that is about the need, or the option to take control over our own lives and shaping it carefully to our own liking, if possible instead of being faithful to all the companies or corporations that try to sell us a "lifestyle complete". We are normally so manipulated by the great flow of influences that the media shower us in every day life and there is always someone out there who want us to subscribe to a new lifestyle or to wear some new clothes or to eat a certain brand of food or try a new better toothpaste or such. Some people simply follow the rest, or go with the flow, because it is a path of less resistance. Some others go deeper into themselves and ask what can be done and what their heart tell them would be the right thing. So in a way we can, to some degree, create and maintain our own little universes without causing any, or little, damage to our surroundings. I often get the question if my lyrics are religious, I'd be tempted to say "yes" to that, because there lies a religious experience hiding in how we can create magic in real life. Religion is probably the science we long to subscribe to as of learning of a higher existance where the universal machinery reach a point of outermost harmony....puh. In short a religion is a handbook of well being, so it's not really that mysterious. When we see ourselves as participants of the big schemes or "links in the chain reaction" or dominoes or whatever, we then realise we can make a change and we can get rewarded with joy and peace or further enlightenment, it IS a reality IF we want it to be. My lyrics deal with all that and it is a religion in a way, all that you'll find in the 10 commandments resonate very fine with all that I believe and proclaim. The title of the CD was initially meant to be named after the opening song "Love Supreme" but we altered it to Adam & Eve because it did better fit our ideas of artwork and our plans for all stage shows and all of the total art and package idea. Adam&Eve was more suitable as a concept, as all lyrics could relate to the Man/Woman, Light/Darkness, Hot/Cold, Day/Night, Love/Hate, Apathy/Devotion etc. No one entity can exist without the other. As for the music, we've tried to work with even more dynamics for this recoding. There is however nothing groundbreaking on this CD but we wouldn't like it to be "groundbreaking" just for the sake of being"groundbreaking". Many others try to do more extreme music, but for us in this time of life we only try to make music that create a feeling of well being or something that is powerful enough to lift you up, fuel your spirit and get ready for the day or make you groove to the beat with lyrics that will hopefully make your head spin with good thoughts. If music put you in a good mood & you feel good you will most certainly do us a BIG, BIG favour, namely ; you will treat your fellow humans good! That's again the great boomerang of LOVE!! I thought that listening to a new Flowerkings record should feel like coming home, but the furniture has been changed just a bit, or the walls repainted or fitted with new wallpaper. Strange and exciting wallpaper that is !!! We feel no need to show the fans or other musicians that we can do something exceptionally difficult or to play a thousand notes or rock real hard or be weird for weird's sake just to show off or impress the fans. I think that, by now, we have established a good devoted and faithful fanbase that will follow us for a long time to come and now we only hope to see many new fans discovering the band, hopefully outside of the progressive rock circles too. We know we can do it, with so much talent within the band and so much love from you fans. It sometimes feels like there is some kind of otherworldly force outside of all the band that drag this project along and fuel it with new powers constantly, I'm amazed how things happen the way they do and how so much great music energy seem to surround The Flower Kings, just look at sideprojects.....wow!! I wouldn't be surprised to find out, after I'm dead and gone, that I wasn't the "real" boss of this band. Being a messenger isn't bad after all. It's great being here and I'm still amazed how much we've achieved lately in terms of quality music and good vibes and great memories. Just going back to the Swedish tour a few weeks ago it was a great uplifting experience after working so hard with the album. Future plans include a new European tour in October where we will use a customized light design and screen projections for the first time. We're gonna play a lot from the new album and the rest will be ONLY songs we never played before. I'm very excited about this. We will then start working on a new DVD that will include a live recording of our most popular shorter songs that didn't make it on to "Meet The Flowerkings". We'll try to do: There is More To this World, Church of your Heart, The Flower King, Last Minute on Earth, Retropolis, Train To Nowhere, I Am The Sun, Road To Sanctuary, My Cosmic Lover, Compassion and maybe some medley of other songs. We have so many songs to pick from. It will also contain interviews in english, biographies, photo galleries. Later we will start working on next studio album, we have a bit of a new work approach to this CD, but I can't reveal details yet. In the meantime different bandmembers will be releasing a diversity of solo albums or side projects, like The Tangent 2, Kaipa, Tomas Bodins -Swedish Family, Daniel Gildenlow (Pain Of Salvation) the orchestral CD "BE" and myself will try doing a few things as solo recordings with different cast. We also hope to come to USA and Central America on tour beginning of next year and we really would love to come back to Japan for a few shows. It sure is a busy time for all of us and I guess we are blessed to actually have all these fantastic visions and projects to be realized in our liftime. Roine Stolt July 3rd 2004. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:53
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Do you think the usual meaniningful lyrics associated with prog will fail to get through to the discerning? I think you missed the point. |
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 02:57
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You spent the majority of this thread trying to prove Adam & Eve is
a religious, Biblical album. I proved you wrong. Address this. I don't think that the discerning will have any problem with any of the lyrics, if they truly are discerning. ------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: Geee
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 04:52
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IMO an artist expresses himself with his lyrics so if he thinks that he needs to write about God, Devil or anything else it is fine. Where we (fans) come into the picture is weather we like them or not and buy the music. I think it is up to the artist to see whatever he thinks is right to write about. As it is up to us to listen to what we like. Cheers ------------- "Just as a bell that has been rung cannot be "unrung", the annoying problem with the Truth is that, once you learn it, you can not "unlearn" it." |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 05:56
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the occult and mysticism have always been sprinkled with biblical truths. nothing new, even evangelicals make the mistake of accepting occult/mystic teachings as christianity. ie - The Bible Code which is no more than Jewish kaballah from centuries ago. The christian community quickly grabs hold of these things. youth is probably the most fertile ground and lucifer was the chief musician in heaven before he was cast down for pride. think he is still at work in those who would open themselves(through drugs, alcohol, spiritualism, occult, sexuality, wealth or pride) to his known or unknown guidances or teachings and relate them through a medium he was the master of?
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Posted By: sigod
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 05:58
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This is a tricky nettle to grasp and shows no sign of
getting any easier.
------------- I must remind the right honourable gentleman that a monologue is not a decision. - Clement Atlee, on Winston Churchill |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 08:10
Hi sigod I think the principle difference is that people who are already respectful of others, and generally lead a peaceful existence, sometimes dont like someone 'preaching' at them. Especially when all the preacher is saying, is what should come naturally to all well adjusted individuals anyway, regardless of whether they have faith or not. Its just my opinion, but I think a religous message in music is as much as a turn off for me as a political message. I believe such things are private to the individual, and shouldn't be shouted from the rooftops. The messages on Judas Priest/Slayer albums are incidental to anything and are clearly tonge in cheek. Those who have felt compelled to comit suicide after listerning to such things are clearly not well to start with. One of the reasons I have never invested in anything by Neal Morse is because of his alleged religous slant. I could be missing out on some good music, I guess, I wouldn't know as I'm so turned off and repulsed by religous messages in music. Sorry if thats offensive to anyone.. I have always regarded religious fundametalism as an excuse for violence, grabbing someone elses territory or imposing ones own system on others. Fundamentalism is rife the world over, and is not exclusive to Islam as many Christian or Jewish fundamentalists would have you believe. IMO. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: Jim Prog Wizard
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 14:28
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Art is an expression of the artist. Religious is an incredibly inspirational and powerful thing. Thus, it is hardly surprising that many artists throughout history should feel compelled to paint, write and sing about God. If an artist wants to praise God or any other religious figure (or condemn them, if they so wish) then they are perfectly free to do so. One of the great things about progressive music is that it's (for the most part) all about the art. And the essence of art is the artist saying: "This is what I made, I poured my heart and soul into it, and I'm showing it to the world - like it or loathe it." Therefore, if someone wants to write songs about God, let them. They are doing what they want to do, and if they did otherwise they would be lying to themselves, and what they made would no longer be art. Incidentally, just because a song is religious, doesn't mean the lyrics are automatically dross. Some of Morse's lyrics from "Testimony" and "One" are great. ------------- "Progressive Rock is the ultimate form of music" (Mikael Akerfeldt, 2003) |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 14:39
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By George I think he's got it. |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 15:50
I agree its the artists right to write about whatever he/she wants. It's also my right not to like it! ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 16:21
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Come back Stryper, all is forgiven...
The Spinal Tap of Christian rock |
Posted By: Gaspy Conana
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 16:49
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There are hundreds of bands out there singing about how much they love satan but you don't see anyone complaining about them. Anyway, just let the artists do what they want. This thread is sh*tty. ------------- i no wuts proggeir and u dont so their |
Posted By: Gaston
Date Posted: May 24 2005 at 17:23
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"Stardust are we" is akin to Crowleyism. Ask any occultist. Rob T. Plant will tell you, I think.... Preaching? No. Pain of Salvation's the only one I can think of that comes remotely close. Gaston -------------  
It's the same guy. Great minds think alike. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 11:50
..*singing*.....The rain in Spain falls mainly on the Plain. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 12:11
Que???? |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 12:48
...*singing*........Whatever will be will be..... ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 12:58
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What's your View on this subject Snow dog? |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 13:05
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Well my question is...What meaningful lyrics associated with prog? For example.....the indecipherable ramblings of Jon Anderson? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: May 25 2005 at 13:10
At last the real answer.
|
Posted By: Litl
Date Posted: May 26 2005 at 11:47
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I draw a clear and distinct line between what's religious and what's
spiritual. I love the spiritual in bands like Yes, The Flower
Kings, RPWL, Spock's Beard (Neal, preconversion), etc. To me the
spiritual is a personal experience of the Divine and these bands
express their experience of it. Beautiful. Bring in the religious, however, and the picture changes completely for me. I see religion as a manmade structure within which people are supposed to get an experience of the divine. Sometimes they do but too often I see the religious as totally devoid of the Divine. Too often religions degress into being shaped by political and idealized concerns rather than spiritual ones. The current religious fundamentalism in the US right now is a prime expamle. It is filled with political and moralistic ideals which have nothing to do with anything Christ ever taught, and, often, expresses exactly the opposite. Anything manmade is subject to being flawed, but you can't deny one's own personal experience. I see in this discussion the religious and the spiritual as being referred to as the same thing, and this bothers me. My own personal bias is that I wish for people to have their own personal experience of the Divine and not to assume religions are the only option for this happening. To me there is a world of difference from Snow, where NM is singing about personal transformation, and his post-conversion solo albums where he's singing about 'the Lord' in words and ideas fashioned by someone else. The first feels real to me, the second feels like he isn't thinking for himself anymore. I say let's go with what's real and what we experience for ourselves. (And if you don't agree with me and think the way I do then I'll invade you and destroy you in the name of my god!!! ) |
Posted By: Paradox
Date Posted: May 26 2005 at 12:58
Cough *PMRC* cough |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: June 09 2005 at 21:24
Get yourself a good linctus, to clear your addled brain. Look at the question, then look at the replies to see who is fooling who. |
Posted By: gr8dane
Date Posted: June 09 2005 at 21:32
| If you don't have faith in yourself,I guess you need a god. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: July 08 2005 at 18:07
| No you don't |
Posted By: DallasBryan
Date Posted: July 09 2005 at 16:59
|
gods more into helping your moronic pea brain from
racing straight into hell's flames!
dont disguard your backing!
|
Posted By: Tiresias
Date Posted: July 09 2005 at 18:32
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He didn't write that, Kevin Gilbert, who worked with NDV before Spock's Beard, wrote that. KG produced Beware of Darkness and was going to audition to replace Philly Collins as lead singer of Genesis before he died of autoerotic asphyxiation
------------- Wh'ghal ng'fth mglw'y Ry'leh, Cthulhu fhtagn... 
|
Posted By: barbs
Date Posted: July 10 2005 at 05:43
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Eternity ------------- Eternity |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: July 10 2005 at 06:03
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I think "Holy Mother" refers to another deity: Gaia, the ancient Greek Goddess of the Earth, of which my wife and I are High Priestesses.
And this is a beautiful statue of her. The earth is her pregnant belly, one of her breasts is the moon (even the proportions of earth and moon, or rather belly and breast, are right), her hair is full of plants and animals, and the evolution is carved into her limbs. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: September 08 2005 at 18:58
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Gaia? ooh err. Well what you get up to in your bedrooms is your business. ------------- Call that an argument? That was never an argument. |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: September 08 2005 at 19:04
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Well, if it isn't old Dazo again! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: Man Overboard
Date Posted: September 08 2005 at 22:27
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I was wondering if this guy was gonna come back.
------------- https://soundcloud.com/erin-susan-jennings" rel="nofollow - Bedroom guitarist". Composer, Arranger, Producer. Perfection may not exist, but I may still choose to serve Perfection. Commissions considered. |
Posted By: greenback
Date Posted: September 10 2005 at 23:13
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to answer the question of this thread, no! just listen to the jadis' more than meet the eyes aLBUM: IT IS A very christian album ------------- [HEADPINS - LINE OF FIRE: THE RECORD HAVING THE MOST POWERFUL GUITAR SOUND IN THE WHOLE HISTORY OF MUSIC!> |
Posted By: Dazo
Date Posted: October 27 2005 at 15:20
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MY AVATAR IS DEDICATED TO THE PRIEST. ------------- Call that an argument? That was never an argument. |
Posted By: Eetu Pellonpaa
Date Posted: October 28 2005 at 03:13
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GENESIS "Judas he knows me" |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: October 29 2005 at 13:16
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I am going to make friends here: God and Religion are not just ruining prog , but they are ruining mankind and the whole universe!
------------- let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |
Posted By: tardis
Date Posted: October 29 2005 at 13:38
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If anyone is responsible for ruining anything, it all comes down to one thing, and one thing only: HUMANITY! We are a disease, a virus!! We must be wiped out by bugs from outer space! |
Posted By: floydaholic
Date Posted: October 30 2005 at 22:21
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God ruining prog? What the hell are you talking about? ------------- I'll see you on the Darkside of the moon... |
Posted By: Elta31
Date Posted: October 31 2005 at 16:50
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Posted By: UncleMeat
Date Posted: November 01 2005 at 16:12
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IMHO God has been created by Man, so if God is ruining music, Manking is ruining music. I do not mind religious people as long as they don't bug me. I do not mind religious texts in progrock if the music is ok. One of my favorites in non-prog, Van Morisson, has some religious texts like in "Full Force Gale" that I like very much for its music and the power that the song expresses. ------------- Music Is The Best |
Posted By: FragileDT
Date Posted: November 01 2005 at 19:36
God and religion aren't ruining the world. People that don't know how to express religion are ruining the world. Probably about 90% of the people that say they are religious (Christian/Catholic mainly, aren't.) The bible is just a moralistic book to follow. The morals in the Bible are great and are very insightful to live life by. People like George Bush for example, are religious in their own world, but are not really religious. You can't be religious and want war and spend money to fight as opposed to spending money on poverty. We are not fighting "in the name of God." Also remember that there is corruption in everything. Don't just blame religion, take a look at the reason why it's happening. Religious groups are doing good things the majority of the time. A lot of charity work and activist work is done through religious groups of all types. Sometimes we look at the bad and overlook the good. Also, anybody talk about Genesis? They had a lot of religious references in their songs (Supper's Ready being the most obvious.) ------------- One likes to believe In the freedom of music But glittering prizes And endless Compromises Shatter the illusion Of integrity |