ELP Abaddon's Bolero vs. Toccata
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Topic: ELP Abaddon's Bolero vs. Toccata
Posted By: jammun
Subject: ELP Abaddon's Bolero vs. Toccata
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 15:01
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As long as we're doing ELP polls (this is a good thing), what do you think of these two?
I'll cast the first vote, for Abaddon's. When I heard it live I think I became possessed by some alien force which still inhabits me. The album track does not do it justice. But I do love me a good Toccata. ------------- Can you tell me where we're headin'? Lincoln County Road or Armageddon. |
Replies:
Posted By: seventhsojourn
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 15:14
Toccata 
Abaddon's Bolero
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Posted By: UndercoverBoy
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 15:15
| I like both a lot, but I prefer Tocotta. |
Posted By: questionsneverknown
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 17:18
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Definitely "Toccata." That was one of the songs that really turned me on to ELP. It's easy to forget how really weird and far out they could be sometimes. I have memories of phoning a local radio station in the early 80s that was mostly playing different kinds of underground/alternative/left-of-the-dial music and requesting "Toccata." I could tell they were very, very, very wary about playing ELP, but I bugged enough and they played it. I think the DJs were surprised about how very avant-garde the band could be. I like "Abaddon's Bolero," but it's never featured among my faves. Never heard a live version. ------------- The damage that we do is just so powerfully strong we call it love The damage that we do just goes on and on and on but not long enough. --Robyn Hitchcock |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 17:21
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I'm repeating myself, but Toccata turned me on before I became a full blown prog fan.
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Morningrise
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 20:57
| Tocatta. I don't even like Abaddon's Bolero |
Posted By: The Wrinkler
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 21:10
Toccata. 
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Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 21:35
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Toccata is more dynamic - Bolero meanders on and on and on ------------- 
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 22:23
This. But I haven't heard the Live Abaddon's Bolero (I wonder if it would make me change my mind about this song). |
Morningrise wrote:Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: May 28 2010 at 23:34
| Toccata for the timpanis |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 06:26
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How much I like Toccata, my vote still goes to Abaddon's Bolero, which is one of my favourite ELP tunes. ------------- 
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Posted By: Green Shield Stamp
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 06:32
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Toccata is the second best track on Brain Salad Surgery. Abaddon's Bolero is the worst track on Trilogy. So, no contest! ------------- Haiku Writing a poem With seventeen syllables Is very diffic.... |
Posted By: Adams Bolero
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 06:38
My username may give you a hint to what I voted
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Posted By: progkidjoel
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 06:44
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Gotta be Toccata. ------------- 
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Posted By: Zombywoof
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 09:37
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"Toccata" for me, since I've never cared for "Abaddon's Bolero". However, it would be interesting to hear it live, since I'm basing the comparison on the studio versions. ------------- Continue the prog discussion here: http://zombyprog.proboards.com/index.cgi ... |
Posted By: Zombywoof
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 09:41
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Here's a live "Abaddon's Bolero": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-oVhTOymeA ------------- Continue the prog discussion here: http://zombyprog.proboards.com/index.cgi ... |
Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: May 29 2010 at 12:27
| I'm going with the minority on this one. Ab's Bolero. i've always liked it. It goes well the the title track. I feel Trilogy doesn't get enough credit as an ELP album. |
Posted By: omri
Date Posted: May 30 2010 at 10:26
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Trilogy is my fav ELP album. AB is my second most loved track on the album (after the title track) and I did not even hear the live version. I'm with the minority (again). ------------- omri |
Posted By: b4usleep
Date Posted: May 30 2010 at 11:05
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Toccata. Bolero is a bit boring ------------- Really don't mind if you sit this one out. My words but a whisper, your deafness a shout. |
Posted By: Kojak
Date Posted: May 30 2010 at 12:49
| Bolero for me, as a preference, at the moment. Subject to change, I s'pose, as I am only getting to know these 2 tracks. |
Posted By: The Truth
Date Posted: May 30 2010 at 13:09
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Tocatta because it's not extremely boring to me. ------------- http://blindpoetrecords.bandcamp.com/" rel="nofollow">  
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Posted By: MFP
Date Posted: May 30 2010 at 14:05
| Toccata. My favourite ELP song. |
Posted By: Roj
Date Posted: June 01 2010 at 02:57
| Surely it has to be Toccata. Go for it Carl!! |
Posted By: Cactus Choir
Date Posted: June 01 2010 at 07:25
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Both are fantastic, ELP at their creative and bombastic (hooray!) best. I voted Abaddon's Bolero to make the contest a bit closer.
------------- "And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!" "He's up the pub" |
Posted By: nosmadar
Date Posted: June 01 2010 at 18:18
| Abbadon's Bolero. I'll never forget it, I was eading part of a Keith Laumer story (serialized novel) in Analog magazine about this mysterious funnel cloud that formed somewhere off the coast of Florida in connection with some other events. So as the storm is building and becoming more mysterious...so was the music. :-) |
Posted By: Transperception
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 11:01
| after the contest Abandon's bolero +1 |
Posted By: The Bearded Bard
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 11:02
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Toccata -------------  
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Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 11:10
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both are great, but I've always loved Bolero.
------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow">  The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: Gerinski
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 12:22
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Wow, a poll resurrected after nearly 3 years, how did that come? I voted Toccata, if you want to show someone what the pure essence of Prog-Rock is about you just play them this song and watch their faces
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 18:49
| Toccata is in my top 5 ELP tracks of all time (Top 10 ??) - Bolero is not. Still, not a bad track, but nothing on Toccata. |
Posted By: Larree
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 18:55
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Toccata! And here is a cool cover of Toccata featuring Peter Banks that some of you may not have heard before! ------------- http://larree.ws" rel="nofollow - The Larree (dot) Website |
Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 19:10
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They're both blinding tracks but I voted for Toccata. They seem an odd pairing for the purposes of a poll methinks? i.e. Bolero is the gradual orchestration by installments of a fixed melodic theme lasting 32 bars encompassing 4 key changes which is repeated 8 times. The harmonies are conventionally triad based and the meter and tempo are unchanging throughout Toccata by way of complete contrast, undergoes numerous tempo shifts and a multitude of meter hikes including 6/4, 7/4, 11/8, 11/16, 24/16, 10/16, 5/16, 13/16, 12/16, 3/8, 15/32. It is not really reducible to triadic chords outlining a tonic key centre for any melody as such, but more the exploration and orchestration of intervallic 'motives' as the basis of musical organisation. (Short version - it's real pant filling 'hard' ya dig?) ------------- 
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Posted By: Eria Tarka
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 19:12
| The one thats good |
Posted By: The.Crimson.King
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 19:14
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Toccata...where else can you go when you crave a timpani solo? ------------- https://wytchcrypt.wixsite.com/mutiny-in-jonestown" rel="nofollow - Mutiny in Jonestown : Progressive Rock Since 1987 |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 19:37
 .
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Posted By: zeqexes
Date Posted: April 24 2013 at 20:46
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I find Toccata to be quite annoying in parts, so I voted Abaddon's Bolero, even though it is a little boring ------------- 
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 25 2013 at 01:51
I love the version done by Jap prog band Gerard which blows that version away to be honest Toccata is one of ELP's best tracks. I think this was what ELP were really about but probably Keith and Carl had to persuade Greg to go along with it .I remember seeing a modern arty cartoon some years ago that used Toccata. I vaguely remember this 'little man' being bemused by all these tall buildings springing up around him. I would love to track that down but its probably long disappeared. Abaddons Bolero was composed by Keith Emerson but he asked John Mayer (conductor of the London Symphony Orchestra) to score for an orchestra. Then Emerson did his Walter(Wendy) Carlos thing and replaced all the instrumental parts with synths. When ELP recorded Works Volume One he got the chance to do a 'proper' version of it with the LPO although the recording was never used on Works. Later on it was included on his solo album Changing States . I'm quite fond of it actually but Toccata gets my vote. |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: April 25 2013 at 06:57
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The live version of Toccata on WBMFTTSTNE is brilliant. I quite like AB but find myself wanting to wind it on a bit. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 25 2013 at 14:25
the live version is the one I tend to go for and is the case with the rest of BSS. Its well known that many fans didn't believe that Carl was making most of those sounds . Apparently he could flick a switch with his foot and the synths kicked in
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Posted By: Progosopher
Date Posted: April 25 2013 at 18:54
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Toccata is a great track of course, intense and dynamic, but I am voting for Abaddon's Bolero because I think using it as the closer for Trilogy was a masterstroke. The musicianship is not flashy but it is of high quality - this is above all a composition and it shows off the musicality of the band. The slow build-up is ingenious and it caps a great album off with a great crescendo. This is the way all good boleroes should be. ------------- The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty" |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: April 25 2013 at 18:58
| "Toccata". Just mad. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 26 2013 at 02:02
nice to read a positive comment about it. I always loved that crescendo .. well actually there are two crescendos for the price of one
 Emerson was very good at this sort of thing as evidenced by his tweeking of Mars The Bringer Of War on the ELPowell album. |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 26 2013 at 19:37
For me the thing with Bolero is that whenever I hear it, I just wish I was hearing Ravel's bolero instead. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 27 2013 at 03:02
I can only picture Torvill and Dean though when I hear Ravel's Bolero while AB conjures up dark images of demons rising from hell
 |
Posted By: Svetonio
Date Posted: April 27 2013 at 03:14
| Toccata |
Posted By: ExittheLemming
Date Posted: April 27 2013 at 03:31
Notwitstanding the gauche pun (A Bad Un's Bolero) In a vision in the New Testament Book of Revelation an angel called Abaddon is shown as the king of an army of locusts, which in Greek means the Destroyer i.e someone you would prefer NOT to date yer sister -------------
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: April 28 2013 at 03:32
There used to be a member of an heavy metal band who called himself 'Abaddon'. Can't remember the band but it amused me when I saw him being interviewed on TV. Wasn't that scary
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: April 29 2013 at 20:39
| I guess it would have been really cool if ELP had actually done a cover of Ravel's Bolero... though given that that piece relies on the same melody being played by many different instruments from the orchestra, it might have been way too repetitive. |