ARCTURUS : Prog Metal or Not ?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Polls
Forum Description: Create polls on topics related to progressive music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=929
Printed Date: May 22 2024 at 23:36
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: ARCTURUS : Prog Metal or Not ?
Posted By: M@X
Subject: ARCTURUS : Prog Metal or Not ?
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 08:32
|
ARCTURUS : Prog Metal or Not ? They are labeled as black metal but they release 2 great and creative (progressive) albums:
More info here:
MP3 can be downloaded:
What do you think ? Should they be included in the ARCHIVE or not ?
------------- Prog On ! |
Replies:
Posted By: diddy
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 09:01
|
I don't think they should be included...maybe if someone requests them but I think we have too much bands of this type included in the archieves, Stormcrow even called this site the death/doom Metal archieves or something similar
 hmmm...it's not always easy to please everyone I think... ------------- If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear... George Orwell |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 09:04
|
Anyone got any mp3s?
|
Posted By: M@X
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 09:26
|
I add some mp3 , check in the first post ------------- Prog On ! |
Posted By: The Prognaut
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 14:27
|
M@x: I just finished listening to all three mp3’s of this band, and apart from the keyboard passages exquisitely executed in “Kinetic” and the symphonic punches in “The Chaos Path”; I wouldn’t think of them as prog. In my humble opinion, their music is also kind of hypnotic, lugubrious and clearly influenced by gothic, doom metal trends (I think that if in the end you decide to upload their material to the site, you might as well consider bringing along great proposing bands such as Lacrimosa, Pyogenesis or L´ame immortelle too). Arcturus is great by the way, sometimes unpredictable which is what sort of defines progressive music, but very incoherent too, they decide to go for the metal "head banging" formula rather than the progressive "continuosly changing" one. I voted “No Prog Metal”. Regards, Land ------------- break the circle reset my head wake the sleepwalker and i'll wake the dead |
Posted By: moonchild
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 14:31
|
If progression is defined as musical experimentation with different styles of music, then yes, I would say that Arcturus is progressive metal. ------------- In the Wake of Poseidon |
Posted By: diddy
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 14:31
yes, I listened to the Mp3s as well and my conclusion is similar to Land's...
I found the songs very interesting but not really essential and the prog elements, wich are admittedly existing are to few to call it prog.
I will now vote "No Prog Metal" as well... ------------- If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear... George Orwell |
landberkdoten wrote:Posted By: M@X
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 15:17
|
Thanks for your thoughts guys ! Really helpful ------------- Prog On ! |
Posted By: DoomHammer
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 17:37
As usual Land saves me the time to wright i have both the albums as i am very fond of Doom Metal ------------- when i sell my life story, maybe i should write it first and do the living later 'cause life is so much cleaner on the page |
and i think they ARE doom metal. A lot of doom bands use keyboards, it's a part of their melodic music structure, and they use orchestrations too. Arcturus is one of my favorite Doom Bands, they are not prog 
Posted By: M@X
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 18:16
GREAT : Subject Close !  ------------- Prog On ! |
Posted By: semismart
Date Posted: June 02 2004 at 21:46
|
Well put. Wake up guys! Nobody wrote a book and said this is Progressive Rock and Metal. It just happened. There is no bible, no constitution of Progressive Metal. I say Progressive Rock/Metal is a big all encompassing family with many elements. Who says Arcturus can't be Progressive Black Metal or Black Metal for short ------------- <i>Sports cars</i>, helping ugly men get sex since 1954. |
Posted By: Joren
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 04:22
|
Could someone please define progressive rock? I don't know about them Max, they have elements that most prog bands have: shifting time signatures, diverse influences. But I DON'T LIKE THEIR MUSIC! Sometimes they really sound like Cradle Of Filth or Running Wild! I think you need more to be classified as progressive... Maybe you must show PROGRESSION? Not within the songs, but within the music and the musical history in his completeness. I don't hear any experimental music, I don't hear originality! I find it very uninteresting. But maybe by saying this band is not prog, I also say Dream Theater is not prog... I didn't vote. Sorry, I can't decide |
Posted By: Jim Garten
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 04:45
|
It's difficult to define 'progressive rock' exactly, but I think a large majority of the members here would refer to the classic bands of the late '60s/'70s, and current bands influenced by them. However, when you begin to get into the area of 'progressive metal' the borders become very blurred - many death metal bands use unusual time signatures in long tracks; whilst that may make them progressive in the black/death/doom metal genre, I do not think that makes them progressive rock as far as this forum is concerned. There are, of course exceptions - Opeth, for example; whilst a majority of their output (which you have to admit is quite brutal) would not be listened to by most people on this site, Opeth released the 'Damnation' album, which is pure progressive rock, i.e. this could have been released in the 1970s, and nobody would have batted an eyelid. Dream Theater is another example - whilst their current output is veering more toward heavy metal, their back catalogue contains many albums which are gems of classic progressive rock, showing exactly where their influences lay in the past. Bearing in mind this is only my own humble opinion, I think a majority of people came to this site due to their love of the 60/70s music described above; don't get me wrong, I've nothing against black/death metal whatsoever (I listen to quite a bit of it myself when the mood takes me), it's just that I do not think progression within that particular genre automatically gives an inroad to this forum be it regarding mp3s or discussion threads (there, I've said it! ). This may seem to be an elitist stance, and I'm sorry if it comes over that way, but as I said before, this is only my opinion.....  but for evidence, look at the top 10 bands looked at on the forum..... no prog-metal there (Dream theater, OK, but I've covered their appeal to prog-holes above). I shall now sit back and await the brickbats, arrows, bullets and hand-grenades of disagreement.... -------------  Jon Lord 1941 - 2012 |
Posted By: diddy
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 07:30
...why? I agree
I alsways said that Opeth should be included because they have a lot of 70' influences, work together with Steven Wilson and of course released a PURE prog album wich many of you know. And I'm against adding bands like "Death" or "Therion" because they really fit into the above said, progression WITHIN their genre.
But you have to agree that it is maybe impossible for Max to please everyone here...there may be many people that like to have such bands included...
It's not always easy  ------------- If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear... George Orwell |
Posted By: M@X
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 07:47
Thanks for your support Diddy  ------------- Prog On ! |
Posted By: diddy
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 07:58
my pleasure ------------- If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear... George Orwell |
Posted By: Certif1ed
Date Posted: June 03 2004 at 09:12
|
I've always been partial to the heavier/darker side, having been a Metallica fan since 1983 (but stopped after the dreadful "Load"). Just about every "prog metal" band I hear owes a huge debt to Metallica, IMO, particularly "Master Of Puppets" and "...Justice For All", and Arcturus are no exception. I think that Metallica should deserve an honourary place in the archives In this music, I hear very interesting experimentation with many different textures and sounds - it's a pity the piano is limited to arpeggiated runs in a kind of guitar solo imitation - arpeggios and scales do not really indicate classical leanings, whatever the pretensions! It's also interesting that they drop from metal to breakbeat in places and make a conscious effort to go through different styles - mostly within the metal genre - with more than a nod and wink towards Celtic Frost (prog metal Godz!!). However, for me, this music still falls within the umbrella terms of Metal, even given the clarity of the vocals, which remind me of some of the New Romantic bands of the eighties, particularly the singer of Dead or Alive ("You Spin Me Round Like A Record"). The last point I would like to make (hopefully without upsetting anyone!) is that prog tends to have a "mature" sound and feel to it - consider the very young Genesis who produced "Trespass", or Marillion's "Script...". Arcturus sound like they could very well mature into a force to be reckoned with - but I do not think it is there just yet. I find that the structuring is a bit on the haphazard side and some of the riffs seem to be an afterthought rather than a logical continuation. So, sorry, Max - a vote against from me, I'm afraid. Thanks for the mp3s though - I do think the music's great despite my critical shredding!! |
Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 14:30
|
This is an interesting thread. I have found out two things about people's opinions towards Arcturus that I would have never expected: 1) Everyone either thinks they are a Doom Metal group, or a Black/Death Metal group. 2)People think they've released two prog albums, they had released at least four by the year 2004, not counting EP's. Fortunately, it is good to see that the values of what is progressive have changed in this website, however, a lot of work still should be done. For example, My Dying Bride have been rejected without a single sign of doubt! -- Ivan ------------- sig |
Posted By: Time-Machinist
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 14:38
| I see them (at least) as prog related. They definitely are not "non-prog". |
Posted By: Atkingani
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 15:01
|
Two things:
------------- Guigo ~~~~~~ |
Posted By: Rising Force
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 15:26
| Well their album covers are proggy enough. |
Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 16:10
|
-- Ivan ------------- sig |
Posted By: AtLossForWords
Date Posted: April 07 2006 at 16:22
I agree with almost everything you've said here. Metallica did some great compositions like Call of Ktulu, To Live is to Die, and even My Friend of Misery show quite a bit of creativity and skill. Metallica is a huge part of the metal influence on progressive metal bands like Dream Theater, Symphony X, and etc. (I'm not saying Symphony X is a quintessential progressive metal band). As for an honorary place in the archives I am undecided. The reason being is what do we do with other metal bands like Megadeth or Testament which had influence on progressive metal bands, but don't cut it as progressive. Many would argue if Metallica deserves a place in the archives, Megadeth does as well. Turning Prog Archives into Thrash Metal Progressive Metal Influences Archives is not something we need here. There are some interesting guitar textures here, but so many other bands have attempted this. The distinction would need to be whether or not Arcturus does it any better. At The Gates experimented with guitar sounds all the time with songs like The Flames of the End, but there is nothing progressive about them. Dark Tranquillity has always experimented with guitar and now keyboard sounds. Martin Brandstrom has become an integral part of the band with his keyboard work on Haven and Damage Done. If Arcturus is in the archives Dark Tranquillity should definately be considered for their Projector- Damage Done era. They like Arcturus have non-progressive matierial as well. Arcturus is doesn't seem to have all that evident progressive influences to me. They may just be a good metal band. I will vote no as well. Arcuturs comes close, but they don't seem to cut it. There isn't enough to distinguish them from other good metal bands.
-------------   "Mastodon sucks giant monkey balls." |