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progrockdeepcuts
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 14 2013
Location: West Virginia
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Points: 394
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Topic: Lima Regional Semi-Final 1: Genesis v. Renaissance Posted: December 29 2014 at 22:43 |
Giving Renaissance a boost!
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Listen to older shows here: mixcloud.com/progrockdeepcuts/
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19535
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Posted: December 27 2014 at 11:23 |
Wow, this is a massacre
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addictedtoprog
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 16 2014
Location: india
Status: Offline
Points: 1422
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Posted: December 27 2014 at 04:09 |
Genesis
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danyboy
Forum Newbie
Joined: October 29 2014
Location: Norway
Status: Offline
Points: 28
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Posted: December 27 2014 at 02:45 |
Love renaissance but Genesis :)
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qwiksand
Forum Groupie
Joined: December 01 2013
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 45
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Posted: December 26 2014 at 10:17 |
Genesis!
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kenethlevine
Special Collaborator
Prog-Folk Team
Joined: December 06 2006
Location: New England
Status: Offline
Points: 8869
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Posted: December 26 2014 at 09:19 |
rogerthat wrote:
Their pungent humour is one of the main things I like about ELP. |
They do stink I'll give you that
But back on topic, I voted for Renaissance easily. GENESIS has always been hit and miss for me. Even my favorite album by them, SEBTP, has "Battle of Epping Forest"
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Argonaught
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 04 2012
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 1413
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Posted: December 26 2014 at 05:39 |
Oops! Poor Renaissance got steamrolled. What a shame
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fudgenuts64
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 17 2013
Location: NY
Status: Offline
Points: 470
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Posted: December 26 2014 at 03:41 |
My two favorite bands ever! Giving sympathy vote to Renaissance.
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 23 2014 at 02:29 |
Rick Robson wrote:
Moogtron III wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Is there really so much hatred against ELP? I just checked the most recent ELP thread, the one with the ELP-Camel poll, and there I didn't see a lot of hate. It's true though that ELP doesn't stand up in popularity compared to the other bands of the so called 'big six'. That is totally undeserved, and I feel sorry that the first and only ELP album to appear in PA's top 100 is only at nr. 81. |
Interesting data Moogtron,tbh I have never checked it out, and thanks to your info I think I never will, anyway I guess it's an unpersonal top list isn't it? |
Well, yes, that is of course true. It's just a lot of ratings being put in a machine full of algorithms, and what counts is your own personal list, which stands out for you no matter what the crowd says. But... I still don't like it
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 23 2014 at 02:24 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Moogtron III wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Is there really so much hatred against ELP? I just checked the most recent ELP thread, the one with the ELP-Camel poll, and there I didn't see a lot of hate. It's true though that ELP doesn't stand up in popularity compared to the other bands of the so called 'big six'. That is totally undeserved, and I feel sorry that the first and only ELP album to appear in PA's top 100 is only at nr. 81. |
Recently ELP is mostly ignored, but specially in the early days, back in 2004 and 2005, the hatred was more than evident.
People could talk trash about ELP and was OK, some of us mentioned we didn't liked (c)rap or Punk, and we were called "enemies of music", "Arrogant b@st@rds", "self indulgent", etc
And believe me I'M NOT REMOTELY AN ELP FAN, except for Trilogy and BSS, care very little for the rest of their albums, neither I consider Emerson the non plus ultra, always said that Vittorio Nocenzi and Patrick Moraz were light years beyond Emerson or Wakeman in technique.
Believe me, this was the only Prog forum in which was ok to trash ELP but it was a sin to say that pro terrorist like Immortal Technique was crap.
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I understand, so it was a big thing in the earlier days of ProgArchives, bashing ELP. Now that you say it, I vaguely remember from my early days at PA that some people did a lot of work for defending ELP. Maybe things are turning for the better now, with de apparent decline of fanboyism on PA, but then again, ignoring ELP is also sad. Myself, I love ELP for some early albums and respect them for all their music till Works 1.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 23:41 |
Their pungent humour is one of the main things I like about ELP.
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Polymorphia
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 06 2012
Location: here
Status: Offline
Points: 8856
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 22:10 |
Rick Robson wrote:
Polymorphia wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Bands like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd and Tull, can only be beaten by one of them
Probably Genesis and Yes can only be beaten by Genesis and yes.
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred | Probably because this forum has more younger members than most prog sites. ELP tends not to resonate with the younger crowd.
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I don't want to turn this thread into another out of topic issue, but if you are right then I can't get the younger crowd point - in the polls I see they tend to resonate with KC, Yes, VdGG etc., but why not with ELP? |
KC, Yes, and VdGG never made anything like "Hoedown." Before even knowing ELP was a widely recognized group I checked out their music and felt the same way I do know. I've tried to get into it several times after that, already being into Yes, Can, King Crimson, Magma, etc. I don't even care that they don't have guitar. The frequency range is limited, but Keith Emerson is a fantastic keyboardist. I find most of my qualms with ELP in the lyrics, the cover art, the renditions of classical music, etc. What ELP had that the other bands above didn't was a pungent sense of humor. One that makes me die a little inside, but that older folks tend to enjoy more. They are not harder on the ears, they are harder on the gut. They are technically very good, but their entire aesthetic is one that I can't really connect to. But I can't speak for other young people and I probably shouldn't have said anything, but I usually feel my disconnect with ELP is mainly because of a generation gap.
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Dellinger
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: June 18 2009
Location: Mexico
Status: Offline
Points: 12612
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 21:42 |
I actually do like ELP very much, but somehow I'm OK with their highest rating album being at 81 or whatever. Mainlhy because I myself don't consider any of their albums to be perfect 5 star albums... they always have some really wonderful music, but they also have enough music that I don't care about, or even rather dislike, to make me like any album as a whole (actually, Genesis suffers from the same thing for me, though at a lesser extent).
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19535
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 19:01 |
Moogtron III wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Is there really so much hatred against ELP? I just checked the most recent ELP thread, the one with the ELP-Camel poll, and there I didn't see a lot of hate. It's true though that ELP doesn't stand up in popularity compared to the other bands of the so called 'big six'. That is totally undeserved, and I feel sorry that the first and only ELP album to appear in PA's top 100 is only at nr. 81. |
Recently ELP is mostly ignored, but specially in the early days, back in 2004 and 2005, the hatred was more than evident.
People could talk trash about ELP and was OK, some of us mentioned we didn't liked (c)rap or Punk, and we were called "enemies of music", "Arrogant b@st@rds", "self indulgent", etc
And believe me I'M NOT REMOTELY AN ELP FAN, except for Trilogy and BSS, care very little for the rest of their albums, neither I consider Emerson the non plus ultra, always said that Vittorio Nocenzi and Patrick Moraz were light years beyond Emerson or Wakeman in technique.
Believe me, this was the only Prog forum in which was ok to trash ELP but it was a sin to say that pro terrorist like Immortal Technique was crap.
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46828
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 17:32 |
because they have had pounded in their young little heads that ELP sucks.. ain't cool.. and face it. ELP really is NOT easy listening. We know full well that many of our world views, and obviously music world views can be shaped by the sh*t that gets pounded into our heads by society. Besides unlike the sugar-coated easy listening of many groups. ELP can be a bit challenging. It is as much a curse to current popularity as it was to their immense popularity back in the day when listeners wanted to be challenged and see bands do something different.
The root of it IMO is most people simply WOULD rather listen to guitarists w**king than keyboardists.. the other reason ELP got away with it was Emerson was able to do it on shear quantity of talent alone. Didn't he win best keyboardist like 25 times in a 30 year span or some crazy like that. He was, for lack of better description, the Hendrix of the keyboard. He totally blew apart the book of keyboard playing and opened the door for generations of keyboard players, both in technique and more importantly.. as centerpieces of a band's sound rather than just a supporting or background instrument.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Rick Robson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 03 2013
Location: Rio de Janeiro
Status: Offline
Points: 1607
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 17:23 |
Polymorphia wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Bands like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd and Tull, can only be beaten by one of them
Probably Genesis and Yes can only be beaten by Genesis and yes.
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred | Probably because this forum has more younger members than most prog sites. ELP tends not to resonate with the younger crowd.
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I don't want to turn this thread into another out of topic issue, but if you are right then I can't get the younger crowd point - in the polls I see they tend to resonate with KC, Yes, VdGG etc., but why not with ELP?
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"Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy." LvB
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Rick Robson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 03 2013
Location: Rio de Janeiro
Status: Offline
Points: 1607
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 17:22 |
Moogtron III wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Is there really so much hatred against ELP? I just checked the most recent ELP thread, the one with the ELP-Camel poll, and there I didn't see a lot of hate. It's true though that ELP doesn't stand up in popularity compared to the other bands of the so called 'big six'. That is totally undeserved, and I feel sorry that the first and only ELP album to appear in PA's top 100 is only at nr. 81. |
Interesting data Moogtron,tbh I have never checked it out, and thanks to your info I think I never will, anyway I guess it's an unpersonal top list isn't it?
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"Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy." LvB
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Argonaught
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 04 2012
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 1413
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 17:20 |
Polymorphia wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred | Probably because this forum has more younger members than most prog sites. ELP tends not to resonate with the younger crowd. |
Lack of broad acceptance is not necessarily hatred. I do not hate ELP; I have most of their albums, but the only one I listen to regularly is the Works Vol. 2. Should this be construed as hatred?
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Polymorphia
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 06 2012
Location: here
Status: Offline
Points: 8856
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 15:28 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
Bands like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd and Tull, can only be beaten by one of them
Probably Genesis and Yes can only be beaten by Genesis and yes.
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Probably because this forum has more younger members than most prog sites. ELP tends not to resonate with the younger crowd.
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 22 2014 at 15:20 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
This is the only Forum in which ELP has always received hatred |
Is there really so much hatred against ELP? I just checked the most recent ELP thread, the one with the ELP-Camel poll, and there I didn't see a lot of hate. It's true though that ELP doesn't stand up in popularity compared to the other bands of the so called 'big six'. That is totally undeserved, and I feel sorry that the first and only ELP album to appear in PA's top 100 is only at nr. 81.
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