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QuoteReplyTopic: AOR and why I don't like it. Posted: March 26 2020 at 03:48
Icarium wrote:
the best AoR record is perhaps Hotel California, imo or Toto IV
I'll go with SoS! Such a throwback in the age of New Wave.
Dire Straits may have been an AOR group with "Money For Nothing" but "Sultans" was an anti AOR song!
Edited by SteveG - March 26 2020 at 04:22
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
Funny that no one posting (mostly from the US) mentioned the other A word that is used in this context - 'American' . For those from the UK this was music that was peculiarly a United States style of music and epitomised by Foreigner , Toto, Kansas , Boston and eventually by Styx and the utterly dreadful Reo Speedwagon. I'm not trying to be xenophobic about this ( I don't need to try lol) but it did seem like 1% inspiration and 99% drivel. Another explanation for its existence I've heard is that the massive stadium acts like ELP, Genesis , Floyd and Yes stopped touring and something had to take its place. It was radio driven but that was less obvious to us here as we didn't listen to US radio! That said I can list at least half a dozen so called AOR songs that I love. Perhaps the earliest might be Chicago 25 or 6 to 4. Of course its an incredibly cool track that's not really considered 'AOR' but I think of it as very early example of what was coming. Stuff like Carry On Wayward Song and More Than A Feeling is also great even though the formula is emerging and becoming more obvious. I will also admit I have a massive soft spot for Toto -Africa . That was such a deceptively delightful record if ever there was one.
Out of the bands I mentioned Foreigner was half american and Def Leppard were from the UK. The others I admit were from the US.
Also, Genesis were not a stadium act in the 70's in the US. They were barely an arena band. ELP and Yes rarely played actual stadiums(when Yes did it was with other bands). Maybe arenas(there is a difference)and PF were just starting to by the time Animals came out but also mostly just played arenas. Genesis were doing smaller theaters and didn't even start to do arenas until right before SH left. They didn't do stadiums until the 80's.
I should just have said large arenas or something like that. Of course Stadiums were mainly for sport and not bands and I guess also had (and still have) non existent acoustics.
Genesis , yes was a bad example , Led Zep and Sabbath were better more obvious examples.
I was aware there was an English connection with Foreigner ( the name is a giveaway). I never thought of Def Leppard as AOR but rather soft metal but then its quite a fine dividing line between the two things!
While not even close to my favorite style of music, there are some artists and songs that i find irresistible.
One of the strongest aspects of this style of music are vocalists ability to be the focus of the music and of course the melody has to be strong. I've always considered neo-prog to be the AOR of prog whether that's a realistic comparison or not
Well, I like one song form the list. Africa by Toto. It's kind of like prog lite.
The only one I like too. AOR is slightly more bearable than mid 80s glam metal and between them, they pretty much killed off rock. If I wanted melodies with strong vocals, I would much rather listen to sophisto pop. ZZ Top had the one very blues rock based album, sort of their Back In Black. I forget the name but that one I like because it sounds nothing like Journey, Boston, Foreigner, Rainbow after Dio left.
Don't get worked up. I don't think that anyone here is militantly against AOR as it's has a lot of crossover appeal with prog fans and is quite popular. I'm only stating why I don't care for it, while shedding some light on the AOR confusion.
Hi,
My biggest issue with it ... is the blatant and over abundant repetition of the same things over and over and over and over ... and my concern is that people get acclimated to those "sounds" and when they hear something new on a "progressive" board, it won't click and they won't like it ... and I've seen this way too many times ... and one example, was kinda sad and pathetic ... playing Ozric Tentacles and the guy really liking the music, but 2 minutes into it ... where's the lyrics? ... and he tuned out ... completely, I mean!
The conditioning hurts the ability to hear new things ... and I'm not sure that this is one of the issues with some new folks here looking for something "like this" or "like that" ... so they can hear something they are "familiar" with ... that is hurting their ability to other kinds of music ... rock music alone, has showed in 50 years that its flexibility is incredible and gone many places ... but in AoR places ... there is no "flexibility" ....
SIDEBAR: IF you sit down and write 20 songs in a row, they all probably have the same distributor for the material ... guess what? You are being "programmed" into thinking that is all the music that is good so you will buy those records! And the length of the cuts is definitely limited, which automatically cuts out many bands!
Edited by moshkito - March 23 2020 at 10:27
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
Have no problem with AOR,but I do have a problem with radio playing the same 3 songs, from each from AOR band.Pretty much stopped listening to radio because of that.Got plenty of it on my I-Pod,so I just shuffle through my AOR playlist.Hey presto, my own perfect AOR radio station without the repeats, ads,DJs yakking.
Same works for other genres I like.
That would work for me as well. If these songs weren't played to death on the radio then I could live a lot easier with AOR.
Edited by SteveG - March 23 2020 at 10:21
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
It seems that the Album Oriented Rock actually meant in the early 70's about Prog bands and assimilated, and the North American FM radios often played big chunks of albums, sometimes a fill side. This wasn't financially viable for private radio stations, which didn't have many commercial spots to air between 9 or 15 minute tracks.
However, the AOR concept changed in the mid-70's, when Adult Oriented Radios (FM stations, going to compete with AM stations) chose singles and commercial tracks lasting between 3 and five minutes from rock albums (and their singles) and thus being able to insert much more add slots
Thus, you'll understand that I generally like Album OR, but dislike Adult O Radio
Unfortunately, this is the popular misconception of AOR as Adult Oriented Rock. It's not a business term that was ever used by either the record industry or FM radio stations in the 70s. This a concept that appeared in the late 80s and has no bearing on AlbumOrientedRock, which is what my post is about, exclusively.
As an aside, adult oriented rock listening also includes groups like the Carpenters and The Monkees. I didn't know that you were a fan.
The AOR I speak of also has been named FM rock (and even Corporate Rock, and sometimes Yacht Rock), but not MOR (Middle Of the Road, which more of an Easy-Listening wist)
But frontiers are blurry and arbitrary. Why has Aerosmith never been considered AOR (or BÖC with their Agents, Spectres and Mirrors trilogy, for that matter), while Boston and Kansas are cited as prime examples of it?
Areosmith are considered AOR. But that use of the initialism this time around is something cooked up sometime time in 90s, by the music press, as ArenaOrientedRock. A way to dodge the pop singles tag associated with AOR in the 80s. Crazy, isn't it?
Back then, A'smith and early BÖC were probably not really addressing adults, but growing-up eens.
Just a guess
But they weren't sugary pop and also did appeal to late teens and early adults.
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
Have no problem with AOR,but I do have a problem with radio playing the same 3 songs, from each from AOR band.Pretty much stopped listening to radio because of that.Got plenty of it on my I-Pod,so I just shuffle through my AOR playlist.Hey presto, my own perfect AOR radio station without the repeats, ads,DJs yakking.
It seems that the Album Oriented Rock actually meant in the early 70's about Prog bands and assimilated, and the North American FM radios often played big chunks of albums, sometimes a fill side. This wasn't financially viable for private radio stations, which didn't have many commercial spots to air between 9 or 15 minute tracks.
However, the AOR concept changed in the mid-70's, when Adult Oriented Radios (FM stations, going to compete with AM stations) chose singles and commercial tracks lasting between 3 and five minutes from rock albums (and their singles) and thus being able to insert much more add slots
Thus, you'll understand that I generally like Album OR, but dislike Adult O Radio
Unfortunately, this is the popular misconception of AOR as Adult Oriented Rock. It's not a business term that was ever used by either the record industry or FM radio stations in the 70s. This a concept that appeared in the late 80s and has no bearing on AlbumOrientedRock, which is what my post is about, exclusively.
As an aside, adult oriented rock listening also includes groups like the Carpenters and The Monkees. I didn't know that you were a fan.
The AOR I speak of also has been named FM rock (and even Corporate Rock, and sometimes Yacht Rock), but not MOR (Middle Of the Road, which more of an Easy-Listening wist)
But frontiers are blurry and arbitrary. Why has Aerosmith never been considered AOR (or BÖC with their Agents, Spectres and Mirrors trilogy, for that matter), while Boston and Kansas are cited as prime examples of it?
Areosmith are considered AOR. But that use of the initialism this time around is something cooked up sometime time in 90s, by the music press, as ArenaOrientedRock. A way to dodge the pop singles tag associated with AOR in the 80s. Crazy, isn't it?
Back then, A'smith and early BÖC were probably not really addressing adults, but growing-up eens.
Don't get worked up. I don't think that anyone here is militantly against AOR as it's has a lot of crossover appeal with prog fans and is quite popular. I'm only stating why I don't care for it, while shedding some light on the AOR confusion.
Edited by SteveG - March 23 2020 at 07:12
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
I don't know why so many are against this style of music. The focus is on a strong vocalist as well as a really sick melody that's often accompanied by some really great musicianship. Sure there are plenty of awful examples like Celine Dion or but can anyone honestly say that the following examples which are considered AOR in the sense of Adult Oriented Rock doesn't have some excellent musicianship? I don't think so.
Asia and Planet P are actually here on PA. Neo-prog has borrowed a lot of its slick production and vocal styles not only from 70s symphonic prog but from the AOR of the 80s as well.
It seems that the Album Oriented Rock actually meant in the early 70's about Prog bands and assimilated, and the North American FM radios often played big chunks of albums, sometimes a fill side. This wasn't financially viable for private radio stations, which didn't have many commercial spots to air between 9 or 15 minute tracks.
However, the AOR concept changed in the mid-70's, when Adult Oriented Radios (FM stations, going to compete with AM stations) chose singles and commercial tracks lasting between 3 and five minutes from rock albums (and their singles) and thus being able to insert much more add slots
Thus, you'll understand that I generally like Album OR, but dislike Adult O Radio
Unfortunately, this is the popular misconception of AOR as Adult Oriented Rock. It's not a business term that was ever used by either the record industry or FM radio stations in the 70s. This a concept that appeared in the late 80s and has no bearing on AlbumOrientedRock, which is what my post is about, exclusively.
As an aside, adult oriented rock listening also includes groups like the Carpenters and The Monkees. I didn't know that you were a fan.
The AOR I speak of also has been named FM rock (and even Coroporate Rock, and sometimes Yacvht Rock), but not MOR (Middle Of the Road, which more of an Easy-Listening wist)
But frontiers are blurry and arbitrary. Why has Aerosmith never been considered AOR (or BÖC with their Agents, Spectres and Mirrors trilogy, for that matter), while Boston and Kansas are cited as prime examples of it?
Areosmith are considered AOR. But that use of the initialism this time around is something cooked up sometime time in 90s, by the music press, as ArenaOrientedRock. A way to dodge the pop singles tag associated with AOR in the 80s. Crazy, isn't it?
Edited by SteveG - March 23 2020 at 05:09
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
It seems that the Album Oriented Rock actually meant in the early 70's about Prog bands and assimilated, and the North American FM radios often played big chunks of albums, sometimes a fill side. This wasn't financially viable for private radio stations, which didn't have many commercial spots to air between 9 or 15 minute tracks.
However, the AOR concept changed in the mid-70's, when Adult Oriented Radios (FM stations, going to compete with AM stations) chose singles and commercial tracks lasting between 3 and five minutes from rock albums (and their singles) and thus being able to insert much more add slots
Thus, you'll understand that I generally like Album OR, but dislike Adult O Radio
Unfortunately, this is the popular misconception of AOR as Adult Oriented Rock. It's not a business term that was ever used by either the record industry or FM radio stations in the 70s. This a concept that appeared in the late 80s and has no bearing on AlbumOrientedRock, which is what my post is about, exclusively.
As an aside, adult oriented rock listening also includes groups like the Carpenters and The Monkees. I didn't know that you were a fan.
The AOR I speak of also has been named FM rock (and even Coroporate Rock, and sometimes Yacvht Rock), but not MOR (Middle Of the Road, which more of an Easy-Listening wist)
But frontiers are blurry and arbitrary. Why has Aerosmith never been considered AOR (or BÖC with their Agents, Spectres and Mirrors trilogy, for that matter), while Boston and Kansas are cited as prime examples of it?
^ prog is king but sometimes simple catchy tunes are just fun!
That's why i love all the pop shlop like bubblegum, euro-disco, new
wave, synthpop etc :)
You might like this:
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
^ prog is king but sometimes simple catchy tunes are just fun!
That's why i love all the pop shlop like bubblegum, euro-disco, new
wave, synthpop etc :)
I hate the commercial
aspect of much of that music but no denying that bands like Jethro Tull
and Beatles were commercialized to death as well.
Site has gotten buggy AF today grrr
Oh, I have a pop sweet tooth. I love older stuff like Odessey and Oracle from the Zombies and Pet Sounds form the BBs, so, to each his own. I even like Daydream Believer from the Monkees.
Edited by SteveG - March 20 2020 at 09:34
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
Funny that no one posting (mostly from the US) mentioned the other A word that is used in this context - 'American' . For those from the UK this was music that was peculiarly a United States style of music and epitomised by Foreigner , Toto, Kansas , Boston and eventually by Styx and the utterly dreadful Reo Speedwagon. I'm not trying to be xenophobic about this ( I don't need to try lol) but it did seem like 1% inspiration and 99% drivel. Another explanation for its existence I've heard is that the massive stadium acts like ELP, Genesis , Floyd and Yes stopped touring and something had to take its place. It was radio driven but that was less obvious to us here as we didn't listen to US radio! That said I can list at least half a dozen so called AOR songs that I love. Perhaps the earliest might be Chicago 25 or 6 to 4. Of course its an incredibly cool track that's not really considered 'AOR' but I think of it as very early example of what was coming. Stuff like Carry On Wayward Song and More Than A Feeling is also great even though the formula is emerging and becoming more obvious. I will also admit I have a massive soft spot for Toto -Africa . That was such a deceptively delightful record if ever there was one.
Out of the bands I mentioned Foreigner was half american and Def Leppard were from the UK. The others I admit were from the US.
Also, Genesis were not a stadium act in the 70's in the US. They were barely an arena band. ELP and Yes rarely played actual stadiums(when Yes did it was with other bands). Maybe arenas(there is a difference)and PF were just starting to by the time Animals came out but also mostly just played arenas. Genesis were doing smaller theaters and didn't even start to do arenas until right before SH left. They didn't do stadiums until the 80's.
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - March 20 2020 at 09:36
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Icarium wrote:
