The Christian Thread

dr wu23 wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: dr wu23 wrote: When I get a chance I'll read your blog posts but imho that's interpretive and to me not 'political' in the sense we mean today as I mentioned above. To me he was anti-political or maybe a-political. Here's the problem with that view: crucifixion was reserved for enemies of the empire.  For insurgents.  Revolutionaries.  Rebels.  To illustrate this, you need to look into other "messiah" figures around the time of Jesus.  There was another messiah figure named Jesus ben Ananias (the Jesus we usually talk about was Jesus ben Joseph), and this Jesus went around prophesying Jerusalem's destruction, and he was whipped and then released as nothing but a lunatic.  Something about Jesus ben Joseph made him a bit more dangerous to the empire, or they would not have crucified him. Simply because Jesus' enemies saw him as political does not mean he saw himself that way and I would argue he did not and was on a personal spiritual mission /quest  that just happened to conflich with secular politics. I believe he was a-political but those who did not understand his spiritual mission did not understand that and saw him as a threat on a secular level. To me it depends on how one 'sees' what his mission was. If he had been truly political himself he would have led a physical revolt or ran for  what was considered a public office back then...but he did not.

Jesus was political in that he did present the gospel as a political message; "gospel" (or "evangelium" in Latin) was actually a commonly used word in that culture; literally meaning "good news" it most commonly denoted a message from a political leader when he gained a new territory, basically saying, "there's a new boss in town and things are changing."  Thus all the talk about the "kingdom of God" in the gospels; Jesus was inaugurating his kingdom.  The gospel was politically subversive because it was telling people "don't trust in Caesar, trust in Christ who is coming to make things new."

Jesus wasn't political in the sense that we often think about it, though; it would be more accurate to say that his political message transcends earthly politics.  It's a call to stop trusting earthly politicians and to trust in Him.  His nation is the Church (1 Peter 2:9) and he didn't come to tell us who to vote for or what opinions to have in earthly politics.  We're never forbidden in Scripture from engaging in politics but we should not trust in it.  The kingdom of God is built on the cornerstone of Christ, who washed us clean with His blood and invites us into his family with His Word.  This kingdom comes by grace, though faith, in the Word and Sacraments administered in the church.  As members of God's kingdom, Christians are called to live out our calling by loving one another and serving others.   The kingdom of God will finally come fully when Christ returns to make all things new.

dtguitarfan wrote: dr wu23 wrote: When I get a chance I'll read your blog posts but imho that's interpretive and to me not 'political' in the sense we mean today as I mentioned above. To me he was anti-political or maybe a-political. Here's the problem with that view: crucifixion was reserved for enemies of the empire.  For insurgents.  Revolutionaries.  Rebels.  To illustrate this, you need to look into other "messiah" figures around the time of Jesus.  There was another messiah figure named Jesus ben Ananias (the Jesus we usually talk about was Jesus ben Joseph), and this Jesus went around prophesying Jerusalem's destruction, and he was whipped and then released as nothing but a lunatic.  Something about Jesus ben Joseph made him a bit more dangerous to the empire, or they would not have crucified him.

dtguitarfan wrote: dr wu23 wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: timothy leary wrote: I also like how when management asked you to leave political agendas at the door you ignored the request. Jesus was political.  Some people not liking his politics does not change that. How exactly was Jesus 'political'..? I have written two blog posts in defense of this - this one tracks the theme of social justice through the Bible to Jesus, and this one demonstrates how Jesus used subversive political language in the Lord's Prayer.  I plan on writing a few more like this to demonstrate how other passages use subversive political language.  It's all throughout Paul's writings.

When I get a chance I'll read your blog posts but imho that's interpretive and to me not 'political' in the sense we mean today as I mentioned above. To me he was anti-political or maybe a-political.

Edited by dr wu23 - October 14 2013 at 10:46

dr wu23 wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: timothy leary wrote: <SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; COLOR: ; LINE-HEIGHT: 18px">I also like how when management asked you to leave political agendas at the door you ignored the request.</SPAN> Jesus was political.  Some people not liking his politics does not change that. How exactly was Jesus 'political'..?

"My kingdom is not of this world" (John 18:36)

"Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's" (Matthew 21:21)

These two quotes illustrate Jesus' "politics" in a nutshell.

Edited by someone_else - October 14 2013 at 06:33

dtguitarfan wrote: timothy leary wrote: I also like how when management asked you to leave political agendas at the door you ignored the request. Jesus was political.  Some people not liking his politics does not change that.

let me know when the bible is in shutdown.

I especially like this part of your blog post"In this prayer, Jesus teaches us that being in touch with the spirit of God means to desire to be free from attitudes that would lead us to accuse and slander others.  And love does that - love avoids accusation and slander, which cause conflict.  "

This post might be going viral - I'm almost to 600 views on it just from posting this morning: The Lord's Prayer: A Politically Subversive Message.

I'm praying for you buddy.

dtguitarfan wrote: You just choose to be so violently opposed to any form of authority