2nd Round Portland Bracket: ELP v. Camel

rogerthat wrote: Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Stool Man wrote: Camel didn't make Love Beach. Neither Trilogy or Brain Salad Surgery. Only the ones who take the risk can ruin an album. Playing Pictures at an Exhibition before a myriad of hippies who didn't even knew who Mussorgsky was, is a risk Camel always played safe with soporiferous albums. I can only listen Moonmadness without feeling an urge to go to sleep . Iván Kind of sums up my views, though I probably like Mirage more than any ELP album.  Even Mirage was heavily derivative of a lot of Canterbury.

I still haven't voted yet, BTW...

kenethlevine wrote: Kati wrote: kenethlevine wrote: Friday13th wrote: VDGG and Renaissance too...but nah, lacking a killer guitarist is never a plus. while Renaissance didn't have a killer guitarist, at least they always had a full time guitarist, even if he only played acoustic guitar for most of his tenure.  I and my colleague ClemofNazareth might be in the minority, but we both rated "A Song for all Seasons" as their best, and part of that had to do with the lead guitar presence.  A permanent guitarist without any input is not interesting to me, for instance even Alice Cooper who is a rock metal band not prog, had two guitarists playing at the same time, good ones.  big hug I love acoustic guitar, and to me there's a world of difference between having no guitarist and having just an acoustic guitarist.  Dunford's acoustic guitar was an integral part of Renaissance classics like "Black Flame" and "Carpet of the Sun", even if it was not the primary instrument.  But yeah it got better when they started using lead, and two guitarists can make things even more interesting.  One can play acoustic and the other electric

I was just deconstructing 'progressive' and 'rock'.  The basic rock group instrumentation features guitar rather than other lead instruments, and I would argue that as rock has progressed there is less reliance on the guitar as the lead instrument.  I don't think the sound has dated, far from it.  More experimental (progressive) groups in their creative phases did not consider a guitar as a necessity - Soft Machine, Univers Zero etc. or use it as part of a rhythm section (i.e. Magma).  I just think it slightly disingenuous to criticise ELP for not having a lead guitarist (although apparently Hendrix wanted to join...) 

Friday13th wrote: VDGG and Renaissance too...but nah, lacking a killer guitarist is never a plus.

Flight123 wrote: I think lacking a guitarist takes a band closer to the prog end of 'prog rock', although Lake did some lead guitar duties as well

Edited by kenethlevine - December 17 2014 at 10:33

ELP is a 3 member band, great one but they lacked a guitarist. Camel had a great guitarist.

rogerthat wrote: Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Stool Man wrote: Camel didn't make Love Beach. Neither Trilogy or Brain Salad Surgery. Only the ones who take the risk can ruin an album. Playing Pictures at an Exhibition before a myriad of hippies who didn't even knew who Mussorgsky was, is a risk Camel always played safe with soporiferous albums. I can only listen Moonmadness without feeling an urge to go to sleep . Iván Kind of sums up my views, though I probably like Mirage more than any ELP album.  Even Mirage was heavily derivative of a lot of Canterbury.

Edited by Kati - December 17 2014 at 09:35

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Stool Man wrote: Camel didn't make Love Beach. Neither Trilogy or Brain Salad Surgery. Only the ones who take the risk can ruin an album. Playing Pictures at an Exhibition before a myriad of hippies who didn't even knew who Mussorgsky was, is a risk Camel always played safe with soporiferous albums. I can only listen Moonmadness without feeling an urge to go to sleep . Iván

Edited by kenethlevine - December 17 2014 at 09:31

octopus-4 wrote: Imperial Zeppelin wrote: Kati wrote: Imperial Zeppelin wrote: Stool Man wrote: Camel didn't make Love Beach. They also didn't make Black Moon and In the Hot Seat  No they did not Molly ooops sorry Sean the Sheep :) you wooly fluffy thing! They did however produce Lady Fantasy and only Focus with Eruption can beat that  So many tracks, most stunning guitar tunes too. hug! And while ELP made In the Hot Seat Camel made great albums like Rajaz and Harbour of Tears. ....aaand it's a tie again. and I don't want to mention the ELP sleeve designs...